Apple slims down iMac 40% with 'friction-stir welding' & ditching the disc drive

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  • Reply 41 of 194

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by jungmark View Post




    i know and in the same breath, "Both can, however, be upgraded if the entire case is opened up." Was this line necessary then? I don't want to pay Apple for RAM. Perhaps there will be a DIY video soon.



     


    According to my TV Guide, this will be covered on next week's Red Green show. Stay tuned!

  • Reply 42 of 194
    hillstoneshillstones Posts: 1,490member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post


     


    Well, I was wrong. The SD card slot could NOT have fit on that side. But it's still in a dumb place. 


     


    Yeah, the black market on Macs with floppy drives is REAL lucrative. ????


     


     


    Huh. I'm seeing six audio inputs on the new one.


     


     


    And two FireWire 800 ports. Well, ten, if you count all the bandwidth. 



     


    Hey Dumbass...you need optional dongles to add audio input and FireWire 800.  Apple cut features, but didn't lower the price.  But you are cool with that too, aren't you?  Used Macs sell quite well, especially ones that have more features than others.  You are a troll anyway.

  • Reply 43 of 194

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by ghostface147 View Post


    The next question is, how far can they take this design?  It won't get thinner anytime soon.  What is the iMac going to look like in 5 years?  



    The 2018 iMac will carry warning stickers because the "cutting edge design" will really have a cutting edge. 


     


    Forget "refrigerators with toasters." 2018 will be computers with meat slicers. 

  • Reply 44 of 194
    gazoobeegazoobee Posts: 3,754member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post


    ... and two FireWire 800 ports. Well, ten, if you count all the bandwidth. 



     


    Har de har har.  


     


    The new iMac actually has *zero* firewire ports (800 or 400).  I'm kind of amazed (well not really considering the author) that the article goes on and on about all the shiny-glowy nice bits but doesn't mention this very relevant fact.  


     


    There are probably 5 or 6 hundred iMacs within a short walk from my office and all of them use/need firewire ports either for video editing or some kind of backup.  They are generally replaced hundreds at a time on a bi-yearly basis.  Not having Firewire is indeed going to be a problem.  


     


    I understand that Apple is likely doing this to push the drive makers to step up to the Thunderbolt plate and produce some good cheap backup drives that use the interface (which is a very good thing), however ... there aren't going to be a heck of a lot of Thunderbolt enabled video cameras any time soon so there will be buckets and buckets of adapters that need to be bought.  

  • Reply 45 of 194
    jeffdmjeffdm Posts: 12,951member
    hillstones wrote: »
    Typical response from an Apple Fanboi drinking the Apple Kool-Aid.  Care to give a reason?  Did the optical drive in the previous models ruin your life of computing?  Apple took away many features from the 2011 model, but still charges the same premium price...but I guess you are okay with that too?  I don't want an external drive sitting on my desk when a DESKTOP computer should retain an optical drive that many people still use today.  Software still ships on CD/DVD, DiskWarrior can only be upgraded by creating a new DVD, DiskWarrior must be booted from a DVD or other drive to make repairs, many DVD games require the disc to be in the drive to play.  People still buy music CDs and rip in their format of choice.  I backup my software installers to DVD, so they don't take up valuable disc space.  Many reasons to include the optical drive, but no valid reason to remove the drive from a desktop computer, especially when they don't lower the price for removing the feature.

    A slot loading internal replacement drive costs $100. An external DVD writer $30, albiet a tray loader.

    Backups are best done to external hard drives. Optical is just a needlessly slow, small and wasteful way to keep a backup. I keep a cold spare bootable backup drive. Probably a lot faster than writing to and booting from an optical disc.

    I just don't think the DIY CD rippers are notable portion of the market, I bet they fit under the margin of error.

    I don't think I use a single Mac program that was delivered on optical disc. Even the OS is downloaded now, which I keep a backup installer on USB stick.

    I have three discs for my current Windows software, the OS (now downloadable legally), CAD/CAM software (also downloadable legally) and an illustration program (don't know, I'm still using an older version).

