Rumor: Apple axed 'evolutionary' 64-bit Final Cut Pro 8 for 'revolutionary' FCPX

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  • Reply 61 of 148
    MacProMacPro Posts: 18,347member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by blur35mm View Post


    I only announce it for the benefit of Apple product managers. When they are querying Google for "switching back to Windows" they'll see +1 comments about that and understand why. :-) BTW you obviously have an axe to grind with MSFT, I on the other hand pick the tools that work best for me. Some people hate Apple because of Chinese labor conditions. Some people hate MSFT because they are considered an evil capitalist corporation that buys up competitors in monopolistic fashion. Pick the lesser of two evils if you wish, but for me, it's what works best for what I do.



    Good luck with the hope you add to a sea of switchers away from Macs in Google searches
  • Reply 62 of 148
    MacProMacPro Posts: 18,347member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by yuusharo View Post


    It's never going to happen. FCP8 will *never* exist, not as developed by Apple anyway. FCPX is the future of this product, love it or hate it, and it will be built upon with new features and capabilities going forward.



    A 64-bit version of Final Cut would require it to be rewritten in Cocoa, as Carbon will never be ported to 64-bit and may have support dropped in OS X all together at some point. No matter how you look at it, Final Cut would need a fresh start, which meant that features from the old program would still not carry over into the new one at launch. Apple decided to take this opportunity to not only rewrite the application, but rethink the entire approach to video editing and solve some of the problems that exist in other NLE systems that are simply inherent to its design and not really something that can be "fixed."



    I'll bet anything that both Adobe and Avid will eventually integrate some of FCPX's concepts into their own suites - things like metadata tags, smart collections, background rendering and skimming to name a few. They won't present a radical shift in paradigm like Apple did, but then again, they really can't either. Apple will be fine if it lost 100% of its professional market, but Adobe and Avid would be killed if they screwed them over. Honestly, Apple's the only company that could have possibly made a huge gamble like this and hope it pays off in the future for both themselves and their users.



    The second sentence in my quote you seemed to ignore did cover an alternative don't you think? X will evolve surely?
  • Reply 63 of 148
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post


    Good luck with the hope you add to a sea of switchers away from Macs in Google searches



    209,000 Google results for the exact quoted phrase "switching back to windows". I am sure there are other phrases with various results.



    If I was an Apple product manager, I'd be scouring these like a hawk for product requirements - oh but that's right, by your logic they should instead be catering to the millions of others who want a free engraving on their iDevice.
  • Reply 64 of 148
    MacProMacPro Posts: 18,347member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by blur35mm View Post


    209,000 Google results for the exact quoted phrase "switching back to windows". I am sure there are other phrases with various results.



    If I was an Apple product manager, I'd be scouring these like a hawk for product requirements - oh but that's right, by your logic they should instead be catering to the millions of others who want a free engraving on their iDevice.



    You think those results are a mathematical sound measure? Try Googling for 'cars run on water using home made hydrolysis'! The results don't change the laws of thermo dynamics do they? They just illustrate there is a ton of rubbish you can google.
  • Reply 65 of 148
    andysolandysol Posts: 2,506member
    iPhone jacked up and I made a post on accident. Sorry.
  • Reply 66 of 148
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post


    It is a discussion that's been had over and over in AI.



    Many multi-seat production houses were created to work around FCPro as it was and had input much into the development to suit there needs. Half of all US production was on FCPro (I have no idea what the current numbers are). As you said the EOL was dropped on these companies like a brick and they simply could not change even if X was better, it didn't fit in the work flow as was.



    As I just said above maybe the parts lacking in X for these production houses could be added and a 'Studio Pro X' could be created out of X. Believe me, I am not a luddite, I have bled all the way on Macs from 1984 with arrows in my back and front keeping up with digital technology.



    Two of the biggest issues, IMO, are:



    1) The inability to open legacy FCP 7 projects in FCP X



    I think Apple just dropped the ball and assumed that once a project is finished -- there's no need to access it again... Once editors finished their active FCP 7 projects, there would be no need to access them again -- therefore no requirement to Open or Migrate FCP 7 to FCP X.





