Hey, remember clicking that little agree button. You agreed that any loss of information due to YOU not being RESPONSIBLE to back up what's important to YOU, won't be apple's responsibility. Take some god damn responsibility lolol...jeeezzz adults act as ignorant as kids.
Very well said. Don't blame someone else if you are not doing your part to prevent the loss of your info.
Which would include your examples of email and Google services, of which only email is really popular. It wouldn't include Netflix, twitter, or IMs. "Cloud computing" also tends to imply (in usage if not in actual capabilities) a "thin client", the modern day equivalent of a dumb terminal. Usually, the "thin client" is the browser.
Outside of e-mail, I'm not really seeing a "killer app" for "The Cloud". Maybe disk backup. If it's free (at least for consumers).
I suggest you work on broadening your definition then.
If you go around saying that there isn't a "killer app" for "The Cloud" whilst simultaneously denying any killer apps presented to you because they don't fit your own definition of what "The Cloud" is then all you're going to achieve is to confuse and irritate a lot of people.
I think he should have made sure he was happy with the product before it was released. Firing people after the fact isn't helpful.
Hopefully it's a lesson learned for the release of this latest incarnation.
That?s why it ultimately falls on Jobs.
The problem wasn?t with how it works, but how they released it. They created a perfect storm by releasing the iPhone 3G (I think in 15 countries), iPhone OS 2.0 and MobileMe all at the same time.
They did no .Mac user release. They did no staggered release from their other products. They pushed the MobileMe service in stores and online but they also had a free 30-day trial that was free to all and didn?t require any CC for the trial period. IOW, people could sign up to check out MobileMe willy-nilly? and they did. It was more logistics than technical from what i can tell.
They were acting like a company with a small user base. I think they learned from that as we?ve seen with future Mail and iCal updates in MobileMe, as well as staggered release cycles.
If you go around saying that there isn't a "killer app" for "The Cloud" whilst simultaneously denying any killer apps presented to you because they don't fit your own definition of what "The Cloud" is then all you're going to achieve is to confuse and irritate a lot of people.
Wasn't my definition. I didn't write that wiki article. And using "Cloud" as a synonym for "network" is probably more confusing.
Anyway, as I said, I'm not trying to turn into an argument over the meaning of "Cloud". If the stuff they offer in this iCloud product catches on, great. If not, they'll invent new things for "The Cloud" until something catches on or people just get tired of hearing about "The Cloud". My guess is it will be the latter, but time will tell.
Hmm... That seems like a fairly broad definition of "Cloud". A more common definition might be:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wikipedia
Users can store and access personal files such as music, pictures, videos, and bookmarks or play games or use productivity applications on a remote server rather than physically carrying around a storage medium such as a DVD or thumb drive.
Which would include your examples of email and Google services, of which only email is really popular. It wouldn't include Netflix, twitter, or IMs. "Cloud computing" also tends to imply (in usage if not in actual capabilities) a "thin client", the modern day equivalent of a dumb terminal. Usually, the "thin client" is the browser.
Outside of e-mail, I'm not really seeing a "killer app" for "The Cloud". Maybe disk backup. If it's free (at least for consumers).
Are you for real? You linked to an article that backs up Firefly7475 and my comments with excessive detail and numerous examples of what I stated yet you score the article ignoring all statements and reply with a single sentence description that doesn’t discount a damn thing that was said.
Here are the remaining sentences immediately before and after in the paragraph you quoted.
The phrase “cloud computing” originated from the cloud symbol that is usually used by flow charts and diagrams to symbolize the internet. The principle behind the cloud is that any computer connected to the internet is connected to the same pool of computing power, applications, and files. Users can store and access personal files such as music, pictures, videos, and bookmarks or play games or use productivity applications on a remote server rather than physically carrying around a storage medium such as a DVD or thumb drive. Almost all users of the internet may be using a form of cloud computing though few realize it. Those who use web-based email such as Gmail, Hotmail, Yahoo, a Company owned email, or even an e-mail client program such as Outlook, Evolution, Mozilla Thunderbird or Entourage are making use of cloud email servers. Hence, desktop applications which connect to cloud email would be considered cloud applications.
I wonder if Steve Jobs knows about the iPhoto roll out. I never did get all my photos recovered.
Recovered? Yes, even if an iPhoto Library is corrupt your photos are still on the disk. It happened to me twice with iPhoto upgrades. Never lost a photo though...
Wasn't my definition. I didn't write that wiki article.
It was your interpretation.
Quote:
Originally Posted by magicj
If the stuff they offer in this iCloud product catches on, great. If not, they'll invent new things for "The Cloud" until something catches on or people just get tired of hearing about "The Cloud".
