UN looks to slow wireless tech patent war with 'Patent Roundtable'

Posted:
in General Discussion edited January 2014
The United Nation's International Telecommunications Union arm is calling smartphone makers and mobile industry bodies together to discuss ways to halt snowballing patent litigation and expects to focus on standards-essential FRAND patents which many believe to be at the center of the disputes.

The ITU said attendees of its "Patent Roundtable" need to address "innovation-stifling use of intellectual property" that has resulted in the sales bans of a number of devices like the Samsung Galaxy Tab, reports the BBC. The meeting is scheduled to take place in Geneva on October 10.

At the heart of the summit are so-called FRAND patents, or standards-essential innovations like 3G wireless technology that are promised to be licensed in fair, reasonable and non-discriminatory manner. Apple and Microsoft recently joined forces in an EU antitrust filing against Motorola's alleged unfair use of its standards-essential properties including an H.264 video streaming codec.

"We are seeing an unwelcome trend in today's marketplace to use standards-essential patents to block markets," said ITU Secretary General Dr. Hamadoun Tour?. "There needs to be an urgent review of this situation: patents are meant to encourage innovation, not stifle it."

Dr. Hamadoun Tour?
ITU Secretary General Dr. Hamadoun Tour?.
Source: ITU


Confusing the situation is FRAND interpretation and the ITU said the companies leveraging the essential patents often disagree with licensees over what royalties are fair and reasonable which reportedly prompted a number of lawsuits and injunctions.

"The situation is complex and it's very easy for someone to complain something is not fair because it is adverse to their position," said Illya Kazi, a member of the UK's Chartered Institute of Patent Attorneys. "I don't think there's a simple answer. High-level talks can't be a bad thing, but I would be surprised if they can come up with an agreed implementable conclusion."

Motorola was able to institute a temporary sales ban on Apple's iPhone and iPad after the Cupertino-based company refused to pay royalties for certain GPRS technology used in the devices' Qualcomm GSM chip. For its part Apple argued that it was a beneficiary by extension of the Qualcomm license but the claim was found as tenuous. The now Google-owned Motorola was also able to shut down Apple's iCloud push services after successfully leveraging a packet transfer patent.

FRAND patent litigation has become such a problem that EU antitrust watchdog the European Commission is investigating Motorola and Samsung over its conduct regarding use of the standards-essential properties against competitors.

A statement from the ITU said that the high-level talks will "include potential improvements to existing policy frameworks, entitlement to injunctive reliefs, and definitions of what constitutes a royalty base."
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Comments

  • Reply 1 of 49
    eye forgeteye forget Posts: 154member


    Oh wonderful. Here's a group of people who get even less done than those hard working civil servants we have in Washington. Not to mention the simple fact they have zero jurisdiction.  

  • Reply 2 of 49
    hill60hill60 Posts: 6,989member
    Google and their FRAND abusing cronies need to be brought to heel.

    Their hypocritical stance regarding standards essential patents has to stop.

    Steve Jobs was quite clear, stop copying, innovate your own stuff and there is no need for legal action.

    A lot of these actions started a year or more ago, various legal systems are so slow the "escalation" is only coming to light now.
  • Reply 3 of 49
    SpamSandwichSpamSandwich Posts: 30,837member


    The UN has no jurisdiction over these issues whatsoever. Last time I checked, the US is a sovereign nation. Who the hell do they think they are?

  • Reply 4 of 49
    SpamSandwichSpamSandwich Posts: 30,837member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by hill60 View Post



    Google and their FRAND abusing cronies need to be brought to heel.

    Their hypocritical stance regarding standards essential patents has to stop.

    Steve Jobs was quite clear, stop copying, innovate your own stuff and there is no need for legal action.

    A lot of these actions started a year or more ago, various legal systems are so slow the "escalation" is only coming to light now.


     


    This will all be settled in the courts. It's none of the UN's business.... at all!


     


    The US needs to stop funding the UN. What a bloody joke.

  • Reply 5 of 49
    apple ][apple ][ Posts: 8,428member


    The UN is disgusting and the US should definitely withdraw from that joke of an organization. How those corrupt and filthy totalitarian bastards are allowed to have their headquarters in this country is mind blogging. The UN has been trying to take control of the internet for a while now, and they are a threat to freedom, a threat to the US and they are an enemy entity as far as I am concerned.


