"It's a point of sales problem. It's an expertise problem. It's a marketing problem to consumers. It's a price point problem," he reportedly said, adding: "And it's a software richness of content problem."
Other than that .... it's great, just perfect ... magical, you might say!
If it's 1,000 -- there are probably a few Xooms and Galaxy Tabs in the mix. RIMM should have checked with their shipping dock, before authorizing 1,000 returns.
Enjoy your laugh now. Then again, perhaps your laugh will continue for a while, I don't know. I do know that today's Android phone market is larger than the iOS market. It's tough to laugh at Android handsets. At least today. Once upon a time, Android phones were weak. Rushed to market. The only appeal was that they weren't Apple products. And yet they still sold. Today, Android phones are represent a pretty decent platform. A true alternative to iOS. I suspect that Android on tablets will come around as well. You may be laughing at something that will come back to bite you.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eternal Emperor
So the tablet market's story has yet to be written, but the Android phone market is all sewn up. We'll see I guess.
iPhone 3GSs are out selling Android phones for pete's sake. Every Android phone that is annointed 'iPhone-killer" is forgotten less than three months after its release. Android, I suspect, is burning through its customers in the US via these BOGO. In other words, companies tend to drop the prices as they move from consuming early adopters, then mainstream, then the latecomers. Android may already by at the end of the curve by giving away the hardware. The broke and the cheapies simply don't make good customers. Look at how much money is being made by iOS developers vs. Android developers.
I mean, let's say Android domintes the low end in India, Brazil and China via the carriers giving away the phones, how does that benefit software developers in say the US? How do you get money of these people? Simple. You don't.
The PC market is having the exact same problem, except where Google is making all the money in phones, its MS in PCs. Yet, in both cases Apple is making more still cleaning up and growing share.
In addition, the Android phone market is NOT larger than the iOS market. That is simply untrue. iOS had sold more units and iPhones have sold more than probably the 4 top Android vendors. I am very interested in what iPhone 5 will do even though I know how it will turn out in the US. If the iPhone 4 is outselling the newest Android LTE phones like the Thunderbolt, I suspect that the iPhone 5 will dominate on Verizon to even a larger degree.
Thanks fo saving me the typing. Key points:
No Android phone outsold the iPhone 3GS last quarter
IOS Developers still making 10-13x Android developers and the dollar value of their revenue is growing 2-3x faster (yoy)
One area, in my opinion THE area is producitivity apps. A real word/excel option, the iPad is still weak there. Android is even weaker with little hope or interest in making a leap forward. So we have to wait for Microkia really. Not to say android tablets won't sell but not in the volume. There is no compelling reason, sure for the minority of geeks you mention who feel they are above it all, so.
The company that produces a tablet that matches the iPad adequately and offer Word and Excel with full editing of any document. There is the opportunity.
Avai
I've been saying the same thing, even though I wouldn't touch Office with... whatever.
MS is getting "itchy" to move. The "elephant" might surprise us and actually develop an App for iOS, and surely before they would develop one for Google-Ads me thinks.
RIM. What can I say? They just make all my predictions of their demise so friggin' easy (and the shorting of their stock), I just love 'em to death! Pity it's all predicated on their own failures and eventually their ruin.
I surely don't hate them, but Ball-Silly and Ball-Me(r) will probably make great bedfellas.
You are missing the reason for the tremendous "success" of the android market share. The reason that they have grown to where they are is is simply because they offer them for free or in 2 for 1 deals.
Without that, their rate of growth wouldn't have been nearly as fast and their success would have been non existent.
Now what you're seeing with the tablets is that they have to stand on their own feet with no subsidies, no freebies and priced high enough that people would rather spend that money on a product with a big name behind it and one that is also "trendy" like the iPad.
agree, so how do you shop for an android phone, which operating system can be upgraded, its a mess from the consumers point of view, i said the same thing for blackberry just before iPhone came out, the vast number of units, which do or do not have 3g, wifi, or browser, consumer confusion helps me talk about iPhone to non techies
even comparing the ip4 to 3gs, a few things differentiate them but both can use the same ios, android is a fragmented mess, and the number of phones coming out each month or two makes it even worse
can you seriously buy an adroid and know that in two years when your contract is up you have something that works?? my 3g is still better than most androids or BB and i don't have to go to college to relearn the ios each phone.
