Adobe goes subscription-only, rebrands Creative Suite as Creative Cloud

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  • Reply 101 of 180
    mstonemstone Posts: 11,510member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Eluard View Post




    Also I am sceptical how many pirates there were in the professional environment. So how will this move put more money into Adobe's hands? Piracy wasn't taking money from Adobe before, it was simply not giving them money they were entitled to. So stopping piracy may put no more dollars than before into Adobe's coffers. It just forces the pirates to steal something else.



    Adobe reportedly did extensive research on this subject and it is speculated that they even seeded some specially identifiable versions to the torrents to test their theory. As it turns out a lot of piracy was being used professionally as the encrypted PDF files on various websites confirmed.

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  • Reply 102 of 180
    technotechno Posts: 737member


    I completely agree with what seems to be the general sentiment in here: Not interested in renting the apps for $600 a year. I will hold onto CS6 until another company comes along or Adobe makes their "We're not dumb and we are not smart" announcement a la Coka-Cola and reverse their decision. I am betting on the former.

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  • Reply 103 of 180
    mstonemstone Posts: 11,510member


    I challenge all these so called CS 6 owners to post an appropriately redacted receipt for their software because I really don't believe there are so many disgruntled CS 6 owners. Surely they should own software appropriate for redacting.

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  • Reply 104 of 180
    eluardeluard Posts: 319member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by mstone View Post


    Adobe reportedly did extensive research on this subject and it is speculated that they even seeded some specially identifiable versions to the torrents to test their theory. As it turns out a lot of piracy was being used professionally as the encrypted PDF files on various websites confirmed.



     


    Ok but "speculated" means just that. Not known at all.


     


    Surely if they continue to sell CS 6 then pirated versions of CS6 will continue to be made? So piracy will continue on the bought software — if it is there now.


     


    I don't doubt that there was a lot of CS piracy — students seem to expect to get these things for free, that is a generational thing. But shutting out paying casual users to kill off pirates is like shooting yourself in both feet so that no one can borrow your shoes.

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  • Reply 105 of 180
    the cool gutthe cool gut Posts: 1,714member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by mstone View Post


    Adobe reportedly did extensive research on this subject and it is speculated that they even seeded some specially identifiable versions to the torrents to test their theory. As it turns out a lot of piracy was being used professionally as the encrypted PDF files on various websites confirmed.



     


    I call bullshit on this. Regardless, you already need to register online with the CS6 and earlier, so I'm not sure what it is about CC that is going to prevent Piracy.  

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  • Reply 106 of 180
    mstonemstone Posts: 11,510member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Eluard View Post


    Ok but "speculated" means just that. Not known at all.


     


    Surely if they continue to sell CS 6 then pirated versions of CS6 will continue to be made? So piracy will continue on the bought software — if it is there now.


     


    I don't doubt that there was a lot of CS piracy — students seem to expect to get these things for free, that is a generational thing. But shutting out paying casual users to kill off pirates is like shooting yourself in both feet so that no one can borrow your shoes.



    This is just what I read in the Internet. If you believe for one second that this is some sophomoric decision made off the cuff without serious research then you are another aluminum hat candidate. They have a firm conviction that this is the way forward. If you don't like it then you don't share their vision. It is not like Adobe is run by a bunch of adolescents. They have a lot of smart people working there. You apparently just don't like their philosophy. It only affects me positively so I don't really share your concerns.

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  • Reply 107 of 180
    the cool gutthe cool gut Posts: 1,714member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by RichL View Post



    This move sucks for pirates but isn't such as a bad deal for professionals who pay for the software. Creative Suite is an industry-leading software package and is priced appropriately.

     


     


    "Industry Leading" is a bit of a stretch.  They've got a monopoly, as any competitor would have formidable compatibility hurdles.  It's not priced appropriately, since Google and iOS have turned software into a commodity.  This is why they are bolting for subscription, they are panicking.

