European Union joins FTC investigation into Apple's opposition of Flash

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  • Reply 221 of 238
    anonymouseanonymouse Posts: 6,577member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Dr Millmoss View Post


    It's been explained, you just fail to comprehend.



    You might consider that it's difficult to comprehend that which doesn't make sense.
  • Reply 222 of 238
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post


    You might consider that it's difficult to comprehend that which doesn't make sense.



    Like explaining calculus is to a grade schooler!
  • Reply 223 of 238
    anonymouseanonymouse Posts: 6,577member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by AsianBob View Post


    Like explaining calculus is to a grade schooler!



    More like explaining creationism to a biologist.
  • Reply 224 of 238
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post


    More like explaining creationism to a biologist.



    Or maybe explaining evolution to a Creationist?
  • Reply 225 of 238
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by RationalTroll View Post


    Apple says they have less than 17% of the market. Define "dominant".



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by TenoBell View Post


    Mobile App Store Market Share Based On Usage



    Apple App Store : 25%

    Blackberry App World : 16%

    Verizon Application Store : 15%

    AT&T Application Store : 12%

    Sprint Application Store : 10%

    T-Mobile Application Stores : 8%

    Windows Marketplace : 4%

    Android Market Store : 2%

    Palm App Store : 1%

    Handango : 1%





    You are talking about two different markets. Nokia is the largest phone manufacturer and has the smallest app market of everyone.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by RationalTroll View Post


    Precisely: 3/4 of the world have nothing to do with iOS.



    Rule #14: Trolls will continually change their positions as reason and logic destroy their previous argument. (See above) This is believed to be a result of a combined lack of critical thinking and maturity that makes the troll unable to admit when they are wrong and unable to acknowledge that moving their previously set ?goal posts? does not trick anyone but themselves.
  • Reply 226 of 238
    anonymouseanonymouse Posts: 6,577member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by AsianBob View Post


    Or maybe explaining evolution to a Creationist?



    No, creationism is the correct analogy for Millmoss's position.
  • Reply 227 of 238
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post


    No, creationism is the correct analogy for Millmoss's position.



    You're the one arguing (debating?) with him, so of course you'd liken his side to be the "wrong" one.



    After reading the majority of the back and forth between you two, I'd have to say that Millmoss does have a lot of good points and isn't completely crazy like you're trying to make it out to be.



    Seems like his side boils down to nothing more than that the EU and the FTC have found reason to continue their investigation of the issue at hand. Regardless of what you, him, or I personally think of the companies involved, they believe there's enough to continue to pursue the matter. Nothing more, nothing less. If in the end they find that nothing bad has been done, so be it. Case closed. If they do find that Apple is "guilty", then the move on with proving their case against them.



    I'd also have to agree with one of his points. Your posts clearly do have a hard bias towards the starting foundation of "Apple is right/can do no wrong" (of course, this being an Apple site and all...).
  • Reply 228 of 238
    anonymouseanonymouse Posts: 6,577member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by AsianBob View Post


    I'd also have to agree with one of his points. Your posts clearly do have a hard bias towards the starting foundation of "Apple is right/can do no wrong" (of course, this being an Apple site and all...).



    This represents the logical inconsistency of all your posts. If it's an "Apple site", then posts must represent the view that Apple can do no wrong. Yet, here you are posting, and most of your posts are to the effect that Apple can do no right. So, you contradict yourself.



    As far as your comments re Millmoss's points, you neglect his faulty Intel/Microsoft "analogy", which is the subject of the chain of posts you are responding too. He is wrong, because his analogy lacks the elements required for an analogy to be valid. You're wrong, because you can't seem to follow a discussion, or reason logically.
  • Reply 229 of 238
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post


    This represents the logical inconsistency of all your posts. If it's an "Apple site", then posts must represent the view that Apple can do no wrong. Yet, here you are posting, and most of your posts are to the effect that Apple can do no right. So, you contradict yourself.



    As far as your comments re Millmoss's points, you neglect his faulty Intel/Microsoft "analogy", which is the subject of the chain of posts you are responding too. He is wrong, because his analogy lacks the elements required for an analogy to be valid. You're wrong, because you can't seem to follow a discussion, or reason logically.



    Seems like someone's in the arguement more for the sake of "winning" than anything else...



    I never said that posts have to represent that Apple can do no wrong simply because this is an Apple-themed site. I'm simply saying that I'm not surprised by the bias put forth. There's no contradicting myself there.