BOGO sounds like you are getting something great, but the lockin for two years with some slub you convinced to take the "other free" phone.
manufactutures know the reason for the iphone success has to do with the ios, many can't or won't create their own os, so they get one for free. maybe BB should be android and join the BOG3, (buy one get 3 free) model.
and androids success requires you giving up your privacy, since google wants to make their money back on your data
So the tablet market's story has yet to be written, but the Android phone market is all sewn up. We'll see I guess.
iPhone 3GSs are out selling Android phones for pete's sake. Every Android phone that is annointed 'iPhone-killer" is forgotten less than three months after its release. Android, I suspect, is burning through its customers in the US via these BOGO. In other words, companies tend to drop the prices as they move from consuming early adopters, then mainstream, then the latecomers. Android may already by at the end of the curve by giving away the hardware. The broke and the cheapies simply don't make good customers. Look at how much money is being made by iOS developers vs. Android developers.
I mean, let's say Android domintes the low end in India, Brazil and China via the carriers giving away the phones, how does that benefit software developers in say the US? How do you get money of these people? Simple. You don't.
The PC market is having the exact same problem, except where Google is making all the money in phones, its MS in PCs. Yet, in both cases Apple is making more still cleaning up and growing share.
In addition, the Android phone market is NOT larger than the iOS market. That is simply untrue. iOS had sold more units and iPhones have sold more than probably the 4 top Android vendors. I am very interested in what iPhone 5 will do even though I know how it will turn out in the US. If the iPhone 4 is outselling the newest Android LTE phones like the Thunderbolt, I suspect that the iPhone 5 will dominate on Verizon to even a larger degree.
All sewn up? No. But I do expect the Android market share to increase. But I only point out the Android handset market share to illustrate that pointing and laughing at a product is often a short term thing. People did laugh at Android. Andoid handsets now sell like hotcakes. I'll not get into the debate about whether they out sell iOS devices. The point being that anybody laughing at Android handsets today better take another look. I strongly suspect the same thing may happen to the Android tablet market. No, Android doesn't have the market sewn up in tablets either. But it's a young market.
Note that I own an iPad and an iPhone. I like the products. I just don't laugh at the competition.
Enjoy your laugh now. Then again, perhaps your laugh will continue for a while, I don't know. I do know that today's Android phone market is larger than the iOS market. It's tough to laugh at Android handsets. At least today. Once upon a time, Android phones were weak. Rushed to market. The only appeal was that they weren't Apple products. And yet they still sold. Today, Android phones are represent a pretty decent platform. A true alternative to iOS. I suspect that Android on tablets will come around as well. You may be laughing at something that will come back to bite you.
Android's marketshare may be bigger than the iPhone's marketshare, but let's see your data that state that Android's market is bigger than iPhone, iPad, iPhone, and AppleTV or as you called it iOS market?
No Android phone outsold the iPhone 3GS last quarter
IOS Developers still making 10-13x Android developers and the dollar value of their revenue is growing 2-3x faster (yoy)
You're looking at individual manufacturers, I'm looking at the entire Android market. Cumulatively, I believe more Android handsets were sold than iPhones. But you have an excellent point about revenue. Apple is making a huge profit.
Enjoy your laugh now. Then again, perhaps your laugh will continue for a while, I don't know. I do know that today's Android phone market is larger than the iOS market ...
I know you're a big Android fan and so forth but I have to point out this statement is simply not true. There are far, far more iOS devices than Android devices.
Android's marketshare may be bigger than the iPhone's marketshare, but let's see your data that state that Android's market is bigger than iPhone, iPad, iPhone, and AppleTV or as you called it iOS market?
