Tablets are not PCs. At least not yet. In the future the lines between PC and tablet will blur but right now they are not. My phone does everything my iPad does, is it a PC? Anything to boost numbers. Are all the other manufactures having their tablets counted? They are pretty crappy but I would venture they sold enough to offset Mac sales. Heck, motorcycles cut into automobile sales but that doesnt make a motorcycle a car.
AI just posted an article about 12% of enterprise laptop users converting strictly to an iPad. So what does that mean? It means that a user used a different type of computer. So as far as I'm concerned, yes and iPad for a good segment of consumers replaces their need for a conventional computer.
Your motorcycle analogy is total spin. I ride a motorcycle every day. A motorcycle (iPad) AND an automobile (desktop/laptop) are BOTH "motor vehicles" (PC's). Each one on their own can do some things better than the other, but neither can replace the other.
I agree with you here. A smartphone shouldn't be called a PC categorically because it's already considered a smartphone. But a tablet was considered a PC up until Apple announced the iPad. It got categorically demoted because it didn't use a standard desktop OS (and to a lesser extent didn't try to replicate every port you find on a notebook PC, but that is only needed to back up the primary reason). If the iPad had been released with Mac OS X as is like all previously released Windows tablets I am sure it would be counted with PC sales without question.
Really it comes down to categorization and organization. Do you count every tablet on the market or ones that are a minimum size? Surely we wouldn't count Acer advertising "The world's smallest tablet" with a 1" 16:9 display (if they were foolish enough to do that)? Yet we counted netbooks which couldn't run every app people thought because of the anemic HW and those that could technically run the experience was too poor to make it a good solution. So Apple and others are pushed from the kingdom because they have idealized the OS for the HW just as Apple does for Mac OS X and Macs.
I personally don't care that they don't count the iPad so long as they don't count any other tablet and explain how they determined the classification. Remember when Jobs stated Apple makes more mobile devices than any other CE vendor when he added the Mac notebooks. He qualified it. He explained it. They are certainly mobile, aren't they.
PS: By definition motorcycles are automobiles, but they are not cars. Your argument is like saying Macs are PCs therefore all PCs are Macs. Surely you know that a logical fallacy.
Here is the definitive answer, IMHO...
"Tastes great, less filling" as the Miller Lite commercials say. Although it doesn't have the calories or same alcohol content as full fledged beers, light beer is still considered beer and is not broken out into a different category than traditional beer.
Tablets essentially have the same ingredients as a PC but maybe not as hearty or substantial as a traditional PC but I would certainly consider a tablet a PC also, as in...PC Lite!
Tablets are not PCs. At least not yet. In the future the lines between PC and tablet will blur but right now they are not. My phone does everything my iPad does, is it a PC? Anything to boost numbers. Are all the other manufactures having their tablets counted? They are pretty crappy but I would venture they sold enough to offset Mac sales. Heck, motorcycles cut into automobile sales but that doesnt make a motorcycle a car.
Tablets are not PC's, smartphones are not PC's, Netbooks are not PC's, underpowered Laptops are not PC's, underpowered desktops are not PC's, and well, Macs are definitely not PC's. Or are they? Of course they are. They are all computers with processors and they are all personal.
I think we can sub categorize until we are blue in the face. They are all 'units', or 'devices'. Computing devices at that. But I don't see why a 7" tablet is any less a pc than a 10" Atom Netbook.
The first problem is that you put netbooks and faster in the same sentence.
The second problem is the fact that iPad sales are growing netbook sales are nearly gone.
The reason for that answers your question.
Quote:
Originally Posted by pridon
What can I do with a netbook that I can't do with an iPad and for the most part faster, especially since I now have Onlive and now have access to MS Office apps, not that I couln't have bought the Apple office apps?
Tablets are not PC's, smartphones are not PC's, Netbooks are not PC's, underpowered Laptops are not PC's, underpowered desktops are not PC's, and well, Macs are definitely not PC's. Or are they? Of course they are. They are all computers with processors and they are all personal.
