The article and related charts are US only sales, and in the case of Samsung numbers, only particular phones accused by Apple of infringement. It's not all of Samsung's US smartphone sales.
What Samsung sold outside the US isn't applicable to this case.
A couple of days ago there was a report (IDC?) that claimed Android with nearly 70% of the EU smartphone market with Apple around 17%. Guess which Android licensee is #1? Even in China where Samsung isn't nearly the market presence as in other areas, they still lead Apple 3:1 in smartphone sales according to market research from back in March. The US is really the only large market where Apple has such a large percentage of smartphone sales. Of course most of the profit is probably coming from the US too.
As Soli said, projecting worldwide sales based on just US figures isn't even remotely reliable. The rest of the world isn't sharing the same metrics.
BTW, I think the reason only US sales are being shown is because those are the only ones that apply to this case with regard to possible damages. What Samsung does in the rest of the world isn't part of this suit and thus doesn't matter.
Both Gartner and IDC claimed Samsung had 70% more smartphone sales compared to Apple in the US for the first 2Q this year. Google data can point he way foe Nexus sales. The G III was not out.
The question is how these firms will be trying to figure out how they have been so far off the past 2 years and how they over-estimated Samsung sales by 300 to 400 %
The article and related charts are US only sales, and in the case of Samsung numbers, only particular phones accused by Apple of infringement. It's not all of Samsung's US smartphone sales.
What Samsung sold outside the US isn't applicable to this case.
It does represent the vast majority and their most popular models. Expect Samsung's #1 smartphone spot offered by IDC and Gartner in the US to drop to 3 or 4.
It does represent the vast majority and their most popular models. Expect Samsung's #1 smartphone spot offered by IDC and Gartner in the US to drop to 3 or 4.
And expect Samsung stock to get hammered tomorrow.
Both Gartner and IDC claimed Samsung had 70% more smartphone sales compared to Apple in the US for the first 2Q this year. Google data can point he way foe Nexus sales. The G III was not out.
The question is how these firms will be trying to figure out how they have been so far off the past 2 years and how they over-estimated Samsung sales by 300 to 400 %
I don't know if it's as high as 3x - 4x, but in broad terms, you're spot on.
I have no doubt that clients of Gartner and IDC will want to know too.
fascinating! lots of material for real "analysis" about Samsung at last here.
just looking at tablets, since there are only three models of all kind which makes it easy, three things jump out:
- of the original 7" Galaxy tab that was so hyped as the first Android tab in late 2010, we already knew 2.2 million were shipped world-wide at least. so 725K were actually sold in the US. the average wholesale price at launch was $588. whereas the last 60K sold so far this year average a heavily discounted $383. for all three years, the average price was $448. and what about the other 1.5M in the rest of the world?
- US sales of all Samsung tablets have COLLAPSED this year. in 2011, all three models sold a total of 983K units (including 404K of that original Galaxy) at an average wholesale price of $426. but so far this year, they are selling at an annual rate (2X actual 6 months) of only 386K units, a 61% drop! and at an average price of $368, 14% less.
- all 10" tablet sales came to a screeching halt in the second quarter. due to the lawsuits?
these are SAVAGE US numbers for 2012.
what's happening to Samsung? 4Q 2011 tablet sales were still ok, so it wasn't the Kindle Fire. the Google/Moto Nexus just started last month. the Transformer? oh yeah, there was iPad 3 with 4G ... maybe that had an impact ...
i'm sure Samsung does much better in the rest of the world. and they can always dump heavily discounted leftover inventory in the developing world.
Notice, the charts that Apple presented are much nicer to look at and easier to read than Samsung's. Kind of shows you how deep Apple's design ethos goes.
Edit: On second thought I'm wondering if these are the actual charts that were submitted into evidence. Considering they have the same color scheme, I'm thinking they likely were copied from the records and reformatted. Unless Samsung copied that too.
I think these numbers probably explain the 2.5 billion that Apple is asking for in this suit. 2.5 billion would probably be the likely profit that Samaung made on the sales of the infringing devices in the US.
Is this a case where the damages may be trebled if Apple wins? Maybe, if Apple wins, they can do a worldwide deal with Samsung on the patents/trademarks associated with this case and a lot of these lawsuits can be put to rest.
according to NPD, in Q2 2012, Samsung sold 24% of US smartphones, while Apple sold 31%. so Apple sold 1.3X as many iPhones as all Samsung phones combined (all Android i believe).
we now know Apple actually sold 8.3M iPhones in the US in Q2 2012, while Samsung sold only 2M in the list given to the court. are there any newer Samsung models missing from this total?
if not, Apple actually sold 4.2X as many smartphones in the US as Samsung. to make the NPD report true, Samsung would have had to sold 6.4M units here. is the court list missing 4.4M newer models?
i don't think so. i think the NPD numbers have been revealed to be total utter crap instead.
oh, and for Q1, the NPD Apple/Samsung US sales ratio reported be NPD was 1.2. but actually we now know it was also 4.2 (unless there were 6.3M newer Samsung models not counted in the court docs).
do you suppose NPD will issue a retraction now?
this whole "analyst" industry - NPD, IDC, Gartner and the rest - are a fraud. they get paid to pull numbers out of their butts.
