Yeah a friend of mine works for a University purchasing dept. and they brought about 100 iMacs about 10 months ago at about 55% off retail (including VAT) so I guess the price on the press release is for Joe public college student...... I agree with Belle, it would do me fine
That's the part that pisses me off so much. If they can sell the thing at a 40% cut to a big purchaser they could certainly sell it at a 25% cut to the average consumer.
That's $936 and $1137 (25% of the current prices). Spec a slightly cheaper HDD and maybe a slower optical and you get a magic 899 to 1099. Presto, Cupertino we have a market share winning machine! All the 'other 95%' rhetoric in the world isn't going to get you one point of that market unless you offer a machine that follows the model of those other 95. That model is a CHEAP yet UP-TO-DATE machine with reasonable speed, graphics, storage and I/O. That model is an eMac priced like an iMac.
While any of my posts regarding Apple pricing tend to sound negative (heck, just read my sig) I'm not too pissed. If Amorph is right, at least volume buyers are getting the kinds of prices that will increase market-share. That's very good. And, it makes me hopeful that a true entry-level mac will come to all of us, sooner than later.
This thing, at 999 to consumers by x-mas, with some promo-bundles for cameras/scanners/printers/iPods/airport would make a huge impact on Apple's marketshare. It may still do that on the institutional side alone. I just hope it isn't a 'stop the bleeding' temporary fix for edu only.
Thats cos we're all fabulously rich in merrie old england, har, har, har.....Sorry, just another example of rip-off Britain maybe.... I guess it will show up in due course, things dont move too fast over in Ireland (Apple assembly plant) I notice..... <img src="graemlins/smokin.gif" border="0" alt="[Chilling]" />
I admit I don't know much about purchasing for k-12 edu, though as a Northwestern U employee I do know about higher ed, but $999 for a 700 Mhz G4 sounds pretty good to me.
If you go to the Apple Store for Education and go to "Shop for your school" you'll see its priced at $999 with a CD drive.
I think this is amazing. A 17 inch (flat CRT, better than the G3 iMacs screen), 700mhz G4, 32 meg video card and all the rest for $999!! Schools will eat this up. Plus the G3 iMacs are now starting at $699!
I worked for a University before and this is the perfect machine for their labs. I shot an email off to an old co-worker who makes the purchasing decisions and he's thrilled that this came out before he put in his order for next year.
They're even considering putting some in their Graphics Arts labs.
I need to go on a search to find the exact thread (probably late December/early January, right before the intro of the LCD iMac), but I said something along the lines of "okay, if this new iMac at MWSF isn't a cool flat screen design, I'd be completely happy if someone took the discontinued 17" Studio Display (the one with the cool mobius strip glass base, remember?), slapped some glossy white paint on it (match the iBook) and somehow engineered the guts of a computer to fit inside it...".
I also remember lobbying heavily for some sort of "tilt and swivel" solution (I would've been happy had Apple simply carried over that mobius strip base design to this new eMac). In either case...
Four months later...
If you look at this new eMac from the side, it looks A LOT like the 17" CRT Studio Display body.
They DID essentially do what I was talking about: monitor size (17" CRT), white glossy shell, use the discontinued 17" Studio Display as a jumping off point, make it tilt/swivel for maximum comfort, etc.
Jeez, I'm good!
Recall, I kinda (in a weird, backwards and mostly accidental way) predicted the design of the new LCD iMacs a few days before their intro (talked about how it would still be an all-in-one, but perhaps the screen wasn't built directly into the base and that that solution would be something really surprising and unique...even though all my silly mockups were based on 15" Studio Displays with the guts "glommed on" to the back, exactly what Jobs told Ives he DIDN'T want).
Anyway...
Kinda cool to see things come out that you imagine being pretty cool or predicting. Even in a casual, roundabout way.
This eMac came out of left field and totally too me buy surprise. But the more I started looking at its shape, color, dimensions, specs, etc., it dawned on me earlier today "hey, wait a minute...".
Well, they paid $2 million for $5 million worth of hardware, software and services (including support). Last time I checked, that was 40%. [edit: Not 40% off. 60% off!]
Apple is a cutthroat bidder, even for small bids. A small business owner one of my coworkers knows submitted bids for a relatively small purchase (~ a half dozen machines) to Apple, Compaq, IBM and Dell. Apple underbid them all, and threw in a free wireless network - free Base Stations, free AirPort cards, and a tech to design and install the network free of charge - to boot.
[quote]<strong>That's the part that pisses me off so much. If they can sell the thing at a 40% cut to a big purchaser they could certainly sell it at a 25% cut to the average consumer.</strong><hr></blockquote>
40% of the sticker price for hardware, software and services - both of the latter are (almost) pure gravy. And if Apple is guaranteed a sizeable chunk of money, they don't need to make as much profit as when they're selling piecemeal.
[quote]<strong>That's very good. And, it makes me hopeful that a true entry-level mac will come to all of us, sooner than later. </strong><hr></blockquote>
It's already here. You just have to know how to buy it. (It helps if you're getting the software and support, too.)