For crying out loud. I'm not trying to make a point about relative market share. Only that it's stupid to laugh at Android handsets. They are a significant force in the marketplace. I don't believe you'll be able to laugh at the Android tablet market for long either.
I know you're a big Android fan and so forth but I have to point out this statement is simply not true. There are far, far more iOS devices than Android devices.
I'm not an Android fan at all. Don't own one. Don't want to own one. But I don't laugh at them either.
...compare this to the iPhone/Android phones market, but what everyone fails to mention is this.
A cell phone is, for all intents and purposes, a necessity, these days. Data Plans? No, but data plans are not so prohibitively expensive.
Google and their OEMs were smart in targeting Verizon in the US as the main carrier. Take the biggest carrier, that also happens to not have the iPhone, and introduce a viable alternative. This is the key to the early success of the Android platform.
It was an alternative platform, in an existing market, that, like iOS, was able to push the market forward.
Turn your attention to tablets. Apple introduced the iPad not as a replacement to anything. As a "tweener" product. It's not a smartphone, but it's not a laptop. It doesn't do everything, but what it does do? It does better than the alternatives.
However, what the tablet market is not? It is not a need. As I mentioned, people basically need a cell phone these days, and they need a computer. They do not need the in between product. It is an accessory. A luxury. Most people, when looking at a luxury item, don't settle. They go for the best/what they want, or the "popular" or status symbol item.
In other words, as of today, they will go with the iPad.
Until everyone "needs" a tablet, the iPad, in my opinion, will dominate. It is wrong to compare it to the smartphone market. It is more closely associated with the MP3 player market, where, just like coke and kleenex before it, iPod has become the "genericized" name referring to a product category.
... One area, in my opinion THE area is producitivity apps. A real word/excel option, the iPad is still weak there. Android is even weaker with little hope or interest in making a leap forward. So we have to wait for Microkia really. Not to say android tablets won't sell but not in the volume. There is no compelling reason, sure for the minority of geeks you mention who feel they are above it all, so.
The company that produces a tablet that matches the iPad adequately and offer Word and Excel with full editing of any document. There is the opportunity. ...
I completely agree with this.
I'm a sort of "edge case" iPad user in that I use mine almost exclusively as a productivity device. It's basically my main portable computer like a netbook or a laptop. I know most don't use the iPad that way, but the point is more and more people will over time if it's ever to replace traditional laptops (and I totally think they can). If Apple doesn't get the finger out and attack the productivity issue soon it might be too late.
Apple really needs to move iOS in the direction of productivity and personally I'm hoping that's what iOS 5 is all about because if it isn't, they might not have another year of lollygagging around by the other manufacturers to do that. I use Pages on the iPad every day all day and it's seriously lacking. It's not feature complete, and when it first came out it was essentially a beta product. So far they've release a single, weak update that added in a few thing that were missing from the beta (but not all), and some bug fixes. That's it.
Hell, DoodleJump on my iPhone must have been updated and patched literally 20 times in the same amount of time it got Apple to put out the single bug-fix to Pages. Pages is obviously a more complicated and involved app, but Pages is supposed to be the leading productivity app on the platform. If this is the best they can do then the iPad really is just a toy.
I think it's kind of embarrassing how little Apple has done on this front, but I'm still assuming that they are working on a big update that will surprise us all soon. I can't imagine what the hell they are thinking if they are not.
Not really. They just need to be good enough to offer a viable alternative. Android phones fumbled around for awhile at first, but now are giving Apple some competition. They didn't "leapfrog" the iPhone. They offered good options as an alternative.
Believe it or not, not everyone drinks the Apple Kool-Aid. Some people want choices which Apple refuse to offer. And I know a growing number of people who are anti-Apple because of that lack of choice and the "my way or the highway" attitude. Sure, Apple has the best option right now, but that doesn't mean it fits everyone's needs.
