To say that something may replace a netbook isn't saying that it is the same thing as a netbook.
I bought my daughter a Toshiba NB205 which had come out two weeks earlier, and had received very good reviews at the time. That was in early July. It cost $400, and I bought the 2 Gb upgrade for $69. So we're talking a $500 machine essentially. She wanted it for her summer in school in the UK to use for Skype, IM, the web, writing assignments and other light weight stuff.
But the thing is horribly slow. I mean horribly. Despite having the fastest Atom chip, its difficult to use it's so slow. I've checked out others, and they're all the same, except that the cheaper ones were even slower.
So sure, it's got a lot of features, runs a PC OS and stuff, but whats it really good for? Not much. Can't play any useful games on it, she tried, and she's a serious gamer. I mean, serious! Even the web using Wifi is slow.
So the iPad can replace that without having all the features that slow it down so much. Ever seriously try to multitask on one of these? It's a joke!
The only good netbook there is is that Alienware Gaming Netbook, which is actually a small notebook that costs $900... $70 more than the top-of-the-line iPad.
I am mostly intrigued about that A4 processor. For what we've seen it could easily outperform a 1.8GHz C2D
1) Having Flash Lite doesn't give you access to the "full web" so these 2007 talking points are pretty lame.
2) Having a full version of Flash doesn't give you access to the "full web" if you consider plug-ins and browser-specific code relevant.
True. You need more than just Flash. The additional stuff needed is another reason to be hesitant of a device which doesn't offer a variety of competent browsers.
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism
3) This device is not designed for "geeks". The sooner you realize that the sooner you understand Apple's market strategy.
Tell you what. I'll realize that BEFORE you start responding to what I actually say.
Wait - I already realize it! And you still respond to your imaginings rather than my words.
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism
2) DVD resolution is 480p/576p. The iPad output H.264, 720p @ 30fps. A little more than "better than DVD" and claiming 720p is not HD is silly.
It cannot display 720p widescreen. In 720p, it is 4:3.
In widescreen, the vertical resolution is 576 (please double check my arithmetic), hardly better than DVD, and certainly not HD.
Let's not argue about what any of these words mean. I think we both understand each other's points.
It's very cool that the iPad can output 720p, so you can hook it up to the TV. But I don't understand the lack of HDMI.
Me too and I can see not useful thing this device can do for me, but it's obvious it will be the most successful tablet to date.[/QUOTE]
The only good netbook there is is that Alienware Gaming Netbook, which is actually a small notebook that costs $900... $70 more than the top-of-the-line iPad.
I am mostly intrigued about that A4 processor. For what we've seen it could easily outperform a 1.8GHz C2D
The Alienware isn't really a netbook, of course. It's weird how the definitions for computers get misty around the edges.
How do we tell a $1,000 netbook from a $400 notebook, esp when they have the same cpu?
Well, if they ALL said they would buy it, that would be very interesting, wouldn't it?
What survey have you ever seen where 100% were in agreement? The fact is right now the iPad is rather underwhelming. You act like somehow when consumers get it in their hands its going to change to something other then an larger iPod Touch. Like I said before right now the iPad is better known for what it lacks rather then what it has to offer.
It's not about raw numbers. For instance, you talk about how many millions of full-feature apps are available to netbook users but overlook the fact that your typical netbook
"Your typical netbook" isn't what the OP was comparing with the iPad. He siad that the iPad is better than any netbook on the market. I was wondering why he thinks that.
What survey have you ever seen where 100% were in agreement? The fact is right now the iPad is rather underwhelming. You act like somehow when consumers get it in their hands its going to change to something other then an larger iPod Touch. Like I said before right now the iPad is better known for what it lacks rather then what it has to offer.
That's why it would be interesting. I didn't bring it up.
So far, the iPad looks great. The most fascinating new device since the iPhone. It will be popular. You have your prejudices. That's fine. But you're trying real hard to ignore what it can do.
]Let's not argue about what any of these words mean. I think we both understand each other's points.
It's very cool that the iPad can output 720p, so you can hook it up to the TV. But I don't understand the lack of HDMI.
No, you don't understand otherwise you wouldn't be asking about HDMI.
It can output 720p iTS HD video to its built-in display, it can be hooked up to a TV and it can output WXGA over the VGA cable. It cannot, according to the spec sheet, output 720p video over the component cables.
