New Office 11 for Mac sports dense ribbons of buttons

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  • Reply 41 of 119
    I don't see why they chose to split functionality between the toolbar and the ribbon. They used the toolbar before and they want to move to the ribbon now. They somehow don't want to leave the toolbar behind so they split the workload between them. Though if I had the option to put font options on the toolbar then the ribbon would go unused, kind of like the "elements gallery" now.



    I also wonder, do they still have the palette like they did in office 2008? I see that icon that was the popup icon for the palette back in '08 but I'm wondering whether you just press it to expand and minimize the ribbon. If they have the palette it's good when it comes to choice.



    Edit: And what's with the "nicknames" for microsoft. Last thing I want to see is someone calling macs "mac$" or seeing "@pple" or whatever. Kind of silly if you ask me.
  • Reply 42 of 119
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    It seems clear to me that the author's used the phrase 'Windows Vista-era "Ribbon"' instead of just using a more general term to refer to the ribbon as to specifically prevent confusion



    The author used that exact phrase. That was what I remember to. It was too prevent confusion.
  • Reply 43 of 119
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post


    Will take the iWork look over Office any day. Attractive, clean, simple, obvious.



    Most importantly, clean -- not a freakin' jumble of everything-but-the-kitchen-sink-oh-wait-a-minute-we'll-break-it-up-into-hundreds-of-pieces-and-toss-'em-all-in.



    And yes, the floppy-disk icon -- out of time, and out of place. Paging Mr. Peabody and the WABAC Machine: you're needed in the Office Group at Microsoft!!!



    Speaking of the Office Group, I just loved this comment:



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post


    Microsoft has not delivered a tablet version of Office, reportedly because of political and management issues flaring between the Office group and engineers working on Tablet PC.



    Is anybody here surprised -- anybody? I'll call Ripley's first thing in the morning to share the news...
  • Reply 44 of 119
    nikon133nikon133 Posts: 2,600member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    How about a link from the company that actually made the Windows Ribbon Framework.
    Look at that, tou even got lucky because Microsoft even stats everything I previous stated all in one page as this is general knowledge for those that have a working knowledge of Windows.



    I think you are a bit off target, Sol.



    Similar in functionality and appearance to the Microsoft Office 2007 Fluent user interface, the Ribbon framework is composed of a ribbon command bar that exposes...




    This implies that Ribbon Framework is created after the fashion of Office 2007 Ribbons, not the other way around; since Vista SP2 is minimum requirement, Ribbon Framework is way younger than Office 2007. Additionally, it is only similar in functionality and appearance... which does not mean it is the same thing, but same GUI philosophy.



    Basically, they borrowed idea from Office 2007 and implemented it into Ribbon Framework - not the other way around. But same thing? I don't think so...
  • Reply 45 of 119
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by nikon133 View Post


    I think you are a bit off target, Sol.



    Similar in functionality and appearance to the Microsoft Office 2007 Fluent user interface, the Ribbon framework is composed of a ribbon command bar that exposes...




    This implies that Ribbon Framework is created after the fashion of Office 2007 Ribbons, not the other way around; since Vista SP2 is minimum requirement, Ribbon Framework is way younger than Office 2007. Additionally, it is only similar in functionality and appearance... which does not mean it is the same thing, but same GUI philosophy.



    Basically, they borrowed idea from Office 2007 and implemented it into Ribbon Framework - not the other way around. But same thing? I don't think so...



    That is exactly what I stated. Of course the took the idea for Windows Ribbon Framework from the Fluent UI Ribbon as it predates it. The author very clearly (or so I thought) uses the Vista-era Ribbon phrase, which refers to the Windows Ribbon Framework which only came about in Vista SP2, not Fluent's Ribbon feature. Angus was stating that nothing of the sort existed and I clearly (or so I thought) pointed out that Windows Ribbon Framework is Vista SP2 and later, and colloquially referred to as Vista Ribbon specially so it's not confused with Fluent.
  • Reply 46 of 119
    nikon133nikon133 Posts: 2,600member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    And there we have the trolls typical flipfloping on the debate when he actually realizes he's backed himself into yet another corner. Sad.



