An iPad mini starting out with a measley 8gb and an old, non-Retina screen all in the name of cost saving? Never would've happened under Steve. This is the beginning of our trip to Scullyville with Tim Cook as the bus driver.
How about you wait until an actual product is announced before you diss it and the CEO etc
What about them? You're not going to read a textbook on a small screen, no matter what the Rez.
Oh, so you don't think the iPad mini is appropriate for schools? That's one of the big things its proponents are pushing: its "suitability" for the classroom.
I don't disagree with you at all; I'm just saying.
Originally Posted by charlituna
How about you wait until an actual product is announced before you diss it and the CEO etc
It's always interesting trying to interpret what Apple is saying in these invites. "A little more" could simply mean more iPads, but little ones.
On the other hand, it could mean a new iPad, and a little more, as in a few more products.
It could mean a slimmer iMac and Mac mini. Or iTunes. Or who knows.
My own feeling is that the target audience isn't the "I want a smaller iPad" but the "I-want-a-bigger-iPod Touch-that isn't-an-iPad".
I always turn-up on time for my medical appointments but find that the surgery/clinic/hospital is always running 20-30 minutes late. My iPhone just isn't the best device for reading, and I don't want to be toting the iPad around, so iPad-mini would be ideal for me.
Or, at least it could be! I wonder if Apple has the brassies and the manufacturing capacity to redefine the entire tablet marketplace... for the next 2-3 years...
Remember the runup to the original iPad announcement... lo, those many years ago before January 27, 2010?
Return with me now, to those thrilling days of yesteryear....
Much of the speculation was comparing the rumored "Apple Tablet" to the Windows offerings and the reworked Mac laptops...
The consensus was, that for Apple to be competitive in the tablet market -- its offering would need to be priced under $1,100 -- bolder wags were looking for a price of $1,000!
Steve Jobs... And the price is $499. Boom!
This.
(And... one more thing;-) along with these words too: "Available.... Today."
With the announcement of Surface RT pricing, I'm expecting the same on the 23rd. The low price announcement, as Apple kneecaps the competition with their ability to profit through supply chain wizardry and component reuse. It killed the Zune HD, and stuffed the Android Tablet market back 2 years. Time for another swing of the pricing axe (yes, that legal monopoly, iOS and the apple ecosystem... as long as Apple is non exclusive on Apps and Media arrangements, then Everyone can build their own tablet/pad/phone/mediastore/appstore/OTA sync to compete).
This would be less about wowing the followers, but striking fear in the heart of competitors. Entering the Holiday season, effectively driving every other competitor's profit estimation down, while driving a fabric of prices on iOS devices from .99 to 699, and then a MacBook Air pinching the top end of any Surface RT line (why buy a half baked Windows device, when you can get a full Intel laptop that weighs practically nothing more that can emulate windows completely for a couple hundred more?).
SJ was often overruled on pricing. Read some of the historical data and you will see that he wasn't personally happy with the original price on the Mac. Steve very much wanted to change the world with electronics and you can't do that is stuff is so expensive that it is priced out of people's reach. The problem for any company, especially a startup, is being able to price your product with enough margin to drive growth. It is very much a balancing act.
As to iPads profit margin, I don't think Apple is hurting here. They seemed to have found the optimal price point that makes it very difficult for the competition to get a toe hold. At the same time they are getting significant profits to drive iOS development and new products.
In a nut shell those people that believe that Steve wanted to sell products with artificially high prices really don't know Apples history well. Apple has always focused on profitable selling points which frankly has allowed them to survive while hundreds of other companies have failed.
That's ridiculous! If what we've been reading is true, and this event is going to be pushing the book reading aspect, to compete with the Kindles and Nooks more directly, a cheaper 8GB version is just what is needed. Same thing with the screen. Get real! Apple can't introduce a retina model at small screen pricing right now. In fact, it could be a problem, as apps designed for the 10" retina screen would have type and elements too small for this screen. This limits that. Next year, they could squeeze it in, once screen prices drop, and developers are ready for it.
SJ himself said, at the introduction that they were pricing the iPad to sell as many as possible, at a lower profit margin. So this is exactly what SJ would have done, and as he has been said to have approved of it, no doubt this is what he thought would work.
Maybe Apple should refresh the entire product line once every year at the same time - and have a several day event - iOS devices one day - Consumer Devices the next - and Prosumer/Education the next. It would simplify things tremendously. Maybe add a fourth day focused on Software. heck why not make it a week long and invite industry partners to showcase their wares as well. They could hold it near to Cupertino maybe in San Fran Cisco and I dunno call it AppleWorld (I was going to write MacWorld - but I think that is already taken and since the Mac is now only one component of a larger picture it doesn't quite work).