I think we can sub categorize until we are blue in the face. They are all 'units', or 'devices'. Computing devices at that. But I don't see why a 7" tablet is any less a pc than a 10" Atom Netbook.
Steve Ballmer called the iPad a "PC" in a different form factor. If anyone can define the "PC," I'd think it was Microsoft, particularly an old guy who has seen the history of computing.
Interestingly, Steve Jobs didn't call the iPad a PC, he referred to it as a "post-PC" device, a term that does not flatter Microsoft, Intel and the conventional PC makers.
However, this isn't really an argument about bullshit semantics of what a "PC" is. The article is talking about who is making the most general computing devices. So no, a refrigerator that runs apps is not really a PC, but tablets people buy to replace the functionality of a conventional laptop is.
There is pretty obviously only one reason Gartner and IDG suddenly stopped calling tablets a PC the moment non-Windows tablets first appeared, yet kept calling toy-level netbooks PCs.
There is also only one reason why the AI trolls are trying to invent arguments as to why the iPad should be gerrymandered out of the market share numbers that reflect who is making the most computers.
HP already admitted that Apple would be taking its spot shortly, so its not even a controversial idea.
Unless you just really hate Apple and resent its success.
Interestingly, Steve Jobs didn't call the iPad a PC, he referred to it as a "post-PC" device, a term that does not flatter Microsoft, Intel and the conventional PC makers.
That was what Jobs did. Defining yourself as being the same as everyone else wasn't going to sell more iPads the way that saying the Mac wasn't a PC sold more Mac personal computers. Note that Apple did advertise the Apple II as a personal computer.
What can I do with a netbook that I can't do with an iPad and for the most part faster, especially since I now have Onlive and now have access to MS Office apps, not that I couln't have bought the Apple office apps?
You can type much much much faster on a Netbook. Outside of that.... Ummm.... Watch flash?
Quote:
Originally Posted by paxman
Tablets are not PC's, smartphones are not PC's, Netbooks are not PC's, underpowered Laptops are not PC's, underpowered desktops are not PC's, and well, Macs are definitely not PC's. Or are they? Of course they are. They are all computers with processors and they are all personal.
I think we can sub categorize until we are blue in the face. They are all 'units', or 'devices'. Computing devices at that. But I don't see why a 7" tablet is any less a pc than a 10" Atom Netbook.
Good post. Yeah- to argue about it is pretty nerdy- because at the end of the day, who cares? But there is no doubt iPads consume the laptop market. My parents don't have two laptops like they used to- they now have a laptop and an iPad.
Tablets are not PCs. At least not yet. In the future the lines between PC and tablet will blur but right now they are not. My phone does everything my iPad does, is it a PC? Anything to boost numbers. Are all the other manufactures having their tablets counted? They are pretty crappy but I would venture they sold enough to offset Mac sales. Heck, motorcycles cut into automobile sales but that doesnt make a motorcycle a car.
Tablets are pretty clearly personal computers. They have a CPU, work with a keyboard, have a pointing device (touch screen), they run general purpose computer applications written in standard programming languages, they have sound, etc.
Tablets have the same screen form factor as net books and they've clearly stolen a huge number of sales from netbooks. I think a very good argument can be made by they're the same market segment.
If you include the phone (which is not the same market segment, because nobody forgoes a computer to buy a phone), then you have to say that Apple's already the largest TV seller in the world, because I can watch anything on my phone and iPad screens that I can on a TV screen.
I bought an iPad. I used it a lot. So much, that I didn't have any more use for my MBP. I sold my MBP. Now I have my iPad, and I use it for almost all of my computing needs. It's a COMPUTER. If you don't want to count it as one, you're just playing ostrich. Closing your eyes doesn't make the bad guys go away.
i wonder why you are not banned. every single post made by you = garbage, really.
how does it hurt people feelings? fact is macs and iPads are growing in numbers really fast while the others are going down.. even this fact is not important.
what is important is that for pretty much anyone that can afford them, mac = best computer, iPad = best tablet, iPhone = best smartphone. and if you put them together apple = close to perfect ecosystem. Sir, this is what hurts feelings from "people" like you. what are you doing here?
