WOW, every computer that I own, was purchased and made myself using a screwdriver. I used components purchased locally in Canada, but it was still assembled in china!!!
I would really like to be able to choose built in America. I wouldn't mind slight extended order times even. We all know if Apple asked for it, Foxconn would return to the US or they could use one of the many US contract manufactures that are here. Most started here and are already here in California and other states. Yes Apple used to build in the US and even in Colorado. Great machines but the wrong CPU (PowerPC was a mistake never admitted as it didn't ever have market share. x86 and ARM both are clearly ISA's - Industry Standard Architectures) back then but this is now. The tool & Die comment about why not US? was the worst non truth - we pioneered high end tool and die and build spacecraft, telescopes and missiles that no other country can match. A iMac is not and issue nor are iphones - that's just plain silly. Great to see final being done here. It should all come back on shore asap.
And Apple should more of it's profits back to the US too. Step up to the plate Apple...
But YES I would vote for Apple Mac's with $$$.
I agree. It's my only complaint against Apple. I understand the rational of having overseas plant manufacturing Apple products. It's not just cheaper labor but also less Gov. regulations. But if Honda, BMW, Mercedes and Toyota can build quality cars with American workers, Apple should do also. Somehow, the idea of "for the good of the shareholders" as be elevated so high that it trumps all other moral considerations. Shipping 50,000 factories overseas was wrong and hurt this country immensely. Not to say unions and american workers are blameless. A window washer making $11/hr. is not going to pay an autoworker in Detroit $40/hr to build them a substandard car.
I'm an American and I could care less where my electronics or other gadgets are assembled. Where in the USA would you get the level of workforce needed to crank out all the iPhones a s iPads Apple sells? I suppose they could bring back manufacturing of iMacs and MacPros but it seems to me that would be more symbolic than good business. Besides people seem to forget the "Designed in California" part. The majority of Apple's designers and engineers, plus all product, marketing, operations support (higher paying jobs) work in the USA. I've seen the videos iPhone and iPads being assembled by hans at Foxconn. How many Amerians would do that kind of work? Especially when these days they'd probably make more getting unemployment.
Wow. I agree. With. Every. Single. Sentence. You. Wrote. Here. Props to you sir.
Who ever thinks it would really cost that much more to manufacture here (USA) can't do math.
Lets just say, that in China, a worker is making $5/hr and it takes a ridiculous time of 10 hours to assemble one iMac.
Now bring that same assembly to the US and pay a worker $15/hr. How much more does it cost? Answer: $100 more.
Being that it's an Apple computer in the first place (premium product), a hundred dollars is not a big deal. Even at $20/hr, it's only an increase of $150 per machine.
Who ever thinks it would really cost that much more to manufacture here (USA) can't do math.
Lets just say, that in China, a worker is making $5/hr and it takes a ridiculous time of 10 hours to assemble one iMac.
Now bring that same assembly to the US and pay a worker $15/hr. How much more does it cost? Answer: $100 more.
Being that it's an Apple computer in the first place (premium product), a hundred dollars is not a big deal. Even at $20/hr, it's only an increase of $150 per machine.
But but but, the hands of those Chinese workers are so small they are able to make these small computers for us. If they are going to assemble it in the States they'll need 'selective' workers¡
Seriously, will Americans apply for these jobs? Looking at video's from these assembly lines I wouldn't want to work there. Would you, or do you know anyone who would?
Honest answer YES i would work there. Want to work there? I don't want to work anywhere. :P
Something to consider: Some of us work jobs that already suck, why not get paid more. Some of us don't have any jobs at all. Some of us understand you have to start somewhere to move up.
Not every job is for everyone, but I am highly confident that there are people out there that are willing to do the job.
I find it odd that Apple wouldn't be shouting this from the rooftops. In their typical modest style, they could say that they are the first manufacturer to ever assemble a computer in the US.
I find it odd that Apple wouldn't be shouting this from the rooftops. In their typical modest style, they could say that they are the first manufacturer to ever assemble a computer in the US.
They did all their assembly in the US back in the '70s and early '80s. I seriously doubt that even THAT makes them "first".