No, you don't understand otherwise you wouldn't be asking about HDMI.
It can output 720p iTS HD video to its built-in display, it can be hooked up to a TV and it can output WXGA over the VGA cable. It cannot, according to the spec sheet, output 720p video over the component cables.
HD is also 1024 x 768 screens. Actually, over those screens the pixels get distorted, as on early plasma's which were Hi Def, or it gets shown at a lower horizontal rez with the vertical 1024 in place. There were many plasma's that were also 1024 x 1024 with non square pixels that were also hi def. Very confusing to those who don't understand the field.
5) YouTube and Vimeo moving to HTMl5. Others will follow. Hulu is a video site, not a Flash site, they will move to HTML5 this year.
6) Mozilla on Firefox 3 for Maemo, "The Adobe Flash plugin used on many sites degraded the performance of the browser to the point where it didn?t meet our standards." http://blog.pavlov.net/2010/01/27/fi...for-maemo-rc3/
7) Now it's rumoured that WinMo 7 won't have Flash support, either.
it's not just Apple, it's mobile computing in general, and it's because Adobe dropped the ball years ago. Enough with the anti-Apple crap.
The subject at hand is whether the average shmoe (Apple's iPad customers) will miss flash. IMO, they will.
I don't understand how your post is responsive to the point I was making.
the web and users of the web will be far better off when web sites no longer use flash.
Flash is buggy
Flash crashes browsers
Flash drains batteries
Flash is proprietary
The last one is the killer too - it means that Apple, Microsoft, Google, and Mozilla, etc. cannot fix the problems with flash. They are all dependent on another company to implement flash for them. Everything else they can do themselves.
And kids use flash primarily to play games. Why go to the web for games when you have the app store?
That is all true. Nonetheless, what is also true is the web runs on it and few are in any kind of hurry to change that. You can either have flash or have a lot of things just not load and pray that a miracle happens and everyone magically goes to HTML5 overnight.
HD is also 1024 x 768 screens. Actually, over those screens the pixels get distorted, as on early plasma's which were Hi Def, or it gets shown at a lower horizontal rez with the vertical 1024 in place. There were many plasma's that were also 1024 x 1024 with non square pixels that were also hi def. Very confusing to those who don't understand the field.
Yeah, I remember the old 1024 x 1024 displays. I also remember customers paying us $7k and up for those things. Fujitsu, if I recall, was the one who made the 1024 x 1024 plasma panels and OEM'ed them to Sony as well.
Wow, with that much trust in a company you shouldn't buy anything from them. And so, why bother?
As a Dutch saying goes: "zoals de waard is vertrouwd hij z'n gasten". I think that sums it up quit nicely.
Do you have a personal (factual) reason to be so negative?
J.
How about Apple have done this before?
Apple sold a version of the iPod Touch which had a bluetooth chip inside without telling purchasers. They then later said they could activate the bluetooth by paying $10 for new firmware.
That is all true. Nonetheless, what is also true is the web runs on it and few are in any kind of hurry to change that. You can either have flash or have a lot of things just not load and pray that a miracle happens and everyone magically goes to HTML5 overnight.
The web doesn't run on Flash. Some services use it. They are disposable. They will be disposed of. The only question is how long it will take.
Apple sold a version of the iPod Touch which had a bluetooth chip inside without telling purchasers. They then later said they could activate the bluetooth by paying $10 for new firmware.
Thats easy. Netbooks are a compromise in every possible way. Run a mainsteam OS but not enough memory or cpu. Too small a keyboard and screen. Poor user experience.
geez, drink the Jobs Kool Aid much?
I have a Dell Mini 9 w/2GB of ram on which I dual boot jolicloud & Leopard. Though the keyboard seemed small at first I adjusted (as I had to when I got the iPhone) and I run iWork, iLife and more on this little computer, I can fully surf the web (flash too), I used skype to video conference back home with the webcam and I can expand my memory with SD cards. All that and I can carry it in my jacket pocket like I did during a two week trip to Europe in the fall. It's not my every day computer, I often go a couple of weeks without firing it up, but it's a fully capable travel computer when I want something that DOES NOT have any major compromises but don't want to lug my 15" MBP with me.