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  • Reply 108 of 180
    mstonemstone Posts: 11,510member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by the cool gut View Post




    Quote:

    Originally Posted by mstone View Post


    Adobe reportedly did extensive research on this subject and it is speculated that they even seeded some specially identifiable versions to the torrents to test their theory. As it turns out a lot of piracy was being used professionally as the encrypted PDF files on various websites confirmed.



     


    I call bullshit on this. Regardless, you already need to register online with the CS6 and earlier, so I'm not sure what it is about CC that is going to prevent Piracy.  



    127.0.0.0

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  • Reply 109 of 180
    the cool gutthe cool gut Posts: 1,714member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by mstone View Post


    It is not like Adobe is run by a bunch of adolescents.



     


    I'm guessing you weren't' around for that whole "Get Flash on the iPhone" episode, where you?  Creative isn't even their core focus anymore - it's social media analytics.

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  • Reply 110 of 180


    You can only go CC with one app at $20/month. So if you only use Photoshop, Illustrator, InDesign, DW, etc., you aren't TOTALLY locked in to the $40-$50/month pricetag.


     


    I may give the entire CC deal a try at $30/month for 1 year. I can go back to my CS6 app for awhile anyway if it's not positive.


     


    I get that Adobe wants to increase their revenue stream, but this can bring a full scale revolt. What's the alterative...Quark (ARRGGHH), GIMP.


     


    As for those asking about Squarespace instead of DW.... I've used it. It's pretty decent. Interface can be kind of buggy at times, but you can (if you start a separate free developer account along with your site account) edit the CSS a great deal.


     


    It's a decent CMS, plus you can have your clients edit their blogs via a iPhone/iPad app from Squarespace. Plus the annual cost isn't that bad. Now that they also offer reasonable e-commerce solutions, they look pretty inviting compared to some of the other CMS platforms out there.

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  • Reply 111 of 180
    godisplaygodisplay Posts: 6member
    This appears to be an admission Abode has reached a plateau, where significant feature upgrades will no longer exist or be scarce. The solution: Make the user pay any way possible.
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  • Reply 112 of 180
    eluardeluard Posts: 319member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by mstone View Post


    This is just what I read in the Internet. If you believe for one second that this is some sophomoric decision made off the cuff without serious research then you are another aluminum hat candidate. They have a firm conviction that this is the way forward. If you don't like it then you don't share their vision. It is not like Adobe is run by a bunch of adolescents. They have a lot of smart people working there. You apparently just don't like their philosophy. It only affects me positively so I don't really share your concerns.



     


    Well, time will tell. My money is on this not working out well for them. In two years I predict there will be a PS killer, that Quark will make a resurgence and a new drawing app will emerge. And it's not that I "just don't like their philosophy" I think they are positively harming a huge number of their loyal customers. I would feel the same way if Apple started a subscription model for OS X. (Heaven forbid!)


     


    And there are two silly attitudes to businesses, both equally childish. One is that all businesses are bad and corrupt and out to do us no good. I don't hold that view. But the other is that businesses are run by clever people who can be trusted to make the best decisions for all concerned — and we shouldn't worry our pretty-little heads when we seem to be asked to pay much much more for something because — well, because there are a lot of smart people there. That way lies Fascism, and other bad -isms.


     


    But there are now a huge number of people who will be on the lookout for alternatives — and what the market asks for the market will surely get. Goodbye Adobe. Not all your customers were pirates, you'll regret treating them like they were.

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  • Reply 113 of 180
    hmmhmm Posts: 3,405member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post


    BA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA!




    Subscription ONLY?! Enjoy that, Adobe.



    I haven't looked over their numbers. If they make more from firms than individuals, it won't work out the way you think. Much of the hand wringing comes from individual users with licensing changes. Businesses tend to be very conservative. They may stick with their current versions for an extended period of time until some functionality breaks, but I don't think they will ditch Adobe. Who would be the alternative? My biggest concern is bugs. In the past you could vote with your wallet and skip over versions that retained excessive bugs long into their cycles. That isn't really an option today.


