I really hope this is true. The lack of multi-tasking is just painful on my iPhone. Having to quit Safari/Last FM/GTA/Plants vs Zombies etc then load the IM client just to reply to a message, then reload Safari/Last FM etc is not a good experience. The cycle takes the best part of a minute, then when another message comes in I have to do it all over again. Urgh.
They marketed it, but not in a really effective way. Their commercials featuring that girl using it was...weird. Maybe finally being on Verizon will give it a little boost.
That doesn't account for it not selling in every market it's in. For example, in the first 85 days, in an admittedly small country, Ireland, Palm only sold about 220 units! In the UK, where O2 was giving them away for FREE with a 2 year contract, sales per capita have been just as bad.
Why is that? Is it all marketing? That's not likely. The teckie sites, which love to write about anything new, and love to give almost anything new great write-ups, so that they have something to write about, just loved the Pre and WebOS.
So with all of those geeks out there buying phones, why hasn't it sold better anywhere it's being sold?
With the news that Palm stopped production for over three weeks because their customers, Sprint AND Verizon stopped ordering from Palm shows that Verizon isn't doing any better than Sprint.
I really hope this is true. The lack of multi-tasking is just painful on my iPhone. Having to quit Safari/Last FM/GTA/Plants vs Zombies etc then load the IM client just to reply to a message, then reload Safari/Last FM etc is not a good experience. The cycle takes the best part of a minute, then when another message comes in I have to do it all over again. Urgh.
1) The reason you can respond to an IM is that you are getting it from a background process. Having to launch it isn't likely to change once backgrounding comes up as I doubt Apple will allow every run-of-the-mill IM client to overlay other apps. It'll still likely have to take up your current display, thus you'll have to leave whatever app you are currently in.
2) Safari, Mail and iPod do run in the background. You can stream music from Safari while using other apps.
The data suggests that the vast majority of smartphone buyers during the quarter chose to NOT get an iPhone. What do you think accounts for that?
Most people around the world find it to be a hassle, no matter how small, to change carriers to get a particular phone. I know the geeks among us find that hard to believe, but it's true. The rest are happy enough with what they've got, so that they don't want to change. In addition, the features don't excite people who aren't interested in them. If you've got a Blackberry, and your main concerns are phone calls and e-mail, then why should you switch, especially as you're already familiar with your phone?
If you've got a corporate phone that you can use as your own as well, why get an additional phone you then have to pay for?
No, I am comparing apples lack of progress in market share with the meaning of stagnation.
Apple's "economic growth" is a totally different subject than their failure to grow market share.
Tell me how I miscomprehend the definition of stagnation.
how are market share and economic growth directly related they are correlated, but they move independently of each other. Besides that the definition you used in fact states the stagnation is compared over a year and comparing economy growth. You are trying to apply Stagnation to Market Share. An economist would fight you tooth and nail over trying to juxtapose those buzz words for their definitions.
All this inane discussion about how Apple might implement multitasking and switching...the solution is already out there. Spend five minutes with a Palm Pre and you have a wonderful, elegant and intuitive solution to multitasking.
It's simple. It's brilliant. It works. Flick up to see your apps (they show up as smaller windows), swipe left or right to slide through the apps, flick up on an app to kill it, click an app to have it come to full screen.
As Ireland wrote: Next
but then Palm would sue apple...there is probably an even more elegant way to do so....but I do not have all day to dream up these things...but i would be glad to if apple hired me...
That doesn't account for it not selling in every market it's in. For example, in the first 85 days, in an admittedly small country, Ireland, Palm only sold about 220 units! In the UK, where O2 was giving them away for FREE with a 2 year contract, sales per capita have been just as bad.
Why is that? Is it all marketing? That's not likely. The teckie sites, which love to write about anything new, and love to give almost anything new great write-ups, so that they have something to write about, just loved the Pre and WebOS.
So with all of those geeks out there buying phones, why hasn't it sold better anywhere it's being sold?
With the news that Palm stopped production for over three weeks because their customers, Sprint AND Verizon stopped ordering from Palm shows that Verizon isn't doing any better than Sprint.
