I don't think most people would buy a dedicated portable gaming device any more. They would buy it for their kids, or tech enthusiasts would buy one, but the general adult population just wants a few casual games installed on their phone.
No, that's not what's happening. People that didn't play before are beginning to play on their phones, and may be tempted to get a wii for casual gaming. People that played before on consoles are not ditching them for touch based controls. In your dreams.
No, that's not what's happening. That's a fantasy, that you created in your head, to explain what you wish was happening.
What's actually happening is that "gaming" and the amount of time/money spent on it, by the largest denomination of people, is going in the direction that iOS is taking it. Android too, to an extent.
You can fantasize about people not ditching their consoles or PCs, but that is what's happening. Even "hardcore" gamers (despise that phrase) only allot a certain amount of time in a day for gaming, and a large amount of that is moving from their console to their phone or tablet. You don't need much data to substantiate it. People aren't inventing more time to play games. As these new things come along, they're splitting time among them, or moving to the new platforms almost entirely. For lots of reasons. Many of which sound ludicrous to the slobbering console drones, but they are reasons nonetheless. Things like, "its simply more convenient to pick up and play, here and there."
It makes absolutely no difference what you WANT to see happen, or what you think should happen. The market has its own idea of this, and it shows.
I was all for the touch keyboards over the physical ones.
But play a 1st person shooter with hardware controls vs touch controls and get back with me.
I am not knocking touch screens. THe best thing to come to mobile devices. But not the end all to everything.
You do get a choice with the Vita.
Again, it makes no difference. People like you don't even READ posts like mine, where I state as clearly as possible that I'm fully aware of how much "better" first person shooters are on the PS3 than they are on the iPad, and that I AGREE.
But I also am not deluded into thinking that matters, when it does not.
But that does not make it the best device for everything. Not being one sided in this debate.
I love the iPad and really can't imagine not having one now. And if I were limited to just one or the other, the iPad wins.
And maybe thats enough for many.
I want a pure gaming device as well.
And what the fuck is wrong with that?
For one, you're way too angry about something so insignificant.
But ignoring that, there's nothing wrong with it ("I want a pure gaming device") at all. But if you're going to chime in on a discussion (or in this case try to direct at all cost) about the future of gaming and platforms, don't speak from desire. What you WANT to see happen, ain't gonna. Sorry to say it.
Dedicated gaming systems can only exist when there's a market for them. And that means profits. If there is no money to be made, there will be no companies making dedicated gaming devices. All efforts will gravitate toward where the money is.
Right now there is a market, albeit a shrinking one. Over the next 5 years, I see the market continuing to exist, and continuing to shrink. Beyond that its anyone's guess....but to say that its a given that a strong and thriving dedicated/independent console gaming market will exist...is a bad guess.
I guess your ignorance on the matter has caught up with you. And this:
Makes you look every bit as elitist as them. Guess as an Apple user it feels natural, huh?
THESE are hardcore games. And they are not shooters. Many do not require "skill" to be played, because most of them aren't competitive. Others require more of it that 99% of board games. They are meant to be engaging.
Actually, most hardcore gamers agree that the market is currently over-saturated with first person shooters that are repetitive and formulaic.
Furthermore, we have other games that involve first or third person shooting but are far from being Call of Duty or GTA (basically the only kinds of games you seem to think that exist):
I do agree with SolipsimX that the idea of portable hardcore gaming is ridiculous.
Edit: Oh, and those people that think that COD and Battlefield 3 are "hardcore", the best genre ever, and talk like 15-year old "bros"? Fscking posers.
If I was a mod here I'd ban you for life for this. I've got infractions myself for saying a lot less.
You call me ignorant? And hypothesise I might be a "Japanese Wierdo?"
The funny thing is that you argue that these games are not "shooters" (I said war games), and then list a long list of .. war games. Even the driving games yo list here are the exact kind of aggressive nonsense that I was talking about.
You were so hot to insult me you completely missed my point.
Post reported for personal racist attack.
Please return to your Mum's basement and have a nice day.
You'd be doing the mods a favor to truncate your quote of his post to something short and free of actual content like I've just done yours. If the post is found to be in violation of the rules, it will have to not only be deleted from its place, but also deleted from yours and any other quotes that use it.
