While there may be some cosmetic issues, I believe the dropped calls are real. What makes it difficult for many people to believe is the "mine works fine so there can't really be a problem" syndrome.
I have personally observed a number of iPhone 4 demo units at Apple stores. One of them, in particular, went from 5 bars to 3, then 2 and then none in a matter of seconds when held in the "conventional" manner (as shown in the Apple TV commercials). Several others had no drop in bars at all when held in the same manner in either the left or right hand. This makes me rather suspicious that there is something which is not affecting all of the units.
Apple really should be rounding up a bunch of units from people who say they are experiencing problems and test the darn things out to find out what is going on. There seems little doubt that Apple will continue to sell iPhones at an astonishing rate, but one has to wonder if the company will have the same golden reputation for long if there is a widespread problem and they do nothing about it. That could affect future sales. Remember, there are a great many iPhone purchasers are not Mac users and may not be committed to the company as many of the members of this forum are.
In any event, I believe that there is more than a cosmetic issue involved. Time will tell.
FCC is not the only regulatory body. I am sure there are others in other countries where this product is available. It's a pretty narrow view to take.
You're sure, but you don't really know or have a list ready for the 88 countries the iPhone will be sold in summer? \
Of course there are other regulatory bodies for RF. The fact is and will remain, unless China sales step up, that the US is the single largest buyer of iPhones, always first on Apple's list which is a company from the US, and more readers on this site are from the US than anywhere else so you can include whatever FCC equivalent for the country you wish but I'm not going to scour the internet looking for all their names and the average turn around time for retesting.
It's a valid comment as to way it might take weeks for Apple to issue an update. No more no or no less has to read into it.
For what it's worth, I was in an Apple retail store today and could not cause any of the iP4s that I was able to get my hands on to lose signal by bridging the seam.
... Apple really should be rounding up a bunch of units from people who say they are experiencing problems and test the darn things out to find out what is going on. ...
How do you know they haven't? It seems that when there are specific HW problems reported, engineering will put out the word, at least with AppleCare reps that they want equipment exhibiting a particular issue and those devices/systems will go straight to them until they feel they have enough, at which point they will tell them they don't need any more. I've had them do express pickups on DOA Mac Pros for this reason, and other times the AppleCare reps checked and said, no, they have enough, so we'll just do a regular return. I'd be stunned if they haven't rounded up a bunch of the units that lose all signal from the seam bridging issue.
This raises the questions why the bars were made to display much better reception than was actually true for 2 years... the plot thickens.
Sure it looks like a conspiracy - thing is all phones lie about reception and I'm getting the impression that it's 6 of one and half a dozen of the other. Meaning Apple lied to cover ATT's problem, then improved the antenna - only to screw up by not coating it and shipping it on the outside. Now they're trying to show the antenna is actually better which means reporting the correct signal.
What gets me about this whole thing is that some people can touch the lower left and not get the lost calls that AnandTech.com demonstrated in his test.
For what it's worth, I was in an Apple retail store today and could not cause any of the iP4s that I was able to get my hands on to lose signal by bridging the seam.
It won't happen at an Apple or ATT store (I tried). However, mine dropped downloading altogether within one block of both stores, and was repeatable, just with one finger on the left seam.
It won't happen at an Apple or ATT store (I tried). However, mine dropped downloading altogether within one block of both stores, and was repeatable, just with one finger on the left seam.
re-reading AnandTech they say the 24Db drop only matters in a low signal area - still some people in a low signal area are saying they get better reception with the ip4 than the ip3g - so who knows
Yes, you are correct. Anand did confirm what Apple has released. That the antenna is far superior to previous models and that the bars algorithm was flawed. But he also confirm that the industrial design, of exposing the antennas, resulted in greater actual loss of signal when touched. That is the issue that Apple has not addressed.
Engineering is always about trade offs. Bringing the antennas to the exterior make them far more sensitive, and so better, than internal antennas. That is a fact. It also makes them more prone to signal degradation when in physical contact with the human body. That is also a fact. having two separate antennas that are exposed and able to be bridged by human contact can cause further signal degradation. Another fact.