    Let's go back to te beginning. You angrily exclaimed that the author's clear use of the phrase "Vista Ribbon" which has been pointed out refers to the Windows Ribbons Framework found in Vista SP2.



    But now you claiming that I stated "Windows Office 2007 [requires] Vista to have the ribbon interface". What Mickey Mouse world do you live in that you think that makes sense?



    Technically, I'd say article is not correct for calling Office Ribbons Vista Ribbons, as Office ribbons are pre-dating Windows Ribbons Framework (a.k.a Vista Ribbon). It makes more sense the other way around, calling Windows Ribbons Framework Office Ribbons, though considering requirements, it is obvious look and feel are comparable, but execution is completely different.



    Does this make any sense?
  • Reply 47 of 119
    nikon133nikon133 Posts: 2,600member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post




    Will take the iWork look over Office any day. Attractive, clean, simple, obvious.



    You don't even have to say - we all know you'd rather take Mac equivalent of Notepad than MS Word
  • Reply 48 of 119
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by nikon133 View Post


    Technically, I'd say article is not correct for calling Office Ribbons Vista Ribbons, as Office ribbons are pre-dating Windows Ribbons Framework (a.k.a Vista Ribbon). It makes more sense the other way around, calling Windows Ribbons Framework Office Ribbons, though considering requirements, it is obvious look and feel are comparable, but execution is completely different.



    Does this make any sense?



    It makes sense the way the author wrote it, the way MS explains it which is the way I know it and what I stated.
  • Reply 49 of 119
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post






    Will take the iWork look over Office any day. Attractive, clean, simple, obvious.



    I'm going to have to disagree here. Too many common tasks are buried in iWork. My one gripe with Office for Mac is that it was too different from the Windows version. I especially hate the function bar for Excel being docked at the top...and it also defaults to not show it at all. I think this new design is a step in the RIGHT direction.
  • Reply 50 of 119
    kcmackcmac Posts: 1,051member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by oneaburns View Post


    I'm going to have to disagree here. Too many common tasks are buried in iWork. My one gripe with Office for Mac is that it was too different from the Windows version. I especially hate the function bar for Excel being docked at the top...and it also defaults to not show it at all. I think this new design is a step in the RIGHT direction.



    What common tasks?
  • Reply 51 of 119
    saldogsaldog Posts: 48member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    As usual you fail on every level, even attacking the author for your ignorance.



    MS Office 2007 offered the Fluent user interface. This is similar in both appearance and functionality to the Windows Ribbon Framework, often referred to as Vista Ribbon because the minimum requirements were Windows Vista SP2.



    You shouldn't call people ignorant when you're the one who's ignorant.



    The Ribbon Bar is not referred to as a Vista Bar by Windows users. The author should be cut some slack since this is not a Microsoft fan site, but it is what it is. Don't act like a troll.
  • Reply 52 of 119
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Saldog View Post


    You shouldn't call people ignorant when you're the one who's ignorant.



    The Ribbon Bar is not referred to as a Vista Bar by Windows users. The author should be cut some slack since this is not a Microsoft fan site, but it is what it is. Don't act like a troll.



    And which troll created this new alias? iGenius? Angus Young?



    This is simple, simple stuff. The Fluent UI came BEFORE Vista so it can't be the Vista-era Ribbon mentioned in the article. Since the author specific referred to the Vista-era Ribbon it CANNOT be the the Ribbon in Fluent UI, which predates Vista. By process of elimination it has to be Windows Ribbon Framework, again ad nauseum, requires Vista SP2. How many links to MS sites do you need before you understand evolution of technology.
  • Reply 53 of 119
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post


    Will take the iWork look over Office any day. Attractive, clean, simple, obvious.



    Absolutely. I keep a copy of Office 2004 around ONLY for emergencies. BTW: RTF files are MUCH more cross-platform compatible than ANY MS document format.



    But, you forgot the Inspector window, which is where most of the iWork stuff can be found and happens!
  • Reply 54 of 119
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by oneaburns View Post


    I'm going to have to disagree here. Too many common tasks are buried in iWork.



