This is a Mac site though. Who the hell buys a laptop that costs less than $500? I feel sorry for such people. I'm glad to say that I do not know a single person who owns such a laptop. I don't hang out with bums.
It's like being on a Rolls Royce forum and along comes these people who say that they are happy with their Lada. Well, good for them. Different people obviously have different standards.
I own an Acer 522 and Mac Mini 2011 plus iphone, ipod nano, ipodshuffle and Apple TV. Am very happy with my Acer 522.
Just no time soon. Or do you think Apple will be around in 150 years? Not gonna happen.
Yeah, of course we're all going to die eventually, you, me, and everybody else.
However, somebody is a complete moron if they repeatedly go around proclaiming that Apple is doomed year after year. People have been saying that for many years now, and Apple only gets stronger.
There's this one Canadian analyst, I forget their name, but they keep on saying that Apple is going to fail soon, and their target price for Apple is beyond ridiculous. They've been saying it for years, and they even predicted that the iPhone would be a flop. Personally, I think that that analyst is on the take from RIM, since they're also a Canadian company. Nobody can possibly be that stupid.
I don't have sales numbers, but yeah, I bet the midpoint in prices for laptop sales in the USA is below $500. And by the way, Apple's laptops don't sell well. They have less than 10% of the market. They are hugely profitable, but don't confuse that with popularity. They are broadly DESIRED but rarely, in the big picture, purchased.
Average non Apple laptop as of January cost $456. So yeah, most laptops cost well under $499.
Sorry, but the math doesn't work that way. I can have 3 products priced $600, $600 and $168 and the mean price would be $456. Does that mean most of those products were under 500 dollars? No because the very low priced item has skewed the average. A median price of $456, though, would prove what you are saying but an "average" does not because averages can be skewed by outliers quite easily. And by looking at the source data the median price is over $500.
This is a Mac site though. Who the hell buys a laptop that costs less than $500? I feel sorry for such people. I'm glad to say that I do not know a single person who owns such a laptop. I don't hang out with bums.
It's like being on a Rolls Royce forum and along comes these people who say that they are happy with their Lada. Well, good for them. Different people obviously have different standards.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cameronj
Well... Apple IS doomed.
Just no time soon. Or do you think Apple will be around in 150 years? Not gonna happen.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple ][
I don't know what an Acer 522 is of course, but if it works for you and you're happy, then all is good.
If you could trade it for a Macbook Air, would you do that?
I wanted a Macbook Air but was way to expensive. If someone would trade of course I would! One thing is for sure I would no way use any google-crap product. That is for sure. Their products suck dog balls, I think I would rather use a Commodore 64 than a Chromebook!
I wanted a Macbook Air but was way to expensive. If someone would trade of course I would! One thing is for sure I would no way use any google-crap product. That is for sure. Their products suck dog balls, I think I would rather use a Commodore 64 than a Chromebook!
The Commodore 64 was a great machine for it's time. I had one of those back in the day.
People buying Mac laptops today are lucky though, because the prices have never been cheaper. I remember what Mac laptops used to cost. And I agree, I would never buy any Google hardware product either.
Sorry, but the math doesn't work that way. I can have 3 products priced $600, $600 and $168 and the mean price would be $456. Does that mean most of those products were under 500 dollars? No because the very low priced item has skewed the average. A median price of $456, though, would prove what you are saying but an "average" does not because averages can be skewed by outliers quite easily. And by looking at the source data the median price is over $500.
What if you have three products priced $300, $300 and $900?
So which is right? Do you really think the larger part of the pyramid is the top half or the bottom?
Show me what source data you're seeing that proves what the median price is?
Edit: just so you know, at Best buy you can walk out with a Dell 15 inch screen, 6 GB of RAM, 500GB laptop for $499.
Look, I'm not saying these are great computers, but for what most people do, they do just fine. And they're (that is, total $499 laptops) definitely selling way more of those than Apple sells laptops at any price. That's what people buy. Most consumers don't have the knowledge and the $500 extra to spend on a Mac laptop that may be better, but in ways that they don't understand or appreciate. So they buy a cheap PC laptop.