Ouch... I believe overall, the lack of apps for it is probably what kept customers from getting it (and that the iPhone was available on the same network). webOS is a very good, unique OS. It's just that there's a lack of things to use on it.
I wonder what would happen if Google buy out Palm and merges the two OSs together.
This is just a crazy left-field kind of thought, but since people most definitely *don't* want to "manage" their phones (you are dead right about that IMO), maybe Apple could give the control to the developer instead of the user.
I'm no programmer, but perhaps they could provide some small set of standard "background pipes" for lack of a better word, that developers could use but that the user need not be aware of at all. For instance it seems to me that the only real uses of multitasking on what is essentially a single window system are:
1) music in the background
2) suspending a game when you get a call.
If this just happened automatically because Apple provides the *developer* with a secure backgrounding system, it seems to me this would solve the problem. The user could start Pandora for instance, and when they close it, it simply keeps playing. If they don't want it to keep playing, even a non-techie user could easily surmise that going back to the app and hitting the stop button would fix it. Just like the iPod app is now basically. The background "audio pipe" would only support one app at a time for obvious reasons, and if you started a second app that needed it, it would shut down the first. All of that could esily be seamless and automatic.
If we take it as a given that users don't want to manage their apps, then the only solution that really seems to work IMO is one where it all happens automatically. Then they just add a system daemon that harshly shuts apps down if someone is determined enough to run ten or twelve background apps and memory gets really bad. Almost all users would never encounter any problems or even know anything was different. They would just know that Pandora keeps playing when you leave it now.
You very much do NOT want to give this power back to the developer. We saw what problem that caused with System 9, for example, with its cooperative multitasking. What developer isn't going to want to give his app priority, no matter what "pipes" Apple has open?
With a given technology your choice is either high pixel density or a bright screen. I appreciate the fact that iPhones screen is readable outdoors. It is a rather important feature on a phone. So while I won't discount that higher resolution would be nice, it isn't very useful if it is not readable. Further I want a bigger screen first, even a half to three quaters of an inch extra length woul do wonders. With a little design effort the iPhone would hardly grow in physical length and only slightly in width.
Dave
Higher resolution doesn't affect the brightness of the screen because that's dependent on the LED backlighting, which would be the same regardless.
In addition, it's not likely that the new phone won't be getting a resolution upgrade this summer.
how are market share and economic growth directly related they are correlated, but they move independently of each other. Besides that the definition you used in fact states the stagnation is compared over a year and comparing economy growth. You are trying to apply Stagnation to Market Share. An economist would fight you tooth and nail over trying to juxtapose those buzz words for their definitions.
That might happen. One could argue that Verizon's Droid advertising was very effective in driving sales.
For a short while. The phone sold well, but has since plummeted. A modest seller overall. It's now available on Amazon for $49 with a two year contract. At least it was last week when it was reported.
For a short while. The phone sold well, but has since plummeted. A modest seller overall. It's now available on Amazon for $49 with a two year contract. At least it was last week when it was reported.
If not the Droid advertising, then what do you think accounts for the impressive growth of Android?
Apple was stunned by the latest figures showing stagnation in their iPhone sales. With just weeks away from the new iPhone 4G, this came as a complete shock to the smart phone industry. Steve Jobs said just look at the surging Android figures??OMG they are out pacing us and we will never catch up to RIM.? Jobs was quoted ?It is time to throw in the towel.? Apple had hopes that having multitasking on the iPhone would boost sales?but looking at the graphs on AI showing stagnating sales?Jobs said it obvious the iPhone is dead.
This is the second time this week that Apple took a hit. Jobs said thank God that the iPhone has a camera, we'll be selling the remaining stock as cameras since the paper weight market is saturated by the iPads.
