Correct... Apple chose to only be in the $1000+ laptop market... where the dominate in that particular market of $1000+ laptops. And that's where Apple wants to be.
Huge players like HP and Dell are down in the $500 laptop market... and recently they both had second thoughts about even being in that market because the margins are so shittty.
It seems there's more money to be made in the enterprise than selling cheap consumer laptops...
Apple's pricing of their products are for the more well-off individual, or someone willing to pay more for Apple than for the many MS hardware products. For the most part, then, Apple has a customer base that is not as price-driven or price sensitive as the base for PCs, and therefore more predictable.
But, I think Apple's customer base may also be different from the customer buying PCs. Apple customers are more comfortable with or prefer or desire less choice, allowing and trusting in Apple designers to make the good choices.
See Sheena Iyengar, Prof at Columbia Business School, her presentations at TED and her book The Art of Choosing. See also the works of Barry Schwartz and his book The Paradox of Choice (and TED lectures). See also Kahneman and Tversky works on choice. The former received the Nobel prize in Economics in 2002 for their work (Tversky had died prior so wasn't eligible).
I think it is so much more interesting to look that the above research on choice rather than continue the silliness of name-calling and shouts of fanboyisms and defenses thereof. It might just make the conversation a little more intelligent. According to this research on choice, Apple customers might be more driven by the desire to simplify and limit the anxiety caused by too many choices, and let the experts (in this case Apple designers) make the significant choices for them (us). This leaves the customer the time and resources to make the choices only he/she can make, leaving choices of computer hardware to Apple.
For these customers, Apple will continue to have loyal customers as long as Apple continues to make good choices in the design of their products.
For these customers, Apple will continue to have loyal customers as long as Apple continues to make good choices in the design of their products.
Brand loyalty is a powerful force. It's why people buy BMWs over cheaper cars with better specifications, etc, etc. Interestingly though I think the iOS devices have done so well largely because Apple has successfully reached out to a new audience with amazing products that are more affordable. I doubt the iPad would have sold very well if it was in the same price band as Apple's laptops.
Apple's pricing of their products are for the more well-off individual, or someone willing to pay more for Apple than for the many MS hardware products.
I think for iPad no other tablet comes close in price for the level of experience.
Quote:
Originally Posted by waldobushman
But, I think Apple's customer base may also be different from the customer buying PCs. Apple customers are more comfortable with or prefer or desire less choice, allowing and trusting in Apple designers to make the good choices.
Agreed.
Quote:
Originally Posted by waldobushman
See Sheena Iyengar...
It's common sense, which most other companies lack.
Brand loyalty is a powerful force. It's why people buy BMWs over cheaper cars with better specifications, etc, etc. Interestingly though I think the iOS devices have done so well largely because Apple has successfully reached out to a new audience with amazing products that are more affordable. I doubt the iPad would have sold very well if it was in the same price band as Apple's laptops.
Brand loyalty is certainly one aspect. But at the same time Apple has delivered on brand promise. People ask me about Apple (PC and Android diehards, including girls in their 20s, believe it or not also a stronghold for Windows and Android [now the "think different" of tech]), and they think it's blind loyalty. But almost no other company has delivered on the brand ~promise~ like Apple had. That's why I stick with them, not just blind faith. I used to be a fan of Nvidia and PC gaming, but despite my desire to be loyal, Windows (Win 2000 and Win XP was alright), Microsoft, Nvidia, ATI, Steam, Valve and the PC game industry has let me down far too many times. That's why I nuked that stuff and got an Xbox360... which is delivering on its brand promise.
But, I think Apple's customer base may also be different from the customer buying PCs. Apple customers are more comfortable with or prefer or desire less choice, allowing and trusting in Apple designers to make the good choices.
This is more common in the WinPC market than many think. Most people who WinPCs aren't building their own desktops, they are buying PCs. Even among the vendor made PCs the inexpensive ones don't have the options that DiY PCs have. But then look at the notebook, you can't alter much about them and they have been dominate PC type for many years now.
