I must admit. I love my iPhone (on Original recently upgraded to 3GS). I am experiencing a NUMBER of dropped calls. Didn't happen when I first got my original iPhone, nor when I first upgraded to this one. 3 months later its dropping nearly every other call.
I'm getting around -80 on my Field Test where a large amount of dropped calls happen. I'm on WiFi/3G.
So. For two+ years I could count the number of dropped calls on one hand. Recently I find myself losing count. And this is from Palm Beach to Miami...
Using an average for this kind of data is non-sensical.
An iPhone user on AT&T doesn't meet an average - they meet the conditions for that city, that block, that neighborhood.
IT's very likely that the call drop levels for SF, NY are much higher than figures indicate, but all the other areas tested bring the average down (though it's still higher than the others).
I CANNOT WAIT TO GET RID OF THESE CLOWNS!!! At least 75% of my calls get dropped. They must be the absolute laughing stock of the cell phone industry. I've come to not like the actor so much who's getting paid by them to LIE to us daily via commercials.
I hope I never have an actual emergency, and need to use my cell. ATT is an anchor tied to the APPLE iPhone.
I drive from North NJ to South NJ daily. My brother lives in upstate NY, and has the same issues.
Do the people they asked understand when a dropped call is because of their end and not the other end of the phone call?
Most of the dropped calls I've gotten on my iPhone 3G seem to come down as follows:
All dropped calls where I was on an iPhone through AT&T and the other side was on the Verizon Network: Almost completely the fault of the Verizon Network.
All dropped calls where I was on an iPhone through AT&T and the other side was on the Sprint Network: About 50% AT&T and 50% Sprint drops.
Of course a survey of average users is not a technical analysis. It is basically opinion and hear say. I used to have Verizon and most of the dropped calls I got was when I was talking to Cingular users.
I'm not usually a conspiracy theorist but let me know what you think of this idea. I was on hold the other day on my iPhone connected to a business land line. I was holding for a long time with no music or other audible data whatsoever. I was not moving and I had a strong signal. After about 5 minutes the iPhone dropped the call. So my theory is that AT&T listens to the call and when there is no content for a given amount of time it disconnects to save bandwidth.
ATT has taken the brunt of the heat for their networks performance from mostly iPhone users. Most of these dropped call surveys come from IPHONE USERS. Well we all need to realize its not ATT its APPLE AND THE IPHONE DESIGN I have proof. I currently have 2 to three handsets including the Iphone because my company develops mobile applications for the Iphone and Android. SO right now I have 2 lines one with an 3gs 16g and the other an ATT compatible NEXUS ONE. THE Call quality on the NEXUS one is MILES AHEAD of the IPHONE MILES AHEAD. The difference in call quality is so significant that I usually do all of my phone calls on the Nexus One. I can be in my parking garage for example and my Iphone will read no service and my Nexus one will have 3g ( I carry both phones all the time). APPLE needs to improve the call and signal quality of the Iphone. If the phone had been on TMOBILE it will would have been the same issue. The problem is with the IPHONE. Put your ATT sim in a GSM Palm Pre or Nexus One ( I have done this ) and the network is fine. The data speeds on my nexus one are insane and things load notably faster on the Nexus One. I have both phones so I know from first hand experience.
I am in Las Vegas and get very few dropped calls; overall I am satisfied of At&t.
Maybe my calls were being dropped on the other end then. The person I was calling didn't have an iPhone. Also when my call was dropped, I always had 4-5 bars. And another friend who had a Blackberry (and AT&T) called the same friend and still dropped every call. We were all at different places on the strip.
I mean come on - how many of us actually make phone calls with the iphone? I use all of 10 minutes of my 450 minutes each month. All my use is data - and I don't think they're counting slow or unavailable data as 'dropped calls'. How do we get counted?
I was originally with Cingular and continued on with AT$T when they merged. Immediately after the merger my phone calls started "dropping immediately" This was roughly 6 yr ago!
Needless to say, I left AT$T but came back a few years later to buy an iPhone 3GS model. I can barely use my phone on the base on Coronado Island (San Diego, CA). The service is so shotty, data too?!?!
