Yea Schiller, keep bashing the competition like a crybaby. Way to stay classy. That will make Apple look better in the media right? How about making iOS better instead of being jealous and insecure? As far as I am concerned, android 2.3.6 can do everything iOS 6 can. 2.5 years old android OS is as advanced a your current iOS.
I've used Android and owned a Nexus 4 for a brief period and out of the box the OS just has half the features of iOS. Granted you can do more and add any number of features on by downloading an app to do it, but talking about the core pre-installed OS I didn't find it a patch on iOS. I became frustrated with it very quickly and frankly didn't want to waste my time hunting for a bolt on solution in the Play Store. I've no idea how manufacturer skins on Android enhance this, but just from using the Nexus 4 I found Android to be pretty poor, there were so many things that it couldn't do or that didn't just work.
Very strange to see a senior Apple exec going around talking about the competition like this with the media. Apple definitely comes off a bit desperate and rattled, even if in reality they are not. Maybe they are feeling it with the plummeting value of the share price.
Quote:
Originally Posted by professorsteve
Phil hurt Apple mightily with these comments. He drew terrible press on the morning TV shows by saying negative things about Samsung.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan
If Schiller was smart he wouldn't have taken the bait. I'm one who has pushed for Apple to do more PR but I think it should be on their terms. Giving some quotes to the WJS which they can spin as Apple being on the defensive is not good PR.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mars123
Yea Schiller, keep bashing the competition like a crybaby. Way to stay classy.
We don't know the circumstances of this interview. We don't know how he was approached, all the questions he was asked etc. It's possible this was part of something bigger and Reuters etc just decided to only publish these comments because of the hit fodder content that talking about this issue at this time gives them. Truth is even if Phil had said no comment or 'we wish them well and good luck with their launch' WSJ etc would have found a way to spin it as Apple is running scared or some other negative. Because that's their game. They try to score hits by bashing Apple with selective topics, quotes, publishing negative talk from analysts etc.
"Apple needs to come up with some new feature of their own, rather than trying to badmouth their competition-"
I think you mean Samsung there
As for "keeping up", how about Samsing keeping up with OS updates?
Because even if Samsing DOES use the latest OS, will it continue to get UPDATES to the latest OS? Past history says no: they'll cut you off before your 2-year contract is even up! Imagine if Apple had that same habit--forcing you to buy new hardware before the old is paid off, just to get OS updates and even security patches? Apple supports their hardware longer.
Just one of the ways fragmentation hurts users. Another being, as you hint at, that developers make fewer and worse apps!
If Schiller was smart he wouldn't have taken the bait. I'm one who has pushed for Apple to do more PR but I think it should be on their terms. Giving some quotes to the WJS which they can spin as Apple being on the defensive is not good PR.
Apple marketing chief Phil Schiller took aim at Android in general and Samsung in particular, saying that the Galaxy S IV will ship with "an OS that is nearly a year old" ...
AI can't get it right either. Wonder who the writer was?
This does make Apple look a little desperate. With the first new major phone in two years (iPhone 5) *and* giving away iPhone 4's for free they were able to gain 3.5% US market share. So what do they have to counter the S IV for the next two years? They'll likely get a minor bump from the 5s, but that will only offset the inevitable lull they get as people stop buying the iPhone 5 waiting for the 5s release.
Apple needs to come up with some new feature of their own, rather than trying to badmouth their competition- because like it or not Android phones are tremendous- especially if you value function over aesthetics.
(Trolling blah)
The 4 and 5 outsold the SG3. I never had the 4 so when I replaced my crappy android with the 4S, i was happy as well with the vast majority of 4S buyers.
Apple doesn't play the volume game. It still commands 70% of the mobile profits.
To be honest no one knows that for certain outside of Samsung and Apple themselves (and perhaps a couple of courts). Neither will publicly break out shipments by model. Anything you've read and taking as fact has really been educated guesses and no more.
I do agree it's likely correct tho based on circumstantial evidence. Certainly not a fact.
The 4 and 5 outsold the SG3. I never had the 4 so when I replaced my crappy android with the 4S, i was happy as well with the vast majority of 4S buyers.
Apple doesn't play the volume game. It still commands 70% of the mobile profits.
