At what point does the increased ppi not become "overkill"?
It becomes overkill when you literally cannot see a difference. That's why televisions, for example, above SHV shouldn't ever be made; there's no point; humans can't see beyond that.
Judging on Apple's last quarter sales, they aren't losing much. Apple can't be everything to everyone and the day it starts trying to be is the day it begins its slow death.
So... Apple is happy to see 200 million plus sales a year go to its competitors...
It's just that Apple's smart enough to realize that if you have to sacrifice your brand in order to increase sales, it may be a losing proposition. Apple makes 'insanely great' products and is not going to abandon that in order to sell a few more phones. They don't expect 100% market share.
As for this particular phone? It looks fine and the specs are certainly good. We'll just have to wait to see how it actually works and how the build quality is. There are already examples of the A6 outperforming quad core CPUs, so there's more to performance than the number of cores. In fact, it wouldn't surprise me if the 2 GB of RAM helps performance more than the extra cores. It's likely to eat power like crazy, though. I hope they put a big battery in it.
Why does building a bigger phone sacrifice Apple's brand? I'm sure Ive could design a larger phone that would blow any HTC or Samsung design out of the water.
Even if Apple garnered an extra 10 million sales a quarter with a larger phone it would be worth it. All it would take is for 6% of Apple's customers to shift to Android because they want a larger phone and 6% of Android's customers to shift to Apple because they want iOS but in a bigger format. Personally I think the shift from Android would be more like 10-12% for a larger iOS phone.
And when Apple releases a higher rez screen than 1136x640 (you don't actually think that Apple is going to stick with ONLY this resolution for the foreseeable future, do you), then what? All of a sudden a higher resolution screen is OK?
I guess my point is, if 1080p is overkill, then what do you suggest the resolution of this 4.7" smartphone should be?
Not resolution. What's overkill is 450+ PPI for a screen display.
Well, they literally can't make their devices faster. So they have to be at least content to see some go.
Funny, I gave the same answer to you a while back and you had exactly the opposite reply... something to the effect that Apple can always increase its quantity numbers.
Funny, I gave the same answer to you a while back and you had exactly the opposite reply... something to the effect that Apple can always increase its quantity numbers.
That was stupid. It takes forever to build new factories and get them going.
Thanks for pretending I cared or said anything at all either way about how it looks.
Of course it matters that it looks good. We already know that Android works suitably enough for well over 200 million people to buy an Android phone every year and if it actually looks good then it just gives people even more reason to buy one.
Why does building a bigger phone sacrifice Apple's brand? I'm sure Ive could design a larger phone that would blow any HTC or Samsung design out of the water.
Even if Apple garnered an extra 10 million sales a quarter with a larger phone it would be worth it. All it would take is for 6% of Apple's customers to shift to Android because they want a larger phone and 6% of Android's customers to shift to Apple because they want iOS but in a bigger format. Personally I think the shift from Android would be more like 10-12% for a larger iOS phone.
Well, let's play a game.
Who knows more about Apple's business and design of systems? Apple (including Ive) or you?
It becomes overkill when you literally cannot see a difference. That's why televisions, for example, above SHV shouldn't ever be made; there's no point; humans can't see beyond that.
But you have to realize, 4.7" and 720p looks pretty crappy to me. I've seen those large screen Android phones and I can make out the pixels pretty clear as day (like the Galaxy S III) -- something that I can't do with my iPhone 5. For Android phones with large screen sizes, 1080p is the next logical step.
Going with something in between those two resolutions doesn't make sense.
Thanks for pretending that in THAT post I said anything about the effect of appearance, specifically on purchases…
This is fun. I don't even have to HAVE another side of whatever argument this is, since you're apparently just making it up for me.
No, what you asked was how does this phone up the ante.
I think it's fairly obvious that it ups the ante of larger phones by appearance alone and I was saying that I didn't expect you to give them credit for that.
Hell, as mentioned previously, we already know that hundreds of millions of people are satisfied enough with the Android phone OS that they continue to increase sales every year.
More cores CAN result in better power efficiency, if you mix low and high power cores and switch the high power ones off when not required.
Even if it's the same core, there can be advantages since power consumption is not linear. A 10% decrease in clock speed can reduce energy consumption by more than 10%. So if you had perfect CPU scaling, 4 CPUs at 1 GHz would be offer lower energy consumption and equal performance to 2 CPUs at 2 GHz. Unfortunately, scaling is not perfect. More importantly, that's not what HTC is doing. Someone above said they're running all 4 cores at 1.7 GHz - so the power consumption will be high.