I am not bashing Apple for the design. They decided on better overall reception and sensitivity by moving it to the outside. But, as Anand said, a simple coating would have greatly minimized the effects of contacting the antennas. Failing to coat it seems to be a bad idea. Not admitting that there is an actual issue of signal degradation when touching the 4 (greater than previous models) makes it look like the are willfully omitting this fact or that their testing hasn't show it (which of course is unbelievable, given the could just read Anand's write up).
why the hell did they not mix up the speaks/sound to the side, move the sync/charging slot over and have the antenna on the bottom
this probably will get some rage, but do you really need it to be centered? this would solve the reception (unless you hold your phone with a finger on the bottom) for most people
while allowing them to keep a superior antenna?
ofc Apple changing something to be NONE SYMMETRICAL AND NOT CENTERED is unlikely
You're sure, but you don't really know or have a list ready for the 88 countries the iPhone will be sold in summer? \
It's certainly not summer here
Quote:
Of course there are other regulatory bodies for RF. The fact is and will remain, unless China sales step up, that the US is the single largest buyer of iPhones, always first on Apple's list which is a company from the US, and more readers on this site are from the US than anywhere else so you can include whatever FCC equivalent for the country you wish but I'm not going to scour the internet looking for all their names and the average turn around time for retesting.
It's a valid comment as to way it might take weeks for Apple to issue an update. No more no or no less has to read into it.
All I'm saying is that waiting FCC approval might be make sense if there was only region in which things would be sold. I don't recall Apple ever making a region specific iPhone update so for this kind of thought process to make sense, then every other regulatory body would have to be involved, depending on how stringent such process are in other markets. If indeed FCC is the reason, then clearly Apple would need to consider how such approvals would or would not be required in other markets.
1) I am not a regular follower of the site and thus not aware of any journalistic reputation, biases, etc. whether they be objective, pro or anti Apple.
2) I normally don't pay much attention to this type of story, email exchanges, because they are easy to spoof and difficult to prove. Without some context and background of the individuals involved it is difficult to determine whether there is a hidden motive or agenda.
3) The page you cited appeared to be more about them (the web site) defending themselves and their prior story, than the story, itself.
4) I read a few of the comments to the page you cited and they seemed to be divided-- some strongly pro Apple, some strongly anti- Apple, some objective... prolly a normal mix
One comment in particular caught my eye:
Quote:
182 Peter Emery says:
July 4, 2010 at 4:33 AM
BGR is missing the point: the only outrageous line in these emails, the only line worthy of castigation, is the final line that BGR falsely attributed to Jobs. Take away that line and you have a straightforward exchange wherein ?Jobs? puts forth his views. It simply reads like a CEO explaining his take on the matter to an over medicated juvenile.
Whatever your view of Apple or Jobs, there is nothing particularly damning in a CEO offering various explanations that could equally affect user reception, while directly acknowledging the company is working on a fix for the known problem.
Without that final line, the conversation isn?t particularly notable, wouldn?t have merited any financial remuneration, and wouldn?t have brought publicity to BGR. The ?mistake? in attributing that final line has greatly damaged any perception of accuracy in BGR reportage and will become a permanent tag line for any serious journalist of blogger in qualifying the veracity of any news from this site.
That piqued my interest so I looked around for the original article:
To get a feel for what Emery was saying, look at the content of the emails attributed to Steve Jobs (to focus, I have only provided the emails attributed to Steve and removed the other side of the conversation)
Quote:
Here is Steve Jobs? reply:
No, you are getting all worked up over a few days of rumors. Calm down.
Steve Jobs counters:
You are most likely in an area with very low signal strength.
Steve responds once again:
You may be working from bad data. Not your fault. Stay tuned. We are working on it.
The line below, apparently, was attributed to Steve Jobs in the original BGR article. The BGR article has been updated and now attributes the comment to "Tom" the other side of the email conversation. Apparently, this is the line causing the controversy, and the one Peter Emery refers to in his comment (above): "Without that final line, the conversation isn?t particularly notable...".
Here's the line, now attributed to Tom, originally attributed to Steve:
Quote:
And lastly, Tom emails in again:
Retire, relax, enjoy your family. It is just a phone. Not worth it.
In the interest of completeness, I have copy/pasted the entire [updated] conversation below. I did not include the email headers added in the 2nd update to the article:
Quote:
First email:
[Apple engineer name redacted],
When we spoke, you would not tell me that there is a fix for this phone?
I assume there is no fix then. If this is legit, I have lost all respect for apple and just want to go back to Verizon and get a nice Android phone. And don?t tell me they have the same issues, all our co-workers with Androids are just mocking us right now?. ?Hey, I am going to go in the basement and continue my call. You can use my office on the 2nd floor so you can get a signal?. You are going to kill your brand over one product. Apple is coming off arrogant and rude. If there is no fix just tell people so they can return their phones. We have work to do. I have bought just about every apple product made in the last 20 years and this is the 1st time I am ashamed to be a MAC fan.