Its not that apple doesn't play the volume game, Apple lost the volume game to samsung. Now all they have left is the profit margin. How is having a high profit margin good for the consumers? Doesn't it mean they are overcharging the customers for something that isn't worth as much? Why should consumers be happy that Apple makes the most profit off them if they buy an apple product?
As much as I'm a fan of Apple products, I have to admit that the last versions of iOS feel outdated.
That's what's most disturbing about a comment like "ship with an OS that is nearly a year old" - iOS is 6 months old (more if you count when betas started showing up), and that's also just assuming that Samsung doesn't roll this new phone out with an updated version of Android. I'm an iOS user and really would like to see updated (and new) features that put the iPhone / iPad ahead, not read FUD statements about how the competition might ship with an OS just a bit older than iOS6 - which is, frankly, almost unchanged since iOS4. How about nice multitasking/process switching like PreOS had? Working Siri? Working Maps? (I just asked for directions to a nearby park the other day, got back something like a 10 hour drive to another state... And that's the sort of thing that has happened repeatedly to where I don't trust the map engine!) Better landing page and/or lock screen? Something else really new!?
I look to Apple to innovate. I understand that they have been ruthlessly copied in both hardware and software design and that the courts apparently aren't giving any meaningful protection, but they are making plenty of money and really need to keep showing others what actual innovation looks like. Higher res screens / faster CPUs / better battery life are all nice but totally expected thanks to progress in electronics. Having Samsung essentially scoop them with face-recognition integration just makes it kind of look like Apple is coasting. (And I'm hopeful that there will be new tech coming - fingerprint readers, haptic feedback, ???)
As long as it is at least on the Jelly Bean platform, the exact version has far less effect on the user's experience than the TouchWiz overlay does. Whether or not the UI will be an enjoyable experience is much more dependent on how well that has been designed.
I personally have never been a fan of TouchWiz, and prefer to use vanilla android, especially as of ICS forward. If I had to pick a vendor overlay I think it would be HTC's Sense. Having said that, I've seen more people actually liking TouchWiz recently with the SGS3's and Note's popularity.
tl;dr: The exact version of Android doesn't matter, it's what they did with TouchWiz that really counts.
The majority of customers are common users who prefer a familiar UI to relearning. ... So an 'old' looking OS and lack of crazy stuff is fine with them.
Androids system opens up too many possible holes and they are patched to slowly with all waiting for your carrier to add their things. Not to mention the nonsense that sometimes a phone you bought six months ago can't be updated to the new software
If the majority of customers prefers a "familiar UI ... so an old looking OS and lack of crazy stuff is fine with them" then the ""nonsense that sometimes a phone you bought six months ago can't be updated to the new software" is entirely a moot point.
Android phones are wonderful, and Apple will continue making great products.
"Apple needs to come up with some new feature of their own, rather than trying to badmouth their competition-"
I think you mean Samsung there
As for "keeping up", how about Samsing keeping up with OS updates?
Because even if Samsing DOES use the latest OS, will it continue to get UPDATES to the latest OS? Past history says no: they'll cut you off before your 2-year contract is even up! Imagine if Apple had that same habit--forcing you to buy new hardware before the old is paid off, just to get OS updates and even security patches? Apple supports their hardware longer.
Just one of the ways fragmentation hurts users. Another being, as you hint at, that developers make fewer and worse apps!
Actually, Samsung has been decent with the upgrades.
The original galaxy s was upgraded from 2.1 eclair to 2.2 froyo to 2.3 gingerbread.
The galaxy s2 was upgraded from 2.3 gingerbread to 4.0 ice cream sandwich to 4.1 jellybean
The galaxy s3 was upgraded from 4.0 ice cream sandwich to 4.1 jellybean, and is expected to get 4.2 jellybean sometime this month.
Yea, it still takes them a few months to get the upgrade out and past carriers, which is one of the drawbacks of how android is structured.
To be honest no one knows that for certain outside of Samsung and Apple themselves (and perhaps a couple of courts). Neither will publicly break out shipments by model. Anything you've read and taking as fact has really been educated guesses and no more.
I do agree it's likely correct tho based on circumstantial evidence. Certainly not a fact.
It's interesting that you're skeptical when something appears in Apple's favor but when it's the other way you take it as fact. Apple may not break it out by model but they do give us a real number unlike Sammy.
Its not that apple doesn't play the volume game, Apple lost the volume game to samsung. Now all they have left is the profit margin. How is having a high profit margin good for the consumers? Doesn't it mean they are overcharging the customers for something that isn't worth as much? Why should consumers be happy that Apple makes the most profit off them if they buy an apple product?