I would say 10% of my calls to family in Tulsa, OK from San Diego receive some sort of cell phone interference or end up being dropped calls.
I understand the pressure AT$T is under to meet the demand, but why not provide relief to their customers (meaning credits) until they solve their network issues.
Customer satisfaction is low and will continue to be low unless they prove they value the customer?s loyalty...
I live in Manhattan, but this happens whether I'm at home or anywhere above-ground in the metro area. I travel to Boston a lot on the train - 100 percent of calls over 1 minute are dropped while the train is moving, anywhere on the line, and there is "no service" 50 percent of the area between New Haven and Providence - in two of the most densely-populated states in the country.
This article talks about volume of complaints, but no one at AT&T has ever surveyed me, so how would they even know my calls are dropped so frequently? If it's some automated internal record-keeping there, how do we know the statistics are accurate and the books not cooked? No one I know has 15 minutes to spare every day to call AT&T and register a complaint, so what sort of legitimacy does the rate of complaints have that AT&T cites?
PS - to all of those who huff and puff about AT&T being a "business, not a public service" and therefore we have no right to complain about service: Customers complaining is the only way any business improves. Their managers only know _why_ their business sucks if customers tell them, rather than just leaving. As with EVERY telecom company, the rank-and-file workers at AT&T could care less what the customers think, much less innovate improvements on their own, but they are obligated to pass along actual complaints. Plus, we all pay a lot of money to have iPhones and we have every right to expect excellent service and to complain to them if we don't.
I understand the pressure AT$T is under to meet the demand, but why not provide relief to their customers (meaning credits) until they solve their network issues.
Quote:
Originally Posted by luft
Needless to say, I left AT$T but came back a few years later to buy an iPhone 3GS model.
I think you answered your own question. As long as AT&T is the exclusive provider for the iPhone, they probably simply think "where else are you going to go?"
Does anyone know of a way to not pay the cancellation fee for a cell contract? I read from one of the forums in the WSJ that you can write a complaint to the FCC and then somehow be freed from your contract? Anyone have any magic way that they would like to share?
Swap your contract, if you still need cellular service but on a different carrier. Here's one example (for which I have no experience and can not vouch for):
AAPL is up 100% in one year, and 25% in the last two months alone.
For the year it's up, but it's all relative isn't it? AAPL's down nearly $20 in 2 weeks. I'm wondering just what the severity of the Greek problem (and the wider Euro problem) will have on the US market.
ATT has taken the brunt of the heat for their networks performance from mostly iPhone users. Most of these dropped call surveys come from IPHONE USERS. Well we all need to realize its not ATT its APPLE AND THE IPHONE DESIGN I have proof. I currently have 2 to three handsets including the Iphone because my company develops mobile applications for the Iphone and Android. SO right now I have 2 lines one with an 3gs 16g and the other an ATT compatible NEXUS ONE. THE Call quality on the NEXUS one is MILES AHEAD of the IPHONE MILES AHEAD. The difference in call quality is so significant that I usually do all of my phone calls on the Nexus One. I can be in my parking garage for example and my Iphone will read no service and my Nexus one will have 3g ( I carry both phones all the time). APPLE needs to improve the call and signal quality of the Iphone. If the phone had been on TMOBILE it will would have been the same issue. The problem is with the IPHONE. Put your ATT sim in a GSM Palm Pre or Nexus One ( I have done this ) and the network is fine. The data speeds on my nexus one are insane and things load notably faster on the Nexus One. I have both phones so I know from first hand experience.
from the article: "The survey contrasts a study released in February, which found that AT&T had undergone a "drastic makeover" over the span of eight months, improving its 3G network speed by 84 percent. That test, conducted in 13 cities across the country, found that AT&T's network was 94 percent reliable -- the best among its competitors."
this article is about a SURVEY of OPINIONS. the study released in Feb 2010 was based on HARD FACTS and FIELD TESTING. so, which group of data would you feel is more trustworthy and more based on reality....the "opinion survey" or the field testing of actual hardware in multiple cities?
