I knew that is why iPhone 5 didint come. It makes total sense for Apple to wait to release a new redesigned iPhone. They want a big "wow" for when real 4G is available and available in more places outside of larger cities to release a redesigned phone. The fact of the matter is that if you get a phone right now with 4G LTE that you will only be able to use 4G in bigger cites but once you go out further away you lose your 4G because it's not fully developed yet. A big percent of users won't be able to use 4G. So this makes sense for apple to hold off on the new redesign and wait for technology to fully catch us. It would be hard to pull off a big "WOW" if they redesigned a new iPhone this year and next year 4G LTE with no new redesign when the next best thing is finally fully developed or close to being fully developed.
Wouldn?t it be better if everyone would stop complaining about the 4S release and realize that this is just an incremental upgrade? Like everyone else I was also waiting for an iPhone 5. My I am due to upgrade two devices right now, and HTC EVO, and the iPhone 3GS. I will upgrade the HTC, and wait for the 5 next year. Samsung can display their spec list for their Galaxy S, but still nothing compare to the iPhone.
Wow! It takes an "analyst" to figure that out? How do I get a job like these low life's? I've been saying 4S for the longest time. No way Apple would release a 5 this year next to the Verizon 4 in Feb. You'd think red flags would have popped up when Apple was announcing a product on their own home base. Nothing big.
There's gotta be a complete redesign of the product for it to get to the next number. I don't need a fat computer geek analyst to figure that out. Clearly, it's a given.
Next iPhone will be called iPhone 4GS. Isn't it obvious that this is Apple's naming convention? iPhone 5 will only come after the 4GS, probably in 2013.
You're missing the major argument in that it shouldn't take 16 months for an incremental upgrade which is far less than the 3GS from the 3G. It's you who's not understanding.
Was there even a need to upgrade the hardware at all? After 16 months they are still selling 20 million units per quarter. Apple were/are under no pressure to release new hardware its only the geeks out there that want new shiny toys the VAST majority care less. When Samsung start selling 20 million of a single handset in a quarter and making 30%+ profit then maybe Apple will feel pressured.
It's nice to know you are capable of posting consistently bad information. Perhaps now your posts can be of use as part of an index of contra-indicators of Apple's success.
"ConradJoe doesn't like it, buy more AAPL stock!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by ConradJoe
Yesterday, I posted the opinion that Steve got out while the getting was good.
This release reverses many trends at Apple. It might signal changes that the old-time Apple fans will not like. It clearly shows that Apple thinks the profit sweet spot is not at the cutting edge of phone tech, but rather, in the mid-market. They have already made the change with computers, and now with phones.
"Good enough for Grandma" is likely what Apple is aiming for now.
How do you make a phone twice as likely to break when it's dropped? Oh ya, let's put glass on BOTH sides of the device. Still the dumbest design decision there is. Helps sell phone cases, but having to have a case for a phone just plain sucks. What's the point of marketing your phone as the thinnest one if you have to put a case on it to protect it from shattering? Didn't buy the 4 because of that design and won't get the 4s either. If Apple ever changes the nearly all glass design, I may upgrade then. Next Apple's going to come out with the all (Gorilla) glass car! Crash? No problem, it's "Gorilla" glass!
How do you make a phone twice as likely to break when it's dropped? Oh ya, let's put glass on BOTH sides of the device. Still the dumbest design decision there is. Helps sell phone cases, but having to have a case for a phone just plain sucks. What's the point of marketing your phone as the thinnest one if you have to put a case on it to protect it from shattering? Didn't buy the 4 because of that design and won't get the 4s either. If Apple ever changes the nearly all glass design, I may upgrade then. Next Apple's going to come out with the all (Gorilla) glass car! Crash? No problem, it's "Gorilla" glass!
Dumb post - A plastic phone will get scratched and damaged when you drop it and treat it rough. My 3G was a mess when I upgraded. I don't wear a coat on my ip4 for the reasons you state (makes the phone look fat) but I am paying the price as usual. I just got a new scratch on the from glass yesterday (keys?). I am all for not upgrading unless you need to, but to hold out against the ip4 because of the glass seems silly. Its an awesome phone and it won't shatter as easily as you think.
