This statement is complete bull. If anything is going to replace the iPod touch, it is a low cost, unsubsidized iPhone. I can't believe that people still don't realize that the iPad mini and iPod touch serve different purposes and target different markets.
And your statement is complete opinion. Show me anywhere on the web where your opinion is substantiated by an "expert" , and not just some guy in his living room.
From what I can tell, the mini is more of what people buy the iPod Touch for.
You are not wrong, In that as more and more kids are being given cell phones by their parents, the iPhone will replace the purchase of a Touch. And as many could tell you, parents have long been giving their old un-activated iPhones to their kids to use as iPod Touches, with the added security that they can make 911 calls.
But the reason people by iPod Touches, and the market demographic Apple is targeting has more to do with gaming. Otherwise, why not just buy a Nano? Yes it offers some organizational features via iCloud, but its a wifi ONLY device. So that's not a priority since it can't be used anywhere. Such devices are used to conveniently load the device with video games, movies and music, then hit the road ... Not keep their digital lives in sync, or surf the web, or get e-mail.
As such, the mini makes for a much better option for that demographic. It's not so big you can't carry it around with you like a Touch, and the added size makes using it so much better than a Touch.
at the risk of being anecdotal, I don't know a single person person who owns both an iPhone and an iPod Touch, nor do I know anybody who owns a Touch and an iPad, though I'm sure there's more evidence of the latter than the former. But the real question is whether a kid, or an adult for that matter, would buy both a Touch and an iPad mini now that the mini is an option.
But instead of proclaiming my opinion complete bull, why don't you substantiate your OPINION as to how the markets are so different that the mini will never replace the Touch.
Those predicting the demise of the iPod Touch should check the Apple Store. Damned if the Classic isn't still around! How many premature obits have been written for the classic Classic?
So, stop making fools of yourselves.
Seriously? The classic hasn't changed since 2007 ... It costs Apple nothing to make it, and offers something you can't get anywhere else ... 40,000 songs in your pocket and 36 hours of battery life. The perfect option for outdoor enthusiasts, car trips, family vacations, trips to foreign countries, etc. where the iPhone, Touch and other devices may not function on cellular or wifi radios.
Please, nobody is embarrassing themselves here. The iPod Touch is a duplication of efforts by the iPhone and now the mini, it is expensive to build as it must be redesigned and marketed to keep it relevant (the Touch has changed 5 times since 2007), and as such, doesn't just cannibalize sales from other devices, it costs Apple money to keep it in the inventory.
The Classic is a bad example as it continues to serve a specific need no other Apple device can offer. The Touch did as well back in 2007, specifically those who wanted the functions of the iPhone, but either already had a mobile phone, couldnt afford a cellular phone bill, or werent old enough to have a cell phone. The Touch arguably drove Apples entry into the gaming field thanks to this particular demographic, and changed the market for this device as the industry evolved as people fulfilled their contracts and became eligible for cheap subsidized iPhones, lines were drawn between Apple and Google users, pre-paid contracts have become available, people are dropping their land lines in favor of just one mobile phone bill, and kids are being given cell phones younger and younger every year, and with a glut of cheap previous generation iPhones out there, deactivated iPhones make great iPod Touches for significantly less than the new ones Apple is selling.
So the Touch is clearly destined to be absorbed by another product category, and considering what seems to be a primary motivation to buy a Touch in today's marketplace, the mini seems the most likely replacement. It offers more of what the Touch does best without significantly sacrificing size.
Seriously? The classic hasn't changed since 2007 ... It costs Apple nothing to make it, and offers something you can't get anywhere else ... 40,000 songs in your pocket and 36 hours of battery life. The perfect option for outdoor enthusiasts, car trips, family vacations, trips to foreign countries, etc. where the iPhone, Touch and other devices may not function on cellular or wifi radios.
Please, nobody is embarrassing themselves here. The iPod Touch is a duplication of efforts by the iPhone and now the mini, it is expensive to build as it must be redesigned and marketed to keep it relevant, and as such, doesn't just cannibalize sales from other devices, it costs Apple money to keep it in the inventory.