For certain traditional (and still very fun) kinds of games, having those controls permanently attached would be great! Still, how good is it as a phone, web-browser, music store, GPS, camera, and non-game app platform? Because if it falls short in those areas, you’d have to carry one AND a phone—or one and a phone and an iPod touch and a camera and a navigator! Yikes. The game device you leave at home is useless when you’re not at home. For something that exists for portability, that’s key.
Even the driving games yo list here are the exact kind of aggressive nonsense that I was talking about.
I didn't know Gran Turismo was an aggressive game.
And to PMZ, we are not talking about the future of gaming. My comments were an answer to people that basically say "VITA SUCKS". Oh my, on french TV they just said that the console was aimed at a more experienced public than the 3ds... they didn't even talk about the iPhone, how dare they! Yes, Vita has no future.
And as you said, nobody uses consoles anymore, look at the failures that were recent games...
The vita will separate the gamers from the posers.
Gaming consoles???
Those toys for kids?
Anyone knows that REAL gamers use a PC, a keyboard and a mouse, so go away with your bleating claims about some handheld POS barely capable of running a Barbie pony riding game.
Your statement is based on a subjective matter of degree with no meaning in the real world and as such it has no relevance.
I'm sorry but you're wrong. Don't fool yourself. The PSP has never been huge, and this device will be no different. QUALITY of gaming is subjective, and not only that, but it appears to matter less and less. People are choosing all-in-one mobile devices over multiple, dedicated-feature mobile devices.
Understand: It makes NO difference if the quality of gameplay (being more traditional aka old style) is better on a joy stick and button device. This is proving to NOT be a purchasing factor. While it may make sense to you, its not making sense to the majority of consumers. The majority are choosing to play simpler games, as the trade off, and gaining the benefits of, 1) A single device, 2) inexpensive titles.
What Sony does not get and will never get is that $30 and up games are out to lunch when it comes to portable. Consoles will always have their niche gaming market, but any and all future attempts at taking that to the mobile space is going to fail.
Also, a little thing that Sony didn't expect....iOS games are getting pretty good. They still don't hold a candle to say a PS3 game (again, doesn't seem to matter according to purchase decisions), but the better they get the shorter that "leg up" gets. I mean, look at Dead Space on iOS. If that is whats available now on current hardware, imagine where we'll be in the next 2 years.
That sounds good & well, the facts aren't with you sir, the video game industry is the second biggest next to porn... Games make more money then Hollywood.
So when i read through peoples "points" they use strong words & say things that sound pretty good & make sense to someone that doesn't know much about the industry.
Unfortunately for you I do know how this works.
Seriously go read some statistics & get some facts, there is a lot A LOT of opinion being thrown around & passed off as fact
& to the people that get offended about people being hardcore games...Get over it, there are many many hardcore gamers, they drive the gaming market at this point.
I think some people here need to step into the real world for a little while, might be surprised to find out how things are.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hill60
Gaming consoles???
Those toys for kids?
Anyone knows that REAL gamers use a PC, a keyboard and a mouse, so go away with your bleating claims about some handheld POS barely capable of running a Barbie pony riding game.
Your statement is based on a subjective matter of degree with no meaning in the real world and as such it has no relevance.
Hahaha wow, yeah....no anyone knows & real gamer uses all consoles & devices (I hope you were just trying to troll & were kidding)
PS your second sentence didn't make sense in the real world context of the conversation & didn't make sense as far as english goes.
That sounds good & well, the facts aren't with you sir, the video game industry is the second biggest next to porn... Games make more money then Hollywood.
So when i read through peoples "points" they use strong words & say things that sound pretty good & make sense to someone that doesn't know much about the industry.
Unfortunately for you I do know how this works.
Seriously go read some statistics & get some facts, there is a lot A LOT of opinion being thrown around & passed off as fact
& to the people that get offended about people being hardcore games...Get over it, there are many many hardcore gamers, they drive the gaming market at this point.
I think some people here need to step into the real world for a little while, might be surprised to find out how things are.
Well said. I read for example that Skyrim is making approx 600 million in revenue. Compare that to the 2 billion apple says it redistributed for apps, and not just games... it's easy to see that non-apple gaming makes A LOT more money, so it gathers a lot of interest. TV ads for videogames are more present than ever. Some people here really don't have a clue. They play on their iPhone and they think they know how the gaming industry works.
Anyone knows that REAL gamers use a PC, a keyboard and a mouse, so go away with your bleating claims about some handheld POS barely capable of running a Barbie pony riding game.
