I'm not sure what point you are trying to make with your comment.
The article was about Samsung backing away from larger screens based on the recent announcement of the S4 mini with the 4.3" screen. That's only one data point. You reference potentially more data points, but what they reflect is a broad (too broad?) product line of newer/older technology, faster/slower processors, larger/smaller screens, etc. Not a specific direction, just a ton of fragmentation.
In the last six months, what truly new phones has Samsung introduced that have screens smaller than 4.3"? I don't track Samsung phones, so I'm only aware of the S4, S4 mini, S4 zoom (rumor), S4 active (rumor), and Note III. None of them have a screen size smaller than 4.3". Even if they introduce an Android phone with a 3" screen, it still proves nothing about their long term direction. Their past lineup included smaller and larger screens, their current lineup includes smaller and larger screens, therefore a single larger or smaller screen data point proves nothing by itself. We'll have to watch the long term.
What are folks going to say about this supposed trend towards smaller screens if/when the S4 active or Note III is introduced? "Samsung fails at small screen devices and flip/flops back to large screen devices" (that's what AI will say), or the more realistic "Samsung continues to push out every type of Android phone they can, to hell with fragmentation"?
The thing is there is no specific data from Samsung stating x% of the phones we sell ship are larger than y", making the argument that Apple needs to compete with a larger screen a fallacious one, usually biased by the misconception that ALL the phones that Samsung (and others) sell ship are high end and have large screens.
What percentage of Samsung's sales shipments are Galaxy S4's?
As Samsung does not release this data there is no way of knowing, so the whole "iPhones need larger screens" argument is spurious, based on guesswork and biased by largely refusing to recognise low end sales shipments.
What percentage of Samsung's sales shipments are Galaxy S4's?
As Samsung does not release this data there is no way of knowing, so the whole "iPhones need larger screens" argument is spurious, based on guesswork and biased by largely refusing to recognise low end sales shipments.
Perhaps Apple misjudged the market for the new iP5 with a larger 4" display. No way to know for certain how iP5 and last-gen 3.5" iPhone 4/4S sales compare since Apple doesn't release that data. It's obvious Apple sells a huge number of iPhones but what percentage are iP5's?
If only Apple would publish the numbers for the old model entry-level versions of the iPhone with that smaller screen there would be less guesswork at how attractive the larger display is to iPhone buyers, right Hill60?
Perhaps Apple misjudged the market for the new iP5 with a larger 4" display. No way to know for certain how iP5 and last-gen 3.5" iPhone 4/4S sales compare since Apple doesn't release that data. If only Apple would publish the numbers for the old model entry-level versions of the iPhone with that smaller screen there would be less guesswork at how attractive the larger display is to iPhone buyers, right Hill60?
Even for you, who will grasp at any straw to spin propaganda, that analogy is so weak as to not even address the issue. The only commonalities between Apple's phone lineup vs. Samsung's, ignoring all the IP Samsung stole from Apple, is that they are phones. That's where the similarities end, and that's where your analogy falls off the cliff.
You seem awfully desperate these days. Have they threatened to cut off your funding if they don't start to see results?
Android phones went to big screens to camouflage big batteries. It also, as you point out, allows them to avoid the engineering effort to reduce the space required for other components. Lazy engineering all around, including poor power management. Let's not pretend it had anything to do with "offering what consumers wanted".
So the bigger screen is to make room for the bigger battery does not well........require a bigger battery? Your logic is not sound......
yep...i have said it before.....they post this stuff to rile up the membership and increase the web traffic to the site. Then hope for some ad hits while you're here too.....
The thing is there is no specific data from Samsung stating x% of the phones we sell ship are larger than y", making the argument that Apple needs to compete with a larger screen a fallacious one, usually biased by the misconception that ALL the phones that Samsung (and others) sell ship are high end and have large screens.
1) Drop the sales/shipment thing if you want to be taken seriously. Apple also reports shipments as sales, and there have been plenty of quarters when their end user sales are millions less than their reported sales (and vice versa).
The only time that sales/shipment differences have any meaning is if a product is a total dud at the outset and shipments have to be returned. Otherwise every company... including Apple... goes through an initial inventory fill with great sales the first few days, and lowered sales after that.
For example, check out why China iPhone revenue was down $2.2 billion dollars between quarters last year. According to Cook, it was due to unsold-to-end-user units from the previous quarter sales that were just filling up retailer inventories. Of course, they had bragged about all those (retailer) sales during that previous quarter. That's what companies do.
For both companies, this difference between "sales/shipments" to retailers and sales to end users even out over time. Otherwise, we'd see the sales drop off over quarters.
