Just from my experience with my MacBook, I wouldn't be at all surprised if he was right. The first thing almost anyone says when they pick up my MB is 'Whoa, it's heavy.'
It's an extremely dense little machine.
(in terms of comparable hardware, it's probably par. in terms of screen size and absolute dimensions, it's considerably heavier than normal.)
Sony VAIO SZ series weighs 3.7 to 4 lbs.
Sharp M4000 weighs 3.7 lbs.
VAIO VGN series weighs 4.2 lbs.
Fujitsu Lifebook weighs 4.2 lbs.
Macbook weighs 5.2 lbs.
Panasonic Toughbook weighs 6 lbs.
Thankyou for taking the time because I wasn't going to bother.
Just from my experience with my MacBook, I wouldn't be at all surprised if he was right. The first thing almost anyone says when they pick up my MB is 'Whoa, it's heavy.'
It's an extremely dense little machine.
(in terms of comparable hardware, it's probably par. in terms of screen size and absolute dimensions, it's considerably heavier than normal.)
Sony VAIO SZ series weighs 3.7 to 4 lbs.
Sharp M4000 weighs 3.7 lbs.
VAIO VGN series weighs 4.2 lbs.
Fujitsu Lifebook weighs 4.2 lbs.
Macbook weighs 5.2 lbs.
Panasonic Toughbook weighs 6 lbs.
I think Mr. H's demand for a "comparable" notebook is somewhat disingenuous as it appears all the other 13" notebooks use LV and ULV chips, the MacBook uses the highest power consuming chips for mobile use, requiring a thicker and heavier notebook for heat management and batteries. LV and ULV chips can run a lot cooler and run longer with lighter batteries. There may not strictly comparable notebook because no one else seems to bother with the "T" series flame throwers for 13" notebooks.
Hah! My iPod pisses all over your X60! It's over 2 pounds lighter and has a 12 hour battery life!
That's nothing. My Timex watch is significantly lighter and has a battery life not of hours, days, months, but years! Plus, its time-telling is more accurate than the iPod's, so nyah!
There may not strictly comparable notebook because no one else seems to bother with the "T" series flame throwers for 13" notebooks.
Because the target is light consumer/student use. As such they probably don't expect too much use away from a desk and power. And "travel" is from dorm room to starbucks.
A MacBook would make a poor travel notebook (except in comparison with some Dells some of us get saddled with).
The 17" MacBook Pro will be a good travel desktop replacement for me. I need horsepower more than size because developing on a sub-notebook is painful after working with dual monitor setups.
That's nothing. My Timex watch is significantly lighter and has a battery life not of hours, days, months, but years! Plus, its time-telling is more accurate than the iPod's, so nyah!
That's nothing. My local power plant lights up an entire city and metro area. Plus, it produces radioactive waste and biohazardous materials. Beat that.
That's nothing. My local power plant lights up an entire city and metro area. Plus, it produces radioactive waste and biohazardous materials. Beat that.
That's fine, me understand. Where is my light notebook though. I assume the Macbook is Apples small notebook so they must be targeting the old 12 Inch crowd with it.
I agree with you. I hope they come up with a MacBook Pro mini for you and the executives who want to travel with a pro laptop but don't need a big display to run PhotoShop and dozens fo palettes. I just wonder if Apple was even losing money on the 12"er.
I'm just surprised that Apple hasn't seen the posibilities in getting a lighter machine for the K-12 market, especially for the K-7 grades. even 5 pounds is heavy for younger kids. They also don't need the utmost in computing power.
It seems to me that for that market, a Core Sole 1.67GHz chip 950 IG, a 12" screen, and a 3.5 pound weight would sell well. I can find other uses for it as well.
I'm just surprised that Apple hasn't seen the posibilities in getting a lighter machine for the K-12 market, especially for the K-7 grades. even 5 pounds is heavy for younger kids. They also don't need the utmost in computing power.
It seems to me that for that market, a Core Sole 1.67GHz chip 950 IG, a 12" screen, and a 3.5 pound weight would sell well. I can find other uses for it as well.
But generally in education markets the laptops are bolted to the desks so there isn't the question about weight so much as having everything, keyboard, track pad and display, in one place to save room. I don't understand the wight argument though, but maybe it's because I've never used a laptop extensively ... really is the difference between 4.6 pounds and 5.2 pounds a deal-breaker for people? It seems like the other 0.6 pounds shouldn't be a problem for pretty much ... well, anybody...