No, real gamers use:
- a football and a helmet
- a soccer ball and cleats
- a 17 foot sailboat
- a shotgun and clay targets
- a rifle and venison on the hoof
- a puck and skates
- and any number of other options.
A PC, keyboard, and a mouse? Hopeless loser wimps.
You didn't disprove anything. Nintendo does hardware mainly created for games. Apple doesn't. Nintendo's and Sony's marketing is solely orientated on gaming (with very rare exceptions), contrary to Apple's.
Be careful with what you say, someone here is going to tell you that the iPhone 4S is better than your Canon for taking pictures. I keep coming here for news and it's so funny to see such fanboism. This may be the heart of Apple fanboism. People talking about patents and comparing iOS games to playstation or Nintendo titles... Pff that's just sad. They clearly don't know what they are talking about. (and don't try to explain that the gaming infrastructure and hardware is better on the Vita, people will think you are crazy).
I played 8 hours a day of Skyrim for the past 2 weeks. Can't I be called a hardcore gamer?
December 17, 2011 :
SolipsismX decides that the term "hardcore gamer" is inappropriate.
No. We'll just call you an Addict. Your time spent gaming isn't a measure of your hardcore label. It's the quality of gaming that would go to labeling you as an elite game player.
Back in the 80s to very early 90s Arcades were surrounded by guys who dumped in routinely $50 a day at an arcade. They all stunk at the games. Then an expert would come in with a single quarter and play Defenders, Galaga, Q-bert, Pacman, Ms. Pacman, Beserker and others for hours as the idiots all stood around in awe.
That person was the talented gamer. They never called themselves hardcore. We called them experts.
As long as idevices don't have hardware buttons there'll be a market for PSP's and DS's.
Why Apple hasnt created an iPhone cradle with analog sticks and shoulder buttons is beyond me: they could have proper FPS and driving games...
GTA3 runs great on my 4S, but it annoys the hell out of me that i have to use the crappy touch controls to drive a car, all while im blocking 1/5th of the screen with my fingers...
Comments
No, that's not what's happening. People that didn't play before are beginning to play on their phones, and may be tempted to get a wii for casual gaming. People that played before on consoles are not ditching them for touch based controls. In your dreams.
No, that's not what's happening. That's a fantasy, that you created in your head, to explain what you wish was happening.
What's actually happening is that "gaming" and the amount of time/money spent on it, by the largest denomination of people, is going in the direction that iOS is taking it. Android too, to an extent.
You can fantasize about people not ditching their consoles or PCs, but that is what's happening. Even "hardcore" gamers (despise that phrase) only allot a certain amount of time in a day for gaming, and a large amount of that is moving from their console to their phone or tablet. You don't need much data to substantiate it. People aren't inventing more time to play games. As these new things come along, they're splitting time among them, or moving to the new platforms almost entirely. For lots of reasons. Many of which sound ludicrous to the slobbering console drones, but they are reasons nonetheless. Things like, "its simply more convenient to pick up and play, here and there."
It makes absolutely no difference what you WANT to see happen, or what you think should happen. The market has its own idea of this, and it shows.
I was all for the touch keyboards over the physical ones.
But play a 1st person shooter with hardware controls vs touch controls and get back with me.
I am not knocking touch screens. THe best thing to come to mobile devices. But not the end all to everything.
You do get a choice with the Vita.
Again, it makes no difference. People like you don't even READ posts like mine, where I state as clearly as possible that I'm fully aware of how much "better" first person shooters are on the PS3 than they are on the iPad, and that I AGREE.
But I also am not deluded into thinking that matters, when it does not.
For GAMING, the Vita is the better experience.
But that does not make it the best device for everything. Not being one sided in this debate.
I love the iPad and really can't imagine not having one now. And if I were limited to just one or the other, the iPad wins.
And maybe thats enough for many.
I want a pure gaming device as well.
And what the fuck is wrong with that?
For one, you're way too angry about something so insignificant.
But ignoring that, there's nothing wrong with it ("I want a pure gaming device") at all. But if you're going to chime in on a discussion (or in this case try to direct at all cost) about the future of gaming and platforms, don't speak from desire. What you WANT to see happen, ain't gonna. Sorry to say it.
Dedicated gaming systems can only exist when there's a market for them. And that means profits. If there is no money to be made, there will be no companies making dedicated gaming devices. All efforts will gravitate toward where the money is.