2) You're right that some people misconceive that all Samsung's sales are high end. Likewise, there are many people who mistakenly go the other way and think they're mostly low end. Both mistaken notions ignore the middle. Also, it's very common for articles to only include the latest Galaxy in the "high end" sales counts, which is also incorrect. Not only do they leave out the Notes (which are very high end with their Wacom digitizers), but they ignore the earlier GS models that are still being sold.
I've been over this before, and it looks like easily 1/4 to 1/3 (or more) of Samsung's sales are high end devices.
3) As for screen size, we can never know consumer desires exactly unless a manufacturer put out the exact same device, at the exact same price, in two different sizes. However, we can look at the fact that Samsung's high end / large screen sales are pretty darned good.
Another example. Taking 1Q2013 UK figures ( I added the screen sizes) ..
We see that just the top ten touchscreen sales for all phones (including Apple's) were:
So at least 39% of all smartphones sold in the UK that quarter were 4" or larger. (No doubt there are more that did not make the top ten, such as the Note).
Including the Note, we can guess that at least 20% of all UK sales were 4.3" or above. And certainly if Apple had a larger screen, some sales would go into this category as well.
Is that a majority? No way. Still, is that many sales a good enough submarket for Apple to go after? That's the question.
Why don't you do a Google search. You will find many articles about Iphones exploding including the Iphone 5. I can find plenty of other articles regarding various flaws and defects with Iphones. Remember the recent poor battery life issues caused by a recent IOS update Apple rolled out. Don't forget the recent fiasco with Apple maps. Oh and what about the antenna issues on the 4S. Your precious Iphones, which by the way contain alot of Samsung hardware inside are JUST as flawed as many of their competitors products. Get off your high horse and accept your Iphone products have the ability to be just a crappy and everyone elses products.
"Thanks for that," he said, quite dismissively, not even bothering to fully turn around. "When we care, we'll call you."
Want me to keep going.
Nah, you've lied enough for one day. Shut up and go away.
So the bigger screen is to make room for the bigger battery does not well........require a bigger battery? Your logic is not sound......
The bigger screen is going to consume more power.
The flaw in your analysis is that, yes, a bigger screen will consume more power, but not all of the "more power" the larger battery can supply. So, yes, you lose some to the screen but you gain overall.
Big batteries are how Android devices got decent battery life times, and the way they got big batteries was by getting bigger cases, which required bigger screens to not look stupid. (Because, if you increase the size of your device in depth, it looks clunky, so you have to increase the breadth to keep it looking thin.)
... So at least 39% of all smartphones sold in the UK that quarter were 4" or larger. (No doubt there are more that did not make the top ten, such as the Note).
Including the Note, we can guess that at least 20% of all UK sales were 4.3" or above. And certainly if Apple had a larger screen, some sales would go into this category as well.
Is that a majority? No way. Still, is that many sales a good enough submarket for Apple to go after? That's the question.
It's always fun to have a little numerical sophistry from KDarling.
The flaw in your analysis is that, yes, a bigger screen will consume more power, but not all of the "more power" the larger battery can supply. So, yes, you lose some to the screen but you gain overall.
Big batteries are how Android devices got decent battery life times, and the way they got big batteries was by getting bigger cases, which required bigger screens to not look stupid. (Because, if you increase the size of your device in depth, it looks clunky, so you have to increase the breadth to keep it looking thin.)
oh...c'mon....really? That is the ONLY reason Android phones have been moving to larger screens? In your opinion...it is because they have such flawed power management that they HAVE to go to bigger screens to hide a larger battery? Wow.......all the people buying the larger screen phones...well they have all been duped. They bought their phones not because they WANTED a bigger screen but because it was well the ONLY choice they could have made! It was the ONLY phone available. Wow according to you people that buy large screen phones did it because it was the only phone available to them. The phone makers pulled one over on them huh? Instead of giving the consumer a larger screen phone because it was what they wanted.......it was because that was all the phone manufacturers could produce? So Samsung is making the 5 inch Galaxy S4...not because people WANT a larger phone but because it is to hide the bigger battery?
So then following your logic....the S4 mini will havre far far more battery life correct? Then following your logic....the iPhone 4 and iPhone 3G should better battery life than the iPhone 5? Your logic falls apart really fast.....People want larger screens on their phones.....not everyone.....but some do.......the phone companies are making larger screen phones because that is what the consumer is buying........
The flaw in your analysis is that, yes, a bigger screen will consume more power, but not all of the "more power" the larger battery can supply. So, yes, you lose some to the screen but you gain overall.
Big batteries are how Android devices got decent battery life times, and the way they got big batteries was by getting bigger cases, which required bigger screens to not look stupid. (Because, if you increase the size of your device in depth, it looks clunky, so you have to increase the breadth to keep it looking thin.)
So all the millions of people buying larger screen phones.....are really just after a larger battery? Consumer choice has nothing to do with it?
The Android phone makers just put out large screen phones...and people buy them by the millions......wow and to think