Google's Nexus 7 outsells Apple's iPad in Japan over holidays

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  • Reply 41 of 155
    I think we should wait and see whether any other "research firms" confirm these statistics. They seem bogus to me. I doubt that Google Nexus could take so much share at the expense not only of Apple but also Samsung.

    I suspect something was lost in translation, or this is just shoddy reporting by AI.
  • Reply 42 of 155
    pmcdpmcd Posts: 395member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Constable Odo View Post



    It's good that the financially handicapped have an opportunity to buy tablets on the cheap. Hey, not everyone can afford a Mercedes-Benz. Some will just have to settle for Toyotas. The Nexus 7 is the is like the Toyota of tablets. Just as Toyota is not putting Mercedes-Benz out of the auto business, neither will ASUS put Apple out of the tablet business. It's different strokes for different folks.



    Windows PCs outsell Macs. They certainly do. However, the Windows PC business is in a huge slump and most of the companies selling them are losing money. So, let them sell cheap Windows PCs at razor-thin margins. There are plenty of consumers out there who can't afford better. But even as cheap as these Windows computers are, consumers are still hesitant about purchasing them. Apple makes good profits selling their computers and Apple has increased sales over the past year while most companies selling Windows PCs are not doing financially well at all.


     


    The unfortunate result of Windows becoming so dominant is that certain software then was available only on PC's and the Mac became a niche product. In addition, Microsoft managed to convince the world that we would all return to the Stone Age without using Office. In effect Windows PC's became the english language of languages. Now, the phone thing may be different in that you don't yet have an Office or financial apps which only run on clones. The danger is that some app becomes absolutely dominant and only available on one platform. I'm sure Microsoft would love for Office to be that app on Windows phones.


     


    Apple has always been in a dangerous position in this regard. Fortunately, the Samsung's of the world do not seem to produce great software. It's all about the software and, to a certain degree, price. Google has an ad based revenue model and so they can afford to have the world flooded with Android devices of all prices and quality. It's hard to imagine that this will not at some point affect Apple in a negative way much as Windows 95 really hurt the Mac. Perhaps there is some strategy that Apple can use in order to not become irrelevant as they did on the desktop ( with some niche but important exceptions). I do hope they come up with something as the Windows and Android worlds strike me as being really ugly garbage dumps.


     


    philip

  • Reply 43 of 155
    BTW, this same research company had the Sony Walkman beating out the iPod in 2010.

    ... right...
  • Reply 44 of 155
    There analysis is rubbish. Determining marketshare with online stores isn't going to give you anywhere near the real picture since they cannot get the numbers from Apple's online store.

    The mini was not being discounted just about everywhere and if you are going to pay full retail, would you buy it from someone other than Apple? Want it engraved?

    Yet another trash story from nikkei trying to drive the stock price down.

  • Reply 45 of 155

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by AppleSauce007 View Post



    Who made more money?



    Which tablets are being used and generate more internet traffic?




    You forgot one:

    Which do they enjoy more?



    CC

  • Reply 46 of 155
    rogifanrogifan Posts: 10,669member
    Oh and by the way, c|net is a steaming pile of garbage. Pretty much everything they write these days put click bait. Just last week there was an article about how Android was better than Apple in "every way". Now they've got another one from a freelance journalist (who writes Android how-to guides on the side) with the 6 reasons iPhone 6 will be a dud: iOS is stale, Samsung and Android are "rocking it", Apple is different under TC, young people don't think Apple is cool anymore, price matters, and finally, Apple doesn't have a "wow" factor. If that isn't pure click bait for the sole purpose of trolling I don't know what is.
  • Reply 47 of 155
    Yeah, but Apple has already sold more than 13 million ipad minis since launch. The chedda has already been made baby.
  • Reply 48 of 155

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by maccherry View Post



    Yeah, but Apple has already sold more than 13 million ipad minis since launch. The chedda has already been made baby.




    Wouldn't that make the Mini the Toyota of tablets?


     


    Mass device (13M...) : check.


    Lower (screen, not casing) quality than the Nexus : check.

  • Reply 49 of 155
    eksodoseksodos Posts: 186member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by AppleSauce007 View Post



    Who made more money?



    Which tablets are being used and generate more internet traffic?