90% of the laptop market (the market outside Apple's tiny 10%) spends an average of $456 on a laptop as of January 2012. You'd have to be an idiot to suggest that Apple laptops are more popular than "cheap, sub-$500" laptops. The numbers are clear. If the 90% which doesn't buy Apple spends $456, they're MOSTLY spending less than $499. The ridiculous example above of a market full of high priced laptops offset by a few cheap ones is a truly impressive example of self-delusion.
What if you have three products priced $300, $300 and $900?
Well if that was the case you would be correct, but that's my point. An "average" does not say what you claim it does. A median price does. You can not make any claims that "most" laptops are priced under the price of the iPad when you are dealing only with averages (especially as they even say that the averages are skewed by Black Friday deals among other special to lower prices). On the other hand, the median price clearly provides a line under which you can say 50% of all things are priced under this and 50% are priced higher.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cameronj
Show me what source data you're seeing that proves what the median price is?
Well if that was the case you would be correct, but that's my point. An "average" does not say what you claim it does. A median price does. You can not make any claims that "most" laptops are priced under the price of the iPad when you are dealing only with averages (especially as they even say that the averages are skewed by Black Friday deals among other special to lower prices). On the other hand, the median price clearly provides a line under which you can say 50% of all things are priced under this and 50% are priced higher.
Unless you have an account with NPD, I can't.
Ha! Pitiful.
OK so let's see here. The average price of a laptop is $456 (yeah sorry I'm not going to exclude those bought on BLack Friday as if they're not real laptops or something).
So in your hypothetical crazy world, 9 buyers of PC laptops pay $501, and one pays $50, and that's how the median laptop price is above $499 while average is $456 huh? Dumbest thing I've ever heard.
You really have to stretch all logic to find me a scenario where 10s of millions of something can be sold with an average price of $456 and yet the median price is over $500. You clearly have no numbers to back it up and basic common sense shows that you're lying, so there's no sense in hitting my head against that wall anymore.
Ok the 12 million Android tablets sold to date versus the 55 million iPads sold to date.
Still not sure that qualifies as a niche market.
I could have been a lot more clear. I was referring to tablets and people that would buy one over the iPad in the same price category. Case in point, you can buy 10" Android tablets for under $100 on Amazon but those aren't the market Apple is selling in. I think it's unlikely there are people buying $499 to $829 Android tablets unless they fill a niche (or, as you said, hate Apple, but that's a niche, too).
Ok the 12 million Android tablets sold to date versus the 55 million iPads sold to date.
Still not sure that qualifies as a niche market.
I really feel sorry for those poor 12 million suckers that have bought Google crapware (most are probably in shops). As I have said before I wish there was an alternative to Apple like Atari or Palm.
Google make ugly, cheap, dysfunctional poor imitations and the Chromebook er crapbook is a disgrace to the laptop market.
I am not sure why a fandroid would be on an apple-site, so why aren't you on a google-crapsoft website reading about specs and how many cores a tegra has?
Ok the 12 million Android tablets sold to date versus the 55 million iPads sold to date.
Still not sure that qualifies as a niche market.
First, I'm not sure if that 12 million number is true, as who can trust any Android numbers? But even if it is true, it still qualifies as a niche market, and that market is called the bottom of the barrel market. It doesn't even register a blip on Apple's radar screen.
What if you have three products priced $300, $300 and $900?
So which is right? Do you really think the larger part of the pyramid is the top half or the bottom?
Show me what source data you're seeing that proves what the median price is?
Edit: just so you know, at Best buy you can walk out with a Dell 15 inch screen, 6 GB of RAM, 500GB laptop for $499.
Look, I'm not saying these are great computers, but for what most people do, they do just fine. And they're (that is, total $499 laptops) definitely selling way more of those than Apple sells laptops at any price. That's what people buy. Most consumers don't have the knowledge and the $500 extra to spend on a Mac laptop that may be better, but in ways that they don't understand or appreciate. So they buy a cheap PC laptop.