people love to hate ATT. it seems to be our national pastime as of late. people always assume if a call drops then it is ATT's fault. there is only one way to tell for certain how/why the call dropped, and that is by checking the call logs from the network, which can only be accessed by the carrier's engineers and tech support personnel. i repeat, you cannot be sure how or why the call dropped unless you go into the network and trace the call logs of the carrier.
public perception is this: "att = bad, verizon = good".
this perception is in part driven by the experience of iphone users in 2007 (the original iphone 2G radio had reception problems, which was a hardware issue from APPLE, not ATT), and in 2008 when the 3G iphone came out (att's brand new, fledgling 3G network was overloaded, which was ATT's fault--but a 5000% increase in data usage would be hard to predict, and even if predicted, impossible to deal with in a short time, for any company).
but mainly this negative perception has been driven by the ruthlessly clever and amazingly effective Verizon ad campaign--which ignores the great improvements ATT has made, and ignores the reality of the current ATT network. so when a call drops, people always assume it has to be ATT's fault, when it could be a problem with the cellphone, or the simcard, or the other carrier, yes the other carriers drop calls too. Verizon is not perfect. nor is any wireless carrier. if apple had gone with verizon in 2007 instead of Cingular/ATT, then everything that is being said of ATT, all the hatred, all the "ATT sux" comments would be directed at verizon instead.
another reality check: Apple does not want a CDMA iphone, Apple will never make a CDMA phone. the WSJ article about "a Verizon iphone in 2010 or 2011" is complete bullspit. why? because you cannot use voice and data at the same time on CDMA (sprint and verizon are CDMA networks). apple does NOT want the iphone experience to go backwards in technology or user experience....which is what would happen with a CDMA verizon iphone. not to mention the cost of creating a new version of iphone with different technology (read: worse technology).
it may be a different story in 2013 or 2014, when Verizon and Sprint have LTE/4G completely built out. at that time, ATT will have LTE 4G built out too, so i figure at that time, iphone may be available to all USA carriers.
i love my iphone and it works great. my ATT service is stellar, with no dropped calls (wireless reception and customer service both are awesome).
DISCLAIMER: I am an AT&T customer and an iPhone owner. I am also an AT&T employee. My posts reflect my own personal opinions and do not necessarily represent AT&T’s positions, strategies or opinions.
..., it's only for a broadband modem and there are no phones with LTE on TeliaSonera.
Maybe because there are no LTE phones available yet?
You'll also have to wait for a while before IMS is working, usable and available on LTE phones. So since there's no voice in practise in LTE for a while yet, broadband modem is all it's gonna be for the next few years.
Still doesn't mean that the Swedes and Norwegians don't have an LTE network. They do. But it's natural that it's only in the cities at the moment (but spreading during this year as the manufacturers get something else besides prototypes out in the field).
Doesn't really matter if it is or not. In this particular case he is correct. The amount of comments and questions I get from network engineers (during 3G trainings that I give) concerning iPhone related problems (dropped calls, exessive signalling load etc.) leads me to the same conclusion. As a GSM/3G phone, the iPhone is apparently not very good. Many of the problems seem to come from overly agressive power savings that they need to do since it seems that otherwise the iPhone would kill its battery too soon.
As a portable computer with excellent UX and app store, it's currently superior, as a phone / wireless device not so good.
The amount of comments and questions I get from network engineers (during 3G trainings that I give) concerning iPhone related problems (dropped calls, exessive signalling load etc.) leads me to the same conclusion.
Could you perhaps be clearer about how technical questions raised by the trainees are specifically related to the iPhone--whose numbers far surpass the Nexus One on AT&T--and not to 3G devices in general on AT&T's network?
Great charts, Verizon looks to have the best network.
FiOS is an excellent product too, so Verizon has it good wireless and wired.
I was on Verizon since the days they were named Bell Atlantic Mobile. They were always fine.
I switched to ATT and got an iPhone. ATT seems fine too.
I don't think that in most places, the choice makes any real difference. In areas of low population density, however, the choice of carrier is extremely important. When I go to Vermont, there are areas that are dead to Verizon, and others that are dead to ATT.