The success of iCloud is irrelivent as Cloud services have already "caught on".
I agree the marketing guys will eventually come up with another name if calling it the "Cloud" becomes passé.
5) Shall we yet again discuss Steve Jobs telling iPhone 4 users to simply "Not hold the phone that way!", when they had reception issues??
Sorry. This one doesn't count because he was right on the money AND the whole antenna gate was bogus.
How do we know? Every survey on iPhone 4 satisfaction results in over 80% being 'very satisfied' and another 12% being 'satisfied'. This satisfaction metric out distances any other phone by a mile.
Yes, but the time for Jobs to ask "What does this product do?" is before it's launched, not after.
Your point is well taken, but it's a conversation trap. The follow up question was always intended to be: "then why doesn't it do that?" Granted, if Apple's management was on top of it, they would never have launched MobileMe in the condition it was in.
Here are the remaining sentences immediately before and after in the paragraph you quoted.
The phrase “cloud computing” originated from the cloud symbol that is usually used by flow charts and diagrams to symbolize the internet. The principle behind the cloud is that any computer connected to the internet is connected to the same pool of computing power, applications, and files. Users can store and access personal files such as music, pictures, videos, and bookmarks or play games or use productivity applications on a remote server rather than physically carrying around a storage medium such as a DVD or thumb drive. Almost all users of the internet may be using a form of cloud computing though few realize it. Those who use web-based email such as Gmail, Hotmail, Yahoo, a Company owned email, or even an e-mail client program such as Outlook, Evolution, Mozilla Thunderbird or Entourage are making use of cloud email servers. Hence, desktop applications which connect to cloud email would be considered cloud applications.
All the examples they give (Gmail, Hotmail, Yahoo, Outlook, Evolution, Mozilla Thunderbird or Entourage) are e-mail examples, which I agreed was an an example of cloud computing.
I'll agree the first sentence could be used to argue "The Cloud" means a Visio cloud, but that's just not the way I'm seeing the term actually being used. Not in the examples presented in that wiki article, not in the services being described for the new iCloud service.
Yeah, that’s what I said in the post which you disagreed.
People use “cloud” tech constantly, they just don’t think of it as such because...
Well, how about I put it this way: There's little point in arguing the technical definition of the term because, at this point, it's a marketing term. "The Cloud" means whatever some company's PR department wants it to mean.
The way I've usually seen the term used is how that wiki article described it. With that definition, I'm not seeing a killer app coming from "The Cloud". I'm seeing people like Oracle using the term to try and sell consulting time to Fortune 500 companies.
Which would include your examples of email and Google services, of which only email is really popular. It wouldn't include Netflix, twitter, or IMs. "Cloud computing" also tends to imply (in usage if not in actual capabilities) a "thin client", the modern day equivalent of a dumb terminal. Usually, the "thin client" is the browser.
Outside of e-mail, I'm not really seeing a "killer app" for "The Cloud". Maybe disk backup. If it's free (at least for consumers).
For Apple the killer app would be iLife plus Numbers, Pages, and Keynote to be cloud services as well as on computer apps. The real killer app for Cloud Computing is reducing the need for IT support. DropBox is great, Apple should buy them. Apple's Sync-Sucks, services such as DropBox are much more straight forward for me. Cloud, to me, is these very simple yet robust technologies, put together to form apps. PHP, javascript, HTML, CSS, KML, and SQL, blend these into any app your heart desires.
For Apple the killer app would be iLife plus Numbers, Pages, and Keynote to be cloud services as well as on computer apps. The real killer app for Cloud Computing is reducing the need for IT support. DropBox is great, Apple should buy them. Apple's Sync-Sucks, services such as DropBox are much more straight forward for me. Cloud, to me, is these very simple yet robust technologies, put together to form apps. PHP, javascript, HTML, CSS, KML, and SQL, blend these into any app your heart desires.
Agree with Dropbox. It's great (which reminds me, I have some backups to do ).
Numbers, iLife, Pages, and Keynote I'm not so sure. Partly because Google's cloud apps haven't been huge successes, partly because I don't want to have to connect to the internet to use those kinds of apps, and partly because I don't want to upload my personal data to Google, Apple, or any other company unless I need to, and partly because it's hard to duplicate full desktop app functionality with javascript/html.
Maybe in a corporate setting the centrally managed apps in a cloud would be a better fit. Even there, I'm not so sure.
Well, how about I put it this way: There's little point in arguing the technical definition of the term because, at this point, it's a marketing term. "The Cloud" means whatever some company's PR department wants it to mean.