Right now there is a market, albeit a shrinking one. Over the next 5 years, I see the market continuing to exist, and continuing to shrink. Beyond that its anyone's guess....but to say that its a given that a strong and thriving dedicated/independent console gaming market will exist...is a bad guess.
It's Sony.
Well? that's got fail written all over it!
Why take two bottles into the shower when you can take one?!
How many iPhones do you have?
And you're brilliant too I suppose?
J.
It was supposed to be a compliment.
Good job turning it into something negative.
I guess your ignorance on the matter has caught up with you. And this:
Makes you look every bit as elitist as them. Guess as an Apple user it feels natural, huh?
THESE are hardcore games. And they are not shooters. Many do not require "skill" to be played, because most of them aren't competitive. Others require more of it that 99% of board games. They are meant to be engaging.
Actually, most hardcore gamers agree that the market is currently over-saturated with first person shooters that are repetitive and formulaic.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myst_IV:_Revelation
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/StarCra...ngs_of_Liberty
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homeworld
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civilization_V
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heavy_Rain
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gran_Turismo_5
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Wa...e_Old_Republic
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Portal_2
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/League_of_Legends
Furthermore, we have other games that involve first or third person shooting but are far from being Call of Duty or GTA (basically the only kinds of games you seem to think that exist):
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Half-Life_2
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uncharted_3
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bioshock_Infinite
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fallout_3
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deus_Ex:_Human_Revolution
And if you're a Japanese weirdo:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catherine_(video_game) (not as bad as the cover makes it look like)
I do agree with SolipsimX that the idea of portable hardcore gaming is ridiculous.
Edit: Oh, and those people that think that COD and Battlefield 3 are "hardcore", the best genre ever, and talk like 15-year old "bros"? Fscking posers.
If I was a mod here I'd ban you for life for this. I've got infractions myself for saying a lot less.
You call me ignorant? And hypothesise I might be a "Japanese Wierdo?"
The funny thing is that you argue that these games are not "shooters" (I said war games), and then list a long list of .. war games. Even the driving games yo list here are the exact kind of aggressive nonsense that I was talking about.
You were so hot to insult me you completely missed my point.
Post reported for personal racist attack.
Please return to your Mum's basement and have a nice day.
previous post
You'd be doing the mods a favor to truncate your quote of his post to something short and free of actual content like I've just done yours. If the post is found to be in violation of the rules, it will have to not only be deleted from its place, but also deleted from yours and any other quotes that use it.
Even the driving games yo list here are the exact kind of aggressive nonsense that I was talking about.
I didn't know Gran Turismo was an aggressive game.
And to PMZ, we are not talking about the future of gaming. My comments were an answer to people that basically say "VITA SUCKS". Oh my, on french TV they just said that the console was aimed at a more experienced public than the 3ds... they didn't even talk about the iPhone, how dare they! Yes, Vita has no future.
And as you said, nobody uses consoles anymore, look at the failures that were recent games...
The vita will separate the gamers from the posers.
Gaming consoles???
Those toys for kids?
Anyone knows that REAL gamers use a PC, a keyboard and a mouse, so go away with your bleating claims about some handheld POS barely capable of running a Barbie pony riding game.
Your statement is based on a subjective matter of degree with no meaning in the real world and as such it has no relevance.
I'm sorry but you're wrong. Don't fool yourself. The PSP has never been huge, and this device will be no different. QUALITY of gaming is subjective, and not only that, but it appears to matter less and less. People are choosing all-in-one mobile devices over multiple, dedicated-feature mobile devices.
Understand: It makes NO difference if the quality of gameplay (being more traditional aka old style) is better on a joy stick and button device. This is proving to NOT be a purchasing factor. While it may make sense to you, its not making sense to the majority of consumers. The majority are choosing to play simpler games, as the trade off, and gaining the benefits of, 1) A single device, 2) inexpensive titles.
What Sony does not get and will never get is that $30 and up games are out to lunch when it comes to portable. Consoles will always have their niche gaming market, but any and all future attempts at taking that to the mobile space is going to fail.
Also, a little thing that Sony didn't expect....iOS games are getting pretty good. They still don't hold a candle to say a PS3 game (again, doesn't seem to matter according to purchase decisions), but the better they get the shorter that "leg up" gets. I mean, look at Dead Space on iOS. If that is whats available now on current hardware, imagine where we'll be in the next 2 years.