90% of the laptop market (the market outside Apple's tiny 10%) spends an average of $456 on a laptop as of January 2012. You'd have to be an idiot to suggest that Apple laptops are more popular than "cheap, sub-$500" laptops. The numbers are clear. If the 90% which doesn't buy Apple spends $456, they're MOSTLY spending less than $499. The ridiculous example above of a market full of high priced laptops offset by a few cheap ones is a truly impressive example of self-delusion.
At CES this year we saw at a lot of Ultrabooks. These are trying to come in under $900 but most seem to be $1000 or more. Some look poorly made and others, like from Samsung, looked pretty solid. Do these have a chance to strengthen the non-Mac PC market or will this be yet another failed attempt by PC vendors?
Then just look at Dell. They have 13 laptops/netbooks under 500. Whereas they have 250 over 500. You can't tell me Dell is an overpriced brand.
Your focus on accurate numbers is very impressive. I can see I'm overmatched here.
So Mr. I Have an NPD account instead uses for evidence the total amount* of systems offered for sale instead of the actual sales numbers already provided on this thread?
I could have been a lot more clear. I was referring to tablets and people that would buy one over the iPad in the same price category. Case in point, you can buy 10" Android tablets for under $100 on Amazon but those aren't the market Apple is selling in. I think it's unlikely there are people buying $499 to $829 Android tablets unless they fill a niche (or, as you said, hate Apple, but that's a niche, too).
I take your point. How many of those 12 million android tablets sold were in the same price band as the iPad and therefore genuine competitors. I guess we'll never know. I think Samsung is the only serious competitior to the iPad at the moment, although it will be interesting to see how well the rumoured 10" Kindle Fire does against the entry level iPad.
Comments
This is a Mac site though. Who the hell buys a laptop that costs less than $500? I feel sorry for such people. I'm glad to say that I do not know a single person who owns such a laptop. I don't hang out with bums.
It's like being on a Rolls Royce forum and along comes these people who say that they are happy with their Lada. Well, good for them.
I own an Acer 522 and Mac Mini 2011 plus iphone, ipod nano, ipodshuffle and Apple TV. Am very happy with my Acer 522.
Well... Apple IS doomed.
Just no time soon. Or do you think Apple will be around in 150 years? Not gonna happen.
Yeah, of course we're all going to die eventually, you, me, and everybody else.
However, somebody is a complete moron if they repeatedly go around proclaiming that Apple is doomed year after year. People have been saying that for many years now, and Apple only gets stronger.
There's this one Canadian analyst, I forget their name, but they keep on saying that Apple is going to fail soon, and their target price for Apple is beyond ridiculous. They've been saying it for years, and they even predicted that the iPhone would be a flop. Personally, I think that that analyst is on the take from RIM, since they're also a Canadian company. Nobody can possibly be that stupid.
I don't have sales numbers, but yeah, I bet the midpoint in prices for laptop sales in the USA is below $500. And by the way, Apple's laptops don't sell well. They have less than 10% of the market. They are hugely profitable, but don't confuse that with popularity. They are broadly DESIRED but rarely, in the big picture, purchased.
Edit: http://blog.laptopmag.com/average-wi...t-in-24-months
Average non Apple laptop as of January cost $456. So yeah, most laptops cost well under $499.
Sorry, but the math doesn't work that way. I can have 3 products priced $600, $600 and $168 and the mean price would be $456. Does that mean most of those products were under 500 dollars? No because the very low priced item has skewed the average. A median price of $456, though, would prove what you are saying but an "average" does not because averages can be skewed by outliers quite easily. And by looking at the source data the median price is over $500.
I own an Acer 522 and Mac Mini 2011 plus iphone, ipod nano, ipodshuffle and Apple TV. Am very happy with my Acer 522.
I don't know what an Acer 522 is of course, but if it works for you and you're happy, then all is good.
If you could trade it for a Macbook Air, would you do that?
This is a Mac site though. Who the hell buys a laptop that costs less than $500? I feel sorry for such people. I'm glad to say that I do not know a single person who owns such a laptop. I don't hang out with bums.
It's like being on a Rolls Royce forum and along comes these people who say that they are happy with their Lada. Well, good for them.
Well... Apple IS doomed.