The way I've usually seen the term used is how that wiki article described it. With that definition, I'm not seeing a killer app coming from "The Cloud". I'm seeing people like Oracle using the term to try and sell consulting time to Fortune 500 companies.
It's not like Wikipedia is the definitive source but in any case your interpretation of the article is incorrect.
The definition in the article is as broad as in real life, simply stating "Cloud computing" is the use of a remote server to store information.
They give some examples of data (music, pictures, videos, bookmarks) and of cloud services (Gmail, Hotmail, Yahoo) but it doesn't state that "Cloud computing" is exclusively limited to these services.
Granted, calling something a "Cloud" service has become a marketing term but not one that a company's PR department can make up the meaning to. For an application to be "Cloud" enabled it still needs to use a server on the Internet to process and/or store user information.
I'm yet to see a company with an offline application/service claim to be integrated with the cloud.
For Apple the killer app would be iLife plus Numbers, Pages, and Keynote to be cloud services as well as on computer apps.
IMO Microsoft has shown the best balance with office integration that Apple would do well to emulate.
Files are stored locally and in the cloud. If you have Office installed on the PC you're using you get the full featured experience. If not, you can edit the documents online using Office Web Apps.
Although this is useful, to be honest it isn't really revolutionary. People have been doing the same thing with email for years.
I expect a lot more applications to evolve this way. Along with the ones you mentioned (iLife, Numbers, Pages, and Keynote) I think you should also add iTunes.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brendon
The real killer app for Cloud Computing is reducing the need for IT support.
For consumers I think Apple have shown you can do this with a curated App Store. You don't have to run everything through a browser.
I think Apple will continue to expand on this with future iOS and OSX versions. Eventually you should be able to log into a computer and have access to everything you own. For example personal pictures, videos, documents and settings along with purchased music, movies, TV and apps.
If you don't have permission to (or don't want to) sync to a computer there should be simplified "web app" versions of the applications you own.
Yes, but the time for Jobs to ask "What does this product do?" is before it's launched, not after.
Don't you get it?!?!?
It was a leading question. Jobs already knew what it was SUPPOSED to do, and he was waiting for the idiot that would answer the question to give his response.
Agree with Dropbox. It's great (which reminds me, I have some backups to do ).
Numbers, iLife, Pages, and Keynote I'm not so sure. Partly because Google's cloud apps haven't been huge successes, partly because I don't want to have to connect to the internet to use those kinds of apps, and partly because I don't want to upload my personal data to Google, Apple, or any other company unless I need to, and partly because it's hard to duplicate full desktop app functionality with javascript/html.
Maybe in a corporate setting the centrally managed apps in a cloud would be a better fit. Even there, I'm not so sure.
Interest by Corps and large organizations are what is driving the Cloud.
Comments
Hey, remember clicking that little agree button. You agreed that any loss of information due to YOU not being RESPONSIBLE to back up what's important to YOU, won't be apple's responsibility. Take some god damn responsibility lolol...jeeezzz adults act as ignorant as kids.
Very well said. Don't blame someone else if you are not doing your part to prevent the loss of your info.
5a) He never said that to users
You obviously missed this interview:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k6IHZBXmixY
You don't go to the Louvre and expect to touch the Mona Lisa, do you?
Hmm... That seems like a fairly broad definition of "Cloud". A more common definition might be:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cloud_computing
Which would include your examples of email and Google services, of which only email is really popular. It wouldn't include Netflix, twitter, or IMs. "Cloud computing" also tends to imply (in usage if not in actual capabilities) a "thin client", the modern day equivalent of a dumb terminal. Usually, the "thin client" is the browser.
Outside of e-mail, I'm not really seeing a "killer app" for "The Cloud". Maybe disk backup. If it's free (at least for consumers).
I suggest you work on broadening your definition then.
If you go around saying that there isn't a "killer app" for "The Cloud" whilst simultaneously denying any killer apps presented to you because they don't fit your own definition of what "The Cloud" is then all you're going to achieve is to confuse and irritate a lot of people.
I think he should have made sure he was happy with the product before it was released. Firing people after the fact isn't helpful.
Hopefully it's a lesson learned for the release of this latest incarnation.
That?s why it ultimately falls on Jobs.
The problem wasn?t with how it works, but how they released it. They created a perfect storm by releasing the iPhone 3G (I think in 15 countries), iPhone OS 2.0 and MobileMe all at the same time.
They did no .Mac user release. They did no staggered release from their other products. They pushed the MobileMe service in stores and online but they also had a free 30-day trial that was free to all and didn?t require any CC for the trial period. IOW, people could sign up to check out MobileMe willy-nilly? and they did. It was more logistics than technical from what i can tell.