     


    I couldn't give a damn which company is making more profit. All I care about is there is a product on the market I want, and that product is being sold at a price I'm willing to pay. And I sure as hell don't care how other people are allegedly using the products I have chosen to purchase. It's how I use it that counts.

  • Reply 50 of 155
    asdasdasdasd Posts: 5,330member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Michael Scrip View Post





    Define "lose"



    Android already dominates the smartphone market with 75% market share to Apple's 15%



    But I have yet to see the result of Android having all that market share... other than simply being able to say they have the most market share.



    Apple... a distant 2nd place with only 15% market share... has already captured the eyes of the developers and the accessory makers. Market share alone won't make developers rush over to Android... and you can count on one hand the number of speaker docks or alarm clocks available for MicroUSB Android devices.



    Oh there are a few speaker docks for Android... but the USB plug is only used for power. You still have to use an AUX cable or Bluetooth for audio.



    I think it's pretty safe to say that the accessory makers still favor Apple products... despite Android having 5 times more market share. Again... market share alone doesn't attract 3rd parties.



    As for Apple... they don't need market share to stay in business. They are making more money with only 15% than the rest of the industry combined.



    But they certainly need a market. And as long as Apple is selling millions and millions of products... I think they've got a market.



    So... more money, more accessories, more developers... all from a company who is NOT in the dominant position. That kinda disproves the market share myth, huh.



    .


     


    I am tired of these arguments. The installed base of iOS is about the same as Android, and a lot of old Android devices are not useful for apps. Hence the difference - however revenue on the Google Play is growing faster than revenue on the App Store, something which can only continue. Eventually if Apple is less than 20% of the market, it will have lower mindshare amongst devs, and your argument in the next year or so  will be "so what if it is 5% of the market and 5% of the downloads: it can still survive on 10% of the profits". 


     


    I thought however that Apple was in this to win, it - a al going thermonuclear on Android. At the moment they are acting timidly. And the legal route isn't working.


     


    The market agrees, Apple is massively undervalued for a growth company with exponential growth. Its forward P/E is 5-6.


     


    So Apple can maintain temporary margins, and temporary profits at the expense of longer term profits and revenues, or disappear into relative obscurity once again. 

  • Reply 51 of 155
    eksodoseksodos Posts: 186member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post



    Oh and by the way, c|net is a steaming pile of garbage. Pretty much everything they write these days put click bait. Just last week there was an article about how Android was better than Apple in "every way". Now they've got another one from a freelance journalist (who writes Android how-to guides on the side) with the 6 reasons iPhone 6 will be a dud: iOS is stale, Samsung and Android are "rocking it", Apple is different under TC, young people don't think Apple is cool anymore, price matters, and finally, Apple doesn't have a "wow" factor. If that isn't pure click bait for the sole purpose of trolling I don't know what is.


     


    It could just be called, you know, an opinion written by a freelance journalist. Opinion pieces are acceptable, even if they don't conform to your personal viewpoint of the world.


     


    Personally I do think iOS is a bit stale. I upgraded to a 4S from a 3GS and definitely questioned my decision afterwards. It's the same OS running a little faster on a better looking display. The camera is also very overrated. Sure it's a lot better than the 3GS, but it's still not something I'd want to use regularly for shooting photography. It's a great phone, but honestly I could have continued to have lived happily with the 3GS on a dirt cheap unsubsidized phone contract. I think that's a sad conclusion to draw on a phone released back in mid-2009.

  • Reply 52 of 155
    Its a bleak day indeed for iPad haters and competitors.

    When all they have left is to resort to shady sales surveys in some far off land to beat it!
  • Reply 53 of 155
    matrix07matrix07 Posts: 1,993member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by lightknight View Post




    Wouldn't that make the Mini the Toyota of tablets?


     


    Mass device (13M...) : check.


    Lower (screen, not casing) quality than the Nexus : check.



    I wonder why you forgot "more expensive"?


     


    In my humble opinion I wouldn't touch Nexus 7 just because the fact that it comes from Google. If it's Microsoft's then maybe. I don't support shady company on privacy issue (oh, yeah don't ask for it I'm too lazy to list). At least I can sleep better with iPad.