That sounds good & well, the facts aren't with you sir, the video game industry is the second biggest next to porn... Games make more money then Hollywood.
So when i read through peoples "points" they use strong words & say things that sound pretty good & make sense to someone that doesn't know much about the industry.
Unfortunately for you I do know how this works.
Seriously go read some statistics & get some facts, there is a lot A LOT of opinion being thrown around & passed off as fact
& to the people that get offended about people being hardcore games...Get over it, there are many many hardcore gamers, they drive the gaming market at this point.
I think some people here need to step into the real world for a little while, might be surprised to find out how things are.
Gaming consoles???
Those toys for kids?
Anyone knows that REAL gamers use a PC, a keyboard and a mouse, so go away with your bleating claims about some handheld POS barely capable of running a Barbie pony riding game.
Your statement is based on a subjective matter of degree with no meaning in the real world and as such it has no relevance.
Hahaha wow, yeah....no anyone knows & real gamer uses all consoles & devices (I hope you were just trying to troll & were kidding)
PS your second sentence didn't make sense in the real world context of the conversation
That sounds good & well, the facts aren't with you sir, the video game industry is the second biggest next to porn... Games make more money then Hollywood.
So when i read through peoples "points" they use strong words & say things that sound pretty good & make sense to someone that doesn't know much about the industry.
Unfortunately for you I do know how this works.
Seriously go read some statistics & get some facts, there is a lot A LOT of opinion being thrown around & passed off as fact
& to the people that get offended about people being hardcore games...Get over it, there are many many hardcore gamers, they drive the gaming market at this point.
I think some people here need to step into the real world for a little while, might be surprised to find out how things are.
Well said. I read for example that Skyrim is making approx 600 million in revenue. Compare that to the 2 billion apple says it redistributed for apps, and not just games... it's easy to see that non-apple gaming makes A LOT more money, so it gathers a lot of interest. TV ads for videogames are more present than ever. Some people here really don't have a clue. They play on their iPhone and they think they know how the gaming industry works.
you're right. it's a good thing Apple has never announced / introduced new hardware right after Christmas...
Big difference is that Apple has not announced a product prior to the biggest holiday that something will be released after that holiday.
Anyone knows that REAL gamers use a PC, a keyboard and a mouse, so go away with your bleating claims about some handheld POS barely capable of running a Barbie pony riding game.
No, real gamers use:
- a football and a helmet
- a soccer ball and cleats
- a 17 foot sailboat
- a shotgun and clay targets
- a rifle and venison on the hoof
- a puck and skates
- and any number of other options.
A PC, keyboard, and a mouse? Hopeless loser wimps.
Says common sense. Stop trolling.
You didn't disprove anything. Nintendo does hardware mainly created for games. Apple doesn't. Nintendo's and Sony's marketing is solely orientated on gaming (with very rare exceptions), contrary to Apple's.
Be careful with what you say, someone here is going to tell you that the iPhone 4S is better than your Canon for taking pictures. I keep coming here for news and it's so funny to see such fanboism. This may be the heart of Apple fanboism. People talking about patents and comparing iOS games to playstation or Nintendo titles... Pff that's just sad. They clearly don't know what they are talking about. (and don't try to explain that the gaming infrastructure and hardware is better on the Vita, people will think you are crazy).
I played 8 hours a day of Skyrim for the past 2 weeks. Can't I be called a hardcore gamer?
December 17, 2011 :
SolipsismX decides that the term "hardcore gamer" is inappropriate.
No. We'll just call you an Addict. Your time spent gaming isn't a measure of your hardcore label. It's the quality of gaming that would go to labeling you as an elite game player.
Back in the 80s to very early 90s Arcades were surrounded by guys who dumped in routinely $50 a day at an arcade. They all stunk at the games. Then an expert would come in with a single quarter and play Defenders, Galaga, Q-bert, Pacman, Ms. Pacman, Beserker and others for hours as the idiots all stood around in awe.
That person was the talented gamer. They never called themselves hardcore. We called them experts.
Why Apple hasnt created an iPhone cradle with analog sticks and shoulder buttons is beyond me: they could have proper FPS and driving games...
GTA3 runs great on my 4S, but it annoys the hell out of me that i have to use the crappy touch controls to drive a car, all while im blocking 1/5th of the screen with my fingers...