But that's not the point that I was responding to. The other posters were saying that 468ppi was overkill. <span style="line-height:1.231;">And there lies the rub, there's no question that Apple will release a higher resolution display at some point. The current iPhone 5 is 326ppi, this is 468ppi. At what point does the increased ppi not become "overkill"? 375ppi, 400ppi?</span>
Simple - when it no longer offers a benefit. More ppi means that your CPU and, especially, GPU have to work harder and consume more energy. The screen costs more. But once you have finer resolution than your eye can see, it no longer offers any benefit.
Apple's current iPhone is a retina display. That means that the pixels are small enough to be indistinguishable at normal viewing distance. Now, if you're going to argue that people will view their phones from a closer distance, then a higher ppi might make sense. Otherwise, there's no benefit and lots of disadvantages.
Age has something to do with it. Also, there will be some people that have spectacular vision. I need correction, but with correction, I'm about 20/10.
How close one holds the device has a lot to do with it too. 300ppi is more than good for most people at about 12", 468 ppi gets pretty silly, you have to hold the device about 7.5" to get comparable performance.
You're just not getting it¡ 1080p on a phone means that your Blu-ray disks can play pixel-for-pixel on the phone. Surely they have a Blu-ray accessory for this device.
How many of you have actually held and used a 1080P phone in person? All these theories mean nothing until you actually view the screen. Since my friend has the HTC Droid DNA I have held and viewed the display and it is absolutely gorgeous. It makes literally everything easier to read and the games were simply stunning. I think the DNA is a 5" phone so a bit larger than this HTC One with a 4.7" screen. It is easy to criticize it until you actually use one. If Apple can make a similar sized 1080P iPhone it will truly be drool worthy and bring back some excitement that to me seems to have been lacking recently.
When will we start seeing some iOS 7 rumors? That is at least as important as any hardware discussion.
Apple's current iPhone is a retina display. That means that the pixels are small enough to be indistinguishable at normal viewing distance. Now, if you're going to argue that people will view their phones from a closer distance, then a higher ppi might make sense. Otherwise, there's no benefit and lots of disadvantages.
As I stated a few posts up, I can make out the pixels on large screen android phones with 720p displays. 1080p displays (should) alleviate that.
If this thing has the horsepower to run the display, has decent battery life, and isn't a lagfest, more power to them. I'm not going to sit here and bitch them out for going that route.
Comments
Originally Posted by Mazda 3s
At what point does the increased ppi not become "overkill"?
It becomes overkill when you literally cannot see a difference. That's why televisions, for example, above SHV shouldn't ever be made; there's no point; humans can't see beyond that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by macxpress
Judging on Apple's last quarter sales, they aren't losing much. Apple can't be everything to everyone and the day it starts trying to be is the day it begins its slow death.
So... Apple is happy to see 200 million plus sales a year go to its competitors...
Thank you for the most stupid answer of the day.
Originally Posted by island hermit
So... Apple is happy to see 200 million plus sales a year go to its competitors...
Well, they literally can't make their devices faster. So they have to be at least content to see some go.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta
No one ever said Apple doesn't want more sales.
It's just that Apple's smart enough to realize that if you have to sacrifice your brand in order to increase sales, it may be a losing proposition. Apple makes 'insanely great' products and is not going to abandon that in order to sell a few more phones. They don't expect 100% market share.
As for this particular phone? It looks fine and the specs are certainly good. We'll just have to wait to see how it actually works and how the build quality is. There are already examples of the A6 outperforming quad core CPUs, so there's more to performance than the number of cores. In fact, it wouldn't surprise me if the 2 GB of RAM helps performance more than the extra cores. It's likely to eat power like crazy, though. I hope they put a big battery in it.
Why does building a bigger phone sacrifice Apple's brand? I'm sure Ive could design a larger phone that would blow any HTC or Samsung design out of the water.
Even if Apple garnered an extra 10 million sales a quarter with a larger phone it would be worth it. All it would take is for 6% of Apple's customers to shift to Android because they want a larger phone and 6% of Android's customers to shift to Apple because they want iOS but in a bigger format. Personally I think the shift from Android would be more like 10-12% for a larger iOS phone.
Not resolution. What's overkill is 450+ PPI for a screen display.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
Well, they literally can't make their devices faster. So they have to be at least content to see some go.
Funny, I gave the same answer to you a while back and you had exactly the opposite reply... something to the effect that Apple can always increase its quantity numbers.
Originally Posted by island hermit
Funny, I gave the same answer to you a while back and you had exactly the opposite reply... something to the effect that Apple can always increase its quantity numbers.