    But I have tested it and performance-wise I still prefer iPad mini anyway.

  • Reply 54 of 155
    matrix07matrix07 Posts: 1,993member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by asdasd View Post


     


    I am tired of these arguments. The installed base of iOS is about the same as Android, and a lot of old Android devices are not useful for apps. Hence the difference - however revenue on the Google Play is growing faster than revenue on the App Store, something which can only continue. Eventually if Apple is less than 20% of the market, it will have lower mindshare amongst devs, and your argument in the next year or so  will be "so what if it is 5% of the market and 5% of the downloads: it can still survive on 10% of the profits". 


     


    I thought however that Apple was in this to win, it - a al going thermonuclear on Android. At the moment they are acting timidly. And the legal route isn't working.


     


    The market agrees, Apple is massively undervalued for a growth company with exponential growth. Its forward P/E is 5-6.


     


    So Apple can maintain temporary margins, and temporary profits at the expense of longer term profits and revenues, or disappear into relative obscurity once again. 



    hmm.. why judge the store on its growth (percentage)? Isn't revenue is a better judgement? Also I don't think Apple will have lower mindshare just because it has 20% of the market or whatever as long as Apple users are spending. 


    For example, straight from the horse's mouth about BBC Olympic apps on both Android and iOS


    "Back in July, when we launched the Olympics app for iPhone and Android together, we saw over three times as many downloads of the iPhone version."


    This despite the much lower marketshare of iPhone.


     


    http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/bbcinternet/2013/01/sport_app.html?postId=114875291

  • Reply 55 of 155
    lerxtlerxt Posts: 185member
    Like I keep on saying, Apple in Asia is nowhere near as popular as it was, iPhones are relatively rare. I worked with a team the other day who almost all had iPhones a year ago and today they ALL had Samsung phones...
  • Reply 56 of 155

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by eksodos View Post


     


    It could just be called, you know, an opinion written by a freelance journalist. Opinion pieces are acceptable, even if they don't conform to your personal viewpoint of the world.


     


    Personally I do think iOS is a bit stale. I upgraded to a 4S from a 3GS and definitely questioned my decision afterwards. It's the same OS running a little faster on a better looking display. The camera is also very overrated. Sure it's a lot better than the 3GS, but it's still not something I'd want to use regularly for shooting photography. It's a great phone, but honestly I could have continued to have lived happily with the 3GS on a dirt cheap unsubsidized phone contract. I think that's a sad conclusion to draw on a phone released back in mid-2009.





    I used the Galaxy S3 for pro reasons, and its camera is imho MASSIVELY inferior to my iPhone 4. Not even a 4S, an "old" 4. (Note, I wanted to upgrade to  iPhone 5, but the iMac 27i is looking so nice that I need one first. Even though I need to convince The Lady who disagrees... ) Therefore, I question your analysis on the iPhone's camera, since if you compare it to the competition, it's rather great, and if you compare it to a CANON or Leica 1000+$ camera, maybe you're not doing a fair comparison...

  • Reply 57 of 155

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by matrix07 View Post


    hmm.. why judge the store on its growth (percentage)? Isn't revenue is a better judgement? Also I don't think Apple will have lower mindshare just because it has 20% of the market or whatever as long as Apple users are spending. 


    For example, straight from the horse's mouth about BBC Olympic apps on both Android and iOS


    "Back in July, when we launched the Olympics app for iPhone and Android together, we saw over three times as many downloads of the iPhone version."


    This despite the much lower marketshare of iPhone.


     


    http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/bbcinternet/2013/01/sport_app.html?postId=114875291



    Precisely.


     


    In the mindshare stakes, it's important to realise that developers and software houses are capitalists and not "Apple fanboys", as angry Android supporters seem to think when new apps are released first for the iOS platform.


     


    So it's obviously the App Store downloads proportion coupled with the relatively low incidence of rampant piracy that continues to tip the scales decisively in Apple's favour. Key in the extra effort required to develop for the various shades of Android hardware, and Google's preferential bias towards free apps with advertising revenue as the developers' money-maker (with all its excess baggage of privacy concerns) and there you have it.


     


    In other words, it's the number of PAYING clients as customers, not the total number of devices that is the kicker, and is likely to stay that way until the competition comes up with a better, different market strategy than just "throwing numbers against the wall to see what sticks".