    2) The inability to pass content between FCP X and other apps, including FCP 7 (in both directions).



    I think Apple did/does not have all the pieces in place to make FCP X as self-contained as it eventually will be. Obviously, an XML import/export was/is not complete -- so there was no way to exchange data among apps.





    However, less than 3 months after FCP X release, they added fcpxml... not great, but a good start. This illustrates that Apple was working on XML import/export -- and was able to add it to the product in an amazingly short period of time (compared the FCP 1-7 updates). And, there is another FCP X XML flavor named axel. AFAICT, it is very robust and can handle all the things in FCP X -- orders of magnitude more robust than FCP 7 xml.



    Apple has said there are some things that they do not want to implement, or want third parties to provide.





    I suspect, that within the next 6-12 months we will see acceptable solutions to both the above issues -- likely fro mthird parties.





    I think the way it will shake (maybe a bad choice of words for this topic) out is that the "pros" will begin to use FCP X more and more for what it does well: quick editing turn-around. And round trip to other apps for specialty processing.



    In the video link I posted earlier...



    MacBreak Studio talks about audio editing and plugin problems in FCPX



    These guys demonstrate how easy and fast it is to sync and edit multi cam and pure sound tracks (even though multi cam is not supported in FCP X)



    1. Select: Audio, Camera A, Camera B...

    2. Click Sync -- (based on audio) creates compound clip with a track for each camera and sound (synced ala PluralEyes)

    3. Disable sound in video tracks

    4. Edit/Disable portions of video tracks as desired to expose different camera shots



    It is amazingly fast and simple -- compared to anything I've seen!



  • Reply 67 of 148
    aplnubaplnub Posts: 2,591member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by vandil View Post


    When Apple was "Apple Computer, Inc." they were more concerned with making powerful Macintosh computers that were used by the publishing, graphic arts, film making, and other creative industries. The higher-end models even echoed some of the high-end workstation-class systems from NEXT. To have an G5 Tower used to be the mark of an accomplished power user. The Apple website would have a front page link to the Pro Story of the week, talking about some business or government or University that deployed a huge IT solution using Apple Pro software and Pro-level Macintosh systems.



    Then Apple went consumer, got into making iPods and selling music, and iPhones, and had a whole ton of non-pros using their products, many of whom thought Macs were too difficult to switch to. So Apple worked on making Macs easier to switch to and even easier to work with those consumer products the non-Pros were buying.



    Then, Apple became "Apple, Inc." They are getting way more money from non-Pros and pro-sumers than the actual Pros... and they've shifted.



    Apple's target market went from University/IT/Creative Pros to middle-to-upper class households that drink Keurig Coffee while they use iPads to read books on their IKEA couch, pondering which wine to have with their Chicken & Gnocchi soup for dinner tonight, as their MacBook Pro is downloading the latest iTunes Movie Rental over 50MB broadband in the living room of a $150K house or $2000/mo apartment in the city, while their Ugg boots dry nicely in the corner beside their North Face winter coat.



    It is not like this happened during the name change but after Steve's return. Their window catering to the education and publishing group has long expired.
  • Reply 68 of 148
    andysolandysol Posts: 2,506member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mstone View Post


    I have started getting myself prepared to lose the Mac Pro.



    I have already studied up on the best hardware to make a Hackintosh. And I will also stay on Snow Leopard as long as possible. And when that becomes too difficult I will have to go to Windows I guess. Damn shame, but the writing is on the wall.



    1st- Why would someone still be on snow leopard? Lion has more features, allows for icloud, and has much better security features. Unless your job requires some PPC program or you don't use an alternative to a PPC program you absolutely must have- I don't get it.



    2nd- What program are you planning on running on Windows that won't run under OSX?