They were acting like a company with a small user base. I think they learned from that as we?ve seen with future Mail and iCal updates in MobileMe, as well as staggered release cycles.
If you go around saying that there isn't a "killer app" for "The Cloud" whilst simultaneously denying any killer apps presented to you because they don't fit your own definition of what "The Cloud" is then all you're going to achieve is to confuse and irritate a lot of people.
Wasn't my definition. I didn't write that wiki article. And using "Cloud" as a synonym for "network" is probably more confusing.
Anyway, as I said, I'm not trying to turn into an argument over the meaning of "Cloud". If the stuff they offer in this iCloud product catches on, great. If not, they'll invent new things for "The Cloud" until something catches on or people just get tired of hearing about "The Cloud". My guess is it will be the latter, but time will tell.
Hmm... That seems like a fairly broad definition of "Cloud". A more common definition might be:
Users can store and access personal files such as music, pictures, videos, and bookmarks or play games or use productivity applications on a remote server rather than physically carrying around a storage medium such as a DVD or thumb drive.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cloud_computing
Which would include your examples of email and Google services, of which only email is really popular. It wouldn't include Netflix, twitter, or IMs. "Cloud computing" also tends to imply (in usage if not in actual capabilities) a "thin client", the modern day equivalent of a dumb terminal. Usually, the "thin client" is the browser.
Outside of e-mail, I'm not really seeing a "killer app" for "The Cloud". Maybe disk backup. If it's free (at least for consumers).
Are you for real? You linked to an article that backs up Firefly7475 and my comments with excessive detail and numerous examples of what I stated yet you score the article ignoring all statements and reply with a single sentence description that doesn’t discount a damn thing that was said.
Here are the remaining sentences immediately before and after in the paragraph you quoted.
I wonder if Steve Jobs knows about the iPhoto roll out. I never did get all my photos recovered.
Recovered? Yes, even if an iPhoto Library is corrupt your photos are still on the disk. It happened to me twice with iPhoto upgrades. Never lost a photo though...
Wasn't my definition. I didn't write that wiki article.
It was your interpretation.
If the stuff they offer in this iCloud product catches on, great. If not, they'll invent new things for "The Cloud" until something catches on or people just get tired of hearing about "The Cloud".
The success of iCloud is irrelivent as Cloud services have already "caught on".
I agree the marketing guys will eventually come up with another name if calling it the "Cloud" becomes passé.
5) Shall we yet again discuss Steve Jobs telling iPhone 4 users to simply "Not hold the phone that way!", when they had reception issues??
Sorry. This one doesn't count because he was right on the money AND the whole antenna gate was bogus.
How do we know? Every survey on iPhone 4 satisfaction results in over 80% being 'very satisfied' and another 12% being 'satisfied'. This satisfaction metric out distances any other phone by a mile.
Yes, but the time for Jobs to ask "What does this product do?" is before it's launched, not after.
Your point is well taken, but it's a conversation trap. The follow up question was always intended to be: "then why doesn't it do that?" Granted, if Apple's management was on top of it, they would never have launched MobileMe in the condition it was in.
Hate each other? That's pretty funny, in that it is pretty messed up.
Well, after hearing our number 2 in our company tear us a new one, this is really business as usual, I guess?
This is what it takes to become the best performing company on Earth. No slags allowed.
Here are the remaining sentences immediately before and after in the paragraph you quoted.
All the examples they give (Gmail, Hotmail, Yahoo, Outlook, Evolution, Mozilla Thunderbird or Entourage) are e-mail examples, which I agreed was an an example of cloud computing.
I'll agree the first sentence could be used to argue "The Cloud" means a Visio cloud, but that's just not the way I'm seeing the term actually being used. Not in the examples presented in that wiki article, not in the services being described for the new iCloud service.
...that's just not the way I'm seeing the term actually being used.
Yeah, that’s what I said in the post which you disagreed.
Yeah, that’s what I said in the post which you disagreed.
Well, how about I put it this way: There's little point in arguing the technical definition of the term because, at this point, it's a marketing term. "The Cloud" means whatever some company's PR department wants it to mean.
The way I've usually seen the term used is how that wiki article described it. With that definition, I'm not seeing a killer app coming from "The Cloud". I'm seeing people like Oracle using the term to try and sell consulting time to Fortune 500 companies.
Hmm... That seems like a fairly broad definition of "Cloud". A more common definition might be:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cloud_computing
Which would include your examples of email and Google services, of which only email is really popular. It wouldn't include Netflix, twitter, or IMs. "Cloud computing" also tends to imply (in usage if not in actual capabilities) a "thin client", the modern day equivalent of a dumb terminal. Usually, the "thin client" is the browser.