EDIT: I understand in some cases schools give the students a laptop for personal use, but these are usually high schools and they're not buying Macs for anything except their multimedia centers. I think a lot of schools have yet to see the value of buying a Mac. The smaller computer you proposed is nice - definitely suited for a k-12 education environment, but that could possibly be the only place a machine like that sells well. You've already seen how people are calling the MB "crippled" because it weighs as much as the sun and doesn't have dedicated graphics...
I'm just surprised that Apple hasn't seen the posibilities in getting a lighter machine for the K-12 market, especially for the K-7 grades. even 5 pounds is heavy for younger kids. They also don't need the utmost in computing power.
It seems to me that for that market, a Core Sole 1.67GHz chip 950 IG, a 12" screen, and a 3.5 pound weight would sell well. I can find other uses for it as well.
Maybe the extra weight is good, if you can't get them to pump iron, at least they can pump LiON or whatever.
I think it is unfortunate that Apple doesn't see the point in a sub-note when seemingly every other company can manage to offer at least one, even brands that have a smaller market share and those still have a larger variety of products.
My understanding is that the Asia Pacific market is very keen on sub-notes such that not much else sells in the notebook market space. The lack of a sub-note could possibly explain why Apple is only selling a very small number of machines to that region.
I went back to the Apple Store yesterday as I was once again in the area. I wanted to investigate a couple of things about the MacBook.
First of all, the BlackBook marks very easily. I don't mean chips or scratches, but smudges. Being matte black really shows up oils from fingers/hands etc. I tried cleaning one of them up with various things from a clean handkerchief to a tissue and it didn't work that well. I do of course understand the huge volume of traffic at an Apple Store will speed this process along, and particularly with the BlackBooks. Still, over time this might be an issue for someone. Anyone got any suggestions as to what might remove these smudges from a matte surface.
I really do like the feel and design of the keyboard a lot on the BBs. I didn't really check out any white MacBooks because I'm definitely not in the market for that look. I did look for smudging, but that essentially was hardly there as the finish is shiny white not matte white. All the MBPs were clean - as with my PB 15" Aluminium..hardly any marking at all and clean up very easily.
The one thing that I *did* check for that I'd heard and read about in a number of forums was the issue of moving windows around in Safari and seeing if the screen flickers. I tried this on all the Intel Macs, from MBP to MB to iMac, and this happened on ALL of them....except one Intel iMac, which for some reason was completely fine. I mentioned this to an Apple Store salesman, and he said he'd never heard the complaint, but was interested to see what I was talking about so he accompanied me on the entire test and saw the results. He was going to put in a full report about it as well, so hopefuly that might help speed things along, you never know.
By the way, the Powermacs didn't exhibit this artifact at all, in any version or on any monitor size up to and including the 30".
The one thing that I *did* check for that I'd heard and read about in a number of forums was the issue of moving windows around in Safari and seeing if the screen flickers. I tried this on all the Intel Macs, from MBP to MB to iMac, and this happened on ALL of them....
I got my 1.83 Macbook with 1 gig of RAM today and this laptop ROCKS! I LOVE IT! GORGEOUS and so far no problems at all. The screen is bright and the glossyness is NO problem at all. The new keys are great, feel nice. That magsafe power plug is cool, stronger magnet than I thought it would have. This is a REALLY sweet laptop! Boots up fast too!
But generally in education markets the laptops are bolted to the desks so there isn't the question about weight so much as having everything, keyboard, track pad and display, in one place to save room. I don't understand the wight argument though, but maybe it's because I've never used a laptop extensively ... really is the difference between 4.6 pounds and 5.2 pounds a deal-breaker for people? It seems like the other 0.6 pounds shouldn't be a problem for pretty much ... well, anybody...
EDIT: I understand in some cases schools give the students a laptop for personal use, but these are usually high schools and they're not buying Macs for anything except their multimedia centers. I think a lot of schools have yet to see the value of buying a Mac. The smaller computer you proposed is nice - definitely suited for a k-12 education environment, but that could possibly be the only place a machine like that sells well. You've already seen how people are calling the MB "crippled" because it weighs as much as the sun and doesn't have dedicated graphics...
Some schools do that, but many do not, including those in lower grades.
Comments
Originally posted by gloss
Just from my experience with my MacBook, I wouldn't be at all surprised if he was right. The first thing almost anyone says when they pick up my MB is 'Whoa, it's heavy.'