I don't believe Apple has ever had the lead in market share. Initially it has been Symbian or blackberry.
It certainly does suck that all Apple has left is profit share. I mean how can they pay the bills? On the PC side, Dell and HP lead the market. They are doing great! /s
It's interesting that you're skeptical when something appears in Apple's favor but when it's the other way you take it as fact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy
To be honest no one knows that for certain outside of Samsung and Apple themselves (and perhaps a couple of courts). Neither will publicly break out shipments by model. Anything you've read and taking as fact has really been educated guesses and no more.
I do agree it's likely correct tho based on circumstantial evidence. Certainly not a fact.
... Samsung is following Apple's lead on focusing on 1 major feature that has the potential to change the mobile environment.
This is assuming of course that Samsung is releasing an eye-tracking feature and that it actually works as promised. This could be a game changer in hands free interaction.
...
That whole "eye-tracking" thing is total nonsense/BS and anyone with any kind of engineering or design competency can see so.
Eye tracking has been around for many years now, it barely works at all even in a desktop setting where the computer is stationary and the user is always in the same place and orientation in respect to the equipment. It also has barely any usability even when it works. Rolling your eyes (deeply ironic) or blinking or nodding your head to make something happen on the screen is of great use to someone without hands or a voice but that's about it.
Additionally, the idea that the phone can "sense" what you want to do based on such cues is somewhere between highly dubious and flat out impossible. Artificial intelligence simply isn't that good and the detection hardware isn't that good either. If a phone cannot reliably recognise a face presented to it's camera when you stand perfectly still (it can't), how will any of this eye-tracking nonsense actually be useful or reliable? The answer is that it won't.
The only thing that surprises me about Samsung's new tech is the great coverage it's getting from the gullible tech press. They should (and mostly do) know better, but instead they are just presenting it to us with a blank face and no comment (in order to give it the "benefit of the doubt" I suppose).
But that kind of false "fairness" is a big part of what's wrong with journalism today in general.
Far better for the consumer, to point out when the Emperor has no clothes.
If Schiller was smart he wouldn't have taken the bait. I'm one who has pushed for Apple to do more PR but I think it should be on their terms. Giving some quotes to the WJS which they can spin as Apple being on the defensive is not good PR.
True, but what the article fails to make clear is that he made these comments to Reuters, because the WSJ article basically ripped him to shreds. He gave an interview in good faith with a leading publication and every comment in it he makes is clear, positive and more on the attack than anything else. Then they publish an article about how Apple is going down and Phil Schiller is "defensive." WTF?!
I agree he should have stayed silent, but my take on it is that he was pissed at being taken for a ride by the WSJ and tried to retaliate a bit.
Comments
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mars123
Yea Schiller, keep bashing the competition like a crybaby. Way to stay classy. That will make Apple look better in the media right? How about making iOS better instead of being jealous and insecure? As far as I am concerned, android 2.3.6 can do everything iOS 6 can. 2.5 years old android OS is as advanced a your current iOS.
I've used Android and owned a Nexus 4 for a brief period and out of the box the OS just has half the features of iOS. Granted you can do more and add any number of features on by downloading an app to do it, but talking about the core pre-installed OS I didn't find it a patch on iOS. I became frustrated with it very quickly and frankly didn't want to waste my time hunting for a bolt on solution in the Play Store. I've no idea how manufacturer skins on Android enhance this, but just from using the Nexus 4 I found Android to be pretty poor, there were so many things that it couldn't do or that didn't just work.
Quote:
Originally Posted by NexusPhan
It's almost guaranteed to have Android 4.2 and not 4.1 The point of this entire article is moot.
I wouldn't be so sure myself.
Quote:
Originally Posted by eksodos
Very strange to see a senior Apple exec going around talking about the competition like this with the media. Apple definitely comes off a bit desperate and rattled, even if in reality they are not. Maybe they are feeling it with the plummeting value of the share price.
Quote:
Originally Posted by professorsteve
Phil hurt Apple mightily with these comments. He drew terrible press on the morning TV shows by saying negative things about Samsung.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan
If Schiller was smart he wouldn't have taken the bait. I'm one who has pushed for Apple to do more PR but I think it should be on their terms. Giving some quotes to the WJS which they can spin as Apple being on the defensive is not good PR.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mars123
Yea Schiller, keep bashing the competition like a crybaby. Way to stay classy.