Maybe the tagline for this event should have been along the lines of We have a little something to show you. But perhaps the "more" is a hint at multiple devices across the product line that are in some way more compact than premium offerings.
Ooh - what if they are releasing a "Surface" device that runs Windows 8 natively... but then that wouldn't be little in most respects I suppose. But man would that be fun - an Apple device that can run MacOS/iOS and Windows 8 - and leave MS wondering why they can't make up for the loss on each tablet with volume of sales.
An iPad mini starting out with a measley 8gb and an old, non-Retina screen all in the name of cost saving? Never would've happened under Steve. This is the beginning of our trip to Scullyville with Tim Cook as the bus driver.
The 8gb iPad mini is truly great for those just want to consume and not create or store media in the iPad.
At that size it doesn't need retina display unless you need to look at the fine pubic hairs.
Just the gift for family members who love to surf the net, answers mails and each videos.
One thing that gets overlooked in the "entry level" WiFi 8GB model of the iPad Mini... Apple is working on a new iTunes... with a release date in October...
What if this iTunes acts similar to a home server for iPad content?
What if you could quickly download (crossload, actually) and/or stream games, books, music, videos, etc. from the iTunes Home Server.
The "entry level" iPad Mini, suddenly becomes an agile and very capable device -- well beyond its SSD storage limitation...
Who, but Apple can offer a solution like that for $199?
Edit: Our household of 5 has 2 adults and 3 teenagers -- each has his own iPad. We group read a chapter or two, 2-3 times a week. It would be trivial to take an extra few seconds and download "tonight's reading" to each iPad. Same thing when the kids want to play a game, watch a movie, whatever... the "storage" for these iPads could be the iTunes "local" cloud.
Same thing with the screen. Get real! Apple can't introduce a retina model at small screen pricing right now.
They could. Someone pointed out that if they don't use the new in-cell touch panels there aren't any supply constraints and it's rather old tech so yields are high and prices lower. It's been around since the iphone 4.
Quote:
In fact, it could be a problem, as apps designed for the 10" retina screen would have type and elements too small for this screen. This limits that. Next year, they could squeeze it in, once screen prices drop, and developers are ready for it.
No, it doesn't. If UI elements are too small for the retina mini then they would be too small for the non-retina mini as well. iPad apps are designed against 1024x768 POINTS and not 1024x768 pixels or 2048x1536 pixels. Type will be smaller but not horribly so...72% of the original size. Us older folks will prefer the 10" iPads but no one else will have much of an issue.
When has a little thing like "lack of solid facts" stopped these forums? We'll just make up our own numbers.
Well, sure. I just hate for someone really looking at those numbers, thinking they're real, and making plans based upon them to be disappointed, or frustrated, if the pricing is higher. We can see people coming here looking for real answers, and thinking they are here, when they likely aren't.
One thing that gets overlooked in the "entry level" WiFi 8GB model of the iPad Mini... Apple is working on a new iTunes... with a release date in October...
What if this iTunes acts similar to a home server for iPad content?
What if you could quickly download (crossload, actually) and/or stream games, books, music, videos, etc. from the iTunes Home Server.
The "entry level" iPad Mini, suddenly becomes an agile and very capable device -- well beyond its SSD storage limitation...
Who, but Apple can offer a solution like that for $199?
Well, for content you can already get a Wi-Drive.
For apps, it's a bit of an annoyance but you can pull down apps via the net.
Regarding iTunes...I don't want iTunes as a home server. I want an appliance as a home server. An aTV/Time Capsule hybrid becoming the home server would be fine to me.
Something that I can dump a lot of photos and movies on and manipulate with the 10" iPad using the CPU and GPU of both iPad and server when running iPhoto and iMovie.
Or, at least it could be! I wonder if Apple has the brassies and the manufacturing capacity to redefine the entire tablet marketplace... for the next 2-3 years...
Remember the runup to the original iPad announcement... lo, those many years ago before January 27, 2010?
Return with me now, to those thrilling days of yesteryear....
Much of the speculation was comparing the rumored "Apple Tablet" to the Windows offerings and the reworked Mac laptops...
The consensus was, that for Apple to be competitive in the tablet market -- its offering would need to be priced under $1,100 -- bolder wags were looking for a price of $1,000!
Steve Jobs... And the price is $499. Boom!
This.
(And... one more thing;-) along with these words too: "Available.... Today."