It's an extremely dense little machine.
(in terms of comparable hardware, it's probably par. in terms of screen size and absolute dimensions, it's considerably heavier than normal.)
Sony VAIO SZ series weighs 3.7 to 4 lbs.
Sharp M4000 weighs 3.7 lbs.
VAIO VGN series weighs 4.2 lbs.
Fujitsu Lifebook weighs 4.2 lbs.
Macbook weighs 5.2 lbs.
Panasonic Toughbook weighs 6 lbs.
Thankyou for taking the time because I wasn't going to bother.
Originally posted by gloss
Just from my experience with my MacBook, I wouldn't be at all surprised if he was right. The first thing almost anyone says when they pick up my MB is 'Whoa, it's heavy.'
It's an extremely dense little machine.
(in terms of comparable hardware, it's probably par. in terms of screen size and absolute dimensions, it's considerably heavier than normal.)
Sony VAIO SZ series weighs 3.7 to 4 lbs.
Sharp M4000 weighs 3.7 lbs.
VAIO VGN series weighs 4.2 lbs.
Fujitsu Lifebook weighs 4.2 lbs.
Macbook weighs 5.2 lbs.
Panasonic Toughbook weighs 6 lbs.
I think Mr. H's demand for a "comparable" notebook is somewhat disingenuous as it appears all the other 13" notebooks use LV and ULV chips, the MacBook uses the highest power consuming chips for mobile use, requiring a thicker and heavier notebook for heat management and batteries. LV and ULV chips can run a lot cooler and run longer with lighter batteries. There may not strictly comparable notebook because no one else seems to bother with the "T" series flame throwers for 13" notebooks.
Originally posted by Mr. H
Hah! My iPod pisses all over your X60! It's over 2 pounds lighter and has a 12 hour battery life!
That's nothing. My Timex watch is significantly lighter and has a battery life not of hours, days, months, but years! Plus, its time-telling is more accurate than the iPod's, so nyah!
Originally posted by JeffDM
There may not strictly comparable notebook because no one else seems to bother with the "T" series flame throwers for 13" notebooks.
Because the target is light consumer/student use. As such they probably don't expect too much use away from a desk and power. And "travel" is from dorm room to starbucks.
A MacBook would make a poor travel notebook (except in comparison with some Dells some of us get saddled with).
The 17" MacBook Pro will be a good travel desktop replacement for me. I need horsepower more than size because developing on a sub-notebook is painful after working with dual monitor setups.
Vinea
Originally posted by Vox Barbara
I've got no clue, give me a hint if you don't mind.
its a song from Sheryl Crow
Originally posted by Chucker
That's nothing. My Timex watch is significantly lighter and has a battery life not of hours, days, months, but years! Plus, its time-telling is more accurate than the iPod's, so nyah!
That's nothing. My local power plant lights up an entire city and metro area. Plus, it produces radioactive waste and biohazardous materials. Beat that.
Originally posted by monkeyastronaut
That's nothing. My local power plant lights up an entire city and metro area. Plus, it produces radioactive waste and biohazardous materials. Beat that.
http://www.macdevcenter.com/pub/a/ma...-question.html
Originally posted by Relic
That's fine, me understand. Where is my light notebook though. I assume the Macbook is Apples small notebook so they must be targeting the old 12 Inch crowd with it.
I agree with you. I hope they come up with a MacBook Pro mini for you and the executives who want to travel with a pro laptop but don't need a big display to run PhotoShop and dozens fo palettes. I just wonder if Apple was even losing money on the 12"er.
It seems to me that for that market, a Core Sole 1.67GHz chip 950 IG, a 12" screen, and a 3.5 pound weight would sell well. I can find other uses for it as well.
Originally posted by monkeyastronaut
its a song from Sheryl Crow
Thank you, i'll check it out
Originally posted by melgross
I'm just surprised that Apple hasn't seen the posibilities in getting a lighter machine for the K-12 market, especially for the K-7 grades. even 5 pounds is heavy for younger kids. They also don't need the utmost in computing power.
It seems to me that for that market, a Core Sole 1.67GHz chip 950 IG, a 12" screen, and a 3.5 pound weight would sell well. I can find other uses for it as well.
But generally in education markets the laptops are bolted to the desks so there isn't the question about weight so much as having everything, keyboard, track pad and display, in one place to save room. I don't understand the wight argument though, but maybe it's because I've never used a laptop extensively ... really is the difference between 4.6 pounds and 5.2 pounds a deal-breaker for people? It seems like the other 0.6 pounds shouldn't be a problem for pretty much ... well, anybody...
