It's certainly cheaper than the iPad, but it's also a lot less functionality. How that equates to being a better deal isn't universal. The iPad has iTunes, Netflix, and Kindle apps and can be a replacement for a standard PC by the time the Kindle Fire will arrive. The same can't be said for the Kindle Fire.
PS: The Silk browser has its benefits, but being a replacement for a secure browser isn't one of them. I don't want my emails shared with Amazon. I don't want my bank account data shared with Amazon. This is a major drawback to a server-side browser.
...The sole purpose of the device is to be a front end to Amazon media subscriptions, so why should a customer pay for the device?
Time will tell.
I think they would be more successful by speading the cost of the device over two years via contract. This contract would include a monthly subscription to Prime. . Unlimited streaming to their limited set of free movies/shows, one free book per month, one free music track per month.
Content:
$79/year free shipping and limited movies = ~ $6.50/mo + $0.99 song + $1.99 cheap book = ~ $10/mo
Fire Device:
now spread the cost of the $199 over two years and you get ~$8/mo with 2 yr contract.
giving you grand total of about $18/mo for the Fire with limited free movie, music and books, + free shipping with Amazon.
That would sell like hotcakes, IMHO.
For someone who cant afford $500 for an iPad, I dont think $200 is a no brainer either. I know plenty of people who live from month to month. $200 is not easy come up with for these people. However, make it a monthly fee of $20-30/mo and you get a ton of people who are willing to do that. I think this is why Android Phones out sell iPhone. The cost of the upgrade for current generation Android phone is typically less than a current generation iPhone. At least that appears to be the case in the US.
I also think this is why Android tablets have not taken off. No month contract structure.
Everyone else seems to love it. Mainstream news media and most analyst. Says better deal than iPad.
"Everyone Else" and all the pundits gushing over the Fire really should wait until they have the real thing in hand to test and review in detail. a demo at a press conference is never the complete story - haven't they learned that hard lesson yet, after so many other hypes at the announcement phase have turned to flops in real life? just how good a user experience the Fire is in all the ways that matter, and how well the hardware performs in real life, remain to be seen. or should Everyone Else always just swallow the hype they are spoon fed at these press events?
one thing that is really disappointing about all that gushing is how blind Everyone Else is to the plain fact there already is a low-priced "iPad Mini" tablet and has been for several years - it's the iPod touch of course. forget what Apple named it, that's just marketing. for just $229, $30 more than a Fire, Everyone Else can get right now everything the Fire has to offer and more. in a beautiful package, i might add, not the Fire's clunky modified Playbook chassis.
the only real advantage of the Fire vs. the touch is of course the Fire's 7" screen is twice the touch's 3.5" size, with 4X the screen area. that makes the Fire easier to use for most, altho too big for most pockets. both are running smartphone apps, the Fire just scales them up - not great.
i'd agree if Everyone Else suggested Apple should come out with a larger model of the iPod touch, like 5.5," to address the same "convenience tablet" market. with about 2X the screen area of a 3.5" model this size has been used by Sony for its PGP's, and it works really good for users (but Sony has other problems). it's more pocket-friendly too.
simply enlarging the size of the iPod touch would not add that much to its manufacturing cost, as all the stuff inside would be the same except a larger battery. Apple could sell one for $299.
so if Everyone Else had a lovely $299 slim and light 5.5" Apple iPod touch on a store table next to the dowdy $199 thick and heavy 7" Amazon Fire, which would they buy?
one thing Everyone Else might take in to account making that choice is that the touch could use its Amazon app to scan bar codes in that store and comparison shop at Amazon for better prices on the web. but having no camera, Amazon's own Fire could not (and that's a really dumb V.1 mistake).
I think they would be more successful by speading the cost of the device over two years via contract. This contract would include a monthly subscription to Prime. . Unlimited streaming to their limited set of free movies/shows, one free book per month, one free music track per month.
Content:
$79/year free shipping and limited movies = ~ $6.50/mo + $0.99 song + $1.99 cheap book = ~ $10/mo
Fire Device:
now spread the cost of the $199 over two years and you get ~$8/mo with 2 yr contract.
giving you grand total of about $18/mo for the Fire with limited free movie, music and books, + free shipping with Amazon.