I think people that buy a PC 1) are familiar with Windows, and/or 2) don't see past the sticker price to the TCO or how a different OS and quality could affect their UX positively. Win8/Metro will be interesting because in many ways Metro is an entirely new OS experience, not just a familiar evolution of the standard system so we'll see how that takes hold. My guess is that they won't have much luck with tablets because if they have to get something new for around the same price as an iPad an overwhelming majority will just take the iPad.
It's amazing how some folks just cannot bring themselves to acknowledge that Apple is successful because they make great, durable products that work really well and provide excellent service after the sale.
Somehow it's always about marketing, RDF, sheep, brand snobbery, hipsterdom, etc. Anything but products. The weird thing is, as Apple continues to sell to more and more people, this theory is obliged to expand until we are required to believe that half the plant are poser rich assholes, or something. There's a fair amount of cognitive dissonance between the hated, niche Apple of old and the hated, wildly successful mass-market Apple of now.
I wanted a Macbook Air but was way to expensive. If someone would trade of course I would! One thing is for sure I would no way use any google-crap product. That is for sure. Their products suck dog balls, I think I would rather use a Commodore 64 than a Chromebook!
"Their products suck dog balls", have you ever owned one our do you generally give your review of things with just your feelings as a reference. The Chromebook might not be for you fine but it is still the future of computing. Once bandwidth becomes faster and cheaper we will all be using dumb devices that just connect to the internet for our content.
I wanted a Macbook Air but was way to expensive. If someone would trade of course I would! One thing is for sure I would no way use any google-crap product. That is for sure. Their products suck dog balls, I think I would rather use a Commodore 64 than a Chromebook!
1
Dog balls? More like dog shit! Chromebooks suck dog shit right straight out of the dog's ass! They are made by Google!
This same thing happened last time, you think they'd have ordered bigger charts.
iPad 2 sold 1 million in the first weekend, the iPhone 4S sold 4 million in the first weekend - I expect the new iPad will be somewhere in between.
I'd guess 2 million. During the holiday quarter, iPad 2 was selling about 1 million per week. There was a lot of publicity about the "iPad 3" from about mid-February on, so undoubtedly iPad 2 sales tailed off and there was pent up demand.
In any case, I'm glad I got my order in on Thursday before they sold out. The wait time is up to 2-3 weeks now (it was still "shipping March 19" earlier today).
Anyhow, went up yesterday to see how she liked it "WONDERFUL!!!" and updated it to iOS 5.1, and the thing is running better than at any time I ever had it! Even Infinity Blade plays fine without crashing She loves the fact that she can show off her grandkids, surf the web and email...the basic stuff, which the original iPad is great for. Glad to see it found a happy home. Now I'm having iPad withdrawal symptoms and have to wait until Friday for the new one
What kinds of improvements have you seen with the upgrade to 5.1? I have an original iPad running 5.0.1, and while I've already upgraded the iPhones in the household to 5.1 I haven't bothered yet with the iPad since the battery improvements aren't as needed there. Though I suppose with the in-device upgrade there's really little reason not to.
All the folks who still use an iPad 1 like me, who passed on the iPad 2 are going to upgrade this year. Not to mention, all new folks will buy purchase a new iPad this year.
That would be me, I'm really looking forward to the upgrade later this year.
Apple's pricing of their products are for the more well-off individual, or someone willing to pay more for Apple than for the many MS hardware products. For the most part, then, Apple has a customer base that is not as price-driven or price sensitive as the base for PCs, and therefore more predictable.
But, I think Apple's customer base may also be different from the customer buying PCs. Apple customers are more comfortable with or prefer or desire less choice, allowing and trusting in Apple designers to make the good choices.
See Sheena Iyengar, Prof at Columbia Business School, her presentations at TED and her book The Art of Choosing. See also the works of Barry Schwartz and his book The Paradox of Choice (and TED lectures). See also Kahneman and Tversky works on choice. The former received the Nobel prize in Economics in 2002 for their work (Tversky had died prior so wasn't eligible).