EDIT: I understand in some cases schools give the students a laptop for personal use, but these are usually high schools and they're not buying Macs for anything except their multimedia centers. I think a lot of schools have yet to see the value of buying a Mac. The smaller computer you proposed is nice - definitely suited for a k-12 education environment, but that could possibly be the only place a machine like that sells well. You've already seen how people are calling the MB "crippled" because it weighs as much as the sun and doesn't have dedicated graphics...
Originally posted by melgross
I'm just surprised that Apple hasn't seen the posibilities in getting a lighter machine for the K-12 market, especially for the K-7 grades. even 5 pounds is heavy for younger kids. They also don't need the utmost in computing power.
It seems to me that for that market, a Core Sole 1.67GHz chip 950 IG, a 12" screen, and a 3.5 pound weight would sell well. I can find other uses for it as well.
Maybe the extra weight is good, if you can't get them to pump iron, at least they can pump LiON or whatever.
I think it is unfortunate that Apple doesn't see the point in a sub-note when seemingly every other company can manage to offer at least one, even brands that have a smaller market share and those still have a larger variety of products.
My understanding is that the Asia Pacific market is very keen on sub-notes such that not much else sells in the notebook market space. The lack of a sub-note could possibly explain why Apple is only selling a very small number of machines to that region.
First of all, the BlackBook marks very easily. I don't mean chips or scratches, but smudges. Being matte black really shows up oils from fingers/hands etc. I tried cleaning one of them up with various things from a clean handkerchief to a tissue and it didn't work that well. I do of course understand the huge volume of traffic at an Apple Store will speed this process along, and particularly with the BlackBooks. Still, over time this might be an issue for someone. Anyone got any suggestions as to what might remove these smudges from a matte surface.
I really do like the feel and design of the keyboard a lot on the BBs. I didn't really check out any white MacBooks because I'm definitely not in the market for that look. I did look for smudging, but that essentially was hardly there as the finish is shiny white not matte white. All the MBPs were clean - as with my PB 15" Aluminium..hardly any marking at all and clean up very easily.
The one thing that I *did* check for that I'd heard and read about in a number of forums was the issue of moving windows around in Safari and seeing if the screen flickers. I tried this on all the Intel Macs, from MBP to MB to iMac, and this happened on ALL of them....except one Intel iMac, which for some reason was completely fine. I mentioned this to an Apple Store salesman, and he said he'd never heard the complaint, but was interested to see what I was talking about so he accompanied me on the entire test and saw the results. He was going to put in a full report about it as well, so hopefuly that might help speed things along, you never know.
By the way, the Powermacs didn't exhibit this artifact at all, in any version or on any monitor size up to and including the 30".
Originally posted by auslander
Anyone got any suggestions as to what might remove these smudges from a matte surface?
I used rubbing alcohol on mine. It cleaned up good, in my opinion. As soon as I started using the 'Book again, more smudges appeared again.
Originally posted by auslander
...
The one thing that I *did* check for that I'd heard and read about in a number of forums was the issue of moving windows around in Safari and seeing if the screen flickers. I tried this on all the Intel Macs, from MBP to MB to iMac, and this happened on ALL of them....
...
I never heard about this issue.
Originally posted by Vox Barbara
I never heard about this issue.
I first read about it in the Apple support discussions at Apple.com.
Great job Apple!
Tom
Originally posted by AgNuke1707
But generally in education markets the laptops are bolted to the desks so there isn't the question about weight so much as having everything, keyboard, track pad and display, in one place to save room. I don't understand the wight argument though, but maybe it's because I've never used a laptop extensively ... really is the difference between 4.6 pounds and 5.2 pounds a deal-breaker for people? It seems like the other 0.6 pounds shouldn't be a problem for pretty much ... well, anybody...
EDIT: I understand in some cases schools give the students a laptop for personal use, but these are usually high schools and they're not buying Macs for anything except their multimedia centers. I think a lot of schools have yet to see the value of buying a Mac. The smaller computer you proposed is nice - definitely suited for a k-12 education environment, but that could possibly be the only place a machine like that sells well. You've already seen how people are calling the MB "crippled" because it weighs as much as the sun and doesn't have dedicated graphics...
Some schools do that, but many do not, including those in lower grades.