If I lived in NYC or SF, likely I'd say that Verizon is a better choice, but my guess is that some local company has all 4 national companies beat in the metro area.
This carrier lock-in, which Apple not only promotes, but profits from, hurts consumers. We have less choice of carrier than would be optimal.
Comments
I'm getting around -80 on my Field Test where a large amount of dropped calls happen. I'm on WiFi/3G.
So. For two+ years I could count the number of dropped calls on one hand. Recently I find myself losing count. And this is from Palm Beach to Miami...
Using an average for this kind of data is non-sensical.
An iPhone user on AT&T doesn't meet an average - they meet the conditions for that city, that block, that neighborhood.
IT's very likely that the call drop levels for SF, NY are much higher than figures indicate, but all the other areas tested bring the average down (though it's still higher than the others).
I CANNOT WAIT TO GET RID OF THESE CLOWNS!!! At least 75% of my calls get dropped. They must be the absolute laughing stock of the cell phone industry. I've come to not like the actor so much who's getting paid by them to LIE to us daily via commercials.
I hope I never have an actual emergency, and need to use my cell. ATT is an anchor tied to the APPLE iPhone.
I drive from North NJ to South NJ daily. My brother lives in upstate NY, and has the same issues.
Who did they ask to get this information?
Do the people they asked understand when a dropped call is because of their end and not the other end of the phone call?
Most of the dropped calls I've gotten on my iPhone 3G seem to come down as follows:
All dropped calls where I was on an iPhone through AT&T and the other side was on the Verizon Network: Almost completely the fault of the Verizon Network.
All dropped calls where I was on an iPhone through AT&T and the other side was on the Sprint Network: About 50% AT&T and 50% Sprint drops.
Of course a survey of average users is not a technical analysis. It is basically opinion and hear say. I used to have Verizon and most of the dropped calls I got was when I was talking to Cingular users.
I'm not usually a conspiracy theorist but let me know what you think of this idea. I was on hold the other day on my iPhone connected to a business land line. I was holding for a long time with no music or other audible data whatsoever. I was not moving and I had a strong signal. After about 5 minutes the iPhone dropped the call. So my theory is that AT&T listens to the call and when there is no content for a given amount of time it disconnects to save bandwidth.
Trust Me.
I am in Las Vegas and get very few dropped calls; overall I am satisfied of At&t.
Maybe my calls were being dropped on the other end then. The person I was calling didn't have an iPhone. Also when my call was dropped, I always had 4-5 bars. And another friend who had a Blackberry (and AT&T) called the same friend and still dropped every call. We were all at different places on the strip.
Guess it is several different factors.
Every time I get disconnected from someone, it's always the same thing. I call back and say "Oh, god, you're on AT&T aren't you?" Of course they are.
I'm on Cricket. I pay $45 a month for everything unlimited. I never have dropped calls.
PLEASE, APPLE, PLEASE. Please add a second carrier for the iPhone.
I mean come on - how many of us actually make phone calls with the iphone? I use all of 10 minutes of my 450 minutes each month. All my use is data - and I don't think they're counting slow or unavailable data as 'dropped calls'. How do we get counted?
Needless to say, I left AT$T but came back a few years later to buy an iPhone 3GS model. I can barely use my phone on the base on Coronado Island (San Diego, CA). The service is so shotty, data too?!?!
I would say 10% of my calls to family in Tulsa, OK from San Diego receive some sort of cell phone interference or end up being dropped calls.
I understand the pressure AT$T is under to meet the demand, but why not provide relief to their customers (meaning credits) until they solve their network issues.
Customer satisfaction is low and will continue to be low unless they prove they value the customer?s loyalty...
25 % of calls under 2 minutes are dropped
50 % of calls 2 - 7 minutes are dropped
100 % of calls 7+ minutes are dropped
I live in Manhattan, but this happens whether I'm at home or anywhere above-ground in the metro area. I travel to Boston a lot on the train - 100 percent of calls over 1 minute are dropped while the train is moving, anywhere on the line, and there is "no service" 50 percent of the area between New Haven and Providence - in two of the most densely-populated states in the country.