$130 extra for 3G is a rip-off. The chip and antenna probably cost $0.50. Hell, the chip is probably just disabled in the non-3G.
I don't like dong stuff like this and don't condone it but it's ironic that the underground people who brought us google voice via jailbreaking to teethering and multitasking, that they will probably be the ones that turn the ipad into the device it "should be" instead of feeling like you have to pay all theses fees for usage when it's really just a way to keep usage down as their 3G is not that fast when compared to wifi. That said. If one has a jailbroken iPhone with teethering, wouldn't that mean that we could get online with the wifi only version via the iPhone?
Nonetheless it will be intersting to see what the likes of icy, cyndia, osx86 can do.
I wouldn't be surprised in the least if an HP Slate can be turned into a ipad down the road with this group. (See above post). But the irony is if the underground turns the ipad into the device it should be from the start, for example, installing flash into it in order t watch free tv show while in bed or something. Lol. As I have my mbpro hooked up to a highend FireWire device andnseveral hard drives plus a glossy HDMI 24"'display.
Nonetheless it will be intersting to see what the likes of icy, cyndia, osx86 can do.
I wouldn't be surprised in the least if an HP Slate can be turned into a ipad down the road with this group. (See above post). But the irony is if the underground turns the ipad into the device it should be from the start, for example, installing flash into it in order t watch free tv show while in bed or something. Lol. As I have my mbpro hooked up to a highend FireWire device andnseveral hard drives plus a glossy HDMI 24"'display.
Guess what, Slingmedia has a program for the iPhone/Touch that should work on the iPad as well that lets you watch free Tv without Flash. Amazing, isn't it?
Specifically, the $10 charge got you iPhone OS 3.0, not just the BT firmware.
Plus, adding 3G to the iPad and not enabling is very much different since the BT module is part of the WiFI module, not extra HW being installed independently but sitting dormant.
Comments
To say that something may replace a netbook isn't saying that it is the same thing as a netbook.
I bought my daughter a Toshiba NB205 which had come out two weeks earlier, and had received very good reviews at the time. That was in early July. It cost $400, and I bought the 2 Gb upgrade for $69. So we're talking a $500 machine essentially. She wanted it for her summer in school in the UK to use for Skype, IM, the web, writing assignments and other light weight stuff.
But the thing is horribly slow. I mean horribly. Despite having the fastest Atom chip, its difficult to use it's so slow. I've checked out others, and they're all the same, except that the cheaper ones were even slower.
So sure, it's got a lot of features, runs a PC OS and stuff, but whats it really good for? Not much. Can't play any useful games on it, she tried, and she's a serious gamer. I mean, serious! Even the web using Wifi is slow.
So the iPad can replace that without having all the features that slow it down so much. Ever seriously try to multitask on one of these? It's a joke!
The only good netbook there is is that Alienware Gaming Netbook, which is actually a small notebook that costs $900... $70 more than the top-of-the-line iPad.
I am mostly intrigued about that A4 processor. For what we've seen it could easily outperform a 1.8GHz C2D
1) Having Flash Lite doesn't give you access to the "full web" so these 2007 talking points are pretty lame.
2) Having a full version of Flash doesn't give you access to the "full web" if you consider plug-ins and browser-specific code relevant.
True. You need more than just Flash. The additional stuff needed is another reason to be hesitant of a device which doesn't offer a variety of competent browsers.
3) This device is not designed for "geeks". The sooner you realize that the sooner you understand Apple's market strategy.
Tell you what. I'll realize that BEFORE you start responding to what I actually say.
Wait - I already realize it! And you still respond to your imaginings rather than my words.
2) DVD resolution is 480p/576p. The iPad output H.264, 720p @ 30fps. A little more than "better than DVD" and claiming 720p is not HD is silly.
It cannot display 720p widescreen. In 720p, it is 4:3.
In widescreen, the vertical resolution is 576 (please double check my arithmetic), hardly better than DVD, and certainly not HD.
Let's not argue about what any of these words mean. I think we both understand each other's points.
It's very cool that the iPad can output 720p, so you can hook it up to the TV. But I don't understand the lack of HDMI.
Me too and I can see not useful thing this device can do for me, but it's obvious it will be the most successful tablet to date.[/QUOTE]
The only good netbook there is is that Alienware Gaming Netbook, which is actually a small notebook that costs $900... $70 more than the top-of-the-line iPad.