    I've argued in the distant past that Apple prematurely rushed to drop the floppy, and I still think that was a bit true, there were no USB sticks, or other good way to move data at the time. But here, I think it's about time to turn the page, internet downloads are fast, we have USB sticks, SD cards, external hard drives, etc. If someone doesn't take steps to push optical out, it's not going to go away, people and businesses will cling to those formats out of habit rather than good practice. If optical doesn't already look like a vestigial organ now, it will in three years.
  • Reply 46 of 194
    hillstoneshillstones Posts: 1,490member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post





    Everything you said the iMac should have are reasons why you are not the target customer. Of course this is a consumer machine. It's the iMac. It always has been and everything to it always being geared toward the average user who doesn't use CDs and doesn't ever service their 'PC's' HDD, RAM, GPU, etc.


    Who are you to say that the average user doesn't use CDs or service their own computer?  Do you think iMac users are retards?  Your comment only proves that you are a retard for making such an assumption.  Safe to assume that the next Mac Pro won't have an optical drive because according to Apple, Pro users don't use optical discs either.  Then you little fanbois will bitch and complain because Apple removed the optical drive from a "Pro" machine.  Idiots.

  • Reply 47 of 194
    hillstoneshillstones Posts: 1,490member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post





    A slot loading internal replacement drive costs $100. An external DVD writer $30, albiet a tray loader.

    Backups are best done to external hard drive. I keep a cold spare bootable backup drive. Probably a lot faster than writing to and booting from an optical disc.

    I just don't think the DIY rippers are notable portion of the market.

    I don't think I use a single Mac program that was delivered on optical disc. Even the OS is downloaded now, which I keep a backup installer on USB stick.

    I have three discs for Windows software, the OS (now downloadable), CAD/CAM software (also downloadable) and an illustration program (don't know).


    Go buy Microsoft Office or Adobe Creative Suite and let us know what format it uses inside the box (DVD).  Internal slot load drives are $59 from OWC.  Get your facts right.  I am not talking about regular backups.  I don't need to backup my downloaded installers over and over again with Time Machine.  I can back those up once to DVD and keep them off the hard drive, and off my Time Machine backups.

  • Reply 48 of 194
    jeffdmjeffdm Posts: 12,951member
    hillstones wrote: »
    Go buy Microsoft Office or Adobe Creative Suite and let us know what format it uses inside the box (DVD).

    Exactly, dinosaurs. Adobe was always behind the curve. Slowest to move to OS X, slowest to Intel, slowest to downloads, you get the idea. Using MS Office is like celebrating being a dinosaur.
    Internal slot load drives are $59 from OWC.  Get your facts right.

    OK, I was reading the optical drives from when I was looking to replace one on a Mac laptop. On OWC, those really are $99.
    I am not talking about regular backups.  I don't need to backup my downloaded installers over and over again with Time Machine.

    I don't think you understand how Time Machine works. It's not making a lot of copies of the same file.
    I can back those up once to DVD and keep them off the hard drive, and off my Time Machine backups.

    I'm sure you'll save a lot of time, space and money with an external drive. Not to mention having to inventory them. But then, most installers barely take up any space. I've got 5GB or so1 of Mac software installers, that's negligible, hardly worth wasting plastic over and over.

    You could also tell Time Machine to not archive your installer folder. All your reasons seem pretty contrived and possibly OCD.
  • Reply 49 of 194
    crimguycrimguy Posts: 124member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post





    Everything you said the iMac should have are reasons why you are not the target customer. Of course this is a consumer machine. It's the iMac. It always has been and everything to it always being geared toward the average user who doesn't use CDs and doesn't ever service their 'PC's' HDD, RAM, GPU, etc.


    You are absolutely correct.  Until yesterday, though, the iMac made an excellent office pc despite it's consumer lineage.  And that's a bit of a problem for me.  I don't need to upgrade graphics cards and cpu's at my office, but hard drives and ram are definitely things that become "too small" or obsolete (or break) with time.  What in the Apple lineup fits that bill now other than a Mac Pro?  And a Mac Pro is way too much computer for my needs at work.