    Look in the Inspector window. Although it IS rather complex, but once you figure it out, no problems. I'll take it over any hideous ribbon or zillion and one menus and sub-menus.
  • Reply 55 of 119
    The hell are people quibbling over Windows versions of Office?



    Who cares?

    And CERTAINLY why on earth would ANYONE on a Macintosh forum give a flying fuck?
  • Reply 56 of 119
    saldogsaldog Posts: 48member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    And which troll created this new alias? iGenius? Angus Young?



    This is simple, simple stuff. The Fluent UI came BEFORE Vista so it can't be the Vista-era Ribbon mentioned in the article. Since the author specific referred to the Vista-era Ribbon it CANNOT be the the Ribbon in Fluent UI, which predates Vista. By process of elimination it has to be Windows Ribbon Framework, again ad nauseum, requires Vista SP2. How many links to MS sites do you need before you understand evolution of technology.



    I don't need to look at Microsoft's web site. Just the 20 machines at my work running XP and Office 2007, all with Ribbon Bars. Troll.



    Not an alias. Not a MS fan boy. Love Macs but have to use Windows at work. Hard core Windows user for about 20 years. I have iWork at home. Nowhere near as powerful as Office. Office for Mac should work just like Office Windows to deal with the simple fact that we have to switch back and forth regularly. MS finally understands this and is making Office 2011 more like 2007.
  • Reply 57 of 119
    saldogsaldog Posts: 48member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    And which troll created this new alias? iGenius? Angus Young?



    This is simple, simple stuff. The Fluent UI came BEFORE Vista so it can't be the Vista-era Ribbon mentioned in the article. Since the author specific referred to the Vista-era Ribbon it CANNOT be the the Ribbon in Fluent UI, which predates Vista. By process of elimination it has to be Windows Ribbon Framework, again ad nauseum, requires Vista SP2. How many links to MS sites do you need before you understand evolution of technology.



    OK so you're trying to tell us the author is referring to a DIFFERENT Ribbon Bar than the one in Office 2007? So, he is referring to a Vista-era Ribbon, which is much newer and special than the one in Office 2007? What product does THAT Ribbon Bar appear in? WordPad? Paint?



    You made a few comments and called someone else ignorant, thinking you're smart because you went to MS' web site. Do you even have access to a Windows PC? Have you ever even seen Office 2007, let alone use it for getting anything done? Best Buy doesn't count.



    iWork is pretty and I wish I could use it everyday. But the simple fact is that it is nowhere near as powerful or ubiquitous as Office. Hey, I think MS blows too so I'm no fan boy, but Office is still king of the office. Once MS makes the Mac version run Visual Freaking Basic once again and have a similar look and feel to the Windows version, they will truly have something. I say that still being a fan of Apple's UI rules.



    By the way, there are so many more features and capabilities in Office than in iWork that MS needed to do something about how far deep these features lie within the UI. I hated the Ribbon Bar at first but I'm getting used to it. If 2011 has VBA, I'm in. Otherwise, I'm sticking with 2004.



    Saldog

    iMac 24/Mini/MB 13/MBP 15/iPhone/iPad(in a few days!)
  • Reply 58 of 119
    fleetfleet Posts: 9member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Saldog View Post


    I don't need to look at Microsoft's web site. Just the 20 machines at my work running XP and Office 2007, all with Ribbon Bars. Troll.



    Not an alias. Not a MS fan boy. Love Macs but have to use Windows at work. Hard core Windows user for about 20 years. I have iWork at home. Nowhere near as powerful as Office. Office for Mac should work just like Office Windows to deal with the simple fact that we have to switch back and forth regularly. MS finally understands this and is making Office 2011 more like 2007.



    Solipsism would get further if he left out the insults, but he is not trying to say that Office 2007 does not have the ribbon in Windows XP. He is simply trying to explain that there are two implementations of the ribbon interface at Microsoft, the Fluent UI and the Windows Ribbon Framework. The Fluent UI for Office was created first and is only used in Office. Based off of that the Windows group created the Windows Ribbon Framework to use in other Windows applications and for use by other developers. The two implementations are different though similar and the reason there are two different implementations of the ribbon likely has to do with internal politics within Microsoft.