Who ever thinks it would really cost that much more to manufacture here (USA) can't do math.
Lets just say, that in China, a worker is making $5/hr and it takes a ridiculous time of 10 hours to assemble one iMac.
Now bring that same assembly to the US and pay a worker $15/hr. How much more does it cost? Answer: $100 more.
Being that it's an Apple computer in the first place (premium product), a hundred dollars is not a big deal. Even at $20/hr, it's only an increase of $150 per machine.
That ignores all the other costs of assembling in the US.
- Legal expenses
- Taxes
- Overheads
- Creating the infrastructure to allow them to manage high volume production
- Productivity
That ignores all the other costs of assembling in the US.
- Legal expenses
- Taxes
- Overheads
- Creating the infrastructure to allow them to manage high volume production
- Productivity
Simply looking at labor rates is pointless.
And pension, medical insurance, and ...
Quote:
Originally Posted by BNZ V3
Who ever thinks it would really cost that much more to manufacture here (USA) can't do math.
Lets just say, that in China, a worker is making $5/hr and it takes a ridiculous time of 10 hours to assemble one iMac.
Now bring that same assembly to the US and pay a worker $15/hr. How much more does it cost? Answer: $100 more.
Being that it's an Apple computer in the first place (premium product), a hundred dollars is not a big deal. Even at $20/hr, it's only an increase of $150 per machine.
If COGS goes up by $150, price doesn't just go up by that amount. Assuming >40% gross margin, the sticker price will be at least $250 more.
Still feeling qualified to mock other people's math?
For this end user, if I buy a Mazda or a Honda a huge selling point is often "this model had the engine assembled in Japan." I wonder how these assembled in US iMacs will turn out, coveted or hated?
Your hypothetical scenario is unrealistic. I don't believe there would be a difference of $500 in the cost of manufacture between the two countries.
That depends on what one means by made. If you mean assembled then I'd agree that $500 is very high, but if you mean that all components are made in the US from components or source materials all sourced in the US -and- assembled in the US then I think it would likely cost thousands more. And that's not even considering where the machines were made that will be used to assemble the Macs. Finally, it doesn't account for any licensing for patents that are used in every Mac.
It's about damn time. While I realize not everything can be made in America, I am so sick of seeing nearly everything from clothes to toys to tools being made or assembled in China.
America has almost an 8% unemployment rate and while we can debate why that is, let's get a strong manufacturing base back here at home.
Made in the USA used to mean something and let's get it back to meaning something.
Sorry to be harsh but for those that don't care about where your stuff comes from, it is your kind that is dragging down this country and continues to do so. (this includes CEOs who outsource to increase profit margins)
Good for Apple on this and at least making a start.
Comments
LOL
Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick Byars
I would really like to be able to choose built in America. I wouldn't mind slight extended order times even. We all know if Apple asked for it, Foxconn would return to the US or they could use one of the many US contract manufactures that are here. Most started here and are already here in California and other states. Yes Apple used to build in the US and even in Colorado. Great machines but the wrong CPU (PowerPC was a mistake never admitted as it didn't ever have market share. x86 and ARM both are clearly ISA's - Industry Standard Architectures) back then but this is now. The tool & Die comment about why not US? was the worst non truth - we pioneered high end tool and die and build spacecraft, telescopes and missiles that no other country can match. A iMac is not and issue nor are iphones - that's just plain silly. Great to see final being done here. It should all come back on shore asap.
And Apple should more of it's profits back to the US too. Step up to the plate Apple...
But YES I would vote for Apple Mac's with $$$.
I agree. It's my only complaint against Apple. I understand the rational of having overseas plant manufacturing Apple products. It's not just cheaper labor but also less Gov. regulations. But if Honda, BMW, Mercedes and Toyota can build quality cars with American workers, Apple should do also. Somehow, the idea of "for the good of the shareholders" as be elevated so high that it trumps all other moral considerations. Shipping 50,000 factories overseas was wrong and hurt this country immensely. Not to say unions and american workers are blameless. A window washer making $11/hr. is not going to pay an autoworker in Detroit $40/hr to build them a substandard car.
I hope this is a trend.
