Very nicely done all around, but I agree on the price. Just a little too high. I was considering a Mini about a month ago and heard new ones were expected. I waited and meanwhile another round of pay cuts is on the way at work. New Mini plus a higher price with less pay means no Mini for me.
Then why buy a Mini in the first place then? I see coflicting arguments. Also, at least according to some here, every product other than Apple is sheer crap. If that's the sentiment, then yes, a buyer (lets say first time) would have to buy the whole Apple arrangement to get the full "asthetic."
No one ever made the argument. Isn't it funny how the Mac-bashers have to make things up?
What I said (and others have echoed) is that if you buy a similar system with similar quality, it's going to cost about as much as the Apple product. That is an implicit statement that there ARE other quality systems out there.
It's just that the high quality systems tend not to be the ones on the $9.99 special rack at Walmart.
T... My DVD player was removed to make room for a mini. And there is no room for a standalone BRD player. ...
In all fairness, this alone puts you in a very very small group of users with a very specific problem that is 100% dependent on this unusual choice.
The mini is a small multi-purpose computer, it's not going to be specced to one single use (adjunct to the TV in the living room), and even given that use, it's not going to fit every user.
The average user would have multiple optical slots in the living room gear already.
The average user considering such a use for the mini, would also have a blue-ray player already.
... I think setting the entry point for Mac ownership at $700, without even including the monitor, keyboard, and mouse, is one such mistake ...
I know you're talking desktops here, but from another perspective, ...
The entry point for ownership of *Apple* gear is $29.00 for an iPhone 3G.
In terms of enticing the great unwashed towards Apple's platforms, I think there are sufficiently low entry price points with the mobile gear. Maybe knowing this, Apple just isn't prepared to eat the margins on the mini anymore, because they don't have to.
Far away from perfect. Have you used it? I have been using it for last years daily with my family. I find it far away from prefect comparing to recently found XBMC or Boxeee. I could open list of flaws in design apprach to Apple TV not to mention its casual problems with content. Only rental works erelatively okay (excapt glitches when it can give you only 24 hours to play rented movie even though you have not started it yet... or some rented movies given FULL YEAR to watch which happened to me - both cases).
My point was mostly that the mac mini was not *only* intended for that living room purpose that many of the posters to this thread use it for. I don't use it, (cause I have many better things to do with my time than hack a mini into a consumer electronics device), but know lots that do.
The last time the mini was updated, we had endless postings from the living-room mini crowd about how "If it only had Blu-Ray and HDMI out it would be perfect." (or words to that effect).
Now the next model comes out and it has HDMI, so everyone is saying "If only it had Blu-Ray it would be perfect."
That's all I meant.
Personally, if it needs endless setup and updates (it does) such a setup would never be "perfect" in my personal world. I like AppleTV, and I think it's better than using a mini. That's just me though.
Woohoo, my wish has been answered. At last I can now buy a new mac to replace my G4. Why didn't I notice that when I check UK apple store for the new iPhone 4 pre-order?
[u] wait, just realised it still uses Core 2 Duo processor. What? I wish it has i5 or at least i3 CPU.... Come'on eh!
And the HDMI explicitly supports audio output as mentioned in the spec page, but interestingly I don't believe it mentions the mini-DisplayPort supporting audio out even though that has been introduced in the MacBook Pros.
Commander Data, that is the exact same thing I've been trying to find out. HDMI doesn't obviate the need for audio over the mini-DP connector. No luck so far figuring this out (and the two mini-DP to HDMI connectors I've bought so far don't have audio support so I can't go to the local Apple Store to test it). Then again, I don't think the updated MBPs spec'ed that out either when they were released, even though it works (with the right cable).
Quote:
Originally Posted by masternav
Since Walmart is now an Apple reseller - they will be offering this handsome piece of kit for 164USD less than retail price!
They'll get the same ability to offer a few percent discount that the big box stores do. Go look at their iPod prices if you don't believe me.
