Wrong. It's in Apples best interest to allow users to _choose_ what services they want to use rather than force people to only use their service. This is yet another reason Windows Phone is a total failure. No one in their right mind would want to be forced to use BING and all the google clone BING services.
Why is Microsoft against choice?
Because they feel it's in their best interest to push their entire ecosystem. They've done letting everyone choose their own thing, but that gets to be unmaintainable. They might open it up to more options gradually, if they follow the Apple model. Apple had only one search engine option at first, then they added a couple others.
I prefer to use not-Microsoft, but I don't get your assertion that Bing is so horrible. I don't think it is. I only don't use it because it is Microsoft, not because I think it's a poor quality product.
Wrong. It's in Apples best interest to allow users to _choose_ what services they want to use rather than force people to only use their service. This is yet another reason Windows Phone is a total failure. No one in their right mind would want to be forced to use BING and all the google clone BING services.
Why is Microsoft against choice?
If its in apples best interest for me to use the service that I want rather than force me to use their service, where is my alternative to the app store.
What nonsense. The marriage has been deemed no such thing as "a huge success" as it hasn't worked yet. Further, in the interim, because of the timing and the way they announced it, it severely hurt their existing business as people quit buying their immediately obsolete symbian phones. Also, try to get your facts right. Nokia does not "own" the smartphone market globally. The only success they have had recently, to keep their market share from totally collapsing, is in low end feature phones in the rest of the world. They have dramatically lost the high end of the market.
Yet you can comment on the failure of a phone that hasn't even been released to the public yet.
Microsoft only ever gets it right in the long run. I don't expect their early efforts to be that great, but it doesn't mean they won't be a force to be reckoned with eventually. Nothing to be done about it, except keep improving the iPhone.
And I also like a choice of running Flash too on my iPhone, but that's not going to happen anytime soon, if ever. Yes, Apple is full of choices.
I thought this debate was laid to rest by anyone with even the shallowest insight in the computer business.
Apple challenged Adobe for years to come up with flash that actually worked on a mobile device AND at the same time didn't suck battery like there is no tomorrow (or next hour for that matter). FInally Apple had to make a choice in order to go further with iOS. Read the open letter from Steve Jobs for information on the subject or the last interview of Jobs on All things digital for full explanation. So stop the trolling on flash!
If its in apples best interest for me to use the service that I want rather than force me to use their service, where is my alternative to the app store.
30k app store, how many millions WP7 was sold in the last year? Because over 4 million iPhone 4S was sold in less than one week of its release. Get off your high horse and see the failure that windows phone is. Stop trying to coddle Microsoft/Nokia.
Hmm. Didn't we hear similar comments briefly after iPhone and Android were released?....
Agreed. Carriers are all talk. Only LTE delivers right now sadly.
Although I have seen some amazing speeds a few times. I saw 11mbps down in Seattle last time I was there. On my Atrix 4g AT&T
Wrong. The LTE figures are such bs that they are working on passing a law to tell people what their real speed is. Plus the LTE coverage so spotty you still end up on 3g networks most of the time. Saw it with my 4G HTC G2.
All products give you figures based on the best case scenario, not most common numbers. Perfect example. My MBP says it has 10 hours of battery life, I've seen it sit at 12 and a half.
What can you review it on then? Cloner Windows Phone devices have been out for over a year, and Microsoft will not release sales numbers because they are that bad.
The OS is total garbage. The UI is horrible. The lock in to the proprietary Windows OS is terrible. The lock in to the equally bad BING/MSN/Live/Hotmail/whatever Microsoft is calling their failed online services this week is terrible. Why doesn't Microsoft allow people to change from the terrible BING search engine? I think we all the answer to that...everyone would use Google as it is so much better.
Strange how almost every post about non-Apple product starts with same-as-the-last-one parade of trolling, before people who actually have something to say chime in. I'm not saying everyone before your post trolled, but many did. Sad, really.
I feel very positive about Nokia 800. Have tried and liked WP7, and Zune Desktop is also much more to my liking than iTunes. In addition, devices looks nice - well built and different from other phones. Integration with 25GB of free SkyDrive is also nice, and I think it is only the beginning; after all, MS is software company, so doing cool things in software should be their thing... otherwise, otherwise, if they cannot bring the fight to other platforms on the software level, they are doomed - and for real. But from what I have seen this far, I am expecting to see integration between Windows phones, tablets, desktops and server products to catch up and possibly overtake Apple's platform in the next 2 years, more or less.