Just no time soon. Or do you think Apple will be around in 150 years? Not gonna happen.
I don't know what an Acer 522 is of course, but if it works for you and you're happy, then all is good.
If you could trade it for a Macbook Air, would you do that?
I wanted a Macbook Air but was way to expensive. If someone would trade of course I would! One thing is for sure I would no way use any google-crap product. That is for sure. Their products suck dog balls, I think I would rather use a Commodore 64 than a Chromebook!
850,000 Android activations a day is a niche market??????
SolipsismX was talking about the tablet market, not every Android phone activated in China and India.
I wanted a Macbook Air but was way to expensive. If someone would trade of course I would! One thing is for sure I would no way use any google-crap product. That is for sure. Their products suck dog balls, I think I would rather use a Commodore 64 than a Chromebook!
The Commodore 64 was a great machine for it's time. I had one of those back in the day.
People buying Mac laptops today are lucky though, because the prices have never been cheaper. I remember what Mac laptops used to cost. And I agree, I would never buy any Google hardware product either.
Sorry, but the math doesn't work that way. I can have 3 products priced $600, $600 and $168 and the mean price would be $456. Does that mean most of those products were under 500 dollars? No because the very low priced item has skewed the average. A median price of $456, though, would prove what you are saying but an "average" does not because averages can be skewed by outliers quite easily. And by looking at the source data the median price is over $500.
What if you have three products priced $300, $300 and $900?
So which is right? Do you really think the larger part of the pyramid is the top half or the bottom?
Show me what source data you're seeing that proves what the median price is?
Edit: just so you know, at Best buy you can walk out with a Dell 15 inch screen, 6 GB of RAM, 500GB laptop for $499.
Look, I'm not saying these are great computers, but for what most people do, they do just fine. And they're (that is, total $499 laptops) definitely selling way more of those than Apple sells laptops at any price. That's what people buy. Most consumers don't have the knowledge and the $500 extra to spend on a Mac laptop that may be better, but in ways that they don't understand or appreciate. So they buy a cheap PC laptop.
90% of the laptop market (the market outside Apple's tiny 10%) spends an average of $456 on a laptop as of January 2012. You'd have to be an idiot to suggest that Apple laptops are more popular than "cheap, sub-$500" laptops. The numbers are clear. If the 90% which doesn't buy Apple spends $456, they're MOSTLY spending less than $499. The ridiculous example above of a market full of high priced laptops offset by a few cheap ones is a truly impressive example of self-delusion.
That's one Christmas I can cancel.
Are you sure? Don't you know someone who might be happy to receive your used socks? Only worn once, good as new once they wash them.
What if you have three products priced $300, $300 and $900?
Well if that was the case you would be correct, but that's my point. An "average" does not say what you claim it does. A median price does. You can not make any claims that "most" laptops are priced under the price of the iPad when you are dealing only with averages (especially as they even say that the averages are skewed by Black Friday deals among other special to lower prices). On the other hand, the median price clearly provides a line under which you can say 50% of all things are priced under this and 50% are priced higher.
Show me what source data you're seeing that proves what the median price is?
Unless you have an account with NPD, I can't.
SolipsismX was talking about the tablet market, not every Android phone activated in China and India.
Ok the 12 million Android tablets sold to date versus the 55 million iPads sold to date.
Still not sure that qualifies as a niche market.
Well if that was the case you would be correct, but that's my point. An "average" does not say what you claim it does. A median price does. You can not make any claims that "most" laptops are priced under the price of the iPad when you are dealing only with averages (especially as they even say that the averages are skewed by Black Friday deals among other special to lower prices). On the other hand, the median price clearly provides a line under which you can say 50% of all things are priced under this and 50% are priced higher.
Unless you have an account with NPD, I can't.
Ha! Pitiful.
OK so let's see here. The average price of a laptop is $456 (yeah sorry I'm not going to exclude those bought on BLack Friday as if they're not real laptops or something).
So in your hypothetical crazy world, 9 buyers of PC laptops pay $501, and one pays $50, and that's how the median laptop price is above $499 while average is $456 huh? Dumbest thing I've ever heard.