I don't mean to pick on you in particular!
But the "My way or the highway" attitude is misattributed if applied to Apple.
Apple tends to focus its efforts on a few superior products that will satisfy a majority of the markets in which they choose to participate -- then support the hell out of them.
Competitors. largely, try to have something for everyone and regurgitate forth a plethora of poorly thought-out and developed offerings to see if/what will sell -- often abandoning new products a few months after (even before) they get to market.
Apple chooses where and how they compete -- they never claim to have a solution for all users.
I know you're a big Android fan and so forth but I have to point out this statement is simply not true. There are far, far more iOS devices than Android devices.
Facts?
Are you also counting AppleTV2 and the original iPhone?
I actually hope they figure it out and do well. More competition is better for the market. It will push innovation at a faster pace. Yes, even as good as Apple's products are, I believe they could do even better if they had some competition nipping at their heels.
Competition won't mean anything to Apple in terms of innovation. Because they don't design or release based on competition. They do what they want when they want.
The results for Apple will be a slight diluting of their market share which will also dilute the claims of anti-trust because there is something else out there and Apple can say they aren't doing anything that affects those other things (a key factor in anti-trust). Also they can say that they are winning because they are the best, not just the only thing. But that's it.
You're looking at individual manufacturers, I'm looking at the entire Android market. Cumulatively, I believe more Android handsets were sold than iPhones. But you have an excellent point about revenue. Apple is making a huge profit.
For the most part I think there are very few companies making huge profits in mobile at this time and the lion share of it would be Apple, HTC and maybe Motorola.
Not really. They just need to be good enough to offer a viable alternative. Android phones fumbled around for awhile at first, but now are giving Apple some competition. They didn't "leapfrog" the iPhone. They offered good options as an alternative.
Believe it or not, not everyone drinks the Apple Kool-Aid. Some people want choices which Apple refuse to offer. And I know a growing number of people who are anti-Apple because of that lack of choice and the "my way or the highway" attitude. Sure, Apple has the best option right now, but that doesn't mean it fits everyone's needs.
I think the big difference, is that people need phones.
People dont need tablets....they dont need them at all.
And so far the interest in tablets tied to contracts is underwhelming, so there are very little in subsidies.
These two points make the tablet a completely different animal from the phone market.
So while there is some room for comparisons, in general the two are apples and oranges, and Android tablets have a LONG way to go before there will be any sort of widespread adoption.
For the life of me I cant understand how ANYONE could reasonably point to the development of Android on PHONES, which are essential, and say that they expect the tablet market, a complete luxury device, to play out in a similar fashion.
Local file management, file sharing, printing... to name three areas that could be improved. The two first are really one, I guess.
Could be, likely won't. At least not for a long while and not in the way that users like this board want to see it.
Contrary to belief there is no moral or divine mandate of what must be in anything so Apple doesn't have to include any feature if they don't want to. And a user accessible file management system is something they don't want to include in iOS. This is not a computer in their eyes and it won't be a computer for a very long time if ever. So no matter what the compet does they are not going to follow. Just like they haven't with Flash storage, blu-ray in their computers etc.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wovel
T
No Android phone outsold the iPhone 3GS last quarter
Correct. Android is winning only if you look at it OS v OS. But no individual phone has done better than any iphone model currently available (ie 3gs or 4)
And I wonder about returns. I know at least a half dozen folks that got Droids cause it is supposed to be so much better than the iphone and hated it. Every one of them is taking it even if they have to pay full price for an iphone. They won't consider trying another Android based phone because they figure the UI is crap on all of them.
Outselling the iphone sounds great but if it turns out that you are selling 1.1 million over iOS selling one million but 30% of yours come back in the first week and 50% of sales are returned by the 30 day deadline v a return rate of 10% for iphones, well it doesn't look so good after all.
Comments
"It's a point of sales problem. It's an expertise problem. It's a marketing problem to consumers. It's a price point problem," he reportedly said, adding: "And it's a software richness of content problem."