The Classic is a bad example as it continues to serve a specific need no other Apple device can offer. The Touch did as well, specifically those who wanted the functions of the iPhone, but either already had a mobile phone, couldnt afford a cellular phone bill, or werent old enough to have a cell phone. The Touch arguably drove Apples entry into the gaming field thanks to this particular demographic, and changed the market for this device as the industry evolved as people fulfilled their contracts and became eligible for cheap subsidized iPhones, lines were drawn between Apple and Google users, pre-paid contracts have become available, people are dropping their land lines in favor of just one mobile phone bill, and kids are being given cell phones younger and younger every year, and with a glut of cheap previous generation iPhones out there, deactivated iPhones make great iPod Touches for significantly less than the new ones Apple is selling.
So the Touch is clearly destined to be absorbed by another product category, and considering what seems to be a primary motivation to buy a Touch in today's marketplace, the mini seems the most likely replacement. It offers more of what the Touch does best without significantly sacrificing size.
Simple—iPod Touch is pocketable, iPad Mini is not. There may not be a market for people who want both (I'd bet there is, though) but there is definitely two separate markets for those who want a pocketable device, and those than want a small, transportable tablet.
I have an iPhone... Yet I still bought an iPad Mini. I don't know why it would be different for people with iPod Touches and iPad Minis.
Seriously? The classic hasn't changed since 2007 ... It costs Apple nothing to make it, and offers something you can't get anywhere else ... 40,000 songs in your pocket and 36 hours of battery life. The perfect option for outdoor enthusiasts, car trips, family vacations, trips to foreign countries, etc. where the iPhone, Touch and other devices may not function on cellular or wifi radios.
So, Apple is still making the Classic for the gargantuan market of outdoorsy, traveling types who always want 40,000 songs in their pocket. BTW, since you sound like you have not traveled to "foreign countries", Wifi does exist outside the region of the world directly affected by the Obama v. Romney election today. Seriously.
People who continue to spout lines like "it costs nothing to make ..." do not understand manufacturing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mac_128
The iPod Touch is a duplication of efforts by the iPhone and now the mini,
Do you have a Mini and a Touch? Put them next to each other. Then use them for a while before you say something embarrassing like they are duplication of efforts. Seriously.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mac_128
So the Touch is clearly destined to be absorbed by another product category, and considering what seems to be a primary motivation to buy a Touch in today's marketplace, the mini seems the most likely replacement. It offers more of what the Touch does best without significantly sacrificing size.
This statement clearly shows you do not own both and have not used them sufficiently. That makes your statement unqualified, or qualified hot air.
Simple—iPod Touch is pocketable, iPad Mini is not. There may not be a market for people who want both (I'd bet there is, though) but there is definitely two separate markets for those who want a pocketable device, and those than want a small, transportable tablet.
I have an iPhone... Yet I still bought an iPad Mini. I don't know why it would be different for people with iPod Touches and iPad Minis.
There are people who use the iPod Touch as a, well..., iPod, and for those people a pocketable device is a must. But I think the iPad touch will eventually get eaten by a combination of the iPhone and the iPad mini. The iPod Nano and shuffle will probably stick around for longer.
The new argument why an Apple product will fail is because it doesn't have a Retina display. At least they've let go of the lame SD card slot, removable battery, and USB port arguments.
Hmmm... mine failed because I dropped it in water. Maybe that'll catch on after the Retina thing has run its course.
Great analysis...this mini is the perfect tablet not to buy at first iteration...Apple is just trying to play catch up...Nexus 7 is a damn good tablet...and let's face it
tablet owners have more than one computer and the tablet will never replace a full blown laptop....I love my Nexus 7 but it does not replace my Macbook Pro...Thanks....
Simple—iPod Touch is pocketable, iPad Mini is not. There may not be a market for people who want both (I'd bet there is, though) but there is definitely two separate markets for those who want a pocketable device, and those than want a small, transportable tablet.
I have an iPhone... Yet I still bought an iPad Mini. I don't know why it would be different for people with iPod Touches and iPad Minis.
Who says the mini isn't pocketable? You mean in your jeans pocket? Some will have no problem with this.
My question for you is do you have an iPhone, a mini and an iPad?
Finally, lets say you do want a universally pocketable device the size of an iPhone ... If you don't need, or can't afford a subsidized cellphone contract, would you rather buy a used iPhone off eBay, with the option to use it with pre-paid cards, or a more expensive new Touch? Or better yet, a free hand-me-down from a relative?
And given the connectivity issues of the Touch when mobile, how exactly are you using this ultra pocketable Touch?