Sixteen months for that? Apple could have released the 4S without Siri or iOS5 back in June and people would have loved it. I've been eligible for an upgrade since the end of June and I was ready to buy. Instead, I will limp along and wait for something actually worth buying.
I don't think so, Apple is just following its naming scheme. Wouldn't apple call the next phone "iPhone 4G" if it were about the network. Didn't they do that for the 2nd generation phone, when it was capable of 3G speeds?
This is what Apple will learn with regret. The China market had exploded because of the newly designed iPhone, iPad and Macbook Air. We don't want our notebook to be upgraded yearly, but the phone is different. If Apple plan to continue with this iPhone_s every two year then they will kiss goodbye the spectacular China market growth.
This is an interesting perspective.. Forgive the armchair analysis (this may be either too obvious or too inane so I apologize beforehand), but it seems to this amateur observer that this viewpoint presupposes two distinct groups of consumers exist (among others of course) who buy Apple products.
The first group (perhaps the smaller) is comprised of individuals who have taken stock of the experience Apple offers (i.e., the OS, service, technology, ease of use, etc.) and characteristically count on Apple to deliver each product they make with a similar level of chutzpah. Characteristically, these individuals also own many other Apple products because they buy into the Apple philosophy which focuses on end-user benefits. Among these are many of the "early-adopter" class of Apple customer who suffered through the earlier difficult years of Apple before their meteoric rise (re: Michael Dell's now infamous comment about closing the company and returning what value remained to the stockholders). What is typical of this group is an awareness while using their Apple product of the relative difference between their user experience with the Apple-item, as opposed to what they might be experiencing had they bought a non-Apple product.
The second group (perhaps the larger) are those who have become attracted to Apple because of the swing in the opinion-makers attitude about what is "cool" and therefore desireable as a "must-have." Because the opinion-makers opine is typically well-informed, it is not surprising that many of their followers have received a great deal of satisfaction with purchases like the iPhone or MacBook Air. Implicit in this mix, however, is the realization that many who belong to this category may well be persuaded by counter-opinion-makers within this group who start chanting that another device is even more "cool" (i.e., faster, stronger, prettier, more OLED-ish, can drain batteries faster, etc.) and therefore more desireable than the Apple counterpart. It could be argued that someone changing to a competitor's product and enjoying it could possibly be one who did not buy the Apple product for its user experience in the first place and never appreciated the relative difference in the first place.
Of course, to suggest such a thing is to be an Apple fanbois spouting yet another blasphemy in the counter-worlds of Droid or PC/Microsoft, but - as Shaw once quipped - "All great truths begin as blasphemies." The fact is, when one makes an argument similar to the one bracketed above, one seems to suggest the possibility that the vast majority of Chinese can be put into the second group - and that their buying decisions and motivations would not be predicated on the same careful factors characteristic of the first group.
If this is true, the so-called "awakening giant" may be of an entirely different nature than what was first contemplated. All may not be lost for either Apple or America if many of the second category Apple bandwagon-ers leave Apple to start enjoying the compromises with their new Droid purchases that Tim Cook said Apple would not make with the iPhone. To say the least, this band of "expatriat-merry-makers" may find themselves on a band wagon already crowded with not only the Chinese, but perrenials from the land of Microsoft and Dell and feel they have never been happier.
As the proverb somewhat goes "as a dog returneth to its own vomit, and a pig to its own sty..." Oh well, one man's sty is another man's heaven.
A sentiment that those in the first group - if I may presume to guess their sentiment - will never understand.
1) I think Siri is being way undervalued by some commentators/posters. It's a game-changing technology in the way Bluetooth and basic voice commands were a few years ago. How many languages will it support? Not sure I've seen that.