We don't know the circumstances of this interview. We don't know how he was approached, all the questions he was asked etc. It's possible this was part of something bigger and Reuters etc just decided to only publish these comments because of the hit fodder content that talking about this issue at this time gives them. Truth is even if Phil had said no comment or 'we wish them well and good luck with their launch' WSJ etc would have found a way to spin it as Apple is running scared or some other negative. Because that's their game. They try to score hits by bashing Apple with selective topics, quotes, publishing negative talk from analysts etc.
I think you mean Samsung there
As for "keeping up", how about Samsing keeping up with OS updates?
Because even if Samsing DOES use the latest OS, will it continue to get UPDATES to the latest OS? Past history says no: they'll cut you off before your 2-year contract is even up! Imagine if Apple had that same habit--forcing you to buy new hardware before the old is paid off, just to get OS updates and even security patches? Apple supports their hardware longer.
Just one of the ways fragmentation hurts users. Another being, as you hint at, that developers make fewer and worse apps!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan
If Schiller was smart he wouldn't have taken the bait. I'm one who has pushed for Apple to do more PR but I think it should be on their terms. Giving some quotes to the WJS which they can spin as Apple being on the defensive is not good PR.
Agreed.
Quote:
Originally Posted by charlituna
He said MIGHT, not would.
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider
Apple marketing chief Phil Schiller took aim at Android in general and Samsung in particular, saying that the Galaxy S IV will ship with "an OS that is nearly a year old" ...
AI can't get it right either. Wonder who the writer was?
How about ALL of the execs just STFU and do their jobs?
The 4 and 5 outsold the SG3. I never had the 4 so when I replaced my crappy android with the 4S, i was happy as well with the vast majority of 4S buyers.
Apple doesn't play the volume game. It still commands 70% of the mobile profits.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jungmark
The 4 and 5 outsold the SG3.
To be honest no one knows that for certain outside of Samsung and Apple themselves (and perhaps a couple of courts). Neither will publicly break out shipments by model. Anything you've read and taking as fact has really been educated guesses and no more.
I do agree it's likely correct tho based on circumstantial evidence. Certainly not a fact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jungmark
The 4 and 5 outsold the SG3. I never had the 4 so when I replaced my crappy android with the 4S, i was happy as well with the vast majority of 4S buyers.
Apple doesn't play the volume game. It still commands 70% of the mobile profits.
Same rehashed dated comment on multiple threads.
Its not that apple doesn't play the volume game, Apple lost the volume game to samsung. Now all they have left is the profit margin. How is having a high profit margin good for the consumers? Doesn't it mean they are overcharging the customers for something that isn't worth as much? Why should consumers be happy that Apple makes the most profit off them if they buy an apple product?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric Hamel
As much as I'm a fan of Apple products, I have to admit that the last versions of iOS feel outdated.
That's what's most disturbing about a comment like "ship with an OS that is nearly a year old" - iOS is 6 months old (more if you count when betas started showing up), and that's also just assuming that Samsung doesn't roll this new phone out with an updated version of Android. I'm an iOS user and really would like to see updated (and new) features that put the iPhone / iPad ahead, not read FUD statements about how the competition might ship with an OS just a bit older than iOS6 - which is, frankly, almost unchanged since iOS4. How about nice multitasking/process switching like PreOS had? Working Siri? Working Maps? (I just asked for directions to a nearby park the other day, got back something like a 10 hour drive to another state... And that's the sort of thing that has happened repeatedly to where I don't trust the map engine!) Better landing page and/or lock screen? Something else really new!?
I look to Apple to innovate. I understand that they have been ruthlessly copied in both hardware and software design and that the courts apparently aren't giving any meaningful protection, but they are making plenty of money and really need to keep showing others what actual innovation looks like. Higher res screens / faster CPUs / better battery life are all nice but totally expected thanks to progress in electronics. Having Samsung essentially scoop them with face-recognition integration just makes it kind of look like Apple is coasting.
I personally have never been a fan of TouchWiz, and prefer to use vanilla android, especially as of ICS forward. If I had to pick a vendor overlay I think it would be HTC's Sense. Having said that, I've seen more people actually liking TouchWiz recently with the SGS3's and Note's popularity.
tl;dr: The exact version of Android doesn't matter, it's what they did with TouchWiz that really counts.