In all fairness, this alone puts you in a very very small group of users with a very specific problem that is 100% dependent on this unusual choice.
The mini is a small multi-purpose computer, it's not going to be specced to one single use (adjunct to the TV in the living room), and even given that use, it's not going to fit every user.
The average user would have multiple optical slots in the living room gear already.
The average user considering such a use for the mini, would also have a blue-ray player already.
The point was that not eveyone is willing/able to continue adding more and more boxes to their TV. Cable boxes, DVD/BR players, dedicated boxes for Amazon and/or netflix boxes, etc. And my post was in response to another post about using a mini as a blu-ray player connected to a TV, not as simply a multi-pupose computer.
Other than playing Apple purchased/rented content, both the Apple TV and mini aren't very useful as home theater devices for the average user (ie, those not techy enough to rip their DVDs). TiVos, TVs, and other devices are already integrating online content such as movie renting, etc. It's increasingly more common for TVs to have this built in. So what value do Apple's devices (as home theater devices) really add? Apple needs to add something to the features to make it more worthwhile in this role. Blu-ray would be one option for doing that.
I'm wondering how difficult the hard drive remove/replace is going to be. 5400 rpm is too slow for use as a computer (though I'm sure it's fine for a media center)...
Personally, if it needs endless setup and updates (it does) such a setup would never be "perfect" in my personal world. I like AppleTV, and I think it's better than using a mini. That's just me though.
Fair enough. The Apple TV meets your needs. Personally, I find it too limiting. It can't play my current media (ie, DVDs) and can only play files in Apple's very limited video spec restrictions. And it all has to be in iTunes. FrontRow on a mini can play DVDs (ripped or physical) and any QuickTime compatible format. Just dump the files in your Movies folder. Pretty much everything it can do are things that are now coming built-in to many TVs (outside of playing iTunes DRM'd movies, but then just get them from Amazon instead).
As for the mini requiring endless setup and updates. I'll respectfully disagree. Unless you are hacking FrontRow or installing Boxee or some other HTPC front-end (which will be unnecessary for most people), it runs just fine out-of-the-box.
But if all you want is access to your iTunes content, yes, AppleTV is probably all you need.
this new Mac Mini with best specs hooked up to a new Sony LED 3D Glossy Flat Screen TV 30"-50", Best Sony Wireless Surround Sound system, PS3/XBOX, Apple TV, Sky + HD, Gaming Seat, Wireless Trackpad, Wireless Keyboard, Wireless Mouse, 2-5TB External HD, Time Machine, and some how connect a cam to all this, Apple really going for the Entertainment Market now...
If you think it's expensive, don't buy one. That simple. Go ahead and buy your POS cheap box which has a 40% failure rate out of the box and which requires you to talk to someone in Swahili to get support.
Meanwhile, here in the real world, the Mini server is a super value. Please look up the cost of Windows server with unlimited client licenses. Heck, the software alone is considerably more expensive than the Mac Mini server.
Mobius probably builds his PC rigs like I do. Gaming performance on macs sucks in comparison. Although Valve giving macs steam support recently was very much awesome.
STILL needs Blu-Ray to justify a $100 increase, plus needs 7200 RPM drives STANDARD, or at least an OPTION for the base model!
My guess is they will FINALLY add Blu-Ray around Sept/Oct when a new iLife w/Blu-Ray burning features gets released... Or maybe never LOL.
I'm betting that this thing will sell like hotcakes despite the price increase. Blu-ray still has licensing and DRM issues that Jobs doesn't like, and we all know what happens when Jobs doesn't like something.
I'm wondering how difficult the hard drive remove/replace is going to be. 5400 rpm is too slow for use as a computer (though I'm sure it's fine for a media center)...
Actually as hard drive density has scaled as high as it has, 5400rpm hard drives are much more feasible than they used to be. Yes, a 7200rpm would be nicer for the OS drive, but my guess is heat limitations kept them using 5400 rpm.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MMTM1983
USB3, BLUETOOTH 3.0, BLUE RAY, all should be added within 2010-11 period...