Now lets say you don't have a phone, a Touch or an iPad. You can get a mini, which is pocketable in many situations, and also has the option of a cellular radio, as well as a bigger screen for better ease of use for essentially the same price as a Touch. Which are you gonna buy first? I guess it all depends on how you're gonna use it, but since almost everyone Curry's a backpack, bag, or purse around with I'm, I'm betting most people will opt for more bang for their buck than slightly greater portability.
And this is what Apple has to deal with ... A shrinking market where the Touch is becoming less and less relevant, mainly filling the void for those who dwell at the very bottom of the market looking for the least expensive entry to the iOS ecosystem without buying a phone or an iPad, with millions of perfectly sevicible options available on the used market for much less than last years technology Apple is marketing and offering as new anyway.
Maybe there is a huge thriving market for the Touch, but until Apple starts releasing specific product sales numbers, my guess is ere are a number of iPod Touch early adopters that are kicking themselves for buying it before e mini was announced ...
There is a problem, the hardware and price. If you are going for premium sell a iPad Mini Retina & with A6 chip. If you will go with non retina and A5(which the A6X makes obsolete) then don't ask 329$ (premium amount compare to the competition). A lot of people will be disappointed with the mini IMHO. Sure next year they will upgraded but it will still be outdated when new top of the line iPad is release...
That being said it will sell millions and normal people wont realize its under power until next year.
None of this makes sense. You can't put the Retina display in the iPad min with an A6 and if you are going to do that you are using a display that is more costly than the 10" iPad due to the increased difficultly of producing a much more dense display so even if you can reduce costs in some areas you still have that additional cost. Then you have weight issues with the much larger battery you'll need to push those pixels that now make what is a clear requirement for the success of the iPad mini a pointless device.
Have you compared the build quality and component quality from other tablets?
The cellular version is coming. In fact, the form factor argues to have people carrying it around all the time. WiFi will not be sufficient.
Not just cellular for data, I mean cellular for voice as well. I really hope that whatever is preventing this will go away, definitely not a technical problem
"If you want a cheaper experience, the only option from Apple is the $200, previous generation iPod touch (the latest model is actually $70 more expensive than the entry level iPad mini, albeit packing 32GB of storage" Incorrect the 5th Gen 32gb iPod touch starts @ 299
I don't get all the people saying the Mini will fail due to its lack of retina display. There's an iPad 2 in the house (which I rarely get to use) and its screen is perfectly fine. Perhaps I'm just not spoiled by retina yet, but shrinking the display size means the Mini has a higher PPI than the 2 so its text should be perceptibly sharper. My concern over the Mini is the use of an outdated processor. Other than the occasional blip about it, I've not heard any real-world mention of whether this makes the device usable or not. All reviews seem to be focused on the lack of retina. Anyone?
It's as usable as your iPad 2, which means very usable. It might have the occasional lag and apps don't open as fast, etc, but it's still very much sufficient for what's out there right now.
Everyone is focused on retina displays because everyone has been spoiled the last few years with them. If you use a retina display of any sort for long periods of time, and then look at a non-retina display, you can easily notice the pixelation and roughness of text. If you've been mostly using non-retina displays, you'll be more than happy with the higher PPI of the mini.
The iPad mini is essentially a large iPod Touch running iPad software, and will replace it as early as next Summer.
Sorry to have to say this but you are flat out wrong.
The iPod Touch is an iPhone without a cellular chip and data plan.
The iPad mini is an iPad, but lighter and easier to carry.
The two products you're conflating have absolutely nothing to do with one another and serve different uses via different apps designed and built around different experiences primarily related to portability and productivity vis-a-vis screen size.
If Apple started with a 7.9" screen over a 10" screen, then we'd be in a different boat as people would have been saying (incorrectly) exactly what you're saying now: it's just a larger iPod Touch. And we would have seen scaled up iPhone apps all over the place. But now we have many thousands of apps optimized for the larger tablet screen, not the phone screen, and this distinction and ecosystem will prevail.
In fact, we're more likely to see the iPod Touch with cellular access than no iPod Touch. Portability and connectivity across a variety of screen sizes.
Further, the idea that Apple would discontinue their best selling iPod to force users to purchase a larger device is absurd.
It's as usable as your iPad 2, which means very usable. It might have the occasional lag and apps don't open as fast, etc, but it's still very much sufficient for what's out there right now.