    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post


     


    Why not wait a year or two until Adobe's a month from bankruptcy due to this travesty, buy them, and make their software into something with a usable interface and OS X priority?



    Wait, what am I saying… OS X exclusive.



    You regularly chastise others for spreading garbage. Why would you do this yourself? Provide some level of reasoning here. As for OSX exclusive, that purchase would be blocked unless they slipped out of relevance. Right now they remain crucial to too many industries.


    Quote:

    Originally Posted by the cool gut View Post


     


    You wouldn't make much of an accountant.  Leasing - is more expensive long term, everyone knows that.  To go with the Creative Cloud for tax savings is what's known as being "A penny wise, and a pound foolish"


     


     


     


     


    Who keeps current with Adobe Apps?  They are so flipping buggy when they come out, full of features that are for the "prosumer" market - not Pros.  The last time I upgraded was June 2010, when I paid $676 for CS 5 Design Premium.  I'm not about to go to something that is paid off to $600/year for the same functionality just so I can save $20 a year in taxes.



    That was an upgrade price in 2010 right? The initial license would have cost much more unless you went the student route. In terms of accounting, as I point out below, it does allow more flexibility in number of licensed seats. Businesses are not tied to keeping that license up to date to ensure they're not hit with the full license cost again. It's not 100% one way or the other. Regarding expenses, it is easier to write them down quarter by quarter.


    Quote:

    Originally Posted by digitaldean View Post


    You can only go CC with one app at $20/month. So if you only use Photoshop, Illustrator, InDesign, DW, etc., you aren't TOTALLY locked in to the $40-$50/month pricetag.


     


    I may give the entire CC deal a try at $30/month for 1 year. I can go back to my CS6 app for awhile anyway if it's not positive.


     


    I get that Adobe wants to increase their revenue stream, but this can bring a full scale revolt. What's the alterative...Quark (ARRGGHH), GIMP.


     


    As for those asking about Squarespace instead of DW.... I've used it. It's pretty decent. Interface can be kind of buggy at times, but you can (if you start a separate free developer account along with your site account) edit the CSS a great deal.


     


    It's a decent CMS, plus you can have your clients edit their blogs via a iPhone/iPad app from Squarespace. Plus the annual cost isn't that bad. Now that they also offer reasonable e-commerce solutions, they look pretty inviting compared to some of the other CMS platforms out there.





    Interestingly GIMP actually has better support for formats that store in floating point rather than fixed integer values than photoshop. Photoshop doesn't support 16 bit half float. It opens as 32 and saves at the expanded size. There are a lot of things that could be improved with raw workflow and LUTs. Just look at what Black Magic has done with Resolve. Anyway it does lessen barriers to entry if a company needs to adjust the number of seats.

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  • Reply 114 of 180
    tallest skiltallest skil Posts: 43,388member


    Originally Posted by mstone View Post

    …I really don't believe there are so many disgruntled CS 6 owners.


     


    Guess Adobe won't be making much money on their new service since "you don't believe" there are many users. image

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  • Reply 115 of 180
    mstonemstone Posts: 11,510member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post





    Originally Posted by mstone View Post

    …I really don't believe there are so many disgruntled CS 6 owners.


     


    Guess Adobe won't be making much money on their new service since "you don't believe" there are many users. image



    Based on your past record you have proven yourself to be so completely off in market in predictions we can probably set a standard solely on the opposite of whatever you forecast.

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  • Reply 116 of 180
    arlomediaarlomedia Posts: 271member


    Originally Posted by mstone View Post


    I challenge all these so called CS 6 owners to post an appropriately redacted receipt for their software because I really don't believe there are so many disgruntled CS 6 owners. Surely they should own software appropriate for redacting.



    Not that I need to prove anything to you, but...