[quote]<strong>I just hope it isn't a 'stop the bleeding' temporary fix for edu only.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I have a feeling the eMac is not a stopgap. It got its own name, its own design and its own page, and it was basically designed by educators. Given that the LCD iMac is unpopular with educators for a variety of fundamental reasons that are not likely to change for a long time (LCD, the swivel arm, etc.), the eMac will probably continue to evolve. What it will probably do, over the course of this year, is replace the CRT iMac.
I agree, Amorph. This eMac addresses the overwhelming gripe directed at the iMac since day one: a 17" screen.
If, after this initial burst of education-oriented marketing, this new G4-based eMac simply became the new CRT iMac, available to anyone and everyone, I think Apple would have a huge hit on their hands.
It matches the LCD iMac in chip, processor speed, 3 USB ports, etc.
Someone could then choose, based on economics, optical drive and screen size basically, the iMac they want.
Some would dig the idea of a flat screen G4 with a SuperDrive. Others may prefer a CRT screen and don't need a SuperDrive. Plus, it's cheaper.
I could see these two types of iMacs co-exist quite peacefully and successfully.
This likely will move into normal retail channels once,
1. G3 iMac supplies dry out
2. They're satisfied that they've saturated the market for new customers with the G4 iMac (that is, people start walking away from them instead of "upgrading" their purchase)
3. They're sure that the G4 iMac's price won't be able to move below $1000 any time soon.
Well, I think I'll be selling a sh!tload of these - my inner-city ed. customers have all be wary about LCD in schools where the kids have fun breaking the bathroom fixtures. However, why the stand only on the top model? European legislation requires some degree of tilt/swivel for ergonomic reasons, and the old iMac CRT's flip foot was the bare minimum.
PS Was this left-field or what? No-one i know at Apple UK Education will admit to any knowledge. Not that they usually do, but in this case they didn't even have that slightly smug air of 'I could tell you, but then I'd have to kill you'.
Let me get this straight; Apple finally releases what I have been wanting to buy for almost 3 years but they won't sell the damn thing to me because I am not a student or faculty member? Unfriggingbelievable..............
<edit>I wonder if that means that you cannot access the innards at all. How do you upgrade the measley 128 MB RAM with non-(expesive)-Apple RAM? Can you?
<strong>ONE MAJOR PROBLEM with the eMac (even though, otherwise, it's a great machine):
"Oh, look, this must be the speaker. I wonder how hard it is to puncture it with a pencil...."
"Not very hard."
And the eMac goes off to Apple for a new speaker.
Come on, guys, integrate a "bulletproof" speaker grille! You should have seen curious and inquisitive pointy objects coming.</strong><hr></blockquote>
As a matter of fact, I've talked to an Apple PR rep, he says that they KNEW students would do this and have built the speakers so that they are very durable and that they will not be able to be punctured.
Comments
That's the part that pisses me off so much. If they can sell the thing at a 40% cut to a big purchaser they could certainly sell it at a 25% cut to the average consumer.
That's $936 and $1137 (25% of the current prices). Spec a slightly cheaper HDD and maybe a slower optical and you get a magic 899 to 1099. Presto, Cupertino we have a market share winning machine! All the 'other 95%' rhetoric in the world isn't going to get you one point of that market unless you offer a machine that follows the model of those other 95. That model is a CHEAP yet UP-TO-DATE machine with reasonable speed, graphics, storage and I/O. That model is an eMac priced like an iMac.
While any of my posts regarding Apple pricing tend to sound negative (heck, just read my sig) I'm not too pissed. If Amorph is right, at least volume buyers are getting the kinds of prices that will increase market-share. That's very good. And, it makes me hopeful that a true entry-level mac will come to all of us, sooner than later.
This thing, at 999 to consumers by x-mas, with some promo-bundles for cameras/scanners/printers/iPods/airport would make a huge impact on Apple's marketshare. It may still do that on the institutional side alone. I just hope it isn't a 'stop the bleeding' temporary fix for edu only.
I think this is amazing. A 17 inch (flat CRT, better than the G3 iMacs screen), 700mhz G4, 32 meg video card and all the rest for $999!! Schools will eat this up. Plus the G3 iMacs are now starting at $699!
I worked for a University before and this is the perfect machine for their labs. I shot an email off to an old co-worker who makes the purchasing decisions and he's thrilled that this came out before he put in his order for next year.
They're even considering putting some in their Graphics Arts labs.
I also remember lobbying heavily for some sort of "tilt and swivel" solution (I would've been happy had Apple simply carried over that mobius strip base design to this new eMac). In either case...
Four months later...
If you look at this new eMac from the side, it looks A LOT like the 17" CRT Studio Display body.
They DID essentially do what I was talking about: monitor size (17" CRT), white glossy shell, use the discontinued 17" Studio Display as a jumping off point, make it tilt/swivel for maximum comfort, etc.
Jeez, I'm good!