That would sell like hotcakes, IMHO.
I disagree! One of the big appeals of the iPad (even the cell models) is that you pay for it and have no obligation to buy anything else -- no monthly fee!
I disagree! One of the big appeals of the iPad (even the cell models) is that you pay for it and have no obligation to buy anything else -- no monthly fee!
I am in agreement with you from my financial position. I am just saying, many people would rather just deal with a month fees because they live month to month and can never come up with any significant saving. This is now our society is unfortunately.
Not too many of those kind of people actually exist. There are a few loud, ignorant individuals on the internet who would fit into that deranged category, but their numbers are small and they have zero effect on the market.
Absolutely not true. There are millions of IT employees - and I've never met one who didn't go out of their way to denigrate Apple products.
Add in a few million Linux fans and a few million people who are apparently being paid by Google to hype Android (at least it appears that way) and the numbers start to become significant.
Then, from that core, you extrapolate the FUD. I can't tell you how many people have told me they couldn't use a Mac because it's "not compatible" even though all they do is email, browsing the web, and an occasional Word document.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hmm
You know this is a bunch of crap yet you posted it anyway. If they are losing anything per tablet I doubt it's much. If it is the case anyway it's tied to high manufacturing costs early on.
There are two reports. First, there's the analyst who said that his estimates are $50 per unit that Amazon loses. Then there's the supply chain report that says that the components alone are $180 per unit. If the components alone are $180, it's not hard to believe that it's $250 for components plus assembly plus QC plus returns plus rework plus shipping plus packaging plus overhead.
The funny thing about the entire report that no one has mentioned is that JP Morgan isn't saying anything new. NO ONE has said that the Kindle Fire will compete with the iPad. Amazon has certainly never made that claim - in fact, they've gone out of their way to say that it's NOT competing with the iPad. At best, it's somewhere between a Kindle and an iPad.
first off, the iPad2 shouldn't be compared to the Kindle Fire. They're at two completely different price points.
That is most likely his point. He is tasked with explaining whether or not the Fire will impact Apple. He says no. He isn't insulting your favorite sports team, he is telling people their investment won't be impacted...
I am in agreement with you from my financial position. I am just saying, many people would rather just deal with a month fees because they live month to month and can never come up with any significant saving. This is now our society is unfortunately.
You are probably right... sigh!
My generation was instilled with the discipline to not buy things we could not afford -- and not buy anything rather than settle for something inferior (that wouldn't satisfy you). Save for what you want rather than compromise for second rate.
It is interesting that a purchasing technique from WWII seems to be gaining popularity...
Am an Apple fanboy and investor, and I just pre-ordered a Kindle Touch and a Fire.
KSO (Kindle Special Offers) is slick as heck, and I'm a long time Amazon customer. I suspect I'll get my $ out of the Kindle Touch
As far as the Fire, it'll play the stuff Amazon streams for movies, tv shows, etc, am already an Amazon Prime customer, so I have access to lots of content.
Will I be selling my iPad 2? hell no, it will have to be pried from my cold dead hands.
No one has said it yet, so here goes, how about a Kindle phone on a forked version of Android?
But, this Amazon mini Android tablet won't have any effect on iPads.
I'm inclined to agree. This device is not in the same audience as the iPad. It will catch all the folks that aren't in the iPad group and could do well. But it wont be an iPad killer
I remember when everyone was saying the iPhone is not a blackberry competitor. Now look where we are. Kindle Fire is an iPad competitor like all the other android tablets. Can the Kindle Fire read other books and do other content besides that which comes through Amazon?
Comments
How long before we see an Amazon Fire with Special Offers? $169.99. Place your bets.
Amazon store already have many Android 7" tablets for well under $199.
No storage will be needed at all. It can all be accessed through Amazon's cloud service.
What if you are at the beach, a park, etc.
What if you are at the beach, a park, etc.
That won't be possible. They'll all end up sitting inside a McDonalds with the old ladies and the other regulars who like to hang out there.
Android outsells iOS at a greater than 2 to 1 ratio.
Groan.... let go of it already. You're really tiresome.
Says better deal than iPad.