And expect Samsung stock to get hammered tomorrow.
Why?
They are a very large vertically integrated conglomerate. This storm in a teacup involves a single market for only one line of products that they manufacture. Every sale by Apple is a partial sale by Samsung, due to their parts comprising a percentage of most of the devices Apple makes. Their overall financial results have been very good and I don't think investors would be put off by this information as it does not seem to have adversely affected their profits. AFAIK the stock in Samsung Electronics is traded on the London Stock Exchange.
It really does seem very hard for a lot of US based posters on here to think globally.
The joint trial exhibit, first discovered by All Things D, shows Samsung sold 21.25 million smartphones between June 2010 and June 2012, generating revenue of about $7.5 billion.
Samsung can definitely afford the $2.5 billion patent infringement damage award they will soon owe Apple.
No problem.
And they'll still have a few billion in revenue left over from their iPhone and iPad clone sales. Which they will be able to use
to develop distinctive, innovative designs that don't look and work exactly like Apple designs. Isn't that what all those bitter
Android Apologists are yapping about? "Choice!" "Innovation!"
Then again, look what happened to Microsoft and Nokia. Square corners. Blue plastic. Ugly flat rectangular icons
with truncated text. Samsung can learn from Nokia and Microsoft's mistakes. Somebody has to. Might as well be Samsung.
Both Gartner and IDC claimed Samsung had 70% more smartphone sales compared to Apple in the US for the first 2Q this year. Google data can point he way foe Nexus sales. The G III was not out.
The question is how these firms will be trying to figure out how they have been so far off the past 2 years and how they over-estimated Samsung sales by 300 to 400 %
So basically the Samsung US numbers we've been fed all along are bullsh*t. Got it. Suprise, surprise. Sure, there's lots of Samsung smartphones out there but for every one you see there's an iPhone as well. So Samsung has mainly eaten up the other Android phones for the most part.
As for tablets, there are still those numbers of iPad only being 70% or something which I think is total fantasy.
The US is really the only large market where Apple has such a large percentage of smartphone sales. Of course most of the profit is probably coming from the US too.
Apple has announced non-US sales making up around 65% of total sales, for several years now.
In reality most of Apple's profit is coming from outside the US.
Comments
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harbinger
These are all US numbers? Are u sure?
The article and related charts are US only sales, and in the case of Samsung numbers, only particular phones accused by Apple of infringement. It's not all of Samsung's US smartphone sales.
What Samsung sold outside the US isn't applicable to this case.
Both Gartner and IDC claimed Samsung had 70% more smartphone sales compared to Apple in the US for the first 2Q this year. Google data can point he way foe Nexus sales. The G III was not out.
The question is how these firms will be trying to figure out how they have been so far off the past 2 years and how they over-estimated Samsung sales by 300 to 400 %
It does represent the vast majority and their most popular models. Expect Samsung's #1 smartphone spot offered by IDC and Gartner in the US to drop to 3 or 4.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven N.
It does represent the vast majority and their most popular models. Expect Samsung's #1 smartphone spot offered by IDC and Gartner in the US to drop to 3 or 4.
And expect Samsung stock to get hammered tomorrow.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven N.
Both Gartner and IDC claimed Samsung had 70% more smartphone sales compared to Apple in the US for the first 2Q this year. Google data can point he way foe Nexus sales. The G III was not out.
The question is how these firms will be trying to figure out how they have been so far off the past 2 years and how they over-estimated Samsung sales by 300 to 400 %
I don't know if it's as high as 3x - 4x, but in broad terms, you're spot on.
I have no doubt that clients of Gartner and IDC will want to know too.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven N.
Both Gartner and IDC claimed Samsung had 70% more smartphone sales compared to Apple in the US for the first 2Q this year.
Based on what source? I think you are confusing with the global market.
So all of that shameless copying and thats all they sold? What about all those shipped units they have been bragging about?
Maybe they should actually start putting Apple's logo on their boxes and name their next gen mobile the galaxy eyephone.
fascinating! lots of material for real "analysis" about Samsung at last here.
just looking at tablets, since there are only three models of all kind which makes it easy, three things jump out:
- of the original 7" Galaxy tab that was so hyped as the first Android tab in late 2010, we already knew 2.2 million were shipped world-wide at least. so 725K were actually sold in the US. the average wholesale price at launch was $588. whereas the last 60K sold so far this year average a heavily discounted $383. for all three years, the average price was $448. and what about the other 1.5M in the rest of the world?
- US sales of all Samsung tablets have COLLAPSED this year. in 2011, all three models sold a total of 983K units (including 404K of that original Galaxy) at an average wholesale price of $426. but so far this year, they are selling at an annual rate (2X actual 6 months) of only 386K units, a 61% drop! and at an average price of $368, 14% less.