With the announcement of Surface RT pricing, I'm expecting the same on the 23rd. The low price announcement, as Apple kneecaps the competition with their ability to profit through supply chain wizardry and component reuse. It killed the Zune HD, and stuffed the Android Tablet market back 2 years. Time for another swing of the pricing axe (yes, that legal monopoly, iOS and the apple ecosystem... as long as Apple is non exclusive on Apps and Media arrangements, then Everyone can build their own tablet/pad/phone/mediastore/appstore/OTA sync to compete).
This would be less about wowing the followers, but striking fear in the heart of competitors. Entering the Holiday season, effectively driving every other competitor's profit estimation down, while driving a fabric of prices on iOS devices from .99 to 699, and then a MacBook Air pinching the top end of any Surface RT line (why buy a half baked Windows device, when you can get a full Intel laptop that weighs practically nothing more that can emulate windows completely for a couple hundred more?).
Oh, so you don't think the iPad mini is appropriate for schools? That's one of the big things its proponents are pushing: its "suitability" for the classroom.
It really depends upon the classroom doesn't it? However I'm still convinced that a 7" iPad will be a huge hit with business. Effectively it becomes an electronic replacement for a Daytimer
Beyond that everybody ignores the significant market out there for E-Book readers. A very large number of people buy Amazon devices for nothing more that a device to read books on. I actually think Apple will have to work hard to capture this market. A key selling point would likely be the devices flexibility.
I don't disagree with you at all; I'm just saying.
Well, certainly the CEO, at least. ????
It will be very interesting to see how all of this plays out over the next few months. Personally I can't imagine Apple being successful with some of the configurations suggested in these forums. I'm seeing Apple pulling out the technology stops to make sure competing devices just look poor next to this device. Mini is where I expect that Sharps new screens are going for example, retina or not I'm expecting a big step forward.
Oh, so you don't think the iPad mini is appropriate for schools? That's one of the big things its proponents are pushing: its "suitability" for the classroom.
I don't disagree with you at all; I'm just saying.
Well, certainly the CEO, at least. ????
Schools have a lot of uses for technology. I worked with the NYC schools since my daughter began kindergarten. I was a technology consultant, and helped write the technology plans over the years. I was in a lot of schools doing evaluations, getting wired, and then wireless networking in place, training the trainers, etc.
These will be very helpful in a school system, particularly in the lower grades from K-3. I'm willing to bet that the companies writing professional iPad software, and there are a lot of them, will be busily adapting software for the smaller tablet. No doubt of that.
But as for "standard" textbooks, well, that's a different story. A well written textbook, electronic or otherwise, has the text and graphics (photo's, or whatever) in the proper spot in relation to the text. With a 10" iPad, that fairly easy to do, esp. with the retina model. But with a small screen, they will have to rethink it entirely. For younger children, regular texts are simpler, and can be reworked more easily, but more conventional textbooks, that are more information dense, will be more difficult. You can't simply allow the text and graphics to flow over the pages.
Comments
How about you wait until an actual product is announced before you diss it and the CEO etc
Originally Posted by melgross
What about them? You're not going to read a textbook on a small screen, no matter what the Rez.
Oh, so you don't think the iPad mini is appropriate for schools? That's one of the big things its proponents are pushing: its "suitability" for the classroom.
I don't disagree with you at all; I'm just saying.
Originally Posted by charlituna
How about you wait until an actual product is announced before you diss it and the CEO etc
Well, certainly the CEO, at least. ????
It could mean a slimmer iMac and Mac mini. Or iTunes. Or who knows.
My own feeling is that the target audience isn't the "I want a smaller iPad" but the "I-want-a-bigger-iPod Touch-that isn't-an-iPad".
I always turn-up on time for my medical appointments but find that the surgery/clinic/hospital is always running 20-30 minutes late. My iPhone just isn't the best device for reading, and I don't want to be toting the iPad around, so iPad-mini would be ideal for me.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum
OK! It's game on!
Or, at least it could be! I wonder if Apple has the brassies and the manufacturing capacity to redefine the entire tablet marketplace... for the next 2-3 years...
Remember the runup to the original iPad announcement... lo, those many years ago before January 27, 2010?
Return with me now, to those thrilling days of yesteryear....
Much of the speculation was comparing the rumored "Apple Tablet" to the Windows offerings and the reworked Mac laptops...
The consensus was, that for Apple to be competitive in the tablet market -- its offering would need to be priced under $1,100 -- bolder wags were looking for a price of $1,000!
Steve Jobs... And the price is $499. Boom!
This.
(And... one more thing;-) along with these words too: "Available.... Today."