Having an opinion does not equal ban. But based on your post I'm not surprised you do not know that. Unlike real life you can not take your ball and go home when someone does not agree with you.
I bought an iPad. I used it a lot. So much, that I didn't have any more use for my MBP. I sold my MBP. Now I have my iPad, and I use it for almost all of my computing needs. It's a COMPUTER. If you don't want to count it as one, you're just playing ostrich. Closing your eyes doesn't make the bad guys go away.
No one is denying that. The issue at hand is that an iPhone/smartphone can do exactly what your iPad can do and more, yet it isn't a PC. Why must a tablet be a PC? Why can it not be a tablet?
If you include the phone (which is not the same market segment, because nobody forgoes a computer to buy a phone).
I do not recall your interview, I assume you interviewed the whole world Since you are speaking for it. Making broad assumptions only make you look foolish and completely negates anything else you wrote, which is why it isn't even worth discussing.
Your motorcycle analogy is total spin. I ride a motorcycle every day. A motorcycle (iPad) AND an automobile (desktop/laptop) are BOTH "motor vehicles" (PC's). Each one on their own can do some things better than the other, but neither can replace the other.
Are we paying attention now?
My exact point. Thank you, same thing about a tablet and a PC.
Yes a car can replace a motorcycle and a motorcycle can replace a car. Maybe not in your situation but in some situations. Same as a tablet and PC. I can not play BF3 on my iPad nor can I take my desktop on a plane. For the most part they are two distinct categories and in some situations one can replace the other but not all. Not the majority. Many own both because they have too or choose too.
I'm pretty sure Apple couldn't care less about the iPad being categorized as a "PC" or not. Apple is really the only company in the "PC" industry laughing its way to the bank. The truth is that the iPad is taking a big bite out of traditional PC sales, including the now virtually extinct netbooks. Let these research firms and PC makers waste their time compiling these numbers and trying to make some sense out of 'em. It's now all about the ecosystem and the bottom line that it produces.
Comments
Tablets are not PCs. At least not yet. In the future the lines between PC and tablet will blur but right now they are not. My phone does everything my iPad does, is it a PC? Anything to boost numbers. Are all the other manufactures having their tablets counted? They are pretty crappy but I would venture they sold enough to offset Mac sales. Heck, motorcycles cut into automobile sales but that doesnt make a motorcycle a car.
AI just posted an article about 12% of enterprise laptop users converting strictly to an iPad. So what does that mean? It means that a user used a different type of computer. So as far as I'm concerned, yes and iPad for a good segment of consumers replaces their need for a conventional computer.
Your motorcycle analogy is total spin. I ride a motorcycle every day. A motorcycle (iPad) AND an automobile (desktop/laptop) are BOTH "motor vehicles" (PC's). Each one on their own can do some things better than the other, but neither can replace the other.
Are we paying attention now?
I agree with you here. A smartphone shouldn't be called a PC categorically because it's already considered a smartphone. But a tablet was considered a PC up until Apple announced the iPad. It got categorically demoted because it didn't use a standard desktop OS (and to a lesser extent didn't try to replicate every port you find on a notebook PC, but that is only needed to back up the primary reason). If the iPad had been released with Mac OS X as is like all previously released Windows tablets I am sure it would be counted with PC sales without question.
Really it comes down to categorization and organization. Do you count every tablet on the market or ones that are a minimum size? Surely we wouldn't count Acer advertising "The world's smallest tablet" with a 1" 16:9 display (if they were foolish enough to do that)? Yet we counted netbooks which couldn't run every app people thought because of the anemic HW and those that could technically run the experience was too poor to make it a good solution. So Apple and others are pushed from the kingdom because they have idealized the OS for the HW just as Apple does for Mac OS X and Macs.
I personally don't care that they don't count the iPad so long as they don't count any other tablet and explain how they determined the classification. Remember when Jobs stated Apple makes more mobile devices than any other CE vendor when he added the Mac notebooks. He qualified it. He explained it. They are certainly mobile, aren't they.