That was stupid. It takes forever to build new factories and get them going.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
Thanks for pretending I cared or said anything at all either way about how it looks.
Of course it matters that it looks good. We already know that Android works suitably enough for well over 200 million people to buy an Android phone every year and if it actually looks good then it just gives people even more reason to buy one.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
That was stupid. It takes forever to build new factories and get them going.
I seem to remember given you that reply as well.
Originally Posted by island hermit
Of course it matters that it looks good.
Thanks for pretending that in THAT post I said anything about the effect of appearance, specifically on purchases…
This is fun. I don't even have to HAVE another side of whatever argument this is, since you're apparently just making it up for me.
Well, let's play a game.
Who knows more about Apple's business and design of systems? Apple (including Ive) or you?
How many guesses do you need?
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta
Well, let's play a game.
Who knows more about Apple's business and design of systems? Apple (including Ive) or you?
How many guesses do you need?
I can play that game...
Who knows more about Apple's business and design of systems? Apple (including Ive) or you?
So... if Apple brings out a larger phone then let's go back to this conversation.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
It becomes overkill when you literally cannot see a difference. That's why televisions, for example, above SHV shouldn't ever be made; there's no point; humans can't see beyond that.
But you have to realize, 4.7" and 720p looks pretty crappy to me. I've seen those large screen Android phones and I can make out the pixels pretty clear as day (like the Galaxy S III) -- something that I can't do with my iPhone 5. For Android phones with large screen sizes, 1080p is the next logical step.
Going with something in between those two resolutions doesn't make sense.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
Thanks for pretending that in THAT post I said anything about the effect of appearance, specifically on purchases…
This is fun. I don't even have to HAVE another side of whatever argument this is, since you're apparently just making it up for me.
No, what you asked was how does this phone up the ante.
I think it's fairly obvious that it ups the ante of larger phones by appearance alone and I was saying that I didn't expect you to give them credit for that.
Hell, as mentioned previously, we already know that hundreds of millions of people are satisfied enough with the Android phone OS that they continue to increase sales every year.
He is factually correct but not correct in spirit.
There are apps for iPhone which emulate the functionality of File Expert and AirDroid.
iTunes is the most popular media store and media management application in the world. Say what you will but the vox populi is clear.
Even if it's the same core, there can be advantages since power consumption is not linear. A 10% decrease in clock speed can reduce energy consumption by more than 10%. So if you had perfect CPU scaling, 4 CPUs at 1 GHz would be offer lower energy consumption and equal performance to 2 CPUs at 2 GHz. Unfortunately, scaling is not perfect. More importantly, that's not what HTC is doing. Someone above said they're running all 4 cores at 1.7 GHz - so the power consumption will be high.
Simple - when it no longer offers a benefit. More ppi means that your CPU and, especially, GPU have to work harder and consume more energy. The screen costs more. But once you have finer resolution than your eye can see, it no longer offers any benefit.
Apple's current iPhone is a retina display. That means that the pixels are small enough to be indistinguishable at normal viewing distance. Now, if you're going to argue that people will view their phones from a closer distance, then a higher ppi might make sense. Otherwise, there's no benefit and lots of disadvantages.
Well, I didn't ask you to do anything here. (Certainly not to try to convert me to an Android user).
You're just not getting it¡ 1080p on a phone means that your Blu-ray disks can play pixel-for-pixel on the phone. Surely they have a Blu-ray accessory for this device.
How many of you have actually held and used a 1080P phone in person? All these theories mean nothing until you actually view the screen. Since my friend has the HTC Droid DNA I have held and viewed the display and it is absolutely gorgeous. It makes literally everything easier to read and the games were simply stunning. I think the DNA is a 5" phone so a bit larger than this HTC One with a 4.7" screen. It is easy to criticize it until you actually use one. If Apple can make a similar sized 1080P iPhone it will truly be drool worthy and bring back some excitement that to me seems to have been lacking recently.
When will we start seeing some iOS 7 rumors? That is at least as important as any hardware discussion.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta
Apple's current iPhone is a retina display. That means that the pixels are small enough to be indistinguishable at normal viewing distance. Now, if you're going to argue that people will view their phones from a closer distance, then a higher ppi might make sense. Otherwise, there's no benefit and lots of disadvantages.
As I stated a few posts up, I can make out the pixels on large screen android phones with 720p displays. 1080p displays (should) alleviate that.
If this thing has the horsepower to run the display, has decent battery life, and isn't a lagfest, more power to them. I'm not going to sit here and bitch them out for going that route.