I think it is so much more interesting to look that the above research on choice rather than continue the silliness of name-calling and shouts of fanboyisms and defenses thereof. It might just make the conversation a little more intelligent. According to this research on choice, Apple customers might be more driven by the desire to simplify and limit the anxiety caused by too many choices, and let the experts (in this case Apple designers) make the significant choices for them (us). This leaves the customer the time and resources to make the choices only he/she can make, leaving choices of computer hardware to Apple.
For these customers, Apple will continue to have loyal customers as long as Apple continues to make good choices in the design of their products.
The traditional customer of the PC is changing. The world of disposable $500 products for laptops, $199 for embedded devices you trash in 2 years is drying up. The profits for such a market is drying up.
The $300 billion in market cap that has been lost by the likes of HP, Dell, IBM, Asus, etc., hasn't disappeared. It's shifted to Apple.
People have always traditionally held onto Apple products longer than non-Apple products.
Enterprise markets for Consulting died before 2000. Most of the traditional talent that is making a killing off the iOS Development platform are former Enterprise Consultants with 10-15 years of ObjC/Cocoa expertise who realize they have a market of several hundred million willing consumers dying to get some good applications for the iOS Ecosystem.
Instead of just a Laptop or just an iPod they are buying a Laptop, iPhone, iPad and holding onto them for more than the typical 18 month cycle. For a few iterations of the iPhone and iPad they give them down and the upgrade to the latest. They skip a revision of the Macbook or iMac/Mac mini and then buy. The hardcore developer for Engineering, Research, and more have been buying fully loaded iMacs and several Mac mini's waiting for a Mac Pro to dump $10k into.
If the world of the embedded processor space had to wait like we do with Intel and AMD the market would not be remotely as profitable.
If Apple would shift to a BTO option of the upcoming Ivy Bridge or Piledriver from AMD and put the latest AMD Radeon 7000 series up to the 7970 available for the Mac Pro they'd see a huge jump in sales for that line.
As it stands, if the 7700 Radeon is offered inside the iMac and the 7600 Mobile inside the Mac Mini both lines will see blow out numbers.
People aren't buying less electronics. They are spending more money for products they perceive have a slower depreciation rate and a longer added value to their time value of money. They are buying Apple.
Apple's non-embedded products will continue to see solid quarter over last year same quarter jumps for years to come.
What kinds of improvements have you seen with the upgrade to 5.1? I have an original iPad running 5.0.1, and while I've already upgraded the iPhones in the household to 5.1 I haven't bothered yet with the iPad since the battery improvements aren't as needed there. Though I suppose with the in-device upgrade there's really little reason not to.
Response on my iPad 1st generation, 16GB model with 5.1 is a noticable improvement in all applications.
iBooks is solid and the loading of large volumes is improved significantly enough to make it worth noting [I'm talking 1000 page+ documents].
GLView Test results for OpenGL ES 1.1, Scene: Cube
Fog: On, Transparency: On, Format: RGBA8, Multisampling: On, Mipmap: On.
Frames per second: 43.8 fps.
Add Anisotropic Filtering: 1
Frames per second: 45.3 fps.
Safari: Loading a page like the HuffingtonPost front page where it has around 700kb of Javascript pre-loaded, and smart prefetching where images don't fully load before you can scroll takes all of 7 seconds on the iPad revision 1.
Running under Firefox 10 takes more time on my Linux workstation which has a lot more raw power.
Safari and the latest WebKit for mobile is well tuned. The Javascript performance increases are very noticable.
Out of 176 applications installed I have only seen a couple dozen updates after the release of iOS 5.1. I expect to be buried with updates in the next couple of weeks.
What kinds of improvements have you seen with the upgrade to 5.1? I have an original iPad running 5.0.1, and while I've already upgraded the iPhones in the household to 5.1 I haven't bothered yet with the iPad since the battery improvements aren't as needed there. Though I suppose with the in-device upgrade there's really little reason not to.
the least i can say is iPad 1 is running smoother on 5.1.
Comments
Correct... Apple chose to only be in the $1000+ laptop market... where the dominate in that particular market of $1000+ laptops. And that's where Apple wants to be.
Huge players like HP and Dell are down in the $500 laptop market... and recently they both had second thoughts about even being in that market because the margins are so shittty.