With the announcement of Surface RT pricing, I'm expecting the same on the 23rd. The low price announcement, as Apple kneecaps the competition with their ability to profit through supply chain wizardry and component reuse. It killed the Zune HD, and stuffed the Android Tablet market back 2 years. Time for another swing of the pricing axe (yes, that legal monopoly, iOS and the apple ecosystem... as long as Apple is non exclusive on Apps and Media arrangements, then Everyone can build their own tablet/pad/phone/mediastore/appstore/OTA sync to compete).
This would be less about wowing the followers, but striking fear in the heart of competitors. Entering the Holiday season, effectively driving every other competitor's profit estimation down, while driving a fabric of prices on iOS devices from .99 to 699, and then a MacBook Air pinching the top end of any Surface RT line (why buy a half baked Windows device, when you can get a full Intel laptop that weighs practically nothing more that can emulate windows completely for a couple hundred more?).
at least "a little more" doesn't suggest a big screen apple tv
for me:
a new mac mini, please!
Quote:
Originally Posted by charlituna
It could mean a slimmer iMac and Mac mini. Or iTunes. Or who knows.
you read too much into this.
iPad Mini (little) and a few 'more' things
As to iPads profit margin, I don't think Apple is hurting here. They seemed to have found the optimal price point that makes it very difficult for the competition to get a toe hold. At the same time they are getting significant profits to drive iOS development and new products.
In a nut shell those people that believe that Steve wanted to sell products with artificially high prices really don't know Apples history well. Apple has always focused on profitable selling points which frankly has allowed them to survive while hundreds of other companies have failed.
Maybe Apple should refresh the entire product line once every year at the same time - and have a several day event - iOS devices one day - Consumer Devices the next - and Prosumer/Education the next. It would simplify things tremendously. Maybe add a fourth day focused on Software. heck why not make it a week long and invite industry partners to showcase their wares as well. They could hold it near to Cupertino maybe in San Fran Cisco and I dunno call it AppleWorld (I was going to write MacWorld - but I think that is already taken and since the Mac is now only one component of a larger picture it doesn't quite work).
Maybe the tagline for this event should have been along the lines of We have a little something to show you. But perhaps the "more" is a hint at multiple devices across the product line that are in some way more compact than premium offerings.
Ooh - what if they are releasing a "Surface" device that runs Windows 8 natively... but then that wouldn't be little in most respects I suppose. But man would that be fun - an Apple device that can run MacOS/iOS and Windows 8 - and leave MS wondering why they can't make up for the loss on each tablet with volume of sales.
Quote:
Originally Posted by AdamC
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacVicta
An iPad mini starting out with a measley 8gb and an old, non-Retina screen all in the name of cost saving? Never would've happened under Steve. This is the beginning of our trip to Scullyville with Tim Cook as the bus driver.
The 8gb iPad mini is truly great for those just want to consume and not create or store media in the iPad.
At that size it doesn't need retina display unless you need to look at the fine pubic hairs.
Just the gift for family members who love to surf the net, answers mails and each videos.
One thing that gets overlooked in the "entry level" WiFi 8GB model of the iPad Mini... Apple is working on a new iTunes... with a release date in October...
What if this iTunes acts similar to a home server for iPad content?
What if you could quickly download (crossload, actually) and/or stream games, books, music, videos, etc. from the iTunes Home Server.
The "entry level" iPad Mini, suddenly becomes an agile and very capable device -- well beyond its SSD storage limitation...
Who, but Apple can offer a solution like that for $199?
Edit: Our household of 5 has 2 adults and 3 teenagers -- each has his own iPad. We group read a chapter or two, 2-3 times a week. It would be trivial to take an extra few seconds and download "tonight's reading" to each iPad. Same thing when the kids want to play a game, watch a movie, whatever... the "storage" for these iPads could be the iTunes "local" cloud.
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross
Same thing with the screen. Get real! Apple can't introduce a retina model at small screen pricing right now.
They could. Someone pointed out that if they don't use the new in-cell touch panels there aren't any supply constraints and it's rather old tech so yields are high and prices lower. It's been around since the iphone 4.
Quote:
In fact, it could be a problem, as apps designed for the 10" retina screen would have type and elements too small for this screen. This limits that. Next year, they could squeeze it in, once screen prices drop, and developers are ready for it.
No, it doesn't. If UI elements are too small for the retina mini then they would be too small for the non-retina mini as well. iPad apps are designed against 1024x768 POINTS and not 1024x768 pixels or 2048x1536 pixels. Type will be smaller but not horribly so...72% of the original size. Us older folks will prefer the 10" iPads but no one else will have much of an issue.