This is just sickening,
[Tom]
Here is Steve Jobs? reply:
No, you are getting all worked up over a few days of rumors. Calm down.
Our reader?s response:
I am really insulted? ?Calm down??. ?rumors?? What arrogance. This is will be marked as the begging of the end of Apple. Seriously, DO THE RIGHT THING. I just had dinner with 3 people who had iPhone 4s we all cant make calls without dropping. There is no rumors it is reality.
Steve Jobs counters:
You are most likely in an area with very low signal strength.
Our reader again:
Stop with jackass comments. I have has every iphone made. They all had a bad signal but this is the so much worse X3. The whole country is is in a ?low signal strength? in reality? all but apple campus and your house it seems? AT&T maps are a joke. I am in ?excellent? to ?good? coverage and on my iPhone 1, Iphone 3G, and my iPhone 3Gs, I could at least make a telephone call. After all, it is a phone. Iphone 4?. 5 bars?.. touch the phone? ZERO bars call drops.
Steve. IT DOES NOT WORK! Geezzz I hope this this is not really you. Are we on a different MHz? I have yet to see an iPhone [4] work in Richmond when you hold it in your hand. It is not ?isolated?. I was a big fan. But I am done.
Steve responds once again:
You may be working from bad data. Not your fault. Stay tuned. We are working on it.
Sent from my iPhone
And lastly, Tom emails in again:
Retire, relax, enjoy your family. It is just a phone. Not worth it.
What are your thoughts on this one? Is Tom in the right? Did he get a little too aggressive with his emails? Do you believe Steve Jobs when he says Apple is actively working on it?
UPDATE: The last line in the email exchange was actually not said by Mr. Jobs; rather it was by ?Tom.? We corrected it as soon as we were made aware.
UPDATE 2: Added email header information and full exchange..
How do you know they haven't? It seems that when there are specific HW problems reported, engineering will put out the word, at least with AppleCare reps that they want equipment exhibiting a particular issue and those devices/systems will go straight to them until they feel they have enough, at which point they will tell them they don't need any more. I've had them do express pickups on DOA Mac Pros for this reason, and other times the AppleCare reps checked and said, no, they have enough, so we'll just do a regular return. I'd be stunned if they haven't rounded up a bunch of the units that lose all signal from the seam bridging issue.
I surely hope they have! (It's a pretty basic concept.)
I do think we would have heard more if they had, however. The way Apple keeps blaming the user and so on just makes people suspicious. I think it would be more useful if they took a different approach.
P.S. When the company denies things that a lot of people have seen "up close and personal" the company's credibility in all things suffers terribly.
It won't happen at an Apple or ATT store (I tried). However, mine dropped downloading altogether within one block of both stores, and was repeatable, just with one finger on the left seam.
There have been reports in these forums of it happening at Apple stores.
I surely hope they have! (It's a pretty basic concept.)
I do think we would have heard more if they had, however. The way Apple keeps blaming the user and so on just makes people suspicious. I think it would be more useful if they took a different approach.
P.S. When the company denies things that a lot of people have seen "up close and personal" the company's credibility in all things suffers terribly.
What exactly has Apple blamed users for? And what exactly have they denied that others have seen?
There are a couple of issues with the iP4 (and a couple of non-issues), and although Apple hasn't made any statements acknowledging these issues, they also haven't made any statements denying them, or blaming users for them.
The uproar over the display of bars is much ado about nothing. Apple made a decision to display the bars in a way that was not an analog of signal strength. Despite the claims of some that this was a dishonest fraud to make Apple and/or AT&T look better, there has been no evidence that this is the case, just conspiracy theory logic. It seems much more likely and plausible that the bars were set to display as they did because with previous iPhones this worked better as an indicator of call quality than signal strength alone does. But, this particular way of displaying the bars doesn't work as well on the iP4 because of properties of the antenna, so now they are changing it to signal strength so that when it's held, you won't usually see a change in the bars because now they will be strictly analogous to signal strength. Not really a big deal. The only difference is that the signal drop you see from holding the phone by the antenna won't seem as large in some instances, because it isn't as large as it seemed.
EDIT: I will also say that Apples PR hasn't been good on both the issues and non-issues in this case, and that the phrasing in the 'letter" was, in a word, stupid.
All I'm saying is that waiting FCC approval might be make sense if there was only region in which things would be sold. I don't recall Apple ever making a region specific iPhone update so for this kind of thought process to make sense, then every other regulatory body would have to be involved, depending on how stringent such process are in other markets. If indeed FCC is the reason, then clearly Apple would need to consider how such approvals would or would not be required in other markets.