Outside of e-mail, I'm not really seeing a "killer app" for "The Cloud". Maybe disk backup. If it's free (at least for consumers).
For Apple the killer app would be iLife plus Numbers, Pages, and Keynote to be cloud services as well as on computer apps. The real killer app for Cloud Computing is reducing the need for IT support. DropBox is great, Apple should buy them. Apple's Sync-Sucks, services such as DropBox are much more straight forward for me. Cloud, to me, is these very simple yet robust technologies, put together to form apps. PHP, javascript, HTML, CSS, KML, and SQL, blend these into any app your heart desires.
For Apple the killer app would be iLife plus Numbers, Pages, and Keynote to be cloud services as well as on computer apps. The real killer app for Cloud Computing is reducing the need for IT support. DropBox is great, Apple should buy them. Apple's Sync-Sucks, services such as DropBox are much more straight forward for me. Cloud, to me, is these very simple yet robust technologies, put together to form apps. PHP, javascript, HTML, CSS, KML, and SQL, blend these into any app your heart desires.
Agree with Dropbox. It's great (which reminds me, I have some backups to do
Numbers, iLife, Pages, and Keynote I'm not so sure. Partly because Google's cloud apps haven't been huge successes, partly because I don't want to have to connect to the internet to use those kinds of apps, and partly because I don't want to upload my personal data to Google, Apple, or any other company unless I need to, and partly because it's hard to duplicate full desktop app functionality with javascript/html.
Maybe in a corporate setting the centrally managed apps in a cloud would be a better fit. Even there, I'm not so sure.
Well, how about I put it this way: There's little point in arguing the technical definition of the term because, at this point, it's a marketing term. "The Cloud" means whatever some company's PR department wants it to mean.
The way I've usually seen the term used is how that wiki article described it. With that definition, I'm not seeing a killer app coming from "The Cloud". I'm seeing people like Oracle using the term to try and sell consulting time to Fortune 500 companies.
It's not like Wikipedia is the definitive source but in any case your interpretation of the article is incorrect.
The definition in the article is as broad as in real life, simply stating "Cloud computing" is the use of a remote server to store information.
They give some examples of data (music, pictures, videos, bookmarks) and of cloud services (Gmail, Hotmail, Yahoo) but it doesn't state that "Cloud computing" is exclusively limited to these services.
Granted, calling something a "Cloud" service has become a marketing term but not one that a company's PR department can make up the meaning to. For an application to be "Cloud" enabled it still needs to use a server on the Internet to process and/or store user information.
I'm yet to see a company with an offline application/service claim to be integrated with the cloud.
Maybe you know of one?
For Apple the killer app would be iLife plus Numbers, Pages, and Keynote to be cloud services as well as on computer apps.
IMO Microsoft has shown the best balance with office integration that Apple would do well to emulate.
Files are stored locally and in the cloud. If you have Office installed on the PC you're using you get the full featured experience. If not, you can edit the documents online using Office Web Apps.
Although this is useful, to be honest it isn't really revolutionary. People have been doing the same thing with email for years.
I expect a lot more applications to evolve this way. Along with the ones you mentioned (iLife, Numbers, Pages, and Keynote) I think you should also add iTunes.
The real killer app for Cloud Computing is reducing the need for IT support.
For consumers I think Apple have shown you can do this with a curated App Store. You don't have to run everything through a browser.
I think Apple will continue to expand on this with future iOS and OSX versions. Eventually you should be able to log into a computer and have access to everything you own. For example personal pictures, videos, documents and settings along with purchased music, movies, TV and apps.
If you don't have permission to (or don't want to) sync to a computer there should be simplified "web app" versions of the applications you own.
Yes, but the time for Jobs to ask "What does this product do?" is before it's launched, not after.
Don't you get it?!?!?
It was a leading question. Jobs already knew what it was SUPPOSED to do, and he was waiting for the idiot that would answer the question to give his response.
Thompson
Agree with Dropbox. It's great (which reminds me, I have some backups to do
Numbers, iLife, Pages, and Keynote I'm not so sure. Partly because Google's cloud apps haven't been huge successes, partly because I don't want to have to connect to the internet to use those kinds of apps, and partly because I don't want to upload my personal data to Google, Apple, or any other company unless I need to, and partly because it's hard to duplicate full desktop app functionality with javascript/html.
Maybe in a corporate setting the centrally managed apps in a cloud would be a better fit. Even there, I'm not so sure.
Interest by Corps and large organizations are what is driving the Cloud.