Everyone is focused on retina displays because everyone has been spoiled the last few years with them. If you use a retina display of any sort for long periods of time, and then look at a non-retina display, you can easily notice the pixelation and roughness of text. If you've been mostly using non-retina displays, you'll be more than happy with the higher PPI of the mini.
It's funny how early this year before the iPad (3) launched it seemed quite unrealistic to expect a 2048x1536 display in a tablet despite all the evidence suggesting it was coming and now, just a half a year later, people expect that same display with a much higher pixel density in a device with 1/3 the battery size.
And your statement is complete opinion. Show me anywhere on the web where your opinion is substantiated by an "expert" , and not just some guy in his living room.
From what I can tell, the mini is more of what people buy the iPod Touch for.
You are not wrong, In that as more and more kids are being given cell phones by their parents, the iPhone will replace the purchase of a Touch. And as many could tell you, parents have long been giving their old un-activated iPhones to their kids to use as iPod Touches, with the added security that they can make 911 calls.
But the reason people by iPod Touches, and the market demographic Apple is targeting has more to do with gaming. Otherwise, why not just buy a Nano? Yes it offers some organizational features via iCloud, but its a wifi ONLY device. So that's not a priority since it can't be used anywhere. Such devices are used to conveniently load the device with video games, movies and music, then hit the road ... Not keep their digital lives in sync, or surf the web, or get e-mail.
As such, the mini makes for a much better option for that demographic. It's not so big you can't carry it around with you like a Touch, and the added size makes using it so much better than a Touch.
at the risk of being anecdotal, I don't know a single person person who owns both an iPhone and an iPod Touch, nor do I know anybody who owns a Touch and an iPad, though I'm sure there's more evidence of the latter than the former. But the real question is whether a kid, or an adult for that matter, would buy both a Touch and an iPad mini now that the mini is an option.
But instead of proclaiming my opinion complete bull, why don't you substantiate your OPINION as to how the markets are so different that the mini will never replace the Touch.
all of our comments here are complete opinions, so i'm not sure why you are attacking me on that front...
no kid is going to take an iPad mini to school in place of an iPod touch. just because you can fit it in your pocket, does not mean it's pocketable.
So, Apple is still making the Classic for the gargantuan market of outdoorsy, traveling types who always want 40,000 songs in their pocket. BTW, since you sound like you have not traveled to "foreign countries", Wifi does exist outside the region of the world directly affected by the Obama v. Romney election today. Seriously.
People who continue to spout lines like "it costs nothing to make ..." do not understand manufacturing.
Do you have a Mini and a Touch? Put them next to each other. Then use them for a while before you say something embarrassing like they are duplication of efforts. Seriously.
This statement clearly shows you do not own both and have not used them sufficiently. That makes your statement unqualified, or qualified hot air.
You need to get out of whatever major metropolis you subsist in, and take a look at the rest of the world.
First I have an iPhone, and without cellular and wifi its pretty much an iPod touch with better hardware.
Second I said "may not" work in foreign countries. I travelled to Paris and Spain this Summer as a matter of fact. I could not find free wifi anywhere in Paris, and with my locked iPhone 4S I had no cell service, as I was unwilling to pay ATTs exorbitant world plan, or outrageous roaming fees, and truly The number of people I met without any Internet at home, much less wifi, was shocking in a major metropolitan city. Outside of Paris wifi was nonexistent. Spain was worse. I mainly was forced to pay to use computers at Internet cafes ... My iDevice was mostly useless. At least the next time I go back, my 4S will be unlocked and I can buy a local SIM card for both cellular and data. And don't get me started on El Salvador ...
But let's just stick to the good old USA for a moment, farmers and ranchers in the Midwest don't have access to either cellular or wifi when working on the land. Hunters rarely have such luxuries, much less power to recharge. Ever been to a national park? Nothing, nada. Military outposts, sailors at sea, etc. Ever driven through South Dakota? It's a long damn drive and you probably won't like what staticky radio stations you might find there. And ill bet you there are people in NY and NJ right now who are thrilled they bought an iPod Classic with 36 hours of battery life. There's a whole world outside of Silicon Valley, and a thriving market of people around the world who don't have access to the free wifi, 4G LTE, or even regular power.