Hence, I think its a very narrow view to take.
The OP mentioned the FCC. It's silly for me to mention every other regulatory board in a reply saying that might be what is happening. It's understood that other countries and groups of countries have their own regulations. This was never in question, we didn't forget about you.
Your comment about it not being Summer is a perfect example of these silly contretemps. Even Steve Jobs has used the Northern Hemisphere seasons to denote time frames that wouldn't apply to you, but you still understand what is being said and aren't confused by an American* company making that statement.
* Since the USA is the only country that has America in its name and it's clear that I wasn't making a sweeping statement covering the Western Hemisphere, referring to the US as America is acceptable. Or is it (rhetorical)?
What exactly has Apple blamed users for? And what exactly have they denied that others have seen?
There are a couple of issues with the iP4 (and a couple of non-issues), and although Apple hasn't made any statements acknowledging these issues, they also haven't made any statements denying them, or blaming users for them.
The uproar over the display of bars is much ado about nothing. Apple made a decision to display the bars in a way that was not an analog of signal strength. Despite the claims of some that this was a dishonest fraud to make Apple and/or AT&T look better, there has been no evidence that this is the case, just conspiracy theory logic. It seems much more likely and plausible that the bars were set to display as they did because with previous iPhones this worked better as an indicator of call quality than signal strength alone does. But, this particular way of displaying the bars doesn't work as well on the iP4 because of properties of the antenna, so now they are changing it to signal strength so that when it's held, you won't usually see a change in the bars because now they will be strictly analogous to signal strength. Not really a big deal. The only difference is that the signal drop you see from holding the phone by the antenna won't seem as large in some instances, because it isn't as large as it seemed.
EDIT: I will also say that Apples PR hasn't been good on both the issues and non-issues in this case, and that the phrasing in the 'letter" was, in a word, stupid.
I am sorry, but this has been covered before in great detail. Apple blames the user for hold the phone "wrong", among other things, notwithstanding the fact that Apple commercials show the phone being held in exactly the same manner they now complain is wrong.
The issue is not, I repeat, NOT, the number of bars displayed. It is about dropped calls. Your continued focus on the number of bars displayed is irrelevant to the matter at hand. The only reason anyone refers to the number of bars displayed in their observations or complaints is to describe what happens before signal is lost and the call dropped.
The OP mentioned the FCC. It's silly for me to mention every other regulatory board in a reply saying that might be what is happening. It's understood that other countries and groups of countries have their own regulations. This was never in question, we didn't forget about you.
Your comment about it not being Summer is a perfect example of these silly contretemps. Even Steve Jobs has used the Northern Hemisphere seasons to denote time frames that wouldn't apply to you, but you still understand what is being said and aren't confused by an American* company making that statement.
* Since the USA is the only country that has America in its name and it's clear that I wasn't making a sweeping statement covering the Western Hemispheres, referring to the US as America is acceptable. Or is it (rhetorical)?
... It's certainly not acceptable to we, the Vespucci family... We are proud Italians!
Now, if you pronounce it as: EM-MURR-AKA (or just MURR-AKA), then we're OK!
I am sorry, but this has been covered before in great detail. Apple blames the user for hold the phone "wrong", among other things, notwithstanding the fact that Apple commercials show the phone being held in exactly the same manner they now complain is wrong.
Wasn't it a single email to a single user that has been taken out of context to mean no one ever hold their iPhone in a normal fashion under any condition, as witnessed by Ireland's pic?
As pointed out, all devices can suffer from attenuation so their documentation universally — or nearly universally — states that you shouldn't block the antenna.
What shouldn't be happening is a complete and instant drop the moment you touch the 3G-Spot. That is not normal behaviour and I'm glad isn't affecting my iPhone.
... Since the USA is the only country that has America in its name and it's clear that I wasn't making a sweeping statement covering the Western Hemisphere, referring to the US as America is acceptable. Or is it (rhetorical)?
Just for the record, it's actually highly offensive in many parts of the world to refer to the USA as "America," and the reason is because actually all of North America, Central America, and Soth America have "America" in their name.
So while its true that no other country has "America" in the name, it's a direct insult to the millions and millions of "Americans" living in South America and Central America particularly to refer to US citizens as "Americans."
I've been told this numerous times by various different South Americans over the years anyway.
Comments
<snip>
Most of this uproar is over a cosmetic issue.
<snip>.
While there may be some cosmetic issues, I believe the dropped calls are real. What makes it difficult for many people to believe is the "mine works fine so there can't really be a problem" syndrome.