No E in Blu Ray. I wouldn't expect to see USB3 on a Mac until Intel starts supporting it directly, which means sometime next year at the earliest.
What part of 'Mini' don't you get? The desktop Macs are iMacs and Mac Pros.
Let's go through the process:
Apple evaluates all the options out there. They could build a computer in a cardboard box. They could build the legendary midi-Mac. They could build a Mini with BD. They could build a Mac Pro with 8 six-core processors. And so on.
Now, based on their 30 years of experience and best marketing skills in the industry, they have chosen a product range. This range was selected as being their evaluation of what would yield them the greatest profits by satisfying the largest number of customers. They've demonstrated an uncanny ability to do this - at least based on results over the last 5 years or so.
They don't offer the specific item you want - whether it's BD or larger box or more RAM or cheaper price or whatever. Too bad. It's not going to happen. Obviously, Apple thinks that the number of people wanting (and willing to pay for ) what you are requesting is not large enough to make it worthwhile. Until you can demonstrate that your abilities to succeed in this industry are greater than Apple's, JUST STOP THE WHINING.
I couldn't agree more ... well said! The sad part is your well thought out answer will fall on deaf ears. Let's face it ... the vast majority of the whiners who populate these boards whine just for the sake of complaining. If Apple came out tomorrow with their "dream computer" at a price point lower than any of the competition .... they'd start posting how, at such a low price, it can't possibly be any good. With these people Apple can never win. \
OK, why is the SD slot in the rear (aside from interior layout considerations)? I have a Belkin Mini-sized USB hub that puts a USB and FW400 in the front so it's easy as pie to connect the occasional peripheral. I've got an SD adapter that fits there. To have no front-facing SD slot is worse than no Blu ray Drive, which I really don't need or want to spend the big bux for.
Too bad Apple couldn't have juiced up the processor and provided an SSD BtoO as options.
I got an early 2009 Mini and it's working great. I'll pass on this upgrade.
Comments
Very nicely done all around, but I agree on the price. Just a little too high. I was considering a Mini about a month ago and heard new ones were expected. I waited and meanwhile another round of pay cuts is on the way at work. New Mini plus a higher price with less pay means no Mini for me.
Configured the way i want it is $1599. Ouchy.
Then why buy a Mini in the first place then? I see coflicting arguments. Also, at least according to some here, every product other than Apple is sheer crap. If that's the sentiment, then yes, a buyer (lets say first time) would have to buy the whole Apple arrangement to get the full "asthetic."
No one ever made the argument. Isn't it funny how the Mac-bashers have to make things up?
What I said (and others have echoed) is that if you buy a similar system with similar quality, it's going to cost about as much as the Apple product. That is an implicit statement that there ARE other quality systems out there.
It's just that the high quality systems tend not to be the ones on the $9.99 special rack at Walmart.
T... My DVD player was removed to make room for a mini. And there is no room for a standalone BRD player. ...
In all fairness, this alone puts you in a very very small group of users with a very specific problem that is 100% dependent on this unusual choice.
The mini is a small multi-purpose computer, it's not going to be specced to one single use (adjunct to the TV in the living room), and even given that use, it's not going to fit every user.
The average user would have multiple optical slots in the living room gear already.
The average user considering such a use for the mini, would also have a blue-ray player already.
... I think setting the entry point for Mac ownership at $700, without even including the monitor, keyboard, and mouse, is one such mistake ...
I know you're talking desktops here, but from another perspective, ...
The entry point for ownership of *Apple* gear is $29.00 for an iPhone 3G.
In terms of enticing the great unwashed towards Apple's platforms, I think there are sufficiently low entry price points with the mobile gear. Maybe knowing this, Apple just isn't prepared to eat the margins on the mini anymore, because they don't have to.