Other than that .... it's great, just perfect ... magical, you might say!
So they've recalled all of them then.
If it's 1,000 -- there are probably a few Xooms and Galaxy Tabs in the mix. RIMM should have checked with their shipping dock, before authorizing 1,000 returns.
Enjoy your laugh now. Then again, perhaps your laugh will continue for a while, I don't know. I do know that today's Android phone market is larger than the iOS market. It's tough to laugh at Android handsets. At least today. Once upon a time, Android phones were weak. Rushed to market. The only appeal was that they weren't Apple products. And yet they still sold. Today, Android phones are represent a pretty decent platform. A true alternative to iOS. I suspect that Android on tablets will come around as well. You may be laughing at something that will come back to bite you.
So the tablet market's story has yet to be written, but the Android phone market is all sewn up. We'll see I guess.
iPhone 3GSs are out selling Android phones for pete's sake. Every Android phone that is annointed 'iPhone-killer" is forgotten less than three months after its release. Android, I suspect, is burning through its customers in the US via these BOGO. In other words, companies tend to drop the prices as they move from consuming early adopters, then mainstream, then the latecomers. Android may already by at the end of the curve by giving away the hardware. The broke and the cheapies simply don't make good customers. Look at how much money is being made by iOS developers vs. Android developers.
I mean, let's say Android domintes the low end in India, Brazil and China via the carriers giving away the phones, how does that benefit software developers in say the US? How do you get money of these people? Simple. You don't.
The PC market is having the exact same problem, except where Google is making all the money in phones, its MS in PCs. Yet, in both cases Apple is making more still cleaning up and growing share.
In addition, the Android phone market is NOT larger than the iOS market. That is simply untrue. iOS had sold more units and iPhones have sold more than probably the 4 top Android vendors. I am very interested in what iPhone 5 will do even though I know how it will turn out in the US. If the iPhone 4 is outselling the newest Android LTE phones like the Thunderbolt, I suspect that the iPhone 5 will dominate on Verizon to even a larger degree.
Thanks fo saving me the typing. Key points:
No Android phone outsold the iPhone 3GS last quarter
IOS Developers still making 10-13x Android developers and the dollar value of their revenue is growing 2-3x faster (yoy)
...
One area, in my opinion THE area is producitivity apps. A real word/excel option, the iPad is still weak there. Android is even weaker with little hope or interest in making a leap forward. So we have to wait for Microkia really. Not to say android tablets won't sell but not in the volume. There is no compelling reason, sure for the minority of geeks you mention who feel they are above it all, so.
The company that produces a tablet that matches the iPad adequately and offer Word and Excel with full editing of any document. There is the opportunity.
Avai
I've been saying the same thing, even though I wouldn't touch Office with... whatever.
MS is getting "itchy" to move. The "elephant" might surprise us and actually develop an App for iOS, and surely before they would develop one for Google-Ads me thinks.
RIM. What can I say? They just make all my predictions of their demise so friggin' easy (and the shorting of their stock), I just love 'em to death! Pity it's all predicated on their own failures and eventually their ruin.
I surely don't hate them, but Ball-Silly and Ball-Me(r) will probably make great bedfellas.
You are missing the reason for the tremendous "success" of the android market share. The reason that they have grown to where they are is is simply because they offer them for free or in 2 for 1 deals.
Without that, their rate of growth wouldn't have been nearly as fast and their success would have been non existent.
Now what you're seeing with the tablets is that they have to stand on their own feet with no subsidies, no freebies and priced high enough that people would rather spend that money on a product with a big name behind it and one that is also "trendy" like the iPad.
agree, so how do you shop for an android phone, which operating system can be upgraded, its a mess from the consumers point of view, i said the same thing for blackberry just before iPhone came out, the vast number of units, which do or do not have 3g, wifi, or browser, consumer confusion helps me talk about iPhone to non techies
even comparing the ip4 to 3gs, a few things differentiate them but both can use the same ios, android is a fragmented mess, and the number of phones coming out each month or two makes it even worse
can you seriously buy an adroid and know that in two years when your contract is up you have something that works?? my 3g is still better than most androids or BB and i don't have to go to college to relearn the ios each phone.