Nobody is saying you can't buy one, or that it will appeal to no one at all. The article merely points out that, apart from those ideologically supportive of Microsoft, Nokia's new WP7 phones don't offer anything the general population will be impressed with. They're not uniquely featured, not cheaper, not nicer, not faster, not anything innovative.
Being tied to WP7 means you get a less ideal ecosystem for music, videos, apps, periodicals, books, and miss out on other features of the very popular iTunes. You can plead that you like the Zune software better, and that's fine, but your opinion is not mainstream. The world hasn't shown any preference for Zune/WP7, in fact, it has been carefully ignored.
And as much as Thurrott-style pundits would like to think, it's not due to Apple "brainwash marketing," because MS is getting a lot of press and has its own ads.
It's also not due to a Windows-like monopoly on the market by Apple, because Apple does nothing to restrict what products can be sold (apart from infringing Android stuff). Apple has done nothing to sign carriers or retailers to exclusive contracts that have locked MS and its WP7 partners out of the market.
MS has failed all on its own. You're free to join, and perhaps you'll eventually benefit from the closeout deals, but to suggest that its morally wrong to print the truth rather than fawning over MS just because the company was relevant in the 90s is evidence that the "bias" and lack of objectivity lies with you, not with AI.
? the gander couldn't care less because they're happy with what they have and don't want to have to deal with getting crap from two different locations.
… the gander couldn't care less because they're happy with what they have and don't want to have to deal with getting crap from two different locations.
except when the starter wis complaining that microsoft is bad for controlling the experience...
The pricing is wrong. Anyone with at least half a brain to work with knows you can't simply run pricing through a currency converter to come up with 'equivalent' prices.
In markets where it will be available the Lumia 800 is around 20% less than an iPhone 4 8GB and 33% less than a iPhone 4S 16GB. It's pricing actually puts it in-line with the mid-range Android devices rather than the 4S.
Case in point a $549 iPhone 4 8GB is sold in Australia for the 'equivalent' of $726 USD. This would mean (by using the famous "Dilger" logic) the iPhone 4 8GB is simultaneously more expensive and less expensive than itself.
These kind of basic factual inaccuracies are one reason why you would have to be a complete idiot to take anything this "Dilger" guy writes seriously.
do even own or used a windows phone?? U should be comparing the two platforms when it comes to what they can do.. Stop predicting what's gonna happen in the future.. What do u think will happen now that Steve jobs is dead"???
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider
Nokia's first Windows Phone 7 device offers specifications somewhere between Apple's iPhone 4 and iPhone 4S, but is missing some key hardware and software features and will only debut in Europe, effectively leaving the US market to Apple and Android this holiday season.
Being tied to WP7 means you get a less ideal ecosystem for music, videos, apps, periodicals, books, and miss out on other features of the very popular iTunes. You can plead that you like the Zune software better, and that's fine, but your opinion is not mainstream. The world hasn't shown any preference for Zune/WP7, in fact, it has been carefully ignored.
The world hasn't really shown any preference for any of these players. People at one point all used Windows Media Player as that was what was on their machine and did the job. Then almost everyone with an MP3 player bought an iPod and therefore started using iTunes, not out of preference but because they had to. Some pople liked it, other didn't but most didn't care. People with iPhones still have to use iTunes and still most don't really care, it's just what was put in front of them. People with WP7 will use Zune, and like iTunes and WMP before it, they won't care as it still does the job they want it to.
30k app store, how many millions WP7 was sold in the last year? Because over 4 million iPhone 4S was sold in less than one week of its release. Get off your high horse and see the failure that windows phone is. Stop trying to coddle Microsoft/Nokia.
Most apple fans don't have a job and live on food stamps and can stand in line for weeks in front of apple store to buy a phone to show others how cool they are. They just can't afford real apple though so have to rely on food stamps.
Comments
Wrong. It's in Apples best interest to allow users to _choose_ what services they want to use rather than force people to only use their service. This is yet another reason Windows Phone is a total failure. No one in their right mind would want to be forced to use BING and all the google clone BING services.
Why is Microsoft against choice?