Far away from perfect. Have you used it? I have been using it for last years daily with my family. I find it far away from prefect comparing to recently found XBMC or Boxeee. I could open list of flaws in design apprach to Apple TV not to mention its casual problems with content. Only rental works erelatively okay (excapt glitches when it can give you only 24 hours to play rented movie even though you have not started it yet... or some rented movies given FULL YEAR to watch which happened to me - both cases).
My point was mostly that the mac mini was not *only* intended for that living room purpose that many of the posters to this thread use it for. I don't use it, (cause I have many better things to do with my time than hack a mini into a consumer electronics device), but know lots that do.
The last time the mini was updated, we had endless postings from the living-room mini crowd about how "If it only had Blu-Ray and HDMI out it would be perfect." (or words to that effect).
Now the next model comes out and it has HDMI, so everyone is saying "If only it had Blu-Ray it would be perfect."
That's all I meant.
Personally, if it needs endless setup and updates (it does) such a setup would never be "perfect" in my personal world. I like AppleTV, and I think it's better than using a mini. That's just me though.
[u] wait, just realised it still uses Core 2 Duo processor. What? I wish it has i5 or at least i3 CPU.... Come'on eh!
And the HDMI explicitly supports audio output as mentioned in the spec page, but interestingly I don't believe it mentions the mini-DisplayPort supporting audio out even though that has been introduced in the MacBook Pros.
Commander Data, that is the exact same thing I've been trying to find out. HDMI doesn't obviate the need for audio over the mini-DP connector. No luck so far figuring this out (and the two mini-DP to HDMI connectors I've bought so far don't have audio support so I can't go to the local Apple Store to test it). Then again, I don't think the updated MBPs spec'ed that out either when they were released, even though it works (with the right cable).
Since Walmart is now an Apple reseller - they will be offering this handsome piece of kit for 164USD less than retail price!
They'll get the same ability to offer a few percent discount that the big box stores do. Go look at their iPod prices if you don't believe me.
In all fairness, this alone puts you in a very very small group of users with a very specific problem that is 100% dependent on this unusual choice.
The mini is a small multi-purpose computer, it's not going to be specced to one single use (adjunct to the TV in the living room), and even given that use, it's not going to fit every user.
The average user would have multiple optical slots in the living room gear already.
The average user considering such a use for the mini, would also have a blue-ray player already.
The point was that not eveyone is willing/able to continue adding more and more boxes to their TV. Cable boxes, DVD/BR players, dedicated boxes for Amazon and/or netflix boxes, etc. And my post was in response to another post about using a mini as a blu-ray player connected to a TV, not as simply a multi-pupose computer.
Other than playing Apple purchased/rented content, both the Apple TV and mini aren't very useful as home theater devices for the average user (ie, those not techy enough to rip their DVDs). TiVos, TVs, and other devices are already integrating online content such as movie renting, etc. It's increasingly more common for TVs to have this built in. So what value do Apple's devices (as home theater devices) really add? Apple needs to add something to the features to make it more worthwhile in this role. Blu-ray would be one option for doing that.
Personally, if it needs endless setup and updates (it does) such a setup would never be "perfect" in my personal world. I like AppleTV, and I think it's better than using a mini. That's just me though.
Fair enough. The Apple TV meets your needs. Personally, I find it too limiting. It can't play my current media (ie, DVDs) and can only play files in Apple's very limited video spec restrictions. And it all has to be in iTunes. FrontRow on a mini can play DVDs (ripped or physical) and any QuickTime compatible format. Just dump the files in your Movies folder. Pretty much everything it can do are things that are now coming built-in to many TVs (outside of playing iTunes DRM'd movies, but then just get them from Amazon instead).
As for the mini requiring endless setup and updates. I'll respectfully disagree. Unless you are hacking FrontRow or installing Boxee or some other HTPC front-end (which will be unnecessary for most people), it runs just fine out-of-the-box.