2) A significant number of Verizonwireless (and Sprint, too I suppose) customers will be switching to an iPhone as the 4S is the first one that will allow them to do so. There really are people who require a "global" phone and they've been stuck with a BlackBerry or something else so far. It's quite possible this extends to existing CDMA network phone users in Korea and Japan, too.
Oh please... this is the same kind of nonsense that naysayers, whiners, and iHaters said about "Antennagate", the small screen, and using glass for both sides of the phone.
But hey, thanks to folks like you, we can add yet another "Apple is doomed" rant about coming out with a "4s" moniker instead of a number 5.
There was no misstep on Apple's part. This is the Apple's methodical and evolutionary approach to not rush things to market before they're ready.
I guess in your world, a new model that is 7-9 times faster than the previous phone is just not good enough for tech-heads like you.
Exactly. The hyperventilation, teeth-gnashing, hand-wringing, and whining has been out of control on these boards.
Nothing before its time, friends. If you don't like it, buy yourself an Android (or whatever.)
I think it absolutely makes sense to use the 4S name for this update. The form factor is the same (and I like it), which means everything that works with the 4 should work for the 4S. Technology-wise, this update is the electronic equivalent of dropping a supercharged V8 into a car that only had a V6 before. There's no new communications abilities, though there is only one model where there used to be two.
Siri is a big deal, but that's software, not hardware.
From an engineering standpoint, Apple has claimed that it is a complete redesign. In other words, the only thing that hasn't changed is the parts you can see. From that standpoint, it would make sense to have called it the iPhone 5. But look at the complaints about the 4S. "They didn't change the form!" Would the complainers have been any happier if Apple had released the same phone as the "iPhone 5"? I doubt it. In fact, I think they would have complained even more.
Overall, IMHO, this is an excellent update, with one major flaw: Memory.
Apple shipped the first iPhones in June 2007. Those models had 4GB, 8GB and 16 GB of storage. If Moore's Law can be applied to flash memory, then the iPhone 4S is coming in just 2 months shy of the memory theoretically doubling 3 times. In other words, 18 months after the first iPhone shipped, the cost of memory should have allowed Apple to release 8GB, 16GB and 32 GB models for the same prices. 18 months later, 16GB, 32GB and 64 GB models. And finally, 32GB, 64GB and 128GB models just two months from now.
Even if we were generous and let the 18 month cycle expand to 2 years to match Apple's annual upgrade cycle, that means the iPhone 4 should have shipped in 16GB, 32GB, and 64GB models, with the most expensive one coming in at $299. Instead, Apple only now has added a 64GB model, but at a jacked up price. That's a double-whammy that's just plain annoying.
Even worse, two of the new features they're touting are the 8 Megapixel camera and 1080 recording. Both of those hit storage far harder than previous models. (1080 more than doubles the memory necessary for 720.) If you were managing to get by with 32GB before, these features would make the 64GB model necessary, but at a premium when, IMHO, it should have become the new $299 model. If you weren't able to get by with 32GB before and you want to make full use of the new features, you're SOL.
Comments
..and these tools get paid for this?? LOL
There's gotta be a complete redesign of the product for it to get to the next number. I don't need a fat computer geek analyst to figure that out. Clearly, it's a given.
typical chinese
hahahaha!
You're missing the major argument in that it shouldn't take 16 months for an incremental upgrade which is far less than the 3GS from the 3G. It's you who's not understanding.
Was there even a need to upgrade the hardware at all? After 16 months they are still selling 20 million units per quarter. Apple were/are under no pressure to release new hardware its only the geeks out there that want new shiny toys the VAST majority care less. When Samsung start selling 20 million of a single handset in a quarter and making 30%+ profit then maybe Apple will feel pressured.
"ConradJoe doesn't like it, buy more AAPL stock!"
Yesterday, I posted the opinion that Steve got out while the getting was good.
This release reverses many trends at Apple. It might signal changes that the old-time Apple fans will not like. It clearly shows that Apple thinks the profit sweet spot is not at the cutting edge of phone tech, but rather, in the mid-market. They have already made the change with computers, and now with phones.
"Good enough for Grandma" is likely what Apple is aiming for now.