BOGO sounds like you are getting something great, but the lockin for two years with some slub you convinced to take the "other free" phone.
manufactutures know the reason for the iphone success has to do with the ios, many can't or won't create their own os, so they get one for free. maybe BB should be android and join the BOG3, (buy one get 3 free) model.
and androids success requires you giving up your privacy, since google wants to make their money back on your data
So the tablet market's story has yet to be written, but the Android phone market is all sewn up. We'll see I guess.
iPhone 3GSs are out selling Android phones for pete's sake. Every Android phone that is annointed 'iPhone-killer" is forgotten less than three months after its release. Android, I suspect, is burning through its customers in the US via these BOGO. In other words, companies tend to drop the prices as they move from consuming early adopters, then mainstream, then the latecomers. Android may already by at the end of the curve by giving away the hardware. The broke and the cheapies simply don't make good customers. Look at how much money is being made by iOS developers vs. Android developers.
I mean, let's say Android domintes the low end in India, Brazil and China via the carriers giving away the phones, how does that benefit software developers in say the US? How do you get money of these people? Simple. You don't.
The PC market is having the exact same problem, except where Google is making all the money in phones, its MS in PCs. Yet, in both cases Apple is making more still cleaning up and growing share.
In addition, the Android phone market is NOT larger than the iOS market. That is simply untrue. iOS had sold more units and iPhones have sold more than probably the 4 top Android vendors. I am very interested in what iPhone 5 will do even though I know how it will turn out in the US. If the iPhone 4 is outselling the newest Android LTE phones like the Thunderbolt, I suspect that the iPhone 5 will dominate on Verizon to even a larger degree.
All sewn up? No. But I do expect the Android market share to increase. But I only point out the Android handset market share to illustrate that pointing and laughing at a product is often a short term thing. People did laugh at Android. Andoid handsets now sell like hotcakes. I'll not get into the debate about whether they out sell iOS devices. The point being that anybody laughing at Android handsets today better take another look. I strongly suspect the same thing may happen to the Android tablet market. No, Android doesn't have the market sewn up in tablets either. But it's a young market.
Note that I own an iPad and an iPhone. I like the products. I just don't laugh at the competition.
Enjoy your laugh now. Then again, perhaps your laugh will continue for a while, I don't know. I do know that today's Android phone market is larger than the iOS market. It's tough to laugh at Android handsets. At least today. Once upon a time, Android phones were weak. Rushed to market. The only appeal was that they weren't Apple products. And yet they still sold. Today, Android phones are represent a pretty decent platform. A true alternative to iOS. I suspect that Android on tablets will come around as well. You may be laughing at something that will come back to bite you.
Android's marketshare may be bigger than the iPhone's marketshare, but let's see your data that state that Android's market is bigger than iPhone, iPad, iPhone, and AppleTV or as you called it iOS market?
Thanks fo saving me the typing. Key points:
No Android phone outsold the iPhone 3GS last quarter
IOS Developers still making 10-13x Android developers and the dollar value of their revenue is growing 2-3x faster (yoy)
You're looking at individual manufacturers, I'm looking at the entire Android market. Cumulatively, I believe more Android handsets were sold than iPhones. But you have an excellent point about revenue. Apple is making a huge profit.
Enjoy your laugh now. Then again, perhaps your laugh will continue for a while, I don't know. I do know that today's Android phone market is larger than the iOS market ...
I know you're a big Android fan and so forth but I have to point out this statement is simply not true. There are far, far more iOS devices than Android devices.
Android's marketshare may be bigger than the iPhone's marketshare, but let's see your data that state that Android's market is bigger than iPhone, iPad, iPhone, and AppleTV or as you called it iOS market?