     


    Maybe Apple knows that, in reality, the office pc user that would get an imac probably has a bit more money in the bank to spend on pc's and doesn't mind upgrading them every couple of years?  I can afford a new iMac at that rate, but really don't want to spend the money.  I'd be happy using my 2007 iMac for a few more years if it wasn't for the fact that the graphics drivers haven't worked since 10.6.2. . . 

  • Reply 50 of 194
    sflocalsflocal Posts: 6,096member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by hillstones View Post


    Who are you to say that the average user doesn't use CDs or service their own computer?  Do you think iMac users are retards?  Your comment only proves that you are a retard for making such an assumption.  Safe to assume that the next Mac Pro won't have an optical drive because according to Apple, Pro users don't use optical discs either.  Then you little fanbois will bitch and complain because Apple removed the optical drive from a "Pro" machine.  Idiots.





    Way to go to make your point by hurling insults.  Pretty much invalidates anything you said.



    This is the reality.  Most folks don't use CD's, and most folks don't service their own computers.  That's the hard truth reality.  It's what I see everywhere and I'm in IT.  No one wants to deal with it.  They send their PC's to someone that knows what they are doing.  Most people will never open their computers to upgrade memory, hardware, etc.  It IS what is going on.



    You may not like it but you really do not represent the Joe Consumer.  You make it sound like Apple is insulting you by not tailoring their products to the 1% of people that do what you do.  I service my own machines and I've opened up my 2009 iMac just because I wanted to.  Sure it's not as simple like a regular PC but if you're as technically-inclined as you imply your self to be, what's an extra 5-10 minutes to open an iMac case?  If you do it for a business, you just past that extra labor time to your customer.



    What Solips said is true.  I'm not EVEN going to waste my time to google for you the direction that PC-tech is going.  CD-tech is dead.  A cheap USB stick holds a heck of a lot more than a CD does.  If grandma who is still set in her ways wants to see the family kids on a CD for her 1990's computer, either tell her to go to Facebook, or buy a $40 burner (or $79 superdrive) for those 1-2 times a year you'll need it and be done with it.



    Technology is not going to be put on hold because you have to have an aging, mechanical device in your computer.  Sorry to be the one to have to tell you that.

  • Reply 51 of 194


    so a thin feature is a benefits how?  it's a feature with no benefit, but all the pundits jump on the thickness of a computer or cell phone like it's the holy grail.  make them all, including my iPad, an 1/8 thicker, increase battery life or reduce the cost, and get on with a feature that has a tangible benefit. 

  • Reply 52 of 194
    pokepoke Posts: 506member


    I think this is the most significant iMac since the original. The original iMac was a computer people wanted because it looked great. This is the first flat panel iMac that really has the same aesthetic impact in my opinion. Up until now they were merely functional. I want one.

  • Reply 53 of 194

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by poke View Post


    I think this is the most significant iMac since the original. The original iMac was a computer people wanted because it looked great. This is the first flat panel iMac that really has the same aesthetic impact in my opinion. Up until now they were merely functional. I want one.



     


    I'd agree with that.


     


    The design of the 'flat' iMac has come of age.  It really is 'flat' (near as dammit) now...  And it's a dramatic design.  Eye arresting.


     


    It's quite telling we're celebrating 14 years of the iMac.  Phil put it himself...that the original iMac kick started the 'new' Apple.  Everything they've done since...


     


    Lemon Bon Bon.

  • Reply 54 of 194
    solipsismxsolipsismx Posts: 19,566member
    hillstones wrote: »
    Who are you to say that the average user doesn't use CDs or service their own computer?  Do you think iMac users are retards?  Your comment only proves that you are a retard for making such an assumption.  Safe to assume that the next Mac Pro won't have an optical drive because according to Apple, Pro users don't use optical discs either.  Then you little fanbois will bitch and complain because Apple removed the optical drive from a "Pro" machine.  Idiots.

    Yikes!
  • Reply 55 of 194

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post





    A slot loading internal replacement drive costs $100. An external DVD writer $30, albiet a tray loader.

    Backups are best done to external hard drives. Optical is just a needlessly slow, small and wasteful way to keep a backup. I keep a cold spare bootable backup drive. Probably a lot faster than writing to and booting from an optical disc.