First significant misstep of Apple in a really long period of time...
Perhaps Jobs leaving before 4s announcement is not a coincidence. Nothing to be proud of really.
Reminds me on the rumor mill lead up to the "non refresh" of the MacBook Pro (both seemingly ready for new form factor/refresh).
I've been waiting 16 months for a non antenna-gate iPhone and it looks like I'll be waiting longer.
Why get into a 2 year contract when the phone we really want will be out early next year...
First significant misstep of Apple in a really long period of time...
Perhaps Jobs leaving before 4s announcement is not a coincidence. Nothing to be proud of really.
It's not a misstep ... as noted, cramming 2 chips in the phone would not have worked. Further, Apple was not pressed to release a redesigned phone.
One thing Apple usually does right is making the technology changes as the right time.
I hope they are working on redefining TV ... which is the next killer app.
How do you make a phone twice as likely to break when it's dropped? Oh ya, let's put glass on BOTH sides of the device. Still the dumbest design decision there is. Helps sell phone cases, but having to have a case for a phone just plain sucks. What's the point of marketing your phone as the thinnest one if you have to put a case on it to protect it from shattering? Didn't buy the 4 because of that design and won't get the 4s either. If Apple ever changes the nearly all glass design, I may upgrade then. Next Apple's going to come out with the all (Gorilla) glass car! Crash? No problem, it's "Gorilla" glass!
Dumb post - A plastic phone will get scratched and damaged when you drop it and treat it rough. My 3G was a mess when I upgraded. I don't wear a coat on my ip4 for the reasons you state (makes the phone look fat) but I am paying the price as usual. I just got a new scratch on the from glass yesterday (keys?). I am all for not upgrading unless you need to, but to hold out against the ip4 because of the glass seems silly. Its an awesome phone and it won't shatter as easily as you think.
Dear Apple, I ain't your bitch, bitch.
Typical Chinese
Yup... In Asia what's the point of pulling out an iPhone 4S if you can't advertise to everyone that it's not a year-and-a-half old phone.
This is what Apple will learn with regret. The China market had exploded because of the newly designed iPhone, iPad and Macbook Air. We don't want our notebook to be upgraded yearly, but the phone is different. If Apple plan to continue with this iPhone_s every two year then they will kiss goodbye the spectacular China market growth.
This is an interesting perspective.. Forgive the armchair analysis (this may be either too obvious or too inane so I apologize beforehand), but it seems to this amateur observer that this viewpoint presupposes two distinct groups of consumers exist (among others of course) who buy Apple products.
The first group (perhaps the smaller) is comprised of individuals who have taken stock of the experience Apple offers (i.e., the OS, service, technology, ease of use, etc.) and characteristically count on Apple to deliver each product they make with a similar level of chutzpah. Characteristically, these individuals also own many other Apple products because they buy into the Apple philosophy which focuses on end-user benefits. Among these are many of the "early-adopter" class of Apple customer who suffered through the earlier difficult years of Apple before their meteoric rise (re: Michael Dell's now infamous comment about closing the company and returning what value remained to the stockholders). What is typical of this group is an awareness while using their Apple product of the relative difference between their user experience with the Apple-item, as opposed to what they might be experiencing had they bought a non-Apple product.
The second group (perhaps the larger) are those who have become attracted to Apple because of the swing in the opinion-makers attitude about what is "cool" and therefore desireable as a "must-have." Because the opinion-makers opine is typically well-informed, it is not surprising that many of their followers have received a great deal of satisfaction with purchases like the iPhone or MacBook Air. Implicit in this mix, however, is the realization that many who belong to this category may well be persuaded by counter-opinion-makers within this group who start chanting that another device is even more "cool" (i.e., faster, stronger, prettier, more OLED-ish, can drain batteries faster, etc.) and therefore more desireable than the Apple counterpart. It could be argued that someone changing to a competitor's product and enjoying it could possibly be one who did not buy the Apple product for its user experience in the first place and never appreciated the relative difference in the first place.