For crying out loud. I'm not trying to make a point about relative market share. Only that it's stupid to laugh at Android handsets. They are a significant force in the marketplace. I don't believe you'll be able to laugh at the Android tablet market for long either.
I know you're a big Android fan and so forth but I have to point out this statement is simply not true. There are far, far more iOS devices than Android devices.
I'm not an Android fan at all. Don't own one. Don't want to own one. But I don't laugh at them either.
... the "my way or the highway" attitude. Sure, Apple has the best option right now, but that doesn't mean it fits everyone's needs.
"my way" = over one hundred thousand developers making it so you CAN have it YOUR way on any highway or byway you choose to take.
Something the fandroids never seem to grasp with their tired, old parroted mantra.
A cell phone is, for all intents and purposes, a necessity, these days. Data Plans? No, but data plans are not so prohibitively expensive.
Google and their OEMs were smart in targeting Verizon in the US as the main carrier. Take the biggest carrier, that also happens to not have the iPhone, and introduce a viable alternative. This is the key to the early success of the Android platform.
It was an alternative platform, in an existing market, that, like iOS, was able to push the market forward.
Turn your attention to tablets. Apple introduced the iPad not as a replacement to anything. As a "tweener" product. It's not a smartphone, but it's not a laptop. It doesn't do everything, but what it does do? It does better than the alternatives.
However, what the tablet market is not? It is not a need. As I mentioned, people basically need a cell phone these days, and they need a computer. They do not need the in between product. It is an accessory. A luxury. Most people, when looking at a luxury item, don't settle. They go for the best/what they want, or the "popular" or status symbol item.
In other words, as of today, they will go with the iPad.
Until everyone "needs" a tablet, the iPad, in my opinion, will dominate. It is wrong to compare it to the smartphone market. It is more closely associated with the MP3 player market, where, just like coke and kleenex before it, iPod has become the "genericized" name referring to a product category.
... One area, in my opinion THE area is producitivity apps. A real word/excel option, the iPad is still weak there. Android is even weaker with little hope or interest in making a leap forward. So we have to wait for Microkia really. Not to say android tablets won't sell but not in the volume. There is no compelling reason, sure for the minority of geeks you mention who feel they are above it all, so.
The company that produces a tablet that matches the iPad adequately and offer Word and Excel with full editing of any document. There is the opportunity. ...
I completely agree with this.
I'm a sort of "edge case" iPad user in that I use mine almost exclusively as a productivity device. It's basically my main portable computer like a netbook or a laptop. I know most don't use the iPad that way, but the point is more and more people will over time if it's ever to replace traditional laptops (and I totally think they can). If Apple doesn't get the finger out and attack the productivity issue soon it might be too late.
Apple really needs to move iOS in the direction of productivity and personally I'm hoping that's what iOS 5 is all about because if it isn't, they might not have another year of lollygagging around by the other manufacturers to do that. I use Pages on the iPad every day all day and it's seriously lacking. It's not feature complete, and when it first came out it was essentially a beta product. So far they've release a single, weak update that added in a few thing that were missing from the beta (but not all), and some bug fixes. That's it.
Hell, DoodleJump on my iPhone must have been updated and patched literally 20 times in the same amount of time it got Apple to put out the single bug-fix to Pages. Pages is obviously a more complicated and involved app, but Pages is supposed to be the leading productivity app on the platform. If this is the best they can do then the iPad really is just a toy.
I think it's kind of embarrassing how little Apple has done on this front, but I'm still assuming that they are working on a big update that will surprise us all soon. I can't imagine what the hell they are thinking if they are not.
Not really. They just need to be good enough to offer a viable alternative. Android phones fumbled around for awhile at first, but now are giving Apple some competition. They didn't "leapfrog" the iPhone. They offered good options as an alternative.
Believe it or not, not everyone drinks the Apple Kool-Aid. Some people want choices which Apple refuse to offer. And I know a growing number of people who are anti-Apple because of that lack of choice and the "my way or the highway" attitude. Sure, Apple has the best option right now, but that doesn't mean it fits everyone's needs.