    I will leave this line of posts with what I said in my previous post. You're clearly going to go down the same condecending (almost insulting), "better than thou" path with me as you did with him (her?).
  • Reply 230 of 238
    anonymouseanonymouse Posts: 6,577member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by AsianBob View Post


    I never said that posts have to represent that Apple can do no wrong simply because this is an Apple-themed site. I'm simply saying that I'm not surprised by the bias put forth. There's no contradicting myself there.



    Ah, I see, everyone but you is biased, is that it?
  • Reply 231 of 238
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    Rule #14: Trolls will continually change their positions as reason and logic destroy their previous argument. (See above) This is believed to be a result of a combined lack of critical thinking and maturity that makes the troll unable to admit when they are wrong and unable to acknowledge that moving their previously set ?goal posts? does not trick anyone but themselves.



    Rule #15: Rule #14 was created by trolls as a ruse to try to distract from discussions with personal attacks then they realize they're no longer able to follow the discussion.
  • Reply 232 of 238
    dr millmossdr millmoss Posts: 5,403member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by AsianBob View Post


    Or maybe explaining evolution to a Creationist?



    More like trying to describe an elephant to a blind man.
  • Reply 233 of 238
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    Using MS? IE as an example, maybe the EU wants to get started now so that if Apple does become a monopoly in a decade they will actually seem timely. Hell, Adobe might even have Flash on more one than one mobile OS by then.



    There is no comparison though between MS' IE and Apple's stance on Flash. Back then, Microsoft was accused of promoting their own proprietary browser, IE, at the expense of other browsers. Apple is promoting HTML5 at the expense of Flash. However, Apple has no ownership at all over HTML5. It's an open standard. In fact, if it weren't for Apple, there would be no innovation at all on HTML5. Why would any content provider waste their time on HTML5 if Apple allowed Flash? Content providers are doing so because Apple product users are such a big market and are willing to get around the Flash hurdle to penetrate the Apple users market.



    Adobe and Apple are part of a committee that is overseeing the HTML5 standard. Adobe is dragging its feet over HTML5, trying to keep the process moving at snail's pace. Let the EU and FTC digest that.
  • Reply 234 of 238
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    @ vvswarup,



    I was just taking a swing at the slowness of the EU to finally stop the IE monopoly after it was down to nearly 50% of the market. Hence, my trailing emoticon. But I do appreciate the factual info, I’m sure there are many readers who aren’t aware of the issue.
  • Reply 235 of 238
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by timgriff84 View Post


    But does Apple have the right to force you not to use Flash and only proprietary software from them.



    First off, your facts are completely wrong. Just how is Apple forcing you to use "only proprietary software from them?" The App Store is nothing more than a centralized marketplace for Apps written by developers so Apple is in now way forcing you to use only proprietary software. Also, if anyone is trying to get you to use proprietary software, it's Adobe. Flash is 100% proprietary. HTML5, on the other hand, is an open web standard. If Apple was actually trying to force you use proprietary software, they would have come out with their own version of Flash, similar to what Microsoft has done with Silverlight.



    Apple didn't lie about Flash. People know that Apple wouldn't allow it. Apple never forced anyone to buy an iPhone in the first place. There are plenty of smartphone platforms out there.
  • Reply 236 of 238
    vvswarupvvswarup Posts: 330member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by rbonner View Post


    Correct me if I am wrong, Apple didn't block flash, they blocked non native apps. I have never seen, or heard of, a version of flash that would actually run on the iPhone/iPad.



    Was this submitted to Apple and denied?



    Actually, Steve Jobs refused to give Adobe access to iPhone/iPad/iPod APIs that Adobe would have needed to develop Flash.



    Make no mistake, Steve Jobs never had any intention of allowing Flash on Apple's mobile products.
  • Reply 237 of 238
    vvswarupvvswarup Posts: 330member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by grking View Post


    Yes, I know the store is curated. I shop there regularly. That is not the point.



    His argument against allowing flash on the iPhone is that doing so would result in bad "crappy" apps. However, that argument implies that there CURRENTLY are no crappy apps at the app store.



    We all know there are PLENTY of crappy apps, so that does not seem to be a credible line of reasoning against Adobe.



    The word "crappy" has nothing to do with the content of the App. It's more about how the App executes itself in the iOS programming architecture.



    Anyone with half a brain could figure out there are plenty of "crappy" apps in the App Store, content-wise that is, a la them fart apps.
  • Reply 238 of 238
    vvswarupvvswarup Posts: 330member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Mazda 3s View Post


    Sort of off topic, but flash runs just fine on my EVO 4G (Froyo). I thought that it would run like crap given what everyone on these forums has said about flash performance.



    I wouldn't mind having the OPTION of using it on my iPhone 4.



    You definitely have the OPTION of not using an iPhone 4 and you've already exercised that right.
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