I have personally observed a number of iPhone 4 demo units at Apple stores. One of them, in particular, went from 5 bars to 3, then 2 and then none in a matter of seconds when held in the "conventional" manner (as shown in the Apple TV commercials). Several others had no drop in bars at all when held in the same manner in either the left or right hand. This makes me rather suspicious that there is something which is not affecting all of the units.
Apple really should be rounding up a bunch of units from people who say they are experiencing problems and test the darn things out to find out what is going on. There seems little doubt that Apple will continue to sell iPhones at an astonishing rate, but one has to wonder if the company will have the same golden reputation for long if there is a widespread problem and they do nothing about it. That could affect future sales. Remember, there are a great many iPhone purchasers are not Mac users and may not be committed to the company as many of the members of this forum are.
In any event, I believe that there is more than a cosmetic issue involved. Time will tell.
FCC is not the only regulatory body. I am sure there are others in other countries where this product is available. It's a pretty narrow view to take.
You're sure, but you don't really know or have a list ready for the 88 countries the iPhone will be sold in summer?
Of course there are other regulatory bodies for RF. The fact is and will remain, unless China sales step up, that the US is the single largest buyer of iPhones, always first on Apple's list which is a company from the US, and more readers on this site are from the US than anywhere else so you can include whatever FCC equivalent for the country you wish but I'm not going to scour the internet looking for all their names and the average turn around time for retesting.
It's a valid comment as to way it might take weeks for Apple to issue an update. No more no or no less has to read into it.
... Apple really should be rounding up a bunch of units from people who say they are experiencing problems and test the darn things out to find out what is going on. ...
How do you know they haven't? It seems that when there are specific HW problems reported, engineering will put out the word, at least with AppleCare reps that they want equipment exhibiting a particular issue and those devices/systems will go straight to them until they feel they have enough, at which point they will tell them they don't need any more. I've had them do express pickups on DOA Mac Pros for this reason, and other times the AppleCare reps checked and said, no, they have enough, so we'll just do a regular return. I'd be stunned if they haven't rounded up a bunch of the units that lose all signal from the seam bridging issue.
This raises the questions why the bars were made to display much better reception than was actually true for 2 years... the plot thickens.
Sure it looks like a conspiracy - thing is all phones lie about reception and I'm getting the impression that it's 6 of one and half a dozen of the other. Meaning Apple lied to cover ATT's problem, then improved the antenna - only to screw up by not coating it and shipping it on the outside. Now they're trying to show the antenna is actually better which means reporting the correct signal.
What gets me about this whole thing is that some people can touch the lower left and not get the lost calls that AnandTech.com demonstrated in his test.
For what it's worth, I was in an Apple retail store today and could not cause any of the iP4s that I was able to get my hands on to lose signal by bridging the seam.
It won't happen at an Apple or ATT store (I tried). However, mine dropped downloading altogether within one block of both stores, and was repeatable, just with one finger on the left seam.
It won't happen at an Apple or ATT store (I tried). However, mine dropped downloading altogether within one block of both stores, and was repeatable, just with one finger on the left seam.
re-reading AnandTech they say the 24Db drop only matters in a low signal area - still some people in a low signal area are saying they get better reception with the ip4 than the ip3g - so who knows
BGR: Apple Is Wrong, That Steve Jobs Email Exchange Was Real
http://www.boygeniusreport.com/2010/...tory-its-real/
Yes, you are correct. Anand did confirm what Apple has released. That the antenna is far superior to previous models and that the bars algorithm was flawed. But he also confirm that the industrial design, of exposing the antennas, resulted in greater actual loss of signal when touched. That is the issue that Apple has not addressed.
Engineering is always about trade offs. Bringing the antennas to the exterior make them far more sensitive, and so better, than internal antennas. That is a fact. It also makes them more prone to signal degradation when in physical contact with the human body. That is also a fact. having two separate antennas that are exposed and able to be bridged by human contact can cause further signal degradation. Another fact.
I am not bashing Apple for the design. They decided on better overall reception and sensitivity by moving it to the outside. But, as Anand said, a simple coating would have greatly minimized the effects of contacting the antennas. Failing to coat it seems to be a bad idea. Not admitting that there is an actual issue of signal degradation when touching the 4 (greater than previous models) makes it look like the are willfully omitting this fact or that their testing hasn't show it (which of course is unbelievable, given the could just read Anand's write up).
why the hell did they not mix up the speaks/sound to the side, move the sync/charging slot over and have the antenna on the bottom
this probably will get some rage, but do you really need it to be centered? this would solve the reception (unless you hold your phone with a finger on the bottom) for most people
while allowing them to keep a superior antenna?
ofc Apple changing something to be NONE SYMMETRICAL AND NOT CENTERED is unlikely
it was fine for 2nd G nano however http://www.images.appleinsider.com/i...gen-shot20.jpg
You're sure, but you don't really know or have a list ready for the 88 countries the iPhone will be sold in summer?