     


     



     


    I updated my Illustrator and Dreamweaver to CS6 on the same day, but these are shown on separate receipts because Adobe's online store wouldn't accept my order and I had to place the order by phone and the account representative didn't know how to put all three products on the same order. I had to dictate all my contact and payment information three separate times, and the whole process took about two hours, including being transferred to several different departments. I look forward to more of this kind of innovation from Adobe in the future. image


     


    Anyway, upgrading these three products for $200 each approximately every two years was costing me $300/year with the option to skip an upgrade if I didn't feel I needed it. Now it will cost $600/year with no such option.

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  • Reply 117 of 180
    tallest skiltallest skil Posts: 43,388member


    Originally Posted by mstone View Post

    Based on your past record you have proven yourself to be so completely off in market in predictions we can probably set a standard solely on the opposite of whatever you forecast.




    I'm just repeating what you're forecasting.


     


    So yeah, I buy that you're wrong; sure.






    Originally Posted by arlomedia View Post

    Not that I need to prove anything to you, but...



     


    Shouldn't have given him the satisfaction.

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  • Reply 118 of 180
    eluardeluard Posts: 319member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Marvin View Post





    Wouldn't you also lose the ability to eat, pay your rent, pay for internet etc? I don't see how knowing you will pay $50/month is worse than coming across a situation where Adobe issues an update and you require the update and unexpectedly have a $600 or higher expense in one month. Would it really be that difficult to keep aside $200 to cover you for 4 months?

     


     


    This sort of boils down the essence of what I see as the colossally insensitive nature of a lot of reactions here. It assumes that everyone has a steady income and that if you are not earning money hand-over-fist as a "professional user" — and, God, is that piece of self-congratulation getting old — then you have no right to even think about using this software. If people have a low, but steady income they might be struggling with their monthly bills. This constitutes a new monthly bill to add to what they pay already. And for what? To use software that they have used just fine in the past — software they paid for.


     


    People: give some thought to how you are coming across. This "if you can't afford it then tough for you" attitude is pretty much what marks someone out a douchebag in my books — and I doubt I'm alone.

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  • Reply 119 of 180
    mstonemstone Posts: 11,510member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by arlomedia View Post


    I updated my Illustrator and Dreamweaver to CS6 on the same day, but these are shown on separate receipts because Adobe's online store wouldn't accept my order and I had to place the order by phone and the account representative didn't know how to put all three products on the same order. I had to dictate all my contact and payment information three separate times, and the whole process took about two hours, including being transferred to several different departments. I look forward to more of this kind of innovation from Adobe in the future. image


     


    Anyway, upgrading these three products for $200 each approximately every two years was costing me $300/year with the option to skip an upgrade if I didn't feel I needed it. Now it will cost $600/year with no such option.



    Sounds like there were some unusual circumstances involved. I'm glad it got worked out for you. Fortunately, I have never needed to contact Adobe sales or customer support anytime in the last 20 something years that I have been a customer.


     


    I just checked and I purchased Illustrator 1a in 1986. It came with a VHS instructional tape.

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  • Reply 120 of 180
    the cool gutthe cool gut Posts: 1,714member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by hmm View Post


    The initial license would have cost much more unless you went the student route. 



     


    Not at all.  I originally bought Photoshop.  Before CS3, Adobe would let you upgrade to the Cs suite from any version of software you had.  So Photoshop 5 which I paid about $500 for, I upgraded to CS2 for about $700. 


     


    When Adobe realized no one was upgrading fast enough, they limited how old your version could be before upgrading - I think it's up to 3 versions old.  (with a tiered pricing structure - the older your copy was the more you payed)


     


    Well, it looks like that isn't enough either - the PrePress industry is on life support, Flash can't be pulling in what it used to,  iPhoto, and a plethora of iOS apps are now good enough for most users who are now just editing photos right on their phone.  This is an act of desperation on Adobe's part.  Nothing more, nothing less.

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