You really have to stretch all logic to find me a scenario where 10s of millions of something can be sold with an average price of $456 and yet the median price is over $500. You clearly have no numbers to back it up and basic common sense shows that you're lying, so there's no sense in hitting my head against that wall anymore.
Ok the 12 million Android tablets sold to date versus the 55 million iPads sold to date.
Still not sure that qualifies as a niche market.
I could have been a lot more clear. I was referring to tablets and people that would buy one over the iPad in the same price category. Case in point, you can buy 10" Android tablets for under $100 on Amazon but those aren't the market Apple is selling in. I think it's unlikely there are people buying $499 to $829 Android tablets unless they fill a niche (or, as you said, hate Apple, but that's a niche, too).
Ok the 12 million Android tablets sold to date versus the 55 million iPads sold to date.
Still not sure that qualifies as a niche market.
I really feel sorry for those poor 12 million suckers that have bought Google crapware (most are probably in shops). As I have said before I wish there was an alternative to Apple like Atari or Palm.
Google make ugly, cheap, dysfunctional poor imitations and the Chromebook er crapbook is a disgrace to the laptop market.
I am not sure why a fandroid would be on an apple-site, so why aren't you on a google-crapsoft website reading about specs and how many cores a tegra has?
Ok the 12 million Android tablets sold to date versus the 55 million iPads sold to date.
Still not sure that qualifies as a niche market.
First, I'm not sure if that 12 million number is true, as who can trust any Android numbers? But even if it is true, it still qualifies as a niche market, and that market is called the bottom of the barrel market. It doesn't even register a blip on Apple's radar screen.
What if you have three products priced $300, $300 and $900?
So which is right? Do you really think the larger part of the pyramid is the top half or the bottom?
Show me what source data you're seeing that proves what the median price is?
Edit: just so you know, at Best buy you can walk out with a Dell 15 inch screen, 6 GB of RAM, 500GB laptop for $499.
Look, I'm not saying these are great computers, but for what most people do, they do just fine. And they're (that is, total $499 laptops) definitely selling way more of those than Apple sells laptops at any price. That's what people buy. Most consumers don't have the knowledge and the $500 extra to spend on a Mac laptop that may be better, but in ways that they don't understand or appreciate. So they buy a cheap PC laptop.
90% of the laptop market (the market outside Apple's tiny 10%) spends an average of $456 on a laptop as of January 2012. You'd have to be an idiot to suggest that Apple laptops are more popular than "cheap, sub-$500" laptops. The numbers are clear. If the 90% which doesn't buy Apple spends $456, they're MOSTLY spending less than $499. The ridiculous example above of a market full of high priced laptops offset by a few cheap ones is a truly impressive example of self-delusion.
At CES this year we saw at a lot of Ultrabooks. These are trying to come in under $900 but most seem to be $1000 or more. Some look poorly made and others, like from Samsung, looked pretty solid. Do these have a chance to strengthen the non-Mac PC market or will this be yet another failed attempt by PC vendors?
850,000 Android activations a day is a niche market??????
In the absence of a "definitive" android device for developers to develop software for: yes.
Then just look at Dell. They have 13 laptops/netbooks under 500. Whereas they have 250 over 500. You can't tell me Dell is an overpriced brand.
Your focus on accurate numbers is very impressive. I can see I'm overmatched here.
So Mr. I Have an NPD account instead uses for evidence the total amount* of systems offered for sale instead of the actual sales numbers already provided on this thread?
Scram buddy, you're embarrassing yourself.
*total amount is actually made up
I could have been a lot more clear. I was referring to tablets and people that would buy one over the iPad in the same price category. Case in point, you can buy 10" Android tablets for under $100 on Amazon but those aren't the market Apple is selling in. I think it's unlikely there are people buying $499 to $829 Android tablets unless they fill a niche (or, as you said, hate Apple, but that's a niche, too).
I take your point. How many of those 12 million android tablets sold were in the same price band as the iPad and therefore genuine competitors. I guess we'll never know. I think Samsung is the only serious competitior to the iPad at the moment, although it will be interesting to see how well the rumoured 10" Kindle Fire does against the entry level iPad.