Where did ever try to prove that the graph was global? I recall saying that it did not specify anywhere in the article.
that;s the problem with your arguments and information. You try to take a small sliver that represents your position and present that as your whole argument, deliberately leaving out info that would counter your own position and usually right in your information you provide as the basis for your argument. Which just makes it absurd because are you not even reading what you post, meaning you catch a few buzz words and do not catch key elements, or this is just futile parody and as you said before you choose satire as your form of expression and furthermore the reason its like talking to a brick wall with you. Most logical and non-antagonistic people would weigh the other information and make a conclusion there. You just keep on repeating the same nonsense just semantically different.
that;s the problem with your arguments and information. You try to take a small sliver that represents your position and present that as your whole argument, deliberately leaving out info that would counter your own position and usually right in your information your provide as your basis for your argument. Which just makes it absurd because are you even reading what you post, meaning you catch a few buzz words and do not catch key elements, or this is just futile parody and as you said before you choose satire as your form of expression and furthermore the reason its like talking to a brick wall with you. Most logical and non-antagonistic people would weigh the other information and make a conclusion there. You just keep on repeating the same nonsense just semantically different.
So then I neither said nor implied that the graph showed global sales? Thanks.
What key elements did I miss from the story I linked to?
but then Palm would sue apple...there is probably an even more elegant way to do so....but I do not have all day to dream up these things...but i would be glad to if apple hired me...
It's sad that Apple now caters to the indifferent. Didn't they used to cater to enthusiasts? Or is that a misconception on my part?
You miss the point here. This is still primarily a PHONE!
I know that may be hard to believe, but it's true.
I'm pretty technically sophisticated, but I don't want to be carrying around a phone with OS X on it that resembles my computers at home. When I use it, I want it to be fast and easy. And I do have over 100 apps. If Apple has to come out with some crappy task manager, they're screwed.
I don't want to see:
"You need to close one or more applications" and then see a bunch of icons, or a list.
I see people going, duh, I have them open because I WANT them open. Then they close one, and 15 seconds later they get:
"You need to close one or more applications."
I see that happen on friends phones, and they aren't happy about it.
Apple is building a platform for the long term. They don't do what so many other companies try, which is to do something different several few months, or every year, to try to figure out how it should work as their early versions don't. Apple wants to get it right the first time, if possible. This is a serious matter.
They said some time ago that they were going to put multitasking for third party apps into the phone?when they got it right. I'm not in a rush.
Apple wants to sell a lot of phones and Touches over the long term. They want to evolve the platform properly. Look at what Android's becoming. It's a mess right now, and it's getting worse. In a couple of years, we won't be able to call a phone an Android phone, because they won't be compatible anymore with each other. It will be a fragmented market.
Comments
They marketed it, but not in a really effective way. Their commercials featuring that girl using it was...weird. Maybe finally being on Verizon will give it a little boost.
That doesn't account for it not selling in every market it's in. For example, in the first 85 days, in an admittedly small country, Ireland, Palm only sold about 220 units! In the UK, where O2 was giving them away for FREE with a 2 year contract, sales per capita have been just as bad.
Why is that? Is it all marketing? That's not likely. The teckie sites, which love to write about anything new, and love to give almost anything new great write-ups, so that they have something to write about, just loved the Pre and WebOS.
So with all of those geeks out there buying phones, why hasn't it sold better anywhere it's being sold?
Because PEOPLE don't seem to like it.
http://www.tomsguide.com/us/palm-pre...news-5520.html
With the news that Palm stopped production for over three weeks because their customers, Sprint AND Verizon stopped ordering from Palm shows that Verizon isn't doing any better than Sprint.
I really hope this is true. The lack of multi-tasking is just painful on my iPhone. Having to quit Safari/Last FM/GTA/Plants vs Zombies etc then load the IM client just to reply to a message, then reload Safari/Last FM etc is not a good experience. The cycle takes the best part of a minute, then when another message comes in I have to do it all over again. Urgh.
1) The reason you can respond to an IM is that you are getting it from a background process. Having to launch it isn't likely to change once backgrounding comes up as I doubt Apple will allow every run-of-the-mill IM client to overlay other apps. It'll still likely have to take up your current display, thus you'll have to leave whatever app you are currently in.
2) Safari, Mail and iPod do run in the background. You can stream music from Safari while using other apps.
The data suggests that the vast majority of smartphone buyers during the quarter chose to NOT get an iPhone. What do you think accounts for that?
Most people around the world find it to be a hassle, no matter how small, to change carriers to get a particular phone. I know the geeks among us find that hard to believe, but it's true. The rest are happy enough with what they've got, so that they don't want to change. In addition, the features don't excite people who aren't interested in them. If you've got a Blackberry, and your main concerns are phone calls and e-mail, then why should you switch, especially as you're already familiar with your phone?