It's certainly not summer here
Of course there are other regulatory bodies for RF. The fact is and will remain, unless China sales step up, that the US is the single largest buyer of iPhones, always first on Apple's list which is a company from the US, and more readers on this site are from the US than anywhere else so you can include whatever FCC equivalent for the country you wish but I'm not going to scour the internet looking for all their names and the average turn around time for retesting.
It's a valid comment as to way it might take weeks for Apple to issue an update. No more no or no less has to read into it.
All I'm saying is that waiting FCC approval might be make sense if there was only region in which things would be sold. I don't recall Apple ever making a region specific iPhone update so for this kind of thought process to make sense, then every other regulatory body would have to be involved, depending on how stringent such process are in other markets. If indeed FCC is the reason, then clearly Apple would need to consider how such approvals would or would not be required in other markets.
Hence, I think its a very narrow view to take.
Just found this...make of it what you wish...
BGR: Apple Is Wrong, That Steve Jobs Email Exchange Was Real
http://www.boygeniusreport.com/2010/...tory-its-real/
Couple of things:
1) I am not a regular follower of the site and thus not aware of any journalistic reputation, biases, etc. whether they be objective, pro or anti Apple.
2) I normally don't pay much attention to this type of story, email exchanges, because they are easy to spoof and difficult to prove. Without some context and background of the individuals involved it is difficult to determine whether there is a hidden motive or agenda.
3) The page you cited appeared to be more about them (the web site) defending themselves and their prior story, than the story, itself.
4) I read a few of the comments to the page you cited and they seemed to be divided-- some strongly pro Apple, some strongly anti- Apple, some objective... prolly a normal mix
One comment in particular caught my eye:
182 Peter Emery says:
July 4, 2010 at 4:33 AM
BGR is missing the point: the only outrageous line in these emails, the only line worthy of castigation, is the final line that BGR falsely attributed to Jobs. Take away that line and you have a straightforward exchange wherein ?Jobs? puts forth his views. It simply reads like a CEO explaining his take on the matter to an over medicated juvenile.
Whatever your view of Apple or Jobs, there is nothing particularly damning in a CEO offering various explanations that could equally affect user reception, while directly acknowledging the company is working on a fix for the known problem.
Without that final line, the conversation isn?t particularly notable, wouldn?t have merited any financial remuneration, and wouldn?t have brought publicity to BGR. The ?mistake? in attributing that final line has greatly damaged any perception of accuracy in BGR reportage and will become a permanent tag line for any serious journalist of blogger in qualifying the veracity of any news from this site.
That piqued my interest so I looked around for the original article:
http://www.boygeniusreport.com/2010/...enna-problems/
To get a feel for what Emery was saying, look at the content of the emails attributed to Steve Jobs (to focus, I have only provided the emails attributed to Steve and removed the other side of the conversation)
Here is Steve Jobs? reply:
No, you are getting all worked up over a few days of rumors. Calm down.
Steve Jobs counters:
You are most likely in an area with very low signal strength.
Steve responds once again:
You may be working from bad data. Not your fault. Stay tuned. We are working on it.
The line below, apparently, was attributed to Steve Jobs in the original BGR article. The BGR article has been updated and now attributes the comment to "Tom" the other side of the email conversation. Apparently, this is the line causing the controversy, and the one Peter Emery refers to in his comment (above): "Without that final line, the conversation isn?t particularly notable...".
Here's the line, now attributed to Tom, originally attributed to Steve:
And lastly, Tom emails in again:
Retire, relax, enjoy your family. It is just a phone. Not worth it.
In the interest of completeness, I have copy/pasted the entire [updated] conversation below. I did not include the email headers added in the 2nd update to the article:
First email:
[Apple engineer name redacted],
When we spoke, you would not tell me that there is a fix for this phone?
A friend just sent me this: http://www.boygeniusreport.com/2010/...ng-procedures/
I assume there is no fix then. If this is legit, I have lost all respect for apple and just want to go back to Verizon and get a nice Android phone. And don?t tell me they have the same issues, all our co-workers with Androids are just mocking us right now?. ?Hey, I am going to go in the basement and continue my call. You can use my office on the 2nd floor so you can get a signal?. You are going to kill your brand over one product. Apple is coming off arrogant and rude. If there is no fix just tell people so they can return their phones. We have work to do. I have bought just about every apple product made in the last 20 years and this is the 1st time I am ashamed to be a MAC fan.