Of course, to suggest such a thing is to be an Apple fanbois spouting yet another blasphemy in the counter-worlds of Droid or PC/Microsoft, but - as Shaw once quipped - "All great truths begin as blasphemies." The fact is, when one makes an argument similar to the one bracketed above, one seems to suggest the possibility that the vast majority of Chinese can be put into the second group - and that their buying decisions and motivations would not be predicated on the same careful factors characteristic of the first group.
If this is true, the so-called "awakening giant" may be of an entirely different nature than what was first contemplated. All may not be lost for either Apple or America if many of the second category Apple bandwagon-ers leave Apple to start enjoying the compromises with their new Droid purchases that Tim Cook said Apple would not make with the iPhone. To say the least, this band of "expatriat-merry-makers" may find themselves on a band wagon already crowded with not only the Chinese, but perrenials from the land of Microsoft and Dell and feel they have never been happier.
As the proverb somewhat goes "as a dog returneth to its own vomit, and a pig to its own sty..." Oh well, one man's sty is another man's heaven.
A sentiment that those in the first group - if I may presume to guess their sentiment - will never understand.
1) I think Siri is being way undervalued by some commentators/posters. It's a game-changing technology in the way Bluetooth and basic voice commands were a few years ago. How many languages will it support? Not sure I've seen that.
2) A significant number of Verizonwireless (and Sprint, too I suppose) customers will be switching to an iPhone as the 4S is the first one that will allow them to do so. There really are people who require a "global" phone and they've been stuck with a BlackBerry or something else so far. It's quite possible this extends to existing CDMA network phone users in Korea and Japan, too.
Oh please... this is the same kind of nonsense that naysayers, whiners, and iHaters said about "Antennagate", the small screen, and using glass for both sides of the phone.
But hey, thanks to folks like you, we can add yet another "Apple is doomed" rant about coming out with a "4s" moniker instead of a number 5.
There was no misstep on Apple's part. This is the Apple's methodical and evolutionary approach to not rush things to market before they're ready.
I guess in your world, a new model that is 7-9 times faster than the previous phone is just not good enough for tech-heads like you.
Exactly. The hyperventilation, teeth-gnashing, hand-wringing, and whining has been out of control on these boards.
Nothing before its time, friends. If you don't like it, buy yourself an Android (or whatever.)
Siri is a big deal, but that's software, not hardware.
From an engineering standpoint, Apple has claimed that it is a complete redesign. In other words, the only thing that hasn't changed is the parts you can see. From that standpoint, it would make sense to have called it the iPhone 5. But look at the complaints about the 4S. "They didn't change the form!" Would the complainers have been any happier if Apple had released the same phone as the "iPhone 5"? I doubt it. In fact, I think they would have complained even more.
Overall, IMHO, this is an excellent update, with one major flaw: Memory.
Apple shipped the first iPhones in June 2007. Those models had 4GB, 8GB and 16 GB of storage. If Moore's Law can be applied to flash memory, then the iPhone 4S is coming in just 2 months shy of the memory theoretically doubling 3 times. In other words, 18 months after the first iPhone shipped, the cost of memory should have allowed Apple to release 8GB, 16GB and 32 GB models for the same prices. 18 months later, 16GB, 32GB and 64 GB models. And finally, 32GB, 64GB and 128GB models just two months from now.
Even if we were generous and let the 18 month cycle expand to 2 years to match Apple's annual upgrade cycle, that means the iPhone 4 should have shipped in 16GB, 32GB, and 64GB models, with the most expensive one coming in at $299. Instead, Apple only now has added a 64GB model, but at a jacked up price. That's a double-whammy that's just plain annoying.
Even worse, two of the new features they're touting are the 8 Megapixel camera and 1080 recording. Both of those hit storage far harder than previous models. (1080 more than doubles the memory necessary for 720.) If you were managing to get by with 32GB before, these features would make the 64GB model necessary, but at a premium when, IMHO, it should have become the new $299 model. If you weren't able to get by with 32GB before and you want to make full use of the new features, you're SOL.