Finally, as for the cost of manufacturing ... Clarify your statement. What don't "people" understand? As long as there is a market for a device, the cost of the parts has long been subsidized by bulk purchase. Of course there's still a cost to manufacture, but the fact Apple has not changed the design, nor had to market the Classic all save millions which can go into maintaining production for the albeit small, but nevertheless significant market for the Classic. Why else would Apple maintain the Mac Pro? Fewer people buy the MacPro than likely buy the iPod Classic, but it is a well defined market segment which requires little or no marketing to maintain the status quo, which in turn helps support the larger mor expensive ecosystem. And look, as I said before, the Classic does not cannibalize from any other existing product, unlike the Touch which takes money away from Apple's other similar products, as well as costing significant investment in upgrading the device to keep it competitive.
As for using them side by side ... Been there done that. I much prefer using the mini to my iPhone limited to the same functions. gaming is better, watching movies is better, reading books is better, and the mini is not significantly bigger. So stop telling me I don't know what I'm talking about. This is what I prefer, and I have expressed a related opinion based on broad experience. Hardly hot air. But feel free to disagree. It's a free country.
Out of all the criticisms, my biggest complaint is that the 32 GB should be more like $70 more than the 16GB. Anything more is a ripoff....this coming from an Apple Fan/shareholder. It's a small thing, but when you think about it, the most desired size is 32GB, Apple knows this and is willing to piss off customers just to make a few extra dollars.
Comments
From what I can tell, the mini is more of what people buy the iPod Touch for.
You are not wrong, In that as more and more kids are being given cell phones by their parents, the iPhone will replace the purchase of a Touch. And as many could tell you, parents have long been giving their old un-activated iPhones to their kids to use as iPod Touches, with the added security that they can make 911 calls.
But the reason people by iPod Touches, and the market demographic Apple is targeting has more to do with gaming. Otherwise, why not just buy a Nano? Yes it offers some organizational features via iCloud, but its a wifi ONLY device. So that's not a priority since it can't be used anywhere. Such devices are used to conveniently load the device with video games, movies and music, then hit the road ... Not keep their digital lives in sync, or surf the web, or get e-mail.
As such, the mini makes for a much better option for that demographic. It's not so big you can't carry it around with you like a Touch, and the added size makes using it so much better than a Touch.
at the risk of being anecdotal, I don't know a single person person who owns both an iPhone and an iPod Touch, nor do I know anybody who owns a Touch and an iPad, though I'm sure there's more evidence of the latter than the former. But the real question is whether a kid, or an adult for that matter, would buy both a Touch and an iPad mini now that the mini is an option.
But instead of proclaiming my opinion complete bull, why don't you substantiate your OPINION as to how the markets are so different that the mini will never replace the Touch.
Please, nobody is embarrassing themselves here. The iPod Touch is a duplication of efforts by the iPhone and now the mini, it is expensive to build as it must be redesigned and marketed to keep it relevant (the Touch has changed 5 times since 2007), and as such, doesn't just cannibalize sales from other devices, it costs Apple money to keep it in the inventory.
The Classic is a bad example as it continues to serve a specific need no other Apple device can offer. The Touch did as well back in 2007, specifically those who wanted the functions of the iPhone, but either already had a mobile phone, couldnt afford a cellular phone bill, or werent old enough to have a cell phone. The Touch arguably drove Apples entry into the gaming field thanks to this particular demographic, and changed the market for this device as the industry evolved as people fulfilled their contracts and became eligible for cheap subsidized iPhones, lines were drawn between Apple and Google users, pre-paid contracts have become available, people are dropping their land lines in favor of just one mobile phone bill, and kids are being given cell phones younger and younger every year, and with a glut of cheap previous generation iPhones out there, deactivated iPhones make great iPod Touches for significantly less than the new ones Apple is selling.
So the Touch is clearly destined to be absorbed by another product category, and considering what seems to be a primary motivation to buy a Touch in today's marketplace, the mini seems the most likely replacement. It offers more of what the Touch does best without significantly sacrificing size.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mac_128
Seriously? The classic hasn't changed since 2007 ... It costs Apple nothing to make it, and offers something you can't get anywhere else ... 40,000 songs in your pocket and 36 hours of battery life. The perfect option for outdoor enthusiasts, car trips, family vacations, trips to foreign countries, etc. where the iPhone, Touch and other devices may not function on cellular or wifi radios.
Please, nobody is embarrassing themselves here. The iPod Touch is a duplication of efforts by the iPhone and now the mini, it is expensive to build as it must be redesigned and marketed to keep it relevant, and as such, doesn't just cannibalize sales from other devices, it costs Apple money to keep it in the inventory.