If you've got a corporate phone that you can use as your own as well, why get an additional phone you then have to pay for?
There are lots of reasons.
No, I am comparing apples lack of progress in market share with the meaning of stagnation.
Apple's "economic growth" is a totally different subject than their failure to grow market share.
Tell me how I miscomprehend the definition of stagnation.
how are market share and economic growth directly related they are correlated, but they move independently of each other. Besides that the definition you used in fact states the stagnation is compared over a year and comparing economy growth. You are trying to apply Stagnation to Market Share. An economist would fight you tooth and nail over trying to juxtapose those buzz words for their definitions.
All this inane discussion about how Apple might implement multitasking and switching...the solution is already out there. Spend five minutes with a Palm Pre and you have a wonderful, elegant and intuitive solution to multitasking.
It's simple. It's brilliant. It works. Flick up to see your apps (they show up as smaller windows), swipe left or right to slide through the apps, flick up on an app to kill it, click an app to have it come to full screen.
As Ireland wrote: Next
but then Palm would sue apple...there is probably an even more elegant way to do so....but I do not have all day to dream up these things...but i would be glad to if apple hired me...
That doesn't account for it not selling in every market it's in. For example, in the first 85 days, in an admittedly small country, Ireland, Palm only sold about 220 units! In the UK, where O2 was giving them away for FREE with a 2 year contract, sales per capita have been just as bad.
Why is that? Is it all marketing? That's not likely. The teckie sites, which love to write about anything new, and love to give almost anything new great write-ups, so that they have something to write about, just loved the Pre and WebOS.
So with all of those geeks out there buying phones, why hasn't it sold better anywhere it's being sold?
Because PEOPLE don't seem to like it.
http://www.tomsguide.com/us/palm-pre...news-5520.html
With the news that Palm stopped production for over three weeks because their customers, Sprint AND Verizon stopped ordering from Palm shows that Verizon isn't doing any better than Sprint.
Ouch... I believe overall, the lack of apps for it is probably what kept customers from getting it (and that the iPhone was available on the same network). webOS is a very good, unique OS. It's just that there's a lack of things to use on it.
I wonder what would happen if Google buy out Palm and merges the two OSs together.
This is just a crazy left-field kind of thought, but since people most definitely *don't* want to "manage" their phones (you are dead right about that IMO), maybe Apple could give the control to the developer instead of the user.
I'm no programmer, but perhaps they could provide some small set of standard "background pipes" for lack of a better word, that developers could use but that the user need not be aware of at all. For instance it seems to me that the only real uses of multitasking on what is essentially a single window system are:
1) music in the background
2) suspending a game when you get a call.
If this just happened automatically because Apple provides the *developer* with a secure backgrounding system, it seems to me this would solve the problem. The user could start Pandora for instance, and when they close it, it simply keeps playing. If they don't want it to keep playing, even a non-techie user could easily surmise that going back to the app and hitting the stop button would fix it. Just like the iPod app is now basically. The background "audio pipe" would only support one app at a time for obvious reasons, and if you started a second app that needed it, it would shut down the first. All of that could esily be seamless and automatic.
If we take it as a given that users don't want to manage their apps, then the only solution that really seems to work IMO is one where it all happens automatically. Then they just add a system daemon that harshly shuts apps down if someone is determined enough to run ten or twelve background apps and memory gets really bad. Almost all users would never encounter any problems or even know anything was different. They would just know that Pandora keeps playing when you leave it now.
You very much do NOT want to give this power back to the developer. We saw what problem that caused with System 9, for example, with its cooperative multitasking. What developer isn't going to want to give his app priority, no matter what "pipes" Apple has open?
With a given technology your choice is either high pixel density or a bright screen. I appreciate the fact that iPhones screen is readable outdoors. It is a rather important feature on a phone. So while I won't discount that higher resolution would be nice, it isn't very useful if it is not readable. Further I want a bigger screen first, even a half to three quaters of an inch extra length woul do wonders. With a little design effort the iPhone would hardly grow in physical length and only slightly in width.