This article talks about volume of complaints, but no one at AT&T has ever surveyed me, so how would they even know my calls are dropped so frequently? If it's some automated internal record-keeping there, how do we know the statistics are accurate and the books not cooked? No one I know has 15 minutes to spare every day to call AT&T and register a complaint, so what sort of legitimacy does the rate of complaints have that AT&T cites?
PS - to all of those who huff and puff about AT&T being a "business, not a public service" and therefore we have no right to complain about service: Customers complaining is the only way any business improves. Their managers only know _why_ their business sucks if customers tell them, rather than just leaving. As with EVERY telecom company, the rank-and-file workers at AT&T could care less what the customers think, much less innovate improvements on their own, but they are obligated to pass along actual complaints. Plus, we all pay a lot of money to have iPhones and we have every right to expect excellent service and to complain to them if we don't.
I understand the pressure AT$T is under to meet the demand, but why not provide relief to their customers (meaning credits) until they solve their network issues.
Needless to say, I left AT$T but came back a few years later to buy an iPhone 3GS model.
I think you answered your own question. As long as AT&T is the exclusive provider for the iPhone, they probably simply think "where else are you going to go?"
How and where were customers polled?
What was the response rate for customers of each carrier?
How accurate is an individual's concept of their dropped-call frequency?
Since when is frequency expressed in percent?!
How do we know respondents didn't exaggerate or out-right lie?
Who sponsored the poll?
Does anyone know of a way to not pay the cancellation fee for a cell contract? I read from one of the forums in the WSJ that you can write a complaint to the FCC and then somehow be freed from your contract? Anyone have any magic way that they would like to share?
Swap your contract, if you still need cellular service but on a different carrier. Here's one example (for which I have no experience and can not vouch for):
http://www.cellswapper.com
Is that a joke?
AAPL is up 100% in one year, and 25% in the last two months alone.
For the year it's up, but it's all relative isn't it? AAPL's down nearly $20 in 2 weeks. I'm wondering just what the severity of the Greek problem (and the wider Euro problem) will have on the US market.
ATT has taken the brunt of the heat for their networks performance from mostly iPhone users. Most of these dropped call surveys come from IPHONE USERS. Well we all need to realize its not ATT its APPLE AND THE IPHONE DESIGN I have proof. I currently have 2 to three handsets including the Iphone because my company develops mobile applications for the Iphone and Android. SO right now I have 2 lines one with an 3gs 16g and the other an ATT compatible NEXUS ONE. THE Call quality on the NEXUS one is MILES AHEAD of the IPHONE MILES AHEAD. The difference in call quality is so significant that I usually do all of my phone calls on the Nexus One. I can be in my parking garage for example and my Iphone will read no service and my Nexus one will have 3g ( I carry both phones all the time). APPLE needs to improve the call and signal quality of the Iphone. If the phone had been on TMOBILE it will would have been the same issue. The problem is with the IPHONE. Put your ATT sim in a GSM Palm Pre or Nexus One ( I have done this ) and the network is fine. The data speeds on my nexus one are insane and things load notably faster on the Nexus One. I have both phones so I know from first hand experience.
Trust Me.
TechShtupp, is that you?
this article is about a SURVEY of OPINIONS. the study released in Feb 2010 was based on HARD FACTS and FIELD TESTING. so, which group of data would you feel is more trustworthy and more based on reality....the "opinion survey" or the field testing of actual hardware in multiple cities?
people love to hate ATT. it seems to be our national pastime as of late. people always assume if a call drops then it is ATT's fault. there is only one way to tell for certain how/why the call dropped, and that is by checking the call logs from the network, which can only be accessed by the carrier's engineers and tech support personnel. i repeat, you cannot be sure how or why the call dropped unless you go into the network and trace the call logs of the carrier.
public perception is this: "att = bad, verizon = good".