It's certainly cheaper than the iPad, but it's also a lot less functionality. How that equates to being a better deal isn't universal. The iPad has iTunes, Netflix, and Kindle apps and can be a replacement for a standard PC by the time the Kindle Fire will arrive. The same can't be said for the Kindle Fire.
PS: The Silk browser has its benefits, but being a replacement for a secure browser isn't one of them. I don't want my emails shared with Amazon. I don't want my bank account data shared with Amazon. This is a major drawback to a server-side browser.
Time will tell.
...The sole purpose of the device is to be a front end to Amazon media subscriptions, so why should a customer pay for the device?
Time will tell.
I think they would be more successful by speading the cost of the device over two years via contract. This contract would include a monthly subscription to Prime. . Unlimited streaming to their limited set of free movies/shows, one free book per month, one free music track per month.
Content:
$79/year free shipping and limited movies = ~ $6.50/mo + $0.99 song + $1.99 cheap book = ~ $10/mo
Fire Device:
now spread the cost of the $199 over two years and you get ~$8/mo with 2 yr contract.
giving you grand total of about $18/mo for the Fire with limited free movie, music and books, + free shipping with Amazon.
That would sell like hotcakes, IMHO.
For someone who cant afford $500 for an iPad, I dont think $200 is a no brainer either. I know plenty of people who live from month to month. $200 is not easy come up with for these people. However, make it a monthly fee of $20-30/mo and you get a ton of people who are willing to do that. I think this is why Android Phones out sell iPhone. The cost of the upgrade for current generation Android phone is typically less than a current generation iPhone. At least that appears to be the case in the US.
I also think this is why Android tablets have not taken off. No month contract structure.
Everyone else seems to love it. Mainstream news media and most analyst. Says better deal than iPad.
"Everyone Else" and all the pundits gushing over the Fire really should wait until they have the real thing in hand to test and review in detail. a demo at a press conference is never the complete story - haven't they learned that hard lesson yet, after so many other hypes at the announcement phase have turned to flops in real life? just how good a user experience the Fire is in all the ways that matter, and how well the hardware performs in real life, remain to be seen. or should Everyone Else always just swallow the hype they are spoon fed at these press events?
one thing that is really disappointing about all that gushing is how blind Everyone Else is to the plain fact there already is a low-priced "iPad Mini" tablet and has been for several years - it's the iPod touch of course. forget what Apple named it, that's just marketing. for just $229, $30 more than a Fire, Everyone Else can get right now everything the Fire has to offer and more. in a beautiful package, i might add, not the Fire's clunky modified Playbook chassis.
the only real advantage of the Fire vs. the touch is of course the Fire's 7" screen is twice the touch's 3.5" size, with 4X the screen area. that makes the Fire easier to use for most, altho too big for most pockets. both are running smartphone apps, the Fire just scales them up - not great.
i'd agree if Everyone Else suggested Apple should come out with a larger model of the iPod touch, like 5.5," to address the same "convenience tablet" market. with about 2X the screen area of a 3.5" model this size has been used by Sony for its PGP's, and it works really good for users (but Sony has other problems). it's more pocket-friendly too.
simply enlarging the size of the iPod touch would not add that much to its manufacturing cost, as all the stuff inside would be the same except a larger battery. Apple could sell one for $299.
so if Everyone Else had a lovely $299 slim and light 5.5" Apple iPod touch on a store table next to the dowdy $199 thick and heavy 7" Amazon Fire, which would they buy?
one thing Everyone Else might take in to account making that choice is that the touch could use its Amazon app to scan bar codes in that store and comparison shop at Amazon for better prices on the web. but having no camera, Amazon's own Fire could not (and that's a really dumb V.1 mistake).
I think they would be more successful by speading the cost of the device over two years via contract. This contract would include a monthly subscription to Prime. . Unlimited streaming to their limited set of free movies/shows, one free book per month, one free music track per month.
Content:
$79/year free shipping and limited movies = ~ $6.50/mo + $0.99 song + $1.99 cheap book = ~ $10/mo
Fire Device:
now spread the cost of the $199 over two years and you get ~$8/mo with 2 yr contract.
giving you grand total of about $18/mo for the Fire with limited free movie, music and books, + free shipping with Amazon.