    I just don't think the DIY CD rippers are notable portion of the market, I bet they fit under the margin of error.

    I don't think I use a single Mac program that was delivered on optical disc. Even the OS is downloaded now, which I keep a backup installer on USB stick.

    I have three discs for my current Windows software, the OS (now downloadable legally), CAD/CAM software (also downloadable legally) and an illustration program (don't know, I'm still using an older version).

    I've argued in the distant past that Apple prematurely rushed to drop the floppy, and I still think that was a bit true, there were no USB sticks, or other good way to move data at the time. But here, I think it's about time to turn the page, internet downloads are fast, we have USB sticks, SD cards, external hard drives, etc. If someone doesn't take steps to push optical out, it's not going to go away, people and businesses will cling to those formats out of habit rather than good practice. If optical doesn't already look like a vestigial organ now, it will in three years.


     


    What Jeff said.


     


    Lemon Bon Bon.

  • Reply 56 of 194

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post





    You aren't watching Blu-ray at this point? You aren't using a separate TV/monitor for this function?


     


    No, I might be in the minority, but I hate Blu-Ray and I have no plans to buy an HDTV. I generally find nothing of interest on cable, so I don't have that either.

  • Reply 57 of 194
    The fact that you can't easily add more ram is a deal breaker for me, especially since Apple charges ridiculous prices to add more when you're configuring it. I bought my mid 2011 iMac with 4gb of RAM and then purchased another 8gb myself for $50. Apple would have wanted $200 for that. Apple knows people do that so rather than lower their price on memory to a reasonable amount they took the option away to add it ourselves. To me that is just a cheap move on their part. With all their engineering ability don't try to tell me they couldn't put a door with two screws on the back.:no:
  • Reply 58 of 194

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by hillstones View Post


    Who are you to say that the average user doesn't use CDs or service their own computer?  Do you think iMac users are retards?  Your comment only proves that you are a retard for making such an assumption.  Safe to assume that the next Mac Pro won't have an optical drive because according to Apple, Pro users don't use optical discs either.  Then you little fanbois will bitch and complain because Apple removed the optical drive from a "Pro" machine.  Idiots.



    Thanks Ann for your psychoanalytic skills.


     


    No, Apple says the _average_ (say +- 2 sigmas to the mean) user does not have the tools, the skills nor the know-how to properly service their own computer.  And they build a computer and an retail service ecosystem (applecare and genius bars) to support that.


     


    The average car driver does not service their own car, beyond consumables.  


     


    As for CDs, Apple is selling an Ecosystem, and that ecosystem does not include CDs.  They'll sell you a CD player, but they won't build it into their base consumer machines.


     


    Heck, You don't see McDonalds selling you ovens, do you?   The average consumer at McDonalds can cook, but since McDonalds doesn't have a 'take home and heat menu' there is no reason to sell you a device that let's you buy frozen pizza from Safeway.   Doesn't make sense.


     


    As for the mac Pro, let's just assume Apple will disappoint someone somehow when (if)  that's updated

  • Reply 59 of 194
    rogifanrogifan Posts: 10,669member
    hillstones wrote: »
    Ars posted the same picture and it is the 21.5 model.

    http://arstechnica.com/apple/2012/10/hands-on-with-the-thumb-able-ipad-mini-and-the-ultrathin-imac/

    The 27s are not even in production yet, since they won't be available until December.
    Ok so then we don't know what they look like as no one has seen them yet.
  • Reply 60 of 194
    iqatedoiqatedo Posts: 1,824member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post





    Everything you said the iMac should have are reasons why you are not the target customer. Of course this is a consumer machine. It's the iMac. It always has been and everything to it always being geared toward the average user who doesn't use CDs and doesn't ever service their 'PC's' HDD, RAM, GPU, etc.


     


    What then is a consumer machine or an average user?  Mine runs 4 operating systems and programs such as Mathematica, which often betters so called high-end workstations in Wolfram's own performance tests.  How is some guy in a law office not an average user... because he needs an optical drive?  I suppose that those who run boxes in which they can tweak every little aspect of hardware think that they are not an average user but I'm sure too that most, if not all, of their computer use is no more than average in light of the iMac's capabilities.  

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