This is just sickening,
[Tom]
Here is Steve Jobs? reply:
No, you are getting all worked up over a few days of rumors. Calm down.
Our reader?s response:
I am really insulted? ?Calm down??. ?rumors?? What arrogance. This is will be marked as the begging of the end of Apple. Seriously, DO THE RIGHT THING. I just had dinner with 3 people who had iPhone 4s we all cant make calls without dropping. There is no rumors it is reality.
Steve Jobs counters:
You are most likely in an area with very low signal strength.
Our reader again:
Stop with jackass comments. I have has every iphone made. They all had a bad signal but this is the so much worse X3. The whole country is is in a ?low signal strength? in reality? all but apple campus and your house it seems? AT&T maps are a joke. I am in ?excellent? to ?good? coverage and on my iPhone 1, Iphone 3G, and my iPhone 3Gs, I could at least make a telephone call. After all, it is a phone. Iphone 4?. 5 bars?.. touch the phone? ZERO bars call drops.
Steve. IT DOES NOT WORK! Geezzz I hope this this is not really you. Are we on a different MHz? I have yet to see an iPhone [4] work in Richmond when you hold it in your hand. It is not ?isolated?. I was a big fan. But I am done.
Steve responds once again:
You may be working from bad data. Not your fault. Stay tuned. We are working on it.
Sent from my iPhone
And lastly, Tom emails in again:
Retire, relax, enjoy your family. It is just a phone. Not worth it.
What are your thoughts on this one? Is Tom in the right? Did he get a little too aggressive with his emails? Do you believe Steve Jobs when he says Apple is actively working on it?
UPDATE: The last line in the email exchange was actually not said by Mr. Jobs; rather it was by ?Tom.? We corrected it as soon as we were made aware.
UPDATE 2: Added email header information and full exchange..
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How do you know they haven't? It seems that when there are specific HW problems reported, engineering will put out the word, at least with AppleCare reps that they want equipment exhibiting a particular issue and those devices/systems will go straight to them until they feel they have enough, at which point they will tell them they don't need any more. I've had them do express pickups on DOA Mac Pros for this reason, and other times the AppleCare reps checked and said, no, they have enough, so we'll just do a regular return. I'd be stunned if they haven't rounded up a bunch of the units that lose all signal from the seam bridging issue.
I surely hope they have! (It's a pretty basic concept.)
I do think we would have heard more if they had, however. The way Apple keeps blaming the user and so on just makes people suspicious. I think it would be more useful if they took a different approach.
P.S. When the company denies things that a lot of people have seen "up close and personal" the company's credibility in all things suffers terribly.
... worth a look.
It won't happen at an Apple or ATT store (I tried). However, mine dropped downloading altogether within one block of both stores, and was repeatable, just with one finger on the left seam.
There have been reports in these forums of it happening at Apple stores.
I surely hope they have! (It's a pretty basic concept.)
I do think we would have heard more if they had, however. The way Apple keeps blaming the user and so on just makes people suspicious. I think it would be more useful if they took a different approach.
P.S. When the company denies things that a lot of people have seen "up close and personal" the company's credibility in all things suffers terribly.
What exactly has Apple blamed users for? And what exactly have they denied that others have seen?
There are a couple of issues with the iP4 (and a couple of non-issues), and although Apple hasn't made any statements acknowledging these issues, they also haven't made any statements denying them, or blaming users for them.
The uproar over the display of bars is much ado about nothing. Apple made a decision to display the bars in a way that was not an analog of signal strength. Despite the claims of some that this was a dishonest fraud to make Apple and/or AT&T look better, there has been no evidence that this is the case, just conspiracy theory logic. It seems much more likely and plausible that the bars were set to display as they did because with previous iPhones this worked better as an indicator of call quality than signal strength alone does. But, this particular way of displaying the bars doesn't work as well on the iP4 because of properties of the antenna, so now they are changing it to signal strength so that when it's held, you won't usually see a change in the bars because now they will be strictly analogous to signal strength. Not really a big deal. The only difference is that the signal drop you see from holding the phone by the antenna won't seem as large in some instances, because it isn't as large as it seemed.
EDIT: I will also say that Apples PR hasn't been good on both the issues and non-issues in this case, and that the phrasing in the 'letter" was, in a word, stupid.