The Classic is a bad example as it continues to serve a specific need no other Apple device can offer. The Touch did as well, specifically those who wanted the functions of the iPhone, but either already had a mobile phone, couldnt afford a cellular phone bill, or werent old enough to have a cell phone. The Touch arguably drove Apples entry into the gaming field thanks to this particular demographic, and changed the market for this device as the industry evolved as people fulfilled their contracts and became eligible for cheap subsidized iPhones, lines were drawn between Apple and Google users, pre-paid contracts have become available, people are dropping their land lines in favor of just one mobile phone bill, and kids are being given cell phones younger and younger every year, and with a glut of cheap previous generation iPhones out there, deactivated iPhones make great iPod Touches for significantly less than the new ones Apple is selling.
So the Touch is clearly destined to be absorbed by another product category, and considering what seems to be a primary motivation to buy a Touch in today's marketplace, the mini seems the most likely replacement. It offers more of what the Touch does best without significantly sacrificing size.
Simple—iPod Touch is pocketable, iPad Mini is not. There may not be a market for people who want both (I'd bet there is, though) but there is definitely two separate markets for those who want a pocketable device, and those than want a small, transportable tablet.
I have an iPhone... Yet I still bought an iPad Mini. I don't know why it would be different for people with iPod Touches and iPad Minis.
Quote:
Originally Posted by maccherry
I have he iPad mini with 32 gigs wifi only. It is awesome.
I just downloaded pages and numbers last night and now I'm on fire.
Doing my work at my hotel job has just gotten easier. And when I get faster wifi in my house ill be a hot mess!!
Build quality is phenomenal.
And I got the product red cover to last night. Wow!
The Apple store was packed last night. The line for the mini jus kept forming as the last line of people left with thier new bling.
Damn.
Nex up? The new iMac !!
Mirror that!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mac_128
Seriously? The classic hasn't changed since 2007 ... It costs Apple nothing to make it, and offers something you can't get anywhere else ... 40,000 songs in your pocket and 36 hours of battery life. The perfect option for outdoor enthusiasts, car trips, family vacations, trips to foreign countries, etc. where the iPhone, Touch and other devices may not function on cellular or wifi radios.
So, Apple is still making the Classic for the gargantuan market of outdoorsy, traveling types who always want 40,000 songs in their pocket. BTW, since you sound like you have not traveled to "foreign countries", Wifi does exist outside the region of the world directly affected by the Obama v. Romney election today. Seriously.
People who continue to spout lines like "it costs nothing to make ..." do not understand manufacturing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mac_128
The iPod Touch is a duplication of efforts by the iPhone and now the mini,
Do you have a Mini and a Touch? Put them next to each other. Then use them for a while before you say something embarrassing like they are duplication of efforts. Seriously.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mac_128
So the Touch is clearly destined to be absorbed by another product category, and considering what seems to be a primary motivation to buy a Touch in today's marketplace, the mini seems the most likely replacement. It offers more of what the Touch does best without significantly sacrificing size.
This statement clearly shows you do not own both and have not used them sufficiently. That makes your statement unqualified, or qualified hot air.
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisbru
Simple—iPod Touch is pocketable, iPad Mini is not. There may not be a market for people who want both (I'd bet there is, though) but there is definitely two separate markets for those who want a pocketable device, and those than want a small, transportable tablet.
I have an iPhone... Yet I still bought an iPad Mini. I don't know why it would be different for people with iPod Touches and iPad Minis.
There are people who use the iPod Touch as a, well..., iPod, and for those people a pocketable device is a must. But I think the iPad touch will eventually get eaten by a combination of the iPhone and the iPad mini. The iPod Nano and shuffle will probably stick around for longer.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX
The new argument why an Apple product will fail is because it doesn't have a Retina display. At least they've let go of the lame SD card slot, removable battery, and USB port arguments.
Hmmm... mine failed because I dropped it in water. Maybe that'll catch on after the Retina thing has run its course.
Great analysis...this mini is the perfect tablet not to buy at first iteration...Apple is just trying to play catch up...Nexus 7 is a damn good tablet...and let's face it
tablet owners have more than one computer and the tablet will never replace a full blown laptop....I love my Nexus 7 but it does not replace my Macbook Pro...Thanks....
My question for you is do you have an iPhone, a mini and an iPad?