I am mostly intrigued about that A4 processor. For what we've seen it could easily outperform a 1.8GHz C2D
The Alienware isn't really a netbook, of course. It's weird how the definitions for computers get misty around the edges.
How do we tell a $1,000 netbook from a $400 notebook, esp when they have the same cpu?
Well, if they ALL said they would buy it, that would be very interesting, wouldn't it?
What survey have you ever seen where 100% were in agreement? The fact is right now the iPad is rather underwhelming. You act like somehow when consumers get it in their hands its going to change to something other then an larger iPod Touch. Like I said before right now the iPad is better known for what it lacks rather then what it has to offer.
It's not about raw numbers. For instance, you talk about how many millions of full-feature apps are available to netbook users but overlook the fact that your typical netbook
"Your typical netbook" isn't what the OP was comparing with the iPad. He siad that the iPad is better than any netbook on the market. I was wondering why he thinks that.
What survey have you ever seen where 100% were in agreement? The fact is right now the iPad is rather underwhelming. You act like somehow when consumers get it in their hands its going to change to something other then an larger iPod Touch. Like I said before right now the iPad is better known for what it lacks rather then what it has to offer.
That's why it would be interesting. I didn't bring it up.
So far, the iPad looks great. The most fascinating new device since the iPhone. It will be popular. You have your prejudices. That's fine. But you're trying real hard to ignore what it can do.
]Let's not argue about what any of these words mean. I think we both understand each other's points.
It's very cool that the iPad can output 720p, so you can hook it up to the TV. But I don't understand the lack of HDMI.
No, you don't understand otherwise you wouldn't be asking about HDMI.
It can output 720p iTS HD video to its built-in display, it can be hooked up to a TV and it can output WXGA over the VGA cable. It cannot, according to the spec sheet, output 720p video over the component cables.
No, you don't understand otherwise you wouldn't be asking about HDMI.
It can output 720p iTS HD video to its built-in display, it can be hooked up to a TV and it can output WXGA over the VGA cable. It cannot, according to the spec sheet, output 720p video over the component cables.
HD is also 1024 x 768 screens. Actually, over those screens the pixels get distorted, as on early plasma's which were Hi Def, or it gets shown at a lower horizontal rez with the vertical 1024 in place. There were many plasma's that were also 1024 x 1024 with non square pixels that were also hi def. Very confusing to those who don't understand the field.
1) If you don't make inroads to change tech it's not going to magically change.
2) Screw Farmville! You're finding a specific use for a specific user. That isn't how devices are designed.
3) No one is saying Flash doesn't have it's place, but mobile devices is not of them.
4) Some Good info: : http://daringfireball.net/2010/02/wi...open_standards
5) YouTube and Vimeo moving to HTMl5. Others will follow. Hulu is a video site, not a Flash site, they will move to HTML5 this year.
6) Mozilla on Firefox 3 for Maemo, "The Adobe Flash plugin used on many sites degraded the performance of the browser to the point where it didn?t meet our standards." http://blog.pavlov.net/2010/01/27/fi...for-maemo-rc3/
7) Now it's rumoured that WinMo 7 won't have Flash support, either.
it's not just Apple, it's mobile computing in general, and it's because Adobe dropped the ball years ago. Enough with the anti-Apple crap.
The subject at hand is whether the average shmoe (Apple's iPad customers) will miss flash. IMO, they will.
I don't understand how your post is responsive to the point I was making.
the web and users of the web will be far better off when web sites no longer use flash.
Flash is buggy
Flash crashes browsers
Flash drains batteries
Flash is proprietary
The last one is the killer too - it means that Apple, Microsoft, Google, and Mozilla, etc. cannot fix the problems with flash. They are all dependent on another company to implement flash for them. Everything else they can do themselves.
And kids use flash primarily to play games. Why go to the web for games when you have the app store?
That is all true. Nonetheless, what is also true is the web runs on it and few are in any kind of hurry to change that. You can either have flash or have a lot of things just not load and pray that a miracle happens and everyone magically goes to HTML5 overnight.