It's certainly not summer here
All I'm saying is that waiting FCC approval might be make sense if there was only region in which things would be sold. I don't recall Apple ever making a region specific iPhone update so for this kind of thought process to make sense, then every other regulatory body would have to be involved, depending on how stringent such process are in other markets. If indeed FCC is the reason, then clearly Apple would need to consider how such approvals would or would not be required in other markets.
Hence, I think its a very narrow view to take.
The OP mentioned the FCC. It's silly for me to mention every other regulatory board in a reply saying that might be what is happening. It's understood that other countries and groups of countries have their own regulations. This was never in question, we didn't forget about you.
Your comment about it not being Summer is a perfect example of these silly contretemps. Even Steve Jobs has used the Northern Hemisphere seasons to denote time frames that wouldn't apply to you, but you still understand what is being said and aren't confused by an American* company making that statement.
* Since the USA is the only country that has America in its name and it's clear that I wasn't making a sweeping statement covering the Western Hemisphere, referring to the US as America is acceptable. Or is it (rhetorical)?
What exactly has Apple blamed users for? And what exactly have they denied that others have seen?
There are a couple of issues with the iP4 (and a couple of non-issues), and although Apple hasn't made any statements acknowledging these issues, they also haven't made any statements denying them, or blaming users for them.
The uproar over the display of bars is much ado about nothing. Apple made a decision to display the bars in a way that was not an analog of signal strength. Despite the claims of some that this was a dishonest fraud to make Apple and/or AT&T look better, there has been no evidence that this is the case, just conspiracy theory logic. It seems much more likely and plausible that the bars were set to display as they did because with previous iPhones this worked better as an indicator of call quality than signal strength alone does. But, this particular way of displaying the bars doesn't work as well on the iP4 because of properties of the antenna, so now they are changing it to signal strength so that when it's held, you won't usually see a change in the bars because now they will be strictly analogous to signal strength. Not really a big deal. The only difference is that the signal drop you see from holding the phone by the antenna won't seem as large in some instances, because it isn't as large as it seemed.
EDIT: I will also say that Apples PR hasn't been good on both the issues and non-issues in this case, and that the phrasing in the 'letter" was, in a word, stupid.
I am sorry, but this has been covered before in great detail. Apple blames the user for hold the phone "wrong", among other things, notwithstanding the fact that Apple commercials show the phone being held in exactly the same manner they now complain is wrong.
The issue is not, I repeat, NOT, the number of bars displayed. It is about dropped calls. Your continued focus on the number of bars displayed is irrelevant to the matter at hand. The only reason anyone refers to the number of bars displayed in their observations or complaints is to describe what happens before signal is lost and the call dropped.
The OP mentioned the FCC. It's silly for me to mention every other regulatory board in a reply saying that might be what is happening. It's understood that other countries and groups of countries have their own regulations. This was never in question, we didn't forget about you.
Your comment about it not being Summer is a perfect example of these silly contretemps. Even Steve Jobs has used the Northern Hemisphere seasons to denote time frames that wouldn't apply to you, but you still understand what is being said and aren't confused by an American* company making that statement.
* Since the USA is the only country that has America in its name and it's clear that I wasn't making a sweeping statement covering the Western Hemispheres, referring to the US as America is acceptable. Or is it (rhetorical)?
... It's certainly not acceptable to we, the Vespucci family... We are proud Italians!
Now, if you pronounce it as: EM-MURR-AKA (or just MURR-AKA), then we're OK!
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I am sorry, but this has been covered before in great detail. Apple blames the user for hold the phone "wrong", among other things, notwithstanding the fact that Apple commercials show the phone being held in exactly the same manner they now complain is wrong.
Wasn't it a single email to a single user that has been taken out of context to mean no one ever hold their iPhone in a normal fashion under any condition, as witnessed by Ireland's pic?
As pointed out, all devices can suffer from attenuation so their documentation universally — or nearly universally — states that you shouldn't block the antenna.
What shouldn't be happening is a complete and instant drop the moment you touch the 3G-Spot. That is not normal behaviour and I'm glad isn't affecting my iPhone.
... Since the USA is the only country that has America in its name and it's clear that I wasn't making a sweeping statement covering the Western Hemisphere, referring to the US as America is acceptable. Or is it (rhetorical)?
Just for the record, it's actually highly offensive in many parts of the world to refer to the USA as "America," and the reason is because actually all of North America, Central America, and Soth America have "America" in their name.
So while its true that no other country has "America" in the name, it's a direct insult to the millions and millions of "Americans" living in South America and Central America particularly to refer to US citizens as "Americans."
I've been told this numerous times by various different South Americans over the years anyway.