PS: By definition motorcycles are automobiles, but they are not cars. Your argument is like saying Macs are PCs therefore all PCs are Macs. Surely you know that a logical fallacy.
Here is the definitive answer, IMHO...
"Tastes great, less filling" as the Miller Lite commercials say. Although it doesn't have the calories or same alcohol content as full fledged beers, light beer is still considered beer and is not broken out into a different category than traditional beer.
Tablets essentially have the same ingredients as a PC but maybe not as hearty or substantial as a traditional PC but I would certainly consider a tablet a PC also, as in...PC Lite!
Enjoy...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=Wde7j9W8NNo
and here's the follow-up...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wKDfa...eature=related
Tablets are not PCs. At least not yet. In the future the lines between PC and tablet will blur but right now they are not. My phone does everything my iPad does, is it a PC? Anything to boost numbers. Are all the other manufactures having their tablets counted? They are pretty crappy but I would venture they sold enough to offset Mac sales. Heck, motorcycles cut into automobile sales but that doesnt make a motorcycle a car.
Tablets are not PC's, smartphones are not PC's, Netbooks are not PC's, underpowered Laptops are not PC's, underpowered desktops are not PC's, and well, Macs are definitely not PC's. Or are they? Of course they are. They are all computers with processors and they are all personal.
I think we can sub categorize until we are blue in the face. They are all 'units', or 'devices'. Computing devices at that. But I don't see why a 7" tablet is any less a pc than a 10" Atom Netbook.
The second problem is the fact that iPad sales are growing netbook sales are nearly gone.
The reason for that answers your question.
What can I do with a netbook that I can't do with an iPad and for the most part faster, especially since I now have Onlive and now have access to MS Office apps, not that I couln't have bought the Apple office apps?
Tablets are not PC's, smartphones are not PC's, Netbooks are not PC's, underpowered Laptops are not PC's, underpowered desktops are not PC's, and well, Macs are definitely not PC's. Or are they? Of course they are. They are all computers with processors and they are all personal.
I think we can sub categorize until we are blue in the face. They are all 'units', or 'devices'. Computing devices at that. But I don't see why a 7" tablet is any less a pc than a 10" Atom Netbook.
Steve Ballmer called the iPad a "PC" in a different form factor. If anyone can define the "PC," I'd think it was Microsoft, particularly an old guy who has seen the history of computing.
Interestingly, Steve Jobs didn't call the iPad a PC, he referred to it as a "post-PC" device, a term that does not flatter Microsoft, Intel and the conventional PC makers.
However, this isn't really an argument about bullshit semantics of what a "PC" is. The article is talking about who is making the most general computing devices. So no, a refrigerator that runs apps is not really a PC, but tablets people buy to replace the functionality of a conventional laptop is.
There is pretty obviously only one reason Gartner and IDG suddenly stopped calling tablets a PC the moment non-Windows tablets first appeared, yet kept calling toy-level netbooks PCs.
There is also only one reason why the AI trolls are trying to invent arguments as to why the iPad should be gerrymandered out of the market share numbers that reflect who is making the most computers.
HP already admitted that Apple would be taking its spot shortly, so its not even a controversial idea.
Unless you just really hate Apple and resent its success.
.... Because then Apple is not number one at something and hat hurts people's feelings.
You seems to be the only one round here who's feelings have been hurt!
Interestingly, Steve Jobs didn't call the iPad a PC, he referred to it as a "post-PC" device, a term that does not flatter Microsoft, Intel and the conventional PC makers.
That was what Jobs did. Defining yourself as being the same as everyone else wasn't going to sell more iPads the way that saying the Mac wasn't a PC sold more Mac personal computers. Note that Apple did advertise the Apple II as a personal computer.
What can I do with a netbook that I can't do with an iPad and for the most part faster, especially since I now have Onlive and now have access to MS Office apps, not that I couln't have bought the Apple office apps?
You can type much much much faster on a Netbook. Outside of that.... Ummm.... Watch flash?