Finally, lets say you do want a universally pocketable device the size of an iPhone ... If you don't need, or can't afford a subsidized cellphone contract, would you rather buy a used iPhone off eBay, with the option to use it with pre-paid cards, or a more expensive new Touch? Or better yet, a free hand-me-down from a relative?
And given the connectivity issues of the Touch when mobile, how exactly are you using this ultra pocketable Touch?
Now lets say you don't have a phone, a Touch or an iPad. You can get a mini, which is pocketable in many situations, and also has the option of a cellular radio, as well as a bigger screen for better ease of use for essentially the same price as a Touch. Which are you gonna buy first? I guess it all depends on how you're gonna use it, but since almost everyone Curry's a backpack, bag, or purse around with I'm, I'm betting most people will opt for more bang for their buck than slightly greater portability.
And this is what Apple has to deal with ... A shrinking market where the Touch is becoming less and less relevant, mainly filling the void for those who dwell at the very bottom of the market looking for the least expensive entry to the iOS ecosystem without buying a phone or an iPad, with millions of perfectly sevicible options available on the used market for much less than last years technology Apple is marketing and offering as new anyway.
Maybe there is a huge thriving market for the Touch, but until Apple starts releasing specific product sales numbers, my guess is ere are a number of iPod Touch early adopters that are kicking themselves for buying it before e mini was announced ...
None of this makes sense. You can't put the Retina display in the iPad min with an A6 and if you are going to do that you are using a display that is more costly than the 10" iPad due to the increased difficultly of producing a much more dense display so even if you can reduce costs in some areas you still have that additional cost. Then you have weight issues with the much larger battery you'll need to push those pixels that now make what is a clear requirement for the success of the iPad mini a pointless device.
Have you compared the build quality and component quality from other tablets?
Quote:
Originally Posted by rsdofny
The cellular version is coming. In fact, the form factor argues to have people carrying it around all the time. WiFi will not be sufficient.
Not just cellular for data, I mean cellular for voice as well. I really hope that whatever is preventing this will go away, definitely not a technical problem
Incorrect the 5th Gen 32gb iPod touch starts @ 299
Quote:
Originally Posted by djames4242
I don't get all the people saying the Mini will fail due to its lack of retina display. There's an iPad 2 in the house (which I rarely get to use) and its screen is perfectly fine. Perhaps I'm just not spoiled by retina yet, but shrinking the display size means the Mini has a higher PPI than the 2 so its text should be perceptibly sharper. My concern over the Mini is the use of an outdated processor. Other than the occasional blip about it, I've not heard any real-world mention of whether this makes the device usable or not. All reviews seem to be focused on the lack of retina. Anyone?
It's as usable as your iPad 2, which means very usable. It might have the occasional lag and apps don't open as fast, etc, but it's still very much sufficient for what's out there right now.
Everyone is focused on retina displays because everyone has been spoiled the last few years with them. If you use a retina display of any sort for long periods of time, and then look at a non-retina display, you can easily notice the pixelation and roughness of text. If you've been mostly using non-retina displays, you'll be more than happy with the higher PPI of the mini.
Sorry to have to say this but you are flat out wrong.
The iPod Touch is an iPhone without a cellular chip and data plan.
The iPad mini is an iPad, but lighter and easier to carry.
The two products you're conflating have absolutely nothing to do with one another and serve different uses via different apps designed and built around different experiences primarily related to portability and productivity vis-a-vis screen size.
If Apple started with a 7.9" screen over a 10" screen, then we'd be in a different boat as people would have been saying (incorrectly) exactly what you're saying now: it's just a larger iPod Touch. And we would have seen scaled up iPhone apps all over the place. But now we have many thousands of apps optimized for the larger tablet screen, not the phone screen, and this distinction and ecosystem will prevail.
In fact, we're more likely to see the iPod Touch with cellular access than no iPod Touch. Portability and connectivity across a variety of screen sizes.
Further, the idea that Apple would discontinue their best selling iPod to force users to purchase a larger device is absurd.
It's funny how early this year before the iPad (3) launched it seemed quite unrealistic to expect a 2048x1536 display in a tablet despite all the evidence suggesting it was coming and now, just a half a year later, people expect that same display with a much higher pixel density in a device with 1/3 the battery size.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mac_128
And your statement is complete opinion. Show me anywhere on the web where your opinion is substantiated by an "expert" , and not just some guy in his living room.