Dave
Higher resolution doesn't affect the brightness of the screen because that's dependent on the LED backlighting, which would be the same regardless.
In addition, it's not likely that the new phone won't be getting a resolution upgrade this summer.
how are market share and economic growth directly related they are correlated, but they move independently of each other. Besides that the definition you used in fact states the stagnation is compared over a year and comparing economy growth. You are trying to apply Stagnation to Market Share. An economist would fight you tooth and nail over trying to juxtapose those buzz words for their definitions.
I surrender. This ain't worth it.
That might happen. One could argue that Verizon's Droid advertising was very effective in driving sales.
For a short while. The phone sold well, but has since plummeted. A modest seller overall. It's now available on Amazon for $49 with a two year contract. At least it was last week when it was reported.
For a short while. The phone sold well, but has since plummeted. A modest seller overall. It's now available on Amazon for $49 with a two year contract. At least it was last week when it was reported.
If not the Droid advertising, then what do you think accounts for the impressive growth of Android?
This is the second time this week that Apple took a hit. Jobs said thank God that the iPhone has a camera, we'll be selling the remaining stock as cameras since the paper weight market is saturated by the iPads.
Can there be a resumption of the main topic?
Where did ever try to prove that the graph was global? I recall saying that it did not specify anywhere in the article.
that;s the problem with your arguments and information. You try to take a small sliver that represents your position and present that as your whole argument, deliberately leaving out info that would counter your own position and usually right in your information you provide as the basis for your argument. Which just makes it absurd because are you not even reading what you post, meaning you catch a few buzz words and do not catch key elements, or this is just futile parody and as you said before you choose satire as your form of expression and furthermore the reason its like talking to a brick wall with you. Most logical and non-antagonistic people would weigh the other information and make a conclusion there. You just keep on repeating the same nonsense just semantically different.
that;s the problem with your arguments and information. You try to take a small sliver that represents your position and present that as your whole argument, deliberately leaving out info that would counter your own position and usually right in your information your provide as your basis for your argument. Which just makes it absurd because are you even reading what you post, meaning you catch a few buzz words and do not catch key elements, or this is just futile parody and as you said before you choose satire as your form of expression and furthermore the reason its like talking to a brick wall with you. Most logical and non-antagonistic people would weigh the other information and make a conclusion there. You just keep on repeating the same nonsense just semantically different.
So then I neither said nor implied that the graph showed global sales? Thanks.
What key elements did I miss from the story I linked to?
but then Palm would sue apple...there is probably an even more elegant way to do so....but I do not have all day to dream up these things...but i would be glad to if apple hired me...
Not if Apple implements Exposé.
If not the Droid advertising, then what do you think accounts for the impressive growth of Android?
How many times must we go 'round with this circular conversation of yours?
It is new (?)
It is cheap (?)
It has neat commercials (?)
It is available on a wide number of carriers (?)
Pick your poison.
You might be right.
It's sad that Apple now caters to the indifferent. Didn't they used to cater to enthusiasts? Or is that a misconception on my part?
You miss the point here. This is still primarily a PHONE!
I know that may be hard to believe, but it's true.
I'm pretty technically sophisticated, but I don't want to be carrying around a phone with OS X on it that resembles my computers at home. When I use it, I want it to be fast and easy. And I do have over 100 apps. If Apple has to come out with some crappy task manager, they're screwed.
I don't want to see:
"You need to close one or more applications" and then see a bunch of icons, or a list.
I see people going, duh, I have them open because I WANT them open. Then they close one, and 15 seconds later they get:
"You need to close one or more applications."
I see that happen on friends phones, and they aren't happy about it.
Apple is building a platform for the long term. They don't do what so many other companies try, which is to do something different several few months, or every year, to try to figure out how it should work as their early versions don't. Apple wants to get it right the first time, if possible. This is a serious matter.
They said some time ago that they were going to put multitasking for third party apps into the phone?when they got it right. I'm not in a rush.
Apple wants to sell a lot of phones and Touches over the long term. They want to evolve the platform properly. Look at what Android's becoming. It's a mess right now, and it's getting worse. In a couple of years, we won't be able to call a phone an Android phone, because they won't be compatible anymore with each other. It will be a fragmented market.