Tablets are not PC's, smartphones are not PC's, Netbooks are not PC's, underpowered Laptops are not PC's, underpowered desktops are not PC's, and well, Macs are definitely not PC's. Or are they? Of course they are. They are all computers with processors and they are all personal.
I think we can sub categorize until we are blue in the face. They are all 'units', or 'devices'. Computing devices at that. But I don't see why a 7" tablet is any less a pc than a 10" Atom Netbook.
Good post. Yeah- to argue about it is pretty nerdy- because at the end of the day, who cares? But there is no doubt iPads consume the laptop market. My parents don't have two laptops like they used to- they now have a laptop and an iPad.
IMO- an iMac + iPad is the best combo ever.
Tablets are not PCs. At least not yet. In the future the lines between PC and tablet will blur but right now they are not. My phone does everything my iPad does, is it a PC? Anything to boost numbers. Are all the other manufactures having their tablets counted? They are pretty crappy but I would venture they sold enough to offset Mac sales. Heck, motorcycles cut into automobile sales but that doesnt make a motorcycle a car.
Tablets are pretty clearly personal computers. They have a CPU, work with a keyboard, have a pointing device (touch screen), they run general purpose computer applications written in standard programming languages, they have sound, etc.
Tablets have the same screen form factor as net books and they've clearly stolen a huge number of sales from netbooks. I think a very good argument can be made by they're the same market segment.
If you include the phone (which is not the same market segment, because nobody forgoes a computer to buy a phone), then you have to say that Apple's already the largest TV seller in the world, because I can watch anything on my phone and iPad screens that I can on a TV screen.
Your analogies are broken, just like your logic.
i wonder why you are not banned. every single post made by you = garbage, really.
how does it hurt people feelings? fact is macs and iPads are growing in numbers really fast while the others are going down.. even this fact is not important.
what is important is that for pretty much anyone that can afford them, mac = best computer, iPad = best tablet, iPhone = best smartphone. and if you put them together apple = close to perfect ecosystem. Sir, this is what hurts feelings from "people" like you. what are you doing here?
Having an opinion does not equal ban. But based on your post I'm not surprised you do not know that. Unlike real life you can not take your ball and go home when someone does not agree with you.
Tablets are not PCs.
/facepalm
I bought an iPad. I used it a lot. So much, that I didn't have any more use for my MBP. I sold my MBP. Now I have my iPad, and I use it for almost all of my computing needs. It's a COMPUTER. If you don't want to count it as one, you're just playing ostrich. Closing your eyes doesn't make the bad guys go away.
No one is denying that. The issue at hand is that an iPhone/smartphone can do exactly what your iPad can do and more, yet it isn't a PC. Why must a tablet be a PC? Why can it not be a tablet?
/facepalm
Thumbs up on your contribution to the discussion. I guess if you can not form an opinion at least you can face palm.
If you include the phone (which is not the same market segment, because nobody forgoes a computer to buy a phone).
I do not recall your interview, I assume you interviewed the whole world Since you are speaking for it. Making broad assumptions only make you look foolish and completely negates anything else you wrote, which is why it isn't even worth discussing.
You seems to be the only one round here who's feelings have been hurt!
Clearly, having a different opinion automatically equals hurt feelings. Do you read what you write?
Better include those refrigerators that run Android, then.
I'm sure if Apple had the number one selling refrigerator that runs iOS we would.
Your motorcycle analogy is total spin. I ride a motorcycle every day. A motorcycle (iPad) AND an automobile (desktop/laptop) are BOTH "motor vehicles" (PC's). Each one on their own can do some things better than the other, but neither can replace the other.
Are we paying attention now?
My exact point. Thank you, same thing about a tablet and a PC.
Yes a car can replace a motorcycle and a motorcycle can replace a car. Maybe not in your situation but in some situations. Same as a tablet and PC. I can not play BF3 on my iPad nor can I take my desktop on a plane. For the most part they are two distinct categories and in some situations one can replace the other but not all. Not the majority. Many own both because they have too or choose too.