Quote:
Originally Posted by balsy2001
You would wait longer, I would actually pay more. Not huge amounts, but I would be in for a a few percent.
Agreed. There has to be some cost benefit in not flying them 6,000 miles in 747's!
Never mind, that it's good for the environment, too.
Originally Posted by herbapou
ship times are slipping, 7 to 10 days now
When the time decreases, that's not called 'slipping'.
Wow. I agree. With. Every. Single. Sentence. You. Wrote. Here. Props to you sir.
That is indeed a common mistake: it should read: I could not care less.
Originally Posted by Rogifan
how is going from 1-3 days to 7-10 days decreasing?
I saw 2-3 weeks just a few days ago. I assumed it was going down.
Who ever thinks it would really cost that much more to manufacture here (USA) can't do math.
Lets just say, that in China, a worker is making $5/hr and it takes a ridiculous time of 10 hours to assemble one iMac.
Now bring that same assembly to the US and pay a worker $15/hr. How much more does it cost? Answer: $100 more.
Being that it's an Apple computer in the first place (premium product), a hundred dollars is not a big deal. Even at $20/hr, it's only an increase of $150 per machine.
But but but, the hands of those Chinese workers are so small they are able to make these small computers for us. If they are going to assemble it in the States they'll need 'selective' workers¡
Seriously, will Americans apply for these jobs? Looking at video's from these assembly lines I wouldn't want to work there. Would you, or do you know anyone who would?
Honest answer YES i would work there. Want to work there? I don't want to work anywhere. :P
Something to consider: Some of us work jobs that already suck, why not get paid more. Some of us don't have any jobs at all. Some of us understand you have to start somewhere to move up.
Not every job is for everyone, but I am highly confident that there are people out there that are willing to do the job.
I find it odd that Apple wouldn't be shouting this from the rooftops. In their typical modest style, they could say that they are the first manufacturer to ever assemble a computer in the US.
Originally Posted by Conrail
I find it odd that Apple wouldn't be shouting this from the rooftops. In their typical modest style, they could say that they are the first manufacturer to ever assemble a computer in the US.
They did all their assembly in the US back in the '70s and early '80s. I seriously doubt that even THAT makes them "first".
That ignores all the other costs of assembling in the US.
- Legal expenses
- Taxes
- Overheads
- Creating the infrastructure to allow them to manage high volume production
- Productivity
Simply looking at labor rates is pointless.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta
That ignores all the other costs of assembling in the US.
- Legal expenses
- Taxes
- Overheads
- Creating the infrastructure to allow them to manage high volume production
- Productivity
Simply looking at labor rates is pointless.
And pension, medical insurance, and ...
Quote:
Originally Posted by BNZ V3
Who ever thinks it would really cost that much more to manufacture here (USA) can't do math.
Lets just say, that in China, a worker is making $5/hr and it takes a ridiculous time of 10 hours to assemble one iMac.
Now bring that same assembly to the US and pay a worker $15/hr. How much more does it cost? Answer: $100 more.
Being that it's an Apple computer in the first place (premium product), a hundred dollars is not a big deal. Even at $20/hr, it's only an increase of $150 per machine.
If COGS goes up by $150, price doesn't just go up by that amount. Assuming >40% gross margin, the sticker price will be at least $250 more.
Still feeling qualified to mock other people's math?
That depends on what one means by made. If you mean assembled then I'd agree that $500 is very high, but if you mean that all components are made in the US from components or source materials all sourced in the US -and- assembled in the US then I think it would likely cost thousands more. And that's not even considering where the machines were made that will be used to assemble the Macs. Finally, it doesn't account for any licensing for patents that are used in every Mac.
Fantastic. So now we are going to get a wave of US-based pest-callers. Sneaky :rolleyes:.
America has almost an 8% unemployment rate and while we can debate why that is, let's get a strong manufacturing base back here at home.
Made in the USA used to mean something and let's get it back to meaning something.
Sorry to be harsh but for those that don't care about where your stuff comes from, it is your kind that is dragging down this country and continues to do so. (this includes CEOs who outsource to increase profit margins)
Good for Apple on this and at least making a start.