arkorott

dabigkahuna said:

The response is not what I'd like since I want the same thing you do. Usually it comes down to something like they say on the forum - that they need to do X before they post an update (where X is nothing you can put your finger on but just a general thing). Sometimes I can see their point in a delay. Sometimes I can't, but also know that some things I shouldn't be told anyway.

You mentioned to have sometimes calls with Mark, so when they are not very clear or comprehensive, do you or somebody else they listen to mention it / push them for more info? What do they respond back with ?

The lack of project status communication is a big warning light - No company doing well / having positive news to tell stays mum and says as little as possible to their eager customer base. Much less when asked again and again and again. I have difficulty finding a positive spin to their lack of (comprehensive project status) communication.

Because they DO stay very active on WTF forums, and spend a lot of time posting on many different topics, but unrelated to the TB  (cooktops, helmets, help you with your Mac, etc etc), so it is not that they don't have the time. The question is why can't they invest a little of that time and put a comprehensive project update together ? (not only the fork but all the remaining gates to be overcome until GR).

In the corporate world, every time there is silence is not normally a good sign. And in this case they are very vocal but perhaps "on the wrong topics". They have us wondering and that is a strange way to communicate with customers.

Edit: spelling

dabigkahuna said:

Interestingly, most Treg members would probably agree with most of your complaints. They might use milder terms, but the areas of complaint would match up quite well. And I and some others members have posted those complaints publicly as well as said so to Mark on calls or in private messaging.

In fact, I did exactly that last night when he called me. He may be tired of hearing me bring it up!

My issue (and some others) is those who go way past those reasonable concerns.

You seem to me - at least what I've read lately - to be a person who could be a good Treg member. Critical but rational about it.

Well thanks. It is good that at least there seems to be some degree of consensus of things to be fixed / addressed.
Some of these comments I made to them directly by email. But normally I do not get a response, and if I do it would be a one liner.

So my question to you is: what kind of response do the Treg members get when they raise these topics ?
Do you think there is any chance of the banning and order cancelling practice to be abolished ? Some kind of compromise ?

You seem to me - at least what I've read lately - to be a person who could be a good Treg member. Critical but rational about it

Thanks. Tell that to Mark and team. Ha
If you take out the emotional parts of theses messages and a little of the way they were outlined, I think a huge lot of the posters have valid points.
Sometimes we get carried away and we start discussing minor aggravating details but not the substance of the comments. That is worse when the insults come in.

edit: spelling

ericpeets said:

 I think most people don't care about $99 after years of waiting. I think most would simply write that off. What they'd like is closure to the messed-up relationship that occurred in the ~4 years of waiting with Waytools.

Very true. And many after waiting for so long think, well I can wait a little longer. 

The promise of the TB is very enchanting / alluring (do not know the right term), so we all put up with longer times we would not be willing to if it was a Microsoft fold-up keyboard what we were talking about for example - as good as they are.

I guess nobody is going to read close to 400 posts but just want to mention that personal attacks on the forums don't accomplish much and in fact drives the attention away of the topic at hand which is when the f*** TB will be released.

I agree that WT mistreats customers through silencing and banning or force cancelling the orders.
Sometimes the passive-aggressive / arrogant comments get under my skin too.
I also believe they have been misleading in terms of readiness and in fact the site tab on availability continues to be misleading.
And also, communication of the overall status of the project has degraded dramatically.

Having said that, I understand angry people lash out but I do not agree into attacking anyone if they don't agree with somebody's view. If MTO or anybody else places orders more power to them. I would be hypocritical if I bashed them as in fact I have not cancelled my order nor want it cancelled. (And I admit would be thrilled to get into TREG so I would finally get my hands on one). 

I am upset as the next one on not receiving mine for so long but don't think it is ok to attack them or to attack DBK or others.
They are all entitled to their opinion. If we all thought the same then we would all be sheep one way or the other.

At least me, despite what I said above about how I disagree with WT practices as a company, I would like them to succeed and ship the TBs.
If I did not care about receiving mine I would not be posting or following up and if I believed they would never ship I would hit that refund button quick. 

As Rolanbek said, insulting people will never bring them to your side / perspective.

dabigkahuna said:

WT posted a little earlier today on their forums. Not a lot, but at least it is something and I did tell them we need more:

Dbk - Quick look -

Testing jumps right now, and data from initial testing looks like they’re now about twice as fast.

We think it can be tuned a bit further, but focus first is on full feature-parity with current release.

Above is a sample datapoint, and we’ll finish working through and testing so we’ve got more of the full picture info. With those results, we’ll do a good, in-depth TechTalk write-up.

Thanks. I read that but it is not saying much. I was hoping for something more comprehensive / detailed / with dates. If I am not mistaken except a few posts here and there there has not been an official update since July 2017 and that one was very light on (new) info and details.

I have read most of the posts at WTF, but I have zero sense of WHEN GR will materialize. (Maybe I am naive but I still want to believe it will happen). Some of WT posts touch base in 1 specific thing but never provides a sense of the overall status as a whole.

That fact that they are so far behind after 4 years does not entitle them to avoid dates overall. I guess the opposite is in order: you need to share MORE info and not less. 

BTW, how communication has deteriorated dramatically since early 2017 is a big warning light, that has me concerned. From monthly to quarterly to almost nothing. They should be eager to share more info, instead of silence. That is why I started the thread of the "next update post" at WTF. Remember when they said repeatedly: we will share more this weekend, the next week, on and on, until they stopped to provide dates even for the delayed next update ?
I think they closed the thread a while ago, but there are another 2 with people requesting updates: "I hear nothing but crickets", and "Waytools: what is the latest info on updates"

People (me included) have been more or less patient so far because how awesome the TB seems its gonna be. Any other small keyboard manufacturer would have disappeared long ago after customers and investors massively pulled their support.

Hope that is not happening with the TB. Weak communication and not a sense of progress (just a few comments here and there) makes people wonder.