I could be coerced into buying a new Mac mini.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton
I would have sent out invitations titled "And one more thing..."
Well played!
Well, sure. I just hate for someone really looking at those numbers, thinking they're real, and making plans based upon them to be disappointed, or frustrated, if the pricing is higher. We can see people coming here looking for real answers, and thinking they are here, when they likely aren't.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum
One thing that gets overlooked in the "entry level" WiFi 8GB model of the iPad Mini... Apple is working on a new iTunes... with a release date in October...
What if this iTunes acts similar to a home server for iPad content?
What if you could quickly download (crossload, actually) and/or stream games, books, music, videos, etc. from the iTunes Home Server.
The "entry level" iPad Mini, suddenly becomes an agile and very capable device -- well beyond its SSD storage limitation...
Who, but Apple can offer a solution like that for $199?
Well, for content you can already get a Wi-Drive.
For apps, it's a bit of an annoyance but you can pull down apps via the net.
Regarding iTunes...I don't want iTunes as a home server. I want an appliance as a home server. An aTV/Time Capsule hybrid becoming the home server would be fine to me.
Something that I can dump a lot of photos and movies on and manipulate with the 10" iPad using the CPU and GPU of both iPad and server when running iPhoto and iMovie.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheOtherGeoff
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum
OK! It's game on!
Or, at least it could be! I wonder if Apple has the brassies and the manufacturing capacity to redefine the entire tablet marketplace... for the next 2-3 years...
Remember the runup to the original iPad announcement... lo, those many years ago before January 27, 2010?
Return with me now, to those thrilling days of yesteryear....
Much of the speculation was comparing the rumored "Apple Tablet" to the Windows offerings and the reworked Mac laptops...
The consensus was, that for Apple to be competitive in the tablet market -- its offering would need to be priced under $1,100 -- bolder wags were looking for a price of $1,000!
Steve Jobs... And the price is $499. Boom!
This.
(And... one more thing;-) along with these words too: "Available.... Today."
With the announcement of Surface RT pricing, I'm expecting the same on the 23rd. The low price announcement, as Apple kneecaps the competition with their ability to profit through supply chain wizardry and component reuse. It killed the Zune HD, and stuffed the Android Tablet market back 2 years. Time for another swing of the pricing axe (yes, that legal monopoly, iOS and the apple ecosystem... as long as Apple is non exclusive on Apps and Media arrangements, then Everyone can build their own tablet/pad/phone/mediastore/appstore/OTA sync to compete).
This would be less about wowing the followers, but striking fear in the heart of competitors. Entering the Holiday season, effectively driving every other competitor's profit estimation down, while driving a fabric of prices on iOS devices from .99 to 699, and then a MacBook Air pinching the top end of any Surface RT line (why buy a half baked Windows device, when you can get a full Intel laptop that weighs practically nothing more that can emulate windows completely for a couple hundred more?).
By Geoff, I think you've got it!
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheOtherGeoff
you read too much into this.
iPad Mini (little) and a few 'more' things
My guess is a "little" iPad that does a whole lot "More" (than the competition??).
Beyond that everybody ignores the significant market out there for E-Book readers. A very large number of people buy Amazon devices for nothing more that a device to read books on. I actually think Apple will have to work hard to capture this market. A key selling point would likely be the devices flexibility.
It will be very interesting to see how all of this plays out over the next few months. Personally I can't imagine Apple being successful with some of the configurations suggested in these forums. I'm seeing Apple pulling out the technology stops to make sure competing devices just look poor next to this device. Mini is where I expect that Sharps new screens are going for example, retina or not I'm expecting a big step forward.
Schools have a lot of uses for technology. I worked with the NYC schools since my daughter began kindergarten. I was a technology consultant, and helped write the technology plans over the years. I was in a lot of schools doing evaluations, getting wired, and then wireless networking in place, training the trainers, etc.
These will be very helpful in a school system, particularly in the lower grades from K-3. I'm willing to bet that the companies writing professional iPad software, and there are a lot of them, will be busily adapting software for the smaller tablet. No doubt of that.
But as for "standard" textbooks, well, that's a different story. A well written textbook, electronic or otherwise, has the text and graphics (photo's, or whatever) in the proper spot in relation to the text. With a 10" iPad, that fairly easy to do, esp. with the retina model. But with a small screen, they will have to rethink it entirely. For younger children, regular texts are simpler, and can be reworked more easily, but more conventional textbooks, that are more information dense, will be more difficult. You can't simply allow the text and graphics to flow over the pages.
Exactly, who knows? Only the Shadow knows, but he's dead, so we can't ask him.