It seems there's more money to be made in the enterprise than selling cheap consumer laptops...
Apple's pricing of their products are for the more well-off individual, or someone willing to pay more for Apple than for the many MS hardware products. For the most part, then, Apple has a customer base that is not as price-driven or price sensitive as the base for PCs, and therefore more predictable.
But, I think Apple's customer base may also be different from the customer buying PCs. Apple customers are more comfortable with or prefer or desire less choice, allowing and trusting in Apple designers to make the good choices.
See Sheena Iyengar, Prof at Columbia Business School, her presentations at TED and her book The Art of Choosing. See also the works of Barry Schwartz and his book The Paradox of Choice (and TED lectures). See also Kahneman and Tversky works on choice. The former received the Nobel prize in Economics in 2002 for their work (Tversky had died prior so wasn't eligible).
I think it is so much more interesting to look that the above research on choice rather than continue the silliness of name-calling and shouts of fanboyisms and defenses thereof. It might just make the conversation a little more intelligent. According to this research on choice, Apple customers might be more driven by the desire to simplify and limit the anxiety caused by too many choices, and let the experts (in this case Apple designers) make the significant choices for them (us). This leaves the customer the time and resources to make the choices only he/she can make, leaving choices of computer hardware to Apple.
For these customers, Apple will continue to have loyal customers as long as Apple continues to make good choices in the design of their products.
For these customers, Apple will continue to have loyal customers as long as Apple continues to make good choices in the design of their products.
Brand loyalty is a powerful force. It's why people buy BMWs over cheaper cars with better specifications, etc, etc. Interestingly though I think the iOS devices have done so well largely because Apple has successfully reached out to a new audience with amazing products that are more affordable. I doubt the iPad would have sold very well if it was in the same price band as Apple's laptops.
Apple's pricing of their products are for the more well-off individual, or someone willing to pay more for Apple than for the many MS hardware products.
I think for iPad no other tablet comes close in price for the level of experience.
But, I think Apple's customer base may also be different from the customer buying PCs. Apple customers are more comfortable with or prefer or desire less choice, allowing and trusting in Apple designers to make the good choices.
Agreed.
See Sheena Iyengar...
It's common sense, which most other companies lack.
Brand loyalty is a powerful force. It's why people buy BMWs over cheaper cars with better specifications, etc, etc. Interestingly though I think the iOS devices have done so well largely because Apple has successfully reached out to a new audience with amazing products that are more affordable. I doubt the iPad would have sold very well if it was in the same price band as Apple's laptops.
Brand loyalty is certainly one aspect. But at the same time Apple has delivered on brand promise. People ask me about Apple (PC and Android diehards, including girls in their 20s, believe it or not also a stronghold for Windows and Android [now the "think different" of tech]), and they think it's blind loyalty. But almost no other company has delivered on the brand ~promise~ like Apple had. That's why I stick with them, not just blind faith. I used to be a fan of Nvidia and PC gaming, but despite my desire to be loyal, Windows (Win 2000 and Win XP was alright), Microsoft, Nvidia, ATI, Steam, Valve and the PC game industry has let me down far too many times. That's why I nuked that stuff and got an Xbox360... which is delivering on its brand promise.
But, I think Apple's customer base may also be different from the customer buying PCs. Apple customers are more comfortable with or prefer or desire less choice, allowing and trusting in Apple designers to make the good choices.
This is more common in the WinPC market than many think. Most people who WinPCs aren't building their own desktops, they are buying PCs. Even among the vendor made PCs the inexpensive ones don't have the options that DiY PCs have. But then look at the notebook, you can't alter much about them and they have been dominate PC type for many years now.
I think people that buy a PC 1) are familiar with Windows, and/or 2) don't see past the sticker price to the TCO or how a different OS and quality could affect their UX positively. Win8/Metro will be interesting because in many ways Metro is an entirely new OS experience, not just a familiar evolution of the standard system so we'll see how that takes hold. My guess is that they won't have much luck with tablets because if they have to get something new for around the same price as an iPad an overwhelming majority will just take the iPad.