Because they feel it's in their best interest to push their entire ecosystem. They've done letting everyone choose their own thing, but that gets to be unmaintainable. They might open it up to more options gradually, if they follow the Apple model. Apple had only one search engine option at first, then they added a couple others.
I prefer to use not-Microsoft, but I don't get your assertion that Bing is so horrible. I don't think it is. I only don't use it because it is Microsoft, not because I think it's a poor quality product.
Wrong. It's in Apples best interest to allow users to _choose_ what services they want to use rather than force people to only use their service. This is yet another reason Windows Phone is a total failure. No one in their right mind would want to be forced to use BING and all the google clone BING services.
Why is Microsoft against choice?
If its in apples best interest for me to use the service that I want rather than force me to use their service, where is my alternative to the app store.
What nonsense. The marriage has been deemed no such thing as "a huge success" as it hasn't worked yet. Further, in the interim, because of the timing and the way they announced it, it severely hurt their existing business as people quit buying their immediately obsolete symbian phones. Also, try to get your facts right. Nokia does not "own" the smartphone market globally. The only success they have had recently, to keep their market share from totally collapsing, is in low end feature phones in the rest of the world. They have dramatically lost the high end of the market.
Yet you can comment on the failure of a phone that hasn't even been released to the public yet.
And I also like a choice of running Flash too on my iPhone, but that's not going to happen anytime soon, if ever. Yes, Apple is full of choices.
I thought this debate was laid to rest by anyone with even the shallowest insight in the computer business.
Apple challenged Adobe for years to come up with flash that actually worked on a mobile device AND at the same time didn't suck battery like there is no tomorrow (or next hour for that matter). FInally Apple had to make a choice in order to go further with iOS. Read the open letter from Steve Jobs for information on the subject or the last interview of Jobs on All things digital for full explanation. So stop the trolling on flash!
If its in apples best interest for me to use the service that I want rather than force me to use their service, where is my alternative to the app store.
Are you fricking joking? That's hilarious.
30k app store, how many millions WP7 was sold in the last year? Because over 4 million iPhone 4S was sold in less than one week of its release. Get off your high horse and see the failure that windows phone is. Stop trying to coddle Microsoft/Nokia.
Hmm. Didn't we hear similar comments briefly after iPhone and Android were released?....
Agreed. Carriers are all talk. Only LTE delivers right now sadly.
Although I have seen some amazing speeds a few times. I saw 11mbps down in Seattle last time I was there. On my Atrix 4g AT&T
Wrong. The LTE figures are such bs that they are working on passing a law to tell people what their real speed is. Plus the LTE coverage so spotty you still end up on 3g networks most of the time. Saw it with my 4G HTC G2.
All products give you figures based on the best case scenario, not most common numbers. Perfect example. My MBP says it has 10 hours of battery life, I've seen it sit at 12 and a half.
probably not. consider the brand and the market.
Nokia owns the market share globally. the fact they partnered with Microsoft has already been deemed a huge success for both companies.
- + - = - At least wen I learned to calculate.
Maybe they should multiply.
J.
What can you review it on then? Cloner Windows Phone devices have been out for over a year, and Microsoft will not release sales numbers because they are that bad.
The OS is total garbage. The UI is horrible. The lock in to the proprietary Windows OS is terrible. The lock in to the equally bad BING/MSN/Live/Hotmail/whatever Microsoft is calling their failed online services this week is terrible. Why doesn't Microsoft allow people to change from the terrible BING search engine? I think we all the answer to that...everyone would use Google as it is so much better.
What else could he review?
Ha ha ha.
J.
First constructive post in this tread.
Strange how almost every post about non-Apple product starts with same-as-the-last-one parade of trolling, before people who actually have something to say chime in. I'm not saying everyone before your post trolled, but many did. Sad, really.
I feel very positive about Nokia 800. Have tried and liked WP7, and Zune Desktop is also much more to my liking than iTunes. In addition, devices looks nice - well built and different from other phones. Integration with 25GB of free SkyDrive is also nice, and I think it is only the beginning; after all, MS is software company, so doing cool things in software should be their thing... otherwise, otherwise, if they cannot bring the fight to other platforms on the software level, they are doomed - and for real. But from what I have seen this far, I am expecting to see integration between Windows phones, tablets, desktops and server products to catch up and possibly overtake Apple's platform in the next 2 years, more or less.