That would sell like hotcakes, IMHO.
I disagree! One of the big appeals of the iPad (even the cell models) is that you pay for it and have no obligation to buy anything else -- no monthly fee!
I disagree! One of the big appeals of the iPad (even the cell models) is that you pay for it and have no obligation to buy anything else -- no monthly fee!
I am in agreement with you from my financial position. I am just saying, many people would rather just deal with a month fees because they live month to month and can never come up with any significant saving. This is now our society is unfortunately.
Not too many of those kind of people actually exist. There are a few loud, ignorant individuals on the internet who would fit into that deranged category, but their numbers are small and they have zero effect on the market.
Absolutely not true. There are millions of IT employees - and I've never met one who didn't go out of their way to denigrate Apple products.
Add in a few million Linux fans and a few million people who are apparently being paid by Google to hype Android (at least it appears that way) and the numbers start to become significant.
Then, from that core, you extrapolate the FUD. I can't tell you how many people have told me they couldn't use a Mac because it's "not compatible" even though all they do is email, browsing the web, and an occasional Word document.
You know this is a bunch of crap yet you posted it anyway. If they are losing anything per tablet I doubt it's much. If it is the case anyway it's tied to high manufacturing costs early on.
There are two reports. First, there's the analyst who said that his estimates are $50 per unit that Amazon loses. Then there's the supply chain report that says that the components alone are $180 per unit. If the components alone are $180, it's not hard to believe that it's $250 for components plus assembly plus QC plus returns plus rework plus shipping plus packaging plus overhead.
The funny thing about the entire report that no one has mentioned is that JP Morgan isn't saying anything new. NO ONE has said that the Kindle Fire will compete with the iPad. Amazon has certainly never made that claim - in fact, they've gone out of their way to say that it's NOT competing with the iPad. At best, it's somewhere between a Kindle and an iPad.
wtf is wrong with this analyst.
first off, the iPad2 shouldn't be compared to the Kindle Fire. They're at two completely different price points.
That is most likely his point. He is tasked with explaining whether or not the Fire will impact Apple. He says no. He isn't insulting your favorite sports team, he is telling people their investment won't be impacted...
I am in agreement with you from my financial position. I am just saying, many people would rather just deal with a month fees because they live month to month and can never come up with any significant saving. This is now our society is unfortunately.
You are probably right... sigh!
My generation was instilled with the discipline to not buy things we could not afford -- and not buy anything rather than settle for something inferior (that wouldn't satisfy you). Save for what you want rather than compromise for second rate.
It is interesting that a purchasing technique from WWII seems to be gaining popularity...
Lay-away!
...The sole purpose of the device is to be a front end to Amazon media subscriptions, so why should a customer pay for the device?
Why would you buy an AppleTV then? Can you buy a movie from anywhere else to play on it either?
It worked in the smartphone biz, so why not the tablet biz?
Poor.
Bad.
Gullible.
Pick one or more to explain why Android is kicking Apples butt in the phone market, and then extend that to the tablet market.
Are you aware that Apple has both the first and second most popular phones? Ever? In the world?
God I wish i could get my "butt kicked" like that. Maybe have the first and second most popular books in the world. Ever.
Stupid, it isn't a lifestyle choice, try fixing it.
Why would you buy an AppleTV then? Can you buy a movie from anywhere else to play on it either?
With iCloud, you should be able to, I believe.
Or maybe iCloud doesn't do TV/Movies yet. I don't remember.
At any rate, it eventually will. I'd say easily before the end of next year.
KSO (Kindle Special Offers) is slick as heck, and I'm a long time Amazon customer. I suspect I'll get my $ out of the Kindle Touch
As far as the Fire, it'll play the stuff Amazon streams for movies, tv shows, etc, am already an Amazon Prime customer, so I have access to lots of content.
Will I be selling my iPad 2? hell no, it will have to be pried from my cold dead hands.
No one has said it yet, so here goes, how about a Kindle phone on a forked version of Android?
But, this Amazon mini Android tablet won't have any effect on iPads.
I'm inclined to agree. This device is not in the same audience as the iPad. It will catch all the folks that aren't in the iPad group and could do well. But it wont be an iPad killer