     


     


    Get the UN’s hands off the Internet 


    http://www.nydailynews.com/opinion/hands-internet-article-1.1108624

  • Reply 6 of 49
    superdxsuperdx Posts: 67member


    A huge percentage (> 70%) of the articles on AI's front page involves some kind of legal dispute or issue. It's very depressing. I've slowed my visits to AI because instead of Apple new about upcoming hardware, reviews of apps or software, we're treated to this legal shit.


     


    I'm an Apple fan about it's products, period. 

  • Reply 7 of 49
    tallest skiltallest skil Posts: 43,399member
    superdx wrote: »
    A huge percentage (> 70%) of the articles on AI's front page involves some kind of legal dispute or issue.

    A huge percentage of Apple's fight right now is against thieves.
    It's very depressing.

    How many thieves there are.
    I've slowed my visits to AI because instead of Apple new about upcoming hardware, reviews of apps or software, we're treated to this legal shit. I'm an Apple fan about it's products, period. 

    Are you claiming they don't post news about upcoming hardware in lieu of legal stuff? Everything's posted as it comes in. If you're not seeing it, they're not getting it.
  • Reply 8 of 49
    quinneyquinney Posts: 2,524member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post


    .... Last time I checked, the US is a sovereign nation. ...



    This part is not completely true.


    The US and other signatories to the WTO/GATT voluntarily gave up some of their sovereignty so that unelected, unaccountable persons could adjudicate trade disputes.


    This troubles me more than any ineffectual UN grandstanding.

  • Reply 9 of 49
    sensisensi Posts: 346member


    Good News. Hopefully US judges like Posner could also push for a cleanup of the US mess over patents.


     


    ;Apple ][


     


    You are such a joke and a caricature of the angry, ignorant, reactionary, far-right conditioned nutjob on nearly every topic that it is well beyond the pale. Go back enlightening you with your tabloids gutter-level drivels, lol.

  • Reply 10 of 49
    apple ][apple ][ Posts: 8,428member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Sensi View Post


    ;Apple ][


     


    You are such a joke and a caricature of the ignorant, reactionary, far-right conditioned nutjob on nearly every topic that it is well beyond the pale. Go back enlightening you with your tabloids gutter-level drivels, lol.



     


    Dumb and ignorant ad-hominem attacks will get you nowhere. If you disagree with anything that I write or claim, then feel free to argue it, if you have any counter arguments at all to make.

  • Reply 11 of 49
    shaun, ukshaun, uk Posts: 1,050member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Sensi View Post


    Good News. Hopefully US judges like Posner could also push for a cleanup of the US mess over patents.


     


    ;Apple ][


     


    You are such a joke and a caricature of the angry, ignorant, reactionary, far-right conditioned nutjob on nearly every topic that it is well beyond the pale. Go back enlightening you with your tabloids gutter-level drivels, lol.



     


    I wouldn't waste your energy. He posts these ridiculous comments in every thread. Just ignore him like the rest of us do.

  • Reply 12 of 49
    aaarrrggghaaarrrgggh Posts: 1,572member
    "Apple wrote:
    [" url="/t/151141/un-looks-to-slow-wireless-tech-patent-war-with-patent-roundtable#post_2141918"]
    sensi wrote: »
    @ <a href="http://forums.appleinsider.com/u/90578/apple" id="user_poster_2141668" style="vertical-align:middle;font-family:'lucida grande', verdana, helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:18px;line-height:22px;background-color:rgb(198,204,208);" name="user_poster_2141668">Apple ][</a>


    You are such a joke and a caricature of the ignorant, reactionary, far-right conditioned nutjob on nearly every topic that it is well beyond the pale. Go back enlightening you with your tabloids gutter-level drivels, lol.

    Dumb and ignorant ad-hominem attacks will get you nowhere. If you disagree with anything that I write or claim, then feel free to argue it, if you have any counter arguments at all to make.

    I would argue that the majority of folks here question your sense of reality that much more given using NY Daily News as a source.