I don't mean to pick on you in particular!
But the "My way or the highway" attitude is misattributed if applied to Apple.
Apple tends to focus its efforts on a few superior products that will satisfy a majority of the markets in which they choose to participate -- then support the hell out of them.
Competitors. largely, try to have something for everyone and regurgitate forth a plethora of poorly thought-out and developed offerings to see if/what will sell -- often abandoning new products a few months after (even before) they get to market.
Apple chooses where and how they compete -- they never claim to have a solution for all users.
I applaud Apple for their approach!
I know you're a big Android fan and so forth but I have to point out this statement is simply not true. There are far, far more iOS devices than Android devices.
Facts?
Are you also counting AppleTV2 and the original iPhone?
I actually hope they figure it out and do well. More competition is better for the market. It will push innovation at a faster pace. Yes, even as good as Apple's products are, I believe they could do even better if they had some competition nipping at their heels.
Competition won't mean anything to Apple in terms of innovation. Because they don't design or release based on competition. They do what they want when they want.
The results for Apple will be a slight diluting of their market share which will also dilute the claims of anti-trust because there is something else out there and Apple can say they aren't doing anything that affects those other things (a key factor in anti-trust). Also they can say that they are winning because they are the best, not just the only thing. But that's it.
You're looking at individual manufacturers, I'm looking at the entire Android market. Cumulatively, I believe more Android handsets were sold than iPhones. But you have an excellent point about revenue. Apple is making a huge profit.
For the most part I think there are very few companies making huge profits in mobile at this time and the lion share of it would be Apple, HTC and maybe Motorola.
Not really. They just need to be good enough to offer a viable alternative. Android phones fumbled around for awhile at first, but now are giving Apple some competition. They didn't "leapfrog" the iPhone. They offered good options as an alternative.
Believe it or not, not everyone drinks the Apple Kool-Aid. Some people want choices which Apple refuse to offer. And I know a growing number of people who are anti-Apple because of that lack of choice and the "my way or the highway" attitude. Sure, Apple has the best option right now, but that doesn't mean it fits everyone's needs.
I think the big difference, is that people need phones.
People dont need tablets....they dont need them at all.
And so far the interest in tablets tied to contracts is underwhelming, so there are very little in subsidies.
These two points make the tablet a completely different animal from the phone market.
So while there is some room for comparisons, in general the two are apples and oranges, and Android tablets have a LONG way to go before there will be any sort of widespread adoption.
For the life of me I cant understand how ANYONE could reasonably point to the development of Android on PHONES, which are essential, and say that they expect the tablet market, a complete luxury device, to play out in a similar fashion.
Local file management, file sharing, printing... to name three areas that could be improved. The two first are really one, I guess.
Could be, likely won't. At least not for a long while and not in the way that users like this board want to see it.
Contrary to belief there is no moral or divine mandate of what must be in anything so Apple doesn't have to include any feature if they don't want to. And a user accessible file management system is something they don't want to include in iOS. This is not a computer in their eyes and it won't be a computer for a very long time if ever. So no matter what the compet does they are not going to follow. Just like they haven't with Flash storage, blu-ray in their computers etc.
T
No Android phone outsold the iPhone 3GS last quarter
Correct. Android is winning only if you look at it OS v OS. But no individual phone has done better than any iphone model currently available (ie 3gs or 4)
And I wonder about returns. I know at least a half dozen folks that got Droids cause it is supposed to be so much better than the iphone and hated it. Every one of them is taking it even if they have to pay full price for an iphone. They won't consider trying another Android based phone because they figure the UI is crap on all of them.
Outselling the iphone sounds great but if it turns out that you are selling 1.1 million over iOS selling one million but 30% of yours come back in the first week and 50% of sales are returned by the 30 day deadline v a return rate of 10% for iphones, well it doesn't look so good after all.