Somehow it's always about marketing, RDF, sheep, brand snobbery, hipsterdom, etc. Anything but products. The weird thing is, as Apple continues to sell to more and more people, this theory is obliged to expand until we are required to believe that half the plant are poser rich assholes, or something. There's a fair amount of cognitive dissonance between the hated, niche Apple of old and the hated, wildly successful mass-market Apple of now.
I wanted a Macbook Air but was way to expensive. If someone would trade of course I would! One thing is for sure I would no way use any google-crap product. That is for sure. Their products suck dog balls, I think I would rather use a Commodore 64 than a Chromebook!
"Their products suck dog balls", have you ever owned one our do you generally give your review of things with just your feelings as a reference. The Chromebook might not be for you fine but it is still the future of computing. Once bandwidth becomes faster and cheaper we will all be using dumb devices that just connect to the internet for our content.
I wanted a Macbook Air but was way to expensive. If someone would trade of course I would! One thing is for sure I would no way use any google-crap product. That is for sure. Their products suck dog balls, I think I would rather use a Commodore 64 than a Chromebook!
1
Dog balls? More like dog shit! Chromebooks suck dog shit right straight out of the dog's ass! They are made by Google!
People ask me about Apple (PC and Android diehards, including girls in their 20s)
Girls in their 20s rarely ask me about anything these days except for directions
Apple says new iPad response is "off the charts," preorders sold out
This same thing happened last time, you think they'd have ordered bigger charts.
iPad 2 sold 1 million in the first weekend, the iPhone 4S sold 4 million in the first weekend - I expect the new iPad will be somewhere in between.
1
Dog balls? More like dog shit! Chromebooks suck dog shit right straight out of the dog's ass! They are made by Google!
I must be surrounded by Harvard scholars.
This same thing happened last time, you think they'd have ordered bigger charts.
iPad 2 sold 1 million in the first weekend, the iPhone 4S sold 4 million in the first weekend - I expect the new iPad will be somewhere in between.
I'd guess 2 million. During the holiday quarter, iPad 2 was selling about 1 million per week. There was a lot of publicity about the "iPad 3" from about mid-February on, so undoubtedly iPad 2 sales tailed off and there was pent up demand.
In any case, I'm glad I got my order in on Thursday before they sold out. The wait time is up to 2-3 weeks now (it was still "shipping March 19" earlier today).
Anyhow, went up yesterday to see how she liked it "WONDERFUL!!!" and updated it to iOS 5.1, and the thing is running better than at any time I ever had it! Even Infinity Blade plays fine without crashing
What kinds of improvements have you seen with the upgrade to 5.1? I have an original iPad running 5.0.1, and while I've already upgraded the iPhones in the household to 5.1 I haven't bothered yet with the iPad since the battery improvements aren't as needed there. Though I suppose with the in-device upgrade there's really little reason not to.
All the folks who still use an iPad 1 like me, who passed on the iPad 2 are going to upgrade this year. Not to mention, all new folks will buy purchase a new iPad this year.
That would be me, I'm really looking forward to the upgrade later this year.
Apple's pricing of their products are for the more well-off individual, or someone willing to pay more for Apple than for the many MS hardware products. For the most part, then, Apple has a customer base that is not as price-driven or price sensitive as the base for PCs, and therefore more predictable.
But, I think Apple's customer base may also be different from the customer buying PCs. Apple customers are more comfortable with or prefer or desire less choice, allowing and trusting in Apple designers to make the good choices.
See Sheena Iyengar, Prof at Columbia Business School, her presentations at TED and her book The Art of Choosing. See also the works of Barry Schwartz and his book The Paradox of Choice (and TED lectures). See also Kahneman and Tversky works on choice. The former received the Nobel prize in Economics in 2002 for their work (Tversky had died prior so wasn't eligible).
I think it is so much more interesting to look that the above research on choice rather than continue the silliness of name-calling and shouts of fanboyisms and defenses thereof. It might just make the conversation a little more intelligent. According to this research on choice, Apple customers might be more driven by the desire to simplify and limit the anxiety caused by too many choices, and let the experts (in this case Apple designers) make the significant choices for them (us). This leaves the customer the time and resources to make the choices only he/she can make, leaving choices of computer hardware to Apple.