- all 10" tablet sales came to a screeching halt in the second quarter. due to the lawsuits?
these are SAVAGE US numbers for 2012.
what's happening to Samsung? 4Q 2011 tablet sales were still ok, so it wasn't the Kindle Fire. the Google/Moto Nexus just started last month. the Transformer? oh yeah, there was iPad 3 with 4G ... maybe that had an impact ...
i'm sure Samsung does much better in the rest of the world. and they can always dump heavily discounted leftover inventory in the developing world.
And I wonder how many Samsung smartphones are actually running Ice Cream Sandwich, vs Gingerbread. Samsung is PA-THE-TIC.
Samsung did sell some WIndows smartphones too. They're just hedging their bets.
Notice, the charts that Apple presented are much nicer to look at and easier to read than Samsung's. Kind of shows you how deep Apple's design ethos goes.
Edit: On second thought I'm wondering if these are the actual charts that were submitted into evidence. Considering they have the same color scheme, I'm thinking they likely were copied from the records and reformatted. Unless Samsung copied that too.
Is this a case where the damages may be trebled if Apple wins? Maybe, if Apple wins, they can do a worldwide deal with Samsung on the patents/trademarks associated with this case and a lot of these lawsuits can be put to rest.
ok, some more fun with numbers.
according to NPD, in Q2 2012, Samsung sold 24% of US smartphones, while Apple sold 31%. so Apple sold 1.3X as many iPhones as all Samsung phones combined (all Android i believe).
https://www.npd.com/wps/portal/npd/us/news/pressreleases/pr_120808
we now know Apple actually sold 8.3M iPhones in the US in Q2 2012, while Samsung sold only 2M in the list given to the court. are there any newer Samsung models missing from this total?
if not, Apple actually sold 4.2X as many smartphones in the US as Samsung. to make the NPD report true, Samsung would have had to sold 6.4M units here. is the court list missing 4.4M newer models?
i don't think so. i think the NPD numbers have been revealed to be total utter crap instead.
oh, and for Q1, the NPD Apple/Samsung US sales ratio reported be NPD was 1.2. but actually we now know it was also 4.2 (unless there were 6.3M newer Samsung models not counted in the court docs).
do you suppose NPD will issue a retraction now?
this whole "analyst" industry - NPD, IDC, Gartner and the rest - are a fraud. they get paid to pull numbers out of their butts.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Galbi
These are Samsung's Android phones. It's not including Windows phones and others.
Considering the Win Phone (and others) market share, that's not going to add a lot to the numbers here…...
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich
And expect Samsung stock to get hammered tomorrow.
Why?
They are a very large vertically integrated conglomerate. This storm in a teacup involves a single market for only one line of products that they manufacture. Every sale by Apple is a partial sale by Samsung, due to their parts comprising a percentage of most of the devices Apple makes. Their overall financial results have been very good and I don't think investors would be put off by this information as it does not seem to have adversely affected their profits. AFAIK the stock in Samsung Electronics is traded on the London Stock Exchange.
It really does seem very hard for a lot of US based posters on here to think globally.
Well with the Prevail, with 2.25 million being one of their top sellers, it's no wonder the average selling price is $350.
Let's take a closer look at the all important specs.
Screen 3.2" 320x480 pixels, no AMOLED here folks.
117MB onboard memory (most of it probably full of undeletable network based crapware).
800MHz Qualcomm processor, no sign of a GPU.
Shipped with Android 2.2 Froyo, wonder if it ever got Gingerbread, let alone Ice Cream Sandwich or Jellybean.
2 Megapixel camera with QVGA video, freaking awesome, welcome to 2007 iPhone territory.
What a powerhouse, this represents Samsung, this represents Android, no wonder it's so fragmented.
Rejoice fandroids, welcome to reality.
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider
The joint trial exhibit, first discovered by All Things D, shows Samsung sold 21.25 million smartphones between June 2010 and June 2012, generating revenue of about $7.5 billion.
Samsung can definitely afford the $2.5 billion patent infringement damage award they will soon owe Apple.
No problem.
And they'll still have a few billion in revenue left over from their iPhone and iPad clone sales. Which they will be able to use
to develop distinctive, innovative designs that don't look and work exactly like Apple designs. Isn't that what all those bitter
Android Apologists are yapping about? "Choice!" "Innovation!"
Then again, look what happened to Microsoft and Nokia. Square corners. Blue plastic. Ugly flat rectangular icons
with truncated text. Samsung can learn from Nokia and Microsoft's mistakes. Somebody has to. Might as well be Samsung.
Get well soon. Apple saved my life.
So basically the Samsung US numbers we've been fed all along are bullsh*t. Got it. Suprise, surprise. Sure, there's lots of Samsung smartphones out there but for every one you see there's an iPhone as well. So Samsung has mainly eaten up the other Android phones for the most part.
As for tablets, there are still those numbers of iPad only being 70% or something which I think is total fantasy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy
The US is really the only large market where Apple has such a large percentage of smartphone sales. Of course most of the profit is probably coming from the US too.
Apple has announced non-US sales making up around 65% of total sales, for several years now.
In reality most of Apple's profit is coming from outside the US.