But if all you want is access to your iTunes content, yes, AppleTV is probably all you need.
this new Mac Mini with best specs hooked up to a new Sony LED 3D Glossy Flat Screen TV 30"-50", Best Sony Wireless Surround Sound system, PS3/XBOX, Apple TV, Sky + HD, Gaming Seat, Wireless Trackpad, Wireless Keyboard, Wireless Mouse, 2-5TB External HD, Time Machine, and some how connect a cam to all this, Apple really going for the Entertainment Market now...
If you think it's expensive, don't buy one. That simple. Go ahead and buy your POS cheap box which has a 40% failure rate out of the box and which requires you to talk to someone in Swahili to get support.
Meanwhile, here in the real world, the Mini server is a super value. Please look up the cost of Windows server with unlimited client licenses. Heck, the software alone is considerably more expensive than the Mac Mini server.
Mobius probably builds his PC rigs like I do. Gaming performance on macs sucks in comparison. Although Valve giving macs steam support recently was very much awesome.
My guess is they will FINALLY add Blu-Ray around Sept/Oct when a new iLife w/Blu-Ray burning features gets released... Or maybe never LOL.
STILL needs Blu-Ray to justify a $100 increase, plus needs 7200 RPM drives STANDARD, or at least an OPTION for the base model!
My guess is they will FINALLY add Blu-Ray around Sept/Oct when a new iLife w/Blu-Ray burning features gets released... Or maybe never LOL.
I'm betting that this thing will sell like hotcakes despite the price increase. Blu-ray still has licensing and DRM issues that Jobs doesn't like, and we all know what happens when Jobs doesn't like something.
i forgot printers and cameras, to the earlier post!
I'm wondering how difficult the hard drive remove/replace is going to be. 5400 rpm is too slow for use as a computer (though I'm sure it's fine for a media center)...
Actually as hard drive density has scaled as high as it has, 5400rpm hard drives are much more feasible than they used to be. Yes, a 7200rpm would be nicer for the OS drive, but my guess is heat limitations kept them using 5400 rpm.
USB3, BLUETOOTH 3.0, BLUE RAY, all should be added within 2010-11 period...
No E in Blu Ray. I wouldn't expect to see USB3 on a Mac until Intel starts supporting it directly, which means sometime next year at the earliest.
What part of 'Mini' don't you get? The desktop Macs are iMacs and Mac Pros.
Let's go through the process:
Apple evaluates all the options out there. They could build a computer in a cardboard box. They could build the legendary midi-Mac. They could build a Mini with BD. They could build a Mac Pro with 8 six-core processors. And so on.
Now, based on their 30 years of experience and best marketing skills in the industry, they have chosen a product range. This range was selected as being their evaluation of what would yield them the greatest profits by satisfying the largest number of customers. They've demonstrated an uncanny ability to do this - at least based on results over the last 5 years or so.
They don't offer the specific item you want - whether it's BD or larger box or more RAM or cheaper price or whatever. Too bad. It's not going to happen. Obviously, Apple thinks that the number of people wanting (and willing to pay for ) what you are requesting is not large enough to make it worthwhile. Until you can demonstrate that your abilities to succeed in this industry are greater than Apple's, JUST STOP THE WHINING.
http://www.lyricsdomain.com/18/rolli..._you_want.html
I couldn't agree more ... well said! The sad part is your well thought out answer will fall on deaf ears. Let's face it ... the vast majority of the whiners who populate these boards whine just for the sake of complaining. If Apple came out tomorrow with their "dream computer" at a price point lower than any of the competition .... they'd start posting how, at such a low price, it can't possibly be any good. With these people Apple can never win.
Apple has actually made the mini more expensive than the iMac, for what you get.
Isn't that almost always the case when comparing desktop-grade components to notebook-grade?
The entry point for ownership of *Apple* gear is $29.00 for an iPhone 3G.
29+two years of contract
Too bad Apple couldn't have juiced up the processor and provided an SSD BtoO as options.
I got an early 2009 Mini and it's working great. I'll pass on this upgrade.