For these customers, Apple will continue to have loyal customers as long as Apple continues to make good choices in the design of their products.
The traditional customer of the PC is changing. The world of disposable $500 products for laptops, $199 for embedded devices you trash in 2 years is drying up. The profits for such a market is drying up.
The $300 billion in market cap that has been lost by the likes of HP, Dell, IBM, Asus, etc., hasn't disappeared. It's shifted to Apple.
People have always traditionally held onto Apple products longer than non-Apple products.
Enterprise markets for Consulting died before 2000. Most of the traditional talent that is making a killing off the iOS Development platform are former Enterprise Consultants with 10-15 years of ObjC/Cocoa expertise who realize they have a market of several hundred million willing consumers dying to get some good applications for the iOS Ecosystem.
Instead of just a Laptop or just an iPod they are buying a Laptop, iPhone, iPad and holding onto them for more than the typical 18 month cycle. For a few iterations of the iPhone and iPad they give them down and the upgrade to the latest. They skip a revision of the Macbook or iMac/Mac mini and then buy. The hardcore developer for Engineering, Research, and more have been buying fully loaded iMacs and several Mac mini's waiting for a Mac Pro to dump $10k into.
If the world of the embedded processor space had to wait like we do with Intel and AMD the market would not be remotely as profitable.
If Apple would shift to a BTO option of the upcoming Ivy Bridge or Piledriver from AMD and put the latest AMD Radeon 7000 series up to the 7970 available for the Mac Pro they'd see a huge jump in sales for that line.
As it stands, if the 7700 Radeon is offered inside the iMac and the 7600 Mobile inside the Mac Mini both lines will see blow out numbers.
People aren't buying less electronics. They are spending more money for products they perceive have a slower depreciation rate and a longer added value to their time value of money. They are buying Apple.
Apple's non-embedded products will continue to see solid quarter over last year same quarter jumps for years to come.
What kinds of improvements have you seen with the upgrade to 5.1? I have an original iPad running 5.0.1, and while I've already upgraded the iPhones in the household to 5.1 I haven't bothered yet with the iPad since the battery improvements aren't as needed there. Though I suppose with the in-device upgrade there's really little reason not to.
Response on my iPad 1st generation, 16GB model with 5.1 is a noticable improvement in all applications.
iBooks is solid and the loading of large volumes is improved significantly enough to make it worth noting [I'm talking 1000 page+ documents].
GLView Test results for OpenGL ES 1.1, Scene: Cube
Fog: On, Transparency: On, Format: RGBA8, Multisampling: On, Mipmap: On.
Frames per second: 43.8 fps.
Add Anisotropic Filtering: 1
Frames per second: 45.3 fps.
Safari: Loading a page like the HuffingtonPost front page where it has around 700kb of Javascript pre-loaded, and smart prefetching where images don't fully load before you can scroll takes all of 7 seconds on the iPad revision 1.
Running under Firefox 10 takes more time on my Linux workstation which has a lot more raw power.
Safari and the latest WebKit for mobile is well tuned. The Javascript performance increases are very noticable.
Out of 176 applications installed I have only seen a couple dozen updates after the release of iOS 5.1. I expect to be buried with updates in the next couple of weeks.
If there is any more doubt that the Murdoch empire is just rubbish, well, it would be wiped out by now.
What kinds of improvements have you seen with the upgrade to 5.1? I have an original iPad running 5.0.1, and while I've already upgraded the iPhones in the household to 5.1 I haven't bothered yet with the iPad since the battery improvements aren't as needed there. Though I suppose with the in-device upgrade there's really little reason not to.
the least i can say is iPad 1 is running smoother on 5.1.
Ok answer this question please..
If it's not a toy why do they show small children using it in Apple's TV advertising for the iPad?
You can even buy it at Toys R Us.
The fallacies of your arguments are that small children only use toys and that ToysRUs only sell Toys.
By your reasoning books, cups, paints and paper must be toys as small children use them.
By your reasoning nappy wipes and musical instruments are toys as ToysRUs sell those too.