    The issues here cross national boundaries. We have already seen the mess that is created by spreading all the lawsuits across jurisdictions. Specifically for FRAND, where standards have global implications, it makes sense to have an independent body preside.

    Would you rather have the IEEE be responsible for it?! How about MPEG-LA?
  • Reply 13 of 49
    shaun, ukshaun, uk Posts: 1,050member


    Whatever the rights and wrongs of each case, clearly the current patent system is broken. The only people winning are the lawyers.


     


    I wish the ITU well but I don't see any mood for compromise just yet. I would have thought WIPO should be the one taking more of a lead on this issue.

  • Reply 14 of 49
    SpamSandwichSpamSandwich Posts: 30,837member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by quinney View Post


    This part is not completely true.


    The US and other signatories to the WTO/GATT voluntarily gave up some of their sovereignty so that unelected, unaccountable persons could adjudicate trade disputes.


    This troubles me more than any ineffectual UN grandstanding.



     


    WTF?!?


     


    What has the UN got to do with the WTO? Am I the one who's been taking crazy pills here?

  • Reply 15 of 49
    SpamSandwichSpamSandwich Posts: 30,837member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Shaun, UK View Post


     


    I wouldn't waste your energy. He posts these ridiculous comments in every thread. Just ignore him like the rest of us do.



     


    He just got blocked by me... ah... sweet relief.

  • Reply 16 of 49
    apple ][apple ][ Posts: 8,428member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Shaun, UK View Post


     


    I wouldn't waste your energy. He posts these ridiculous comments in every thread. Just ignore him like the rest of us do.



    I get that a few people don't like me here. I'm ok with that, because I'm outspoken and I tell it like I see it, and that may offend a few Fandroids and various peasants, but there's no reason for you to lie. 


     


    As a matter of fact, I have the #1 top rated post for the past seven days. Your little lie doesn't jive too well with reality.


     


    And I still wish for a reverse-ignore switch on this forum, because there are certain posters whom I would block from ever reading my posts.

  • Reply 17 of 49
    SpamSandwichSpamSandwich Posts: 30,837member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by aaarrrgggh View Post





    I would argue that the majority of folks here question your sense of reality that much more given using NY Daily News as a source.

    The issues here cross national boundaries. We have already seen the mess that is created by spreading all the lawsuits across jurisdictions. Specifically for FRAND, where standards have global implications, it makes sense to have an independent body preside.

    Would you rather have the IEEE be responsible for it?! How about MPEG-LA?


     


    The UN? Where in their charter does it say they are responsible for negotiating patent disputes? That's outrageous! It's a matter for the WTO and/or the companies involved to solve in court. What the hell is wrong with this picture?

  • Reply 18 of 49
    apple ][apple ][ Posts: 8,428member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post


     


    He just got blocked by me... ah... sweet relief.



     


    The person who gave your post a thumbs up in this thread was me. I certainly regret that now, and I wish that I could take that back.

  • Reply 19 of 49
    SpamSandwichSpamSandwich Posts: 30,837member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Shaun, UK View Post


    Whatever the rights and wrongs of each case, clearly the current patent system is broken. The only people winning are the lawyers.


     


    I wish the ITU well but I don't see any mood for compromise just yet. I would have thought WIPO should be the one taking more of a lead on this issue.



     


    The system is working! Conflicts get sorted out in court, not by politicians. This is strictly a business matter, FFS.


     


    The lawyers are the only ones winning? Where does this nonsense come from?


     


    Next thing you know, the world court will be running America. Screw that!

  • Reply 20 of 49
    chris_cachris_ca Posts: 2,543member
    "Apple wrote:
    [" url="/t/151141/un-looks-to-slow-wireless-tech-patent-war-with-patent-roundtable#post_2141918"]
    Dumb and ignorant ad-hominem attacks will get you nowhere. If you disagree with anything that I write or claim, then feel free to argue it, if you have any counter arguments at all to make.
    That's not the way to do it.
    Why try to discuss something rationally with a well thought-out case when you can simply do a drive by?
    Kinda like PETA and GreenPeace. ;-)
    (I gave a thumps up for your response)
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