     


    Equally important is the fact that both strategies are viable, so doomsayers waiting for one platform or the other to blink, crash and burn will probably have a long, long while to wait - only a technological quantum leap in the manner of iPhone's 2007 advent is likely to trigger any dramatic changes in the landscape of vendors' fortunes.


     


    Apple's strategy has consistently allowed it to thrive alongside competitors (see iPod's dominance amid Toshiba, Sony, Casio, Zen , iRiver,0 etc and MacBooks in the crowded laptop market).

  • Reply 58 of 155

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by matrix07 View Post


    I wonder why you forgot "more expensive"?


     


    In my humble opinion I wouldn't touch Nexus 7 just because the fact that it comes from Google. If it's Microsoft's then maybe. I don't support shady company on privacy issue (oh, yeah don't ask for it I'm too lazy to list). At least I can sleep better with iPad.


    But I have tested it and performance-wise I still prefer iPad mini anyway.



    1- Expensive is (in my opinion) not appropriate as a metrics here because


    A- 330 is still not budget-breaking (I can still eat this month and get one...)


    B- if price is a good metrics, I have very expensive pencils to sell to you


     


    2- You're entitled to your opinion, but to me, any big corporation is at least suspect and definitely, Microsoft's track record is worse than Google's. My opinion, I hope someone somewhere in this big world shares it :p


     


    3- Of course you may prefer iPad Mini. I never said it's not an OK machine. I happen to believe Nexus 7 is superior, and definitely Nexus 7 fits my preference better, but why shouldn't other people have other needs/tastes/preferences?


     


    I was just iterating on the absurd comparison between car brands and tablets. Google, quite obviously in my opinion, made a very good tablet called Nexus 7, in order to have a flagship product capable of standing up to iPad Mini. It's politics, and they (in my opinion) completely beat iPad Mini. I have no idea if it costs them millions while Apple makes money on the iPad Mini due to the inferior screen and admittedly superior market (but I don't need that, I only need a reader+browser, as most people do).


     


    In my opinion, the ideal lineup currently and until iPad Mini Retina comes out is:


     


    new iMac 27 inches at home for gaming/movies


    iPad 4


    Nexus 7


    iPhone 5


    MBA 11 inches latest generation for on the move computing (I'm not at all convinced by the Retina MBP, due to them being bigger than 11 inches, but I haven't owned a 12+ inches laptop in 15 years now, so I might be an exception)


     


    Can't afford the complete lineup, so i only have part of it (older models etc) but I accept donations.

  • Reply 59 of 155

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by airmanchairman View Post


    Precisely.


     


    In the mindshare stakes, it's important to realise that developers and software houses are capitalists and not "Apple fanboys", as angry Android supporters seem to think when new apps are released first for the iOS platform.


     


    So it's obviously the App Store downloads proportion coupled with the relatively low incidence of rampant piracy that continues to tip the scales decisively in Apple's favour. Key in the extra effort required to develop for the various shades of Android hardware, and Google's preferential bias towards free apps with advertising revenue as the developer's money-maker (with all its excess baggage of privacy concerns) and there you have it.


     


    In other words, it's the number of PAYING clients as customers, not the total number of devices that is the kicker, and is likely to stay that way until the competition comes up with a better, different market strategy than just "throwing numbers against the wall to see what sticks".





    Yes, perfect analysis. It's the same reason why Apple doesn't have most of the PC games on release day (and may get the biggest successes as maybe-somehow-ported-with-few-new-bugs* a while later, see Civilization 4 or 5 to see the bugs creep out, or Assassin's Creed). Software houses are no philantropists, and these are actually more active on another type of Unix (Linux, FreeBSD... etc).


     


    Currently, iOS is a much more viable platform for software houses, for all the reasons outlined by airmanchairman.


     


     


    * I'm in no way bashing the great work done by Aspyr, I'm saying that developping for DirectX first is the logical decision for software houses, and this causes tremendous issues when (possibly, and not for everygame) porting. Not to mention the probable lower performance.

  • Reply 60 of 155


    the Nexus 7 / Kindle Fire make great gifts, but the iPad is something you buy for yourself.

     

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