Nobody is saying you can't buy one, or that it will appeal to no one at all. The article merely points out that, apart from those ideologically supportive of Microsoft, Nokia's new WP7 phones don't offer anything the general population will be impressed with. They're not uniquely featured, not cheaper, not nicer, not faster, not anything innovative.
Being tied to WP7 means you get a less ideal ecosystem for music, videos, apps, periodicals, books, and miss out on other features of the very popular iTunes. You can plead that you like the Zune software better, and that's fine, but your opinion is not mainstream. The world hasn't shown any preference for Zune/WP7, in fact, it has been carefully ignored.
And as much as Thurrott-style pundits would like to think, it's not due to Apple "brainwash marketing," because MS is getting a lot of press and has its own ads.
It's also not due to a Windows-like monopoly on the market by Apple, because Apple does nothing to restrict what products can be sold (apart from infringing Android stuff). Apple has done nothing to sign carriers or retailers to exclusive contracts that have locked MS and its WP7 partners out of the market.
MS has failed all on its own. You're free to join, and perhaps you'll eventually benefit from the closeout deals, but to suggest that its morally wrong to print the truth rather than fawning over MS just because the company was relevant in the 90s is evidence that the "bias" and lack of objectivity lies with you, not with AI.
Are you fricking joking? That's hilarious.
If its good for the goose...
If its good for the goose...
? the gander couldn't care less because they're happy with what they have and don't want to have to deal with getting crap from two different locations.
… the gander couldn't care less because they're happy with what they have and don't want to have to deal with getting crap from two different locations.
except when the starter wis complaining that microsoft is bad for controlling the experience...
In markets where it will be available the Lumia 800 is around 20% less than an iPhone 4 8GB and 33% less than a iPhone 4S 16GB. It's pricing actually puts it in-line with the mid-range Android devices rather than the 4S.
Case in point a $549 iPhone 4 8GB is sold in Australia for the 'equivalent' of $726 USD. This would mean (by using the famous "Dilger" logic) the iPhone 4 8GB is simultaneously more expensive and less expensive than itself.
These kind of basic factual inaccuracies are one reason why you would have to be a complete idiot to take anything this "Dilger" guy writes seriously.
Nokia's first Windows Phone 7 device offers specifications somewhere between Apple's iPhone 4 and iPhone 4S, but is missing some key hardware and software features and will only debut in Europe, effectively leaving the US market to Apple and Android this holiday season.
Being tied to WP7 means you get a less ideal ecosystem for music, videos, apps, periodicals, books, and miss out on other features of the very popular iTunes. You can plead that you like the Zune software better, and that's fine, but your opinion is not mainstream. The world hasn't shown any preference for Zune/WP7, in fact, it has been carefully ignored.
The world hasn't really shown any preference for any of these players. People at one point all used Windows Media Player as that was what was on their machine and did the job. Then almost everyone with an MP3 player bought an iPod and therefore started using iTunes, not out of preference but because they had to. Some pople liked it, other didn't but most didn't care. People with iPhones still have to use iTunes and still most don't really care, it's just what was put in front of them. People with WP7 will use Zune, and like iTunes and WMP before it, they won't care as it still does the job they want it to.
do even own or used a windows phone?? U should be comparing the two platforms when it comes to what they can do..
Could have sworn that's wants going on here.
Stop predicting what's gonna happen in the future..
Maybe you need to stop reading this forum or at least get a better understanding of what we do here.
What do u think will happen now that Steve jobs is dead"???
Having WHAT to do with ANYTHING?!
Could have sworn that's wants going on here.
Maybe you need to stop reading this forum or at least get a better understanding of what we do here.
Having WHAT to do with ANYTHING?!
Lol, I was wondering that mahself. This forum has a LOT of issues.... (AKA MACRUMORS NOT NEARLY AS BAD)
30k app store, how many millions WP7 was sold in the last year? Because over 4 million iPhone 4S was sold in less than one week of its release. Get off your high horse and see the failure that windows phone is. Stop trying to coddle Microsoft/Nokia.
Most apple fans don't have a job and live on food stamps and can stand in line for weeks in front of apple store to buy a phone to show others how cool they are. They just can't afford real apple though so have to rely on food stamps.