    Solipsism's original post was in response to AngusYoung's statement that the author, in referring to the ribbon in Office for Mac as the Vista Ribbon, was showing his ignorance on the subject. Solipsism tried to point out that the author of the article was probably referring to the Windows Ribbon Framework when he stated that it was a Vista Ribbon, as the framework was added in Vista SP2. Perhaps the author felt that the look of the ribbon more closely resembles the ribbon that is part of the framework built for Vista than the Office ribbon and was not actually ignorant of the ribbons origins. This is obviously what Solipsism was trying to point out but AngusYoung took the statements and provided references to mean that Solipsism was trying to argue that the ribbon in Office 2007 was only available in Vista SP2 and later which was not the case.



    From that point neither of them really seemed to understand what the other was saying and things got ugly. Solipsism even accused AngusYoung of changing his argument part way through, which he did not. AngusYoung simply failed to properly understand what Solipsism was trying to say and Solipsism failed to recognize how AngusYoung was interpreting his statements and explain the misunderstanding. If they had taken the time to better understand what the other was saying they would have realized that they were both right about certain things and weren't really arguing the same point of contention.



    Solipsism is correct in saying that the Windows Ribbon Framework was created as part of Windows Vista SP2 and later. Solipsism could be correct in saying that this is what the author was referring to when he compared the Office for Mac ribbon to the Vista ribbon. AngusYoung was correct in pointing out that Office 2007 was the first program to have the ribbon interface and that the ribbon in Office is available on Windows XP. On these two points Solipsism is in agreement. So, there would seem to be nothing more to argue about. The case is closed.
  • Reply 59 of 119
    saldogsaldog Posts: 48member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by fleet View Post


    Solipsism would get further if he left out the insults, but he is not trying to say that Office 2007 does not have the ribbon in Windows XP. He is simply trying to explain that there are two implementations of the ribbon interface at Microsoft, the Fluent UI and the Windows Ribbon Framework. The Fluent UI for Office was created first and is only used in Office. Based off of that the Windows group created the Windows Ribbon Framework to use in other Windows applications and for use by other developers. The two implementations are different though similar and the reason there are two different implementations of the ribbon likely has to do with internal politics within Microsoft.



    Solipsism's original post was in response to AngusYoung's statement that the author, in referring to the ribbon in Office for Mac as the Vista Ribbon, was showing his ignorance on the subject. Solipsism tried to point out that the author of the article was probably referring to the Windows Ribbon Framework when he stated that it was a Vista Ribbon, as the framework was added in Vista SP2. Perhaps the author felt that the look of the ribbon more closely resembles the ribbon that is part of the framework built for Vista than the Office ribbon and was not actually ignorant of the ribbons origins. This is obviously what Solipsism was trying to point out but AngusYoung took the statements and provided references to mean that Solipsism was trying to argue that the ribbon in Office 2007 was only available in Vista SP2 and later which was not the case.



    From that point neither of them really seemed to understand what the other was saying and things got ugly. Solipsism even accused AngusYoung of changing his argument part way through, which he did not. AngusYoung simply failed to properly understand what Solipsism was trying to say and Solipsism failed to recognize how AngusYoung was interpreting his statements and explain the misunderstanding. If they had taken the time to better understand what the other was saying they would have realized that they were both right about certain things and weren't really arguing the same point of contention.



    Solipsism is correct in saying that the Windows Ribbon Framework was created as part of Windows Vista SP2 and later. Solipsism could be correct in saying that this is what the author was referring to when he compared the Office for Mac ribbon to the Vista ribbon. AngusYoung was correct in pointing out that Office 2007 was the first program to have the ribbon interface and that the ribbon in Office is available on Windows XP. On these two points Solipsism is in agreement. So, there would seem to be nothing more to argue about. The case is closed.



    Thanks fleet. Clears things up. Nicely done.
  • Reply 60 of 119
    fleetfleet Posts: 9member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Saldog View Post


    Thanks fleet. Clears things up. Nicely done.



    Thanks, glad to be of service.
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