Quote:
Originally Posted by charlituna
The majority of customers are common users who prefer a familiar UI to relearning. ... So an 'old' looking OS and lack of crazy stuff is fine with them.
Androids system opens up too many possible holes and they are patched to slowly with all waiting for your carrier to add their things. Not to mention the nonsense that sometimes a phone you bought six months ago can't be updated to the new software
If the majority of customers prefers a "familiar UI ... so an old looking OS and lack of crazy stuff is fine with them" then the ""nonsense that sometimes a phone you bought six months ago can't be updated to the new software" is entirely a moot point.
Android phones are wonderful, and Apple will continue making great products.
Actually, Samsung has been decent with the upgrades.
The original galaxy s was upgraded from 2.1 eclair to 2.2 froyo to 2.3 gingerbread.
The galaxy s2 was upgraded from 2.3 gingerbread to 4.0 ice cream sandwich to 4.1 jellybean
The galaxy s3 was upgraded from 4.0 ice cream sandwich to 4.1 jellybean, and is expected to get 4.2 jellybean sometime this month.
Yea, it still takes them a few months to get the upgrade out and past carriers, which is one of the drawbacks of how android is structured.
Same thing could be said with all the trolling comments.
It's interesting that you're skeptical when something appears in Apple's favor but when it's the other way you take it as fact. Apple may not break it out by model but they do give us a real number unlike Sammy.
I don't believe Apple has ever had the lead in market share. Initially it has been Symbian or blackberry.
It certainly does suck that all Apple has left is profit share. I mean how can they pay the bills? On the PC side, Dell and HP lead the market. They are doing great! /s
Quote:
Originally Posted by jungmark
It's interesting that you're skeptical when something appears in Apple's favor but when it's the other way you take it as fact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy
To be honest no one knows that for certain outside of Samsung and Apple themselves (and perhaps a couple of courts). Neither will publicly break out shipments by model. Anything you've read and taking as fact has really been educated guesses and no more.
I do agree it's likely correct tho based on circumstantial evidence. Certainly not a fact.
What...?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric Hamel
... Samsung is following Apple's lead on focusing on 1 major feature that has the potential to change the mobile environment.
This is assuming of course that Samsung is releasing an eye-tracking feature and that it actually works as promised. This could be a game changer in hands free interaction.
...
That whole "eye-tracking" thing is total nonsense/BS and anyone with any kind of engineering or design competency can see so.
Eye tracking has been around for many years now, it barely works at all even in a desktop setting where the computer is stationary and the user is always in the same place and orientation in respect to the equipment. It also has barely any usability even when it works. Rolling your eyes (deeply ironic) or blinking or nodding your head to make something happen on the screen is of great use to someone without hands or a voice but that's about it.
Additionally, the idea that the phone can "sense" what you want to do based on such cues is somewhere between highly dubious and flat out impossible. Artificial intelligence simply isn't that good and the detection hardware isn't that good either. If a phone cannot reliably recognise a face presented to it's camera when you stand perfectly still (it can't), how will any of this eye-tracking nonsense actually be useful or reliable? The answer is that it won't.
The only thing that surprises me about Samsung's new tech is the great coverage it's getting from the gullible tech press. They should (and mostly do) know better, but instead they are just presenting it to us with a blank face and no comment (in order to give it the "benefit of the doubt" I suppose).
But that kind of false "fairness" is a big part of what's wrong with journalism today in general.
Far better for the consumer, to point out when the Emperor has no clothes.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan
If Schiller was smart he wouldn't have taken the bait. I'm one who has pushed for Apple to do more PR but I think it should be on their terms. Giving some quotes to the WJS which they can spin as Apple being on the defensive is not good PR.
True, but what the article fails to make clear is that he made these comments to Reuters, because the WSJ article basically ripped him to shreds. He gave an interview in good faith with a leading publication and every comment in it he makes is clear, positive and more on the attack than anything else. Then they publish an article about how Apple is going down and Phil Schiller is "defensive." WTF?!
I agree he should have stayed silent, but my take on it is that he was pissed at being taken for a ride by the WSJ and tried to retaliate a bit.
Well, Apple hasn't updated Mountain Lion for about 6months.
Apple. Don't do this. So disappointing.