From what I can tell, the mini is more of what people buy the iPod Touch for.
You are not wrong, In that as more and more kids are being given cell phones by their parents, the iPhone will replace the purchase of a Touch. And as many could tell you, parents have long been giving their old un-activated iPhones to their kids to use as iPod Touches, with the added security that they can make 911 calls.
But the reason people by iPod Touches, and the market demographic Apple is targeting has more to do with gaming. Otherwise, why not just buy a Nano? Yes it offers some organizational features via iCloud, but its a wifi ONLY device. So that's not a priority since it can't be used anywhere. Such devices are used to conveniently load the device with video games, movies and music, then hit the road ... Not keep their digital lives in sync, or surf the web, or get e-mail.
As such, the mini makes for a much better option for that demographic. It's not so big you can't carry it around with you like a Touch, and the added size makes using it so much better than a Touch.
at the risk of being anecdotal, I don't know a single person person who owns both an iPhone and an iPod Touch, nor do I know anybody who owns a Touch and an iPad, though I'm sure there's more evidence of the latter than the former. But the real question is whether a kid, or an adult for that matter, would buy both a Touch and an iPad mini now that the mini is an option.
But instead of proclaiming my opinion complete bull, why don't you substantiate your OPINION as to how the markets are so different that the mini will never replace the Touch.
all of our comments here are complete opinions, so i'm not sure why you are attacking me on that front...
no kid is going to take an iPad mini to school in place of an iPod touch. just because you can fit it in your pocket, does not mean it's pocketable.
First I have an iPhone, and without cellular and wifi its pretty much an iPod touch with better hardware.
Second I said "may not" work in foreign countries. I travelled to Paris and Spain this Summer as a matter of fact. I could not find free wifi anywhere in Paris, and with my locked iPhone 4S I had no cell service, as I was unwilling to pay ATTs exorbitant world plan, or outrageous roaming fees, and truly The number of people I met without any Internet at home, much less wifi, was shocking in a major metropolitan city. Outside of Paris wifi was nonexistent. Spain was worse. I mainly was forced to pay to use computers at Internet cafes ... My iDevice was mostly useless. At least the next time I go back, my 4S will be unlocked and I can buy a local SIM card for both cellular and data. And don't get me started on El Salvador ...
But let's just stick to the good old USA for a moment, farmers and ranchers in the Midwest don't have access to either cellular or wifi when working on the land. Hunters rarely have such luxuries, much less power to recharge. Ever been to a national park? Nothing, nada. Military outposts, sailors at sea, etc. Ever driven through South Dakota? It's a long damn drive and you probably won't like what staticky radio stations you might find there. And ill bet you there are people in NY and NJ right now who are thrilled they bought an iPod Classic with 36 hours of battery life. There's a whole world outside of Silicon Valley, and a thriving market of people around the world who don't have access to the free wifi, 4G LTE, or even regular power.
Finally, as for the cost of manufacturing ... Clarify your statement. What don't "people" understand? As long as there is a market for a device, the cost of the parts has long been subsidized by bulk purchase. Of course there's still a cost to manufacture, but the fact Apple has not changed the design, nor had to market the Classic all save millions which can go into maintaining production for the albeit small, but nevertheless significant market for the Classic. Why else would Apple maintain the Mac Pro? Fewer people buy the MacPro than likely buy the iPod Classic, but it is a well defined market segment which requires little or no marketing to maintain the status quo, which in turn helps support the larger mor expensive ecosystem. And look, as I said before, the Classic does not cannibalize from any other existing product, unlike the Touch which takes money away from Apple's other similar products, as well as costing significant investment in upgrading the device to keep it competitive.
As for using them side by side ... Been there done that. I much prefer using the mini to my iPhone limited to the same functions. gaming is better, watching movies is better, reading books is better, and the mini is not significantly bigger. So stop telling me I don't know what I'm talking about. This is what I prefer, and I have expressed a related opinion based on broad experience. Hardly hot air. But feel free to disagree. It's a free country.
Out of all the criticisms, my biggest complaint is that the 32 GB should be more like $70 more than the 16GB. Anything more is a ripoff....this coming from an Apple Fan/shareholder. It's a small thing, but when you think about it, the most desired size is 32GB, Apple knows this and is willing to piss off customers just to make a few extra dollars.
64GB at $100 more than the 32GB is acceptable.