HD is also 1024 x 768 screens. Actually, over those screens the pixels get distorted, as on early plasma's which were Hi Def, or it gets shown at a lower horizontal rez with the vertical 1024 in place. There were many plasma's that were also 1024 x 1024 with non square pixels that were also hi def. Very confusing to those who don't understand the field.
Yeah, I remember the old 1024 x 1024 displays. I also remember customers paying us $7k and up for those things. Fujitsu, if I recall, was the one who made the 1024 x 1024 plasma panels and OEM'ed them to Sony as well.
Wow, with that much trust in a company you shouldn't buy anything from them. And so, why bother?
As a Dutch saying goes: "zoals de waard is vertrouwd hij z'n gasten". I think that sums it up quit nicely.
Do you have a personal (factual) reason to be so negative?
J.
How about Apple have done this before?
Apple sold a version of the iPod Touch which had a bluetooth chip inside without telling purchasers. They then later said they could activate the bluetooth by paying $10 for new firmware.
The subject at hand is whether the average shmoe (Apple's iPad customers) will miss flash. IMO, they will.
I don't understand how your post is responsive to the point I was making.
His post was responsive because he was showing how Flash is disappearing.
That is all true. Nonetheless, what is also true is the web runs on it and few are in any kind of hurry to change that. You can either have flash or have a lot of things just not load and pray that a miracle happens and everyone magically goes to HTML5 overnight.
The web doesn't run on Flash. Some services use it. They are disposable. They will be disposed of. The only question is how long it will take.
How about Apple have done this before?
Apple sold a version of the iPod Touch which had a bluetooth chip inside without telling purchasers. They then later said they could activate the bluetooth by paying $10 for new firmware.
You are oversimplifying a complex issue.
Thats easy. Netbooks are a compromise in every possible way. Run a mainsteam OS but not enough memory or cpu. Too small a keyboard and screen. Poor user experience.
geez, drink the Jobs Kool Aid much?
I have a Dell Mini 9 w/2GB of ram on which I dual boot jolicloud & Leopard. Though the keyboard seemed small at first I adjusted (as I had to when I got the iPhone) and I run iWork, iLife and more on this little computer, I can fully surf the web (flash too), I used skype to video conference back home with the webcam and I can expand my memory with SD cards. All that and I can carry it in my jacket pocket like I did during a two week trip to Europe in the fall. It's not my every day computer, I often go a couple of weeks without firing it up, but it's a fully capable travel computer when I want something that DOES NOT have any major compromises but don't want to lug my 15" MBP with me.
It's a great user experience for this user.
$130 extra for 3G is a rip-off. The chip and antenna probably cost $0.50. Hell, the chip is probably just disabled in the non-3G.
I don't like dong stuff like this and don't condone it but it's ironic that the underground people who brought us google voice via jailbreaking to teethering and multitasking, that they will probably be the ones that turn the ipad into the device it "should be" instead of feeling like you have to pay all theses fees for usage when it's really just a way to keep usage down as their 3G is not that fast when compared to wifi. That said. If one has a jailbroken iPhone with teethering, wouldn't that mean that we could get online with the wifi only version via the iPhone?
I wouldn't be surprised in the least if an HP Slate can be turned into a ipad down the road with this group. (See above post). But the irony is if the underground turns the ipad into the device it should be from the start, for example, installing flash into it in order t watch free tv show while in bed or something. Lol. As I have my mbpro hooked up to a highend FireWire device andnseveral hard drives plus a glossy HDMI 24"'display.
Nonetheless it will be intersting to see what the likes of icy, cyndia, osx86 can do.
I wouldn't be surprised in the least if an HP Slate can be turned into a ipad down the road with this group. (See above post). But the irony is if the underground turns the ipad into the device it should be from the start, for example, installing flash into it in order t watch free tv show while in bed or something. Lol. As I have my mbpro hooked up to a highend FireWire device andnseveral hard drives plus a glossy HDMI 24"'display.
Guess what, Slingmedia has a program for the iPhone/Touch that should work on the iPad as well that lets you watch free Tv without Flash. Amazing, isn't it?
You are oversimplifying a complex issue.
Specifically, the $10 charge got you iPhone OS 3.0, not just the BT firmware.
Plus, adding 3G to the iPad and not enabling is very much different since the BT module is part of the WiFI module, not extra HW being installed independently but sitting dormant.