    My office has a Mac- one. Because there is no alternative program for sharpdesk- adobe acrobat on a Mac won't allow what the pc version does. I've looked high and low for a product I can "print" or merge multiple files into (some word, some excel, some PDF) and make them all one combined PDF. But if it weren't for that, we'd be all OSX only tomorrow (~12 computers). Unfortunately...
  • Reply 69 of 148
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post


    I think the way it will shake (maybe a bad choice of words for this topic)







    heh-heh yet another fine example...
  • Reply 70 of 148
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Andysol View Post


    1st- Why would someone still be on snow leopard?



    Here's one reason, because Final Cut Pro 7 runs very well on Snow Leopard.
  • Reply 71 of 148
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Andysol View Post


    1st- Why would someone still be on snow leopard? Lion has more features, allows for icloud, and has much better security features. Unless your job requires some PPC program or you don't use an alternative to a PPC program you absolutely must have- I don't get it.



    2nd- What program are you planning on running on Windows that won't run under OSX?



    My office has a Mac- one. Because there is no alternative program for sharpdesk- adobe acrobat on a Mac won't allow what the pc version does. I've looked high and low for a product I can "print" or merge multiple files into (some word, some excel, some PDF) and make them all one combined PDF. But if it weren't for that, we'd be all OSX only tomorrow (~12 computers). Unfortunately...



    Print to PDF and Preview.app can take care of the rest.
  • Reply 72 of 148
    mstonemstone Posts: 11,510member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post


    These guys demonstrate how easy and fast it is to sync and edit multi cam and pure sound tracks (even though multi cam is not supported in FCP X)



    1. Select: Audio, Camera A, Camera B...

    2. Click Sync -- (based on audio) creates compound clip with a track for each camera and sound (synced ala PluralEyes)

    3. Disable sound in video tracks

    4. Edit/Disable portions of video tracks as desired to expose different camera shots



    It is amazingly fast and simple -- compared to anything I've seen!







    Many times the sound is synced to camera #1 at the sound booth in the back of the concert hall. The other cameras are not recording audio and even if they were there would be a delay since they are some other distance from the source. That is why they use timecode. It doesn't take more than about 20 meters to make a huge difference. Speed of light verses speed of sound.
  • Reply 73 of 148
    MacProMacPro Posts: 18,347member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post


    Two of the biggest issues, IMO, are:



    1) The inability to open legacy FCP 7 projects in FCP X



    I think Apple just dropped the ball and assumed that once a project is finished -- there's no need to access it again... Once editors finished their active FCP 7 projects, there would be no need to access them again -- therefore no requirement to Open or Migrate FCP 7 to FCP X.





    2) The inability to pass content between FCP X and other apps, including FCP 7 (in both directions).



    I think Apple did/does not have all the pieces in place to make FCP X as self-contained as it eventually will be. Obviously, an XML import/export was/is not complete -- so there was no way to exchange data among apps.





    However, less than 3 months after FCP X release, they added fcpxml... not great, but a good start. This illustrates that Apple was working on XML import/export -- and was able to add it to the product in an amazingly short period of time (compared the FCP 1-7 updates). And, there is another FCP X XML flavor named axel. AFAICT, it is very robust and can handle all the things in FCP X -- orders of magnitude more robust than FCP 7 xml.



    Apple has said there are some things that they do not want to implement, or want third parties to provide.





    I suspect, that within the next 6-12 months we will see acceptable solutions to both the above issues -- likely fro mthird parties.





    I think the way it will shake (maybe a bad choice of words for this topic) out is that the "pros" will begin to use FCP X more and more for what it does well: quick editing turn-around. And round trip to other apps for specialty processing.



    In the video link I posted earlier...



    MacBreak Studio talks about audio editing and plugin problems in FCPX



    These guys demonstrate how easy and fast it is to sync and edit multi cam and pure sound tracks (even though multi cam is not supported in FCP X)



    1. Select: Audio, Camera A, Camera B...

    2. Click Sync -- (based on audio) creates compound clip with a track for each camera and sound (synced ala PluralEyes)

    3. Disable sound in video tracks

    4. Edit/Disable portions of video tracks as desired to expose different camera shots



    It is amazingly fast and simple -- compared to anything I've seen!