this perception is in part driven by the experience of iphone users in 2007 (the original iphone 2G radio had reception problems, which was a hardware issue from APPLE, not ATT), and in 2008 when the 3G iphone came out (att's brand new, fledgling 3G network was overloaded, which was ATT's fault--but a 5000% increase in data usage would be hard to predict, and even if predicted, impossible to deal with in a short time, for any company).
but mainly this negative perception has been driven by the ruthlessly clever and amazingly effective Verizon ad campaign--which ignores the great improvements ATT has made, and ignores the reality of the current ATT network. so when a call drops, people always assume it has to be ATT's fault, when it could be a problem with the cellphone, or the simcard, or the other carrier, yes the other carriers drop calls too. Verizon is not perfect. nor is any wireless carrier. if apple had gone with verizon in 2007 instead of Cingular/ATT, then everything that is being said of ATT, all the hatred, all the "ATT sux" comments would be directed at verizon instead.
another reality check: Apple does not want a CDMA iphone, Apple will never make a CDMA phone. the WSJ article about "a Verizon iphone in 2010 or 2011" is complete bullspit. why? because you cannot use voice and data at the same time on CDMA (sprint and verizon are CDMA networks). apple does NOT want the iphone experience to go backwards in technology or user experience....which is what would happen with a CDMA verizon iphone. not to mention the cost of creating a new version of iphone with different technology (read: worse technology).
it may be a different story in 2013 or 2014, when Verizon and Sprint have LTE/4G completely built out. at that time, ATT will have LTE 4G built out too, so i figure at that time, iphone may be available to all USA carriers.
i love my iphone and it works great. my ATT service is stellar, with no dropped calls (wireless reception and customer service both are awesome).
DISCLAIMER: I am an AT&T customer and an iPhone owner. I am also an AT&T employee. My posts reflect my own personal opinions and do not necessarily represent AT&T’s positions, strategies or opinions.
What is everyone's signal strength from Field Test Mode? .....
How do you exit Field Test Mode?
..., it's only for a broadband modem and there are no phones with LTE on TeliaSonera.
Maybe because there are no LTE phones available yet?
You'll also have to wait for a while before IMS is working, usable and available on LTE phones. So since there's no voice in practise in LTE for a while yet, broadband modem is all it's gonna be for the next few years.
Still doesn't mean that the Swedes and Norwegians don't have an LTE network. They do. But it's natural that it's only in the cities at the moment (but spreading during this year as the manufacturers get something else besides prototypes out in the field).
Regs, Jarkko
TechShtupp, is that you?
Doesn't really matter if it is or not. In this particular case he is correct. The amount of comments and questions I get from network engineers (during 3G trainings that I give) concerning iPhone related problems (dropped calls, exessive signalling load etc.) leads me to the same conclusion. As a GSM/3G phone, the iPhone is apparently not very good. Many of the problems seem to come from overly agressive power savings that they need to do since it seems that otherwise the iPhone would kill its battery too soon.
As a portable computer with excellent UX and app store, it's currently superior, as a phone / wireless device not so good.
Regs, Jarkko
The amount of comments and questions I get from network engineers (during 3G trainings that I give) concerning iPhone related problems (dropped calls, exessive signalling load etc.) leads me to the same conclusion.
Could you perhaps be clearer about how technical questions raised by the trainees are specifically related to the iPhone--whose numbers far surpass the Nexus One on AT&T--and not to 3G devices in general on AT&T's network?
Great charts, Verizon looks to have the best network.
FiOS is an excellent product too, so Verizon has it good wireless and wired.
I was on Verizon since the days they were named Bell Atlantic Mobile. They were always fine.
I switched to ATT and got an iPhone. ATT seems fine too.
I don't think that in most places, the choice makes any real difference. In areas of low population density, however, the choice of carrier is extremely important. When I go to Vermont, there are areas that are dead to Verizon, and others that are dead to ATT.
If I lived in NYC or SF, likely I'd say that Verizon is a better choice, but my guess is that some local company has all 4 national companies beat in the metro area.
This carrier lock-in, which Apple not only promotes, but profits from, hurts consumers. We have less choice of carrier than would be optimal.