Recall, I kinda (in a weird, backwards and mostly accidental way) predicted the design of the new LCD iMacs a few days before their intro (talked about how it would still be an all-in-one, but perhaps the screen wasn't built directly into the base and that that solution would be something really surprising and unique...even though all my silly mockups were based on 15" Studio Displays with the guts "glommed on" to the back, exactly what Jobs told Ives he DIDN'T want).
Anyway...
Kinda cool to see things come out that you imagine being pretty cool or predicting. Even in a casual, roundabout way.
This eMac came out of left field and totally too me buy surprise. But the more I started looking at its shape, color, dimensions, specs, etc., it dawned on me earlier today "hey, wait a minute...".
I'll find that thread later...
Admit it, you work at Apple, and you're divulging inside infomation on these boards.
Either that, or you are the luckiest bastard I've seen in a while... heh heh.
You did nail the last 2 new pieces of hardware though buddy, congrats.
<strong>40% off! :eek: Amorph, R-U-sure?</strong><hr></blockquote>
Well, they paid $2 million for $5 million worth of hardware, software and services (including support). Last time I checked, that was 40%. [edit: Not 40% off. 60% off!]
Apple is a cutthroat bidder, even for small bids. A small business owner one of my coworkers knows submitted bids for a relatively small purchase (~ a half dozen machines) to Apple, Compaq, IBM and Dell. Apple underbid them all, and threw in a free wireless network - free Base Stations, free AirPort cards, and a tech to design and install the network free of charge - to boot.
[quote]<strong>That's the part that pisses me off so much. If they can sell the thing at a 40% cut to a big purchaser they could certainly sell it at a 25% cut to the average consumer.</strong><hr></blockquote>
40% of the sticker price for hardware, software and services - both of the latter are (almost) pure gravy. And if Apple is guaranteed a sizeable chunk of money, they don't need to make as much profit as when they're selling piecemeal.
[quote]<strong>That's very good. And, it makes me hopeful that a true entry-level mac will come to all of us, sooner than later. </strong><hr></blockquote>
It's already here. You just have to know how to buy it.
[quote]<strong>I just hope it isn't a 'stop the bleeding' temporary fix for edu only.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I have a feeling the eMac is not a stopgap. It got its own name, its own design and its own page, and it was basically designed by educators. Given that the LCD iMac is unpopular with educators for a variety of fundamental reasons that are not likely to change for a long time (LCD, the swivel arm, etc.), the eMac will probably continue to evolve. What it will probably do, over the course of this year, is replace the CRT iMac.
[ 04-29-2002: Message edited by: Amorph ]
[ 04-29-2002: Message edited by: Amorph ]</p>
If, after this initial burst of education-oriented marketing, this new G4-based eMac simply became the new CRT iMac, available to anyone and everyone, I think Apple would have a huge hit on their hands.
It matches the LCD iMac in chip, processor speed, 3 USB ports, etc.
Someone could then choose, based on economics, optical drive and screen size basically, the iMac they want.
Some would dig the idea of a flat screen G4 with a SuperDrive. Others may prefer a CRT screen and don't need a SuperDrive. Plus, it's cheaper.
I could see these two types of iMacs co-exist quite peacefully and successfully.
Now, just to get that iBook up to a G4...
1. G3 iMac supplies dry out
2. They're satisfied that they've saturated the market for new customers with the G4 iMac (that is, people start walking away from them instead of "upgrading" their purchase)
3. They're sure that the G4 iMac's price won't be able to move below $1000 any time soon.
PS Was this left-field or what? No-one i know at Apple UK Education will admit to any knowledge. Not that they usually do, but in this case they didn't even have that slightly smug air of 'I could tell you, but then I'd have to kill you'.
Kids (the target user) at play with new eMac
[ 04-29-2002: Message edited by: MacsRGood4U ]</p>
"Oh, look, this must be the speaker. I wonder how hard it is to puncture it with a pencil...."
"Not very hard."
And the eMac goes off to Apple for a new speaker.
Come on, guys, integrate a "bulletproof" speaker grille! You should have seen curious and inquisitive pointy objects coming.
Yup. Check this out: <a href="http://www.apple.com/education/emac/internet.html"; target="_blank">http://www.apple.com/education/emac/internet.html</a>;
<edit>I wonder if that means that you cannot access the innards at all. How do you upgrade the measley 128 MB RAM with non-(expesive)-Apple RAM? Can you?
[ 04-29-2002: Message edited by: bauman ]</p>
<strong>ONE MAJOR PROBLEM with the eMac (even though, otherwise, it's a great machine):
"Oh, look, this must be the speaker. I wonder how hard it is to puncture it with a pencil...."
"Not very hard."
And the eMac goes off to Apple for a new speaker.
Come on, guys, integrate a "bulletproof" speaker grille! You should have seen curious and inquisitive pointy objects coming.</strong><hr></blockquote>
As a matter of fact, I've talked to an Apple PR rep, he says that they KNEW students would do this and have built the speakers so that they are very durable and that they will not be able to be punctured.