    I agree with you for the most part. I did a multi camera edit the day I got FCProX but it is a work around.



    My personal biggest issue is the overly automated nature of the beast but that is probably because of many thousands of hours using 7 and it's predecessors. It's akin to the Lion apps auto saving when I want to save something to a specific folder. I know how to do my way it but it threw me for a while and maybe their way is better ... still thinking about that .



    I also developed some idiosyncratic tricks that I'd developed over the years that are hard to stop. I always made TV shows backwards. I did a ton one hour shows for ESPN in FCPro and I'd start with the endings and then add the ad breaks and then the going to breaks and so on ... finally filling in the gaps. Not as easy in X although I'm sure it could be done with slugs. But I digress...
  • Reply 74 of 148
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post


    You think those results are a mathematical sound measure? Try Googling for 'cars run on water using home made hydrolysis'! The results don't change the laws of thermo dynamics do they? They just illustrate there is a ton of rubbish you can google.



    Not sure what your point is. If I sold a software product, I'd want to make sure I was up to date on feedback about that product coming from a range of sources. Google, Bing, Yahoo queries would be one source for such feedback. Customer surveys, media reports, Conan O'Brien videos poking fun of my product would also be another source.
  • Reply 75 of 148
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by blur35mm View Post


    209,000 Google results for the exact quoted phrase "switching back to windows". I am sure there are other phrases with various results.



    If I was an Apple product manager, I'd be scouring these like a hawk for product requirements - oh but that's right, by your logic they should instead be catering to the millions of others who want a free engraving on their iDevice.



    Are you serious?



    You are going to pay attention to what people say they are going to do?



    On the Web?



    The first thing you learn in becoming an adult...



    Pay attention to what people do -- not what they say!
  • Reply 76 of 148
    MacProMacPro Posts: 18,347member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by blur35mm View Post


    Here's one reason, because Final Cut Pro 7 runs very well on Snow Leopard.



    It seems to in Lion for me too.
  • Reply 77 of 148
    MacProMacPro Posts: 18,347member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mstone View Post


    Many times the sound is synced to camera #1 at the sound booth in the back of the concert hall. The other cameras are not recording audio and even if they were there would be a delay since they are some other distance from the source. That is why they use timecode. It doesn't take more than about 20 meters to make a huge difference. Speed of light verses speed of sound.



    And don't forget those freaking neutrinos!
  • Reply 78 of 148
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Patranus View Post


    Print to PDF and Preview.app can take care of the rest.



    +1. You can do this on a Mac using Print to PDF and Preview where you can merge multiple PDF's into one (and include security).
  • Reply 79 of 148
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Andysol View Post


    1st- Why would someone still be on snow leopard? Lion has more features, allows for icloud, and has much better security features. Unless your job requires some PPC program or you don't use an alternative to a PPC program you absolutely must have- I don't get it.



    2nd- What program are you planning on running on Windows that won't run under OSX?



    My office has a Mac- one. Because there is no alternative program for sharpdesk- adobe acrobat on a Mac won't allow what the pc version does. I've looked high and low for a product I can "print" or merge multiple files into (some word, some excel, some PDF) and make them all one combined PDF. But if it weren't for that, we'd be all OSX only tomorrow (~12 computers). Unfortunately...



    Ever thought of looking into PDFpen from Smile Software? Not sure about excel documents, but it does allow you to open up and create PDFs from Word documents and others. Pro version is $99 and the base version is $59. Both are available on the Mac App Store or directly from the developer.



    *** Affiliate link *** http://smilesoftware.com/macbreak/ *** Affiliate link ***



    Just wanted to give the guys over at TWiT a little plug .
  • Reply 80 of 148
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post


    Are you serious?



    You are going to pay attention to what people say they are going to do?



    On the Web?



    The first thing you learn in becoming an adult...



    Pay attention to what people do -- not what they say!



    HUH? Again, the point is that it can be used to collect data points in an equation to improve their products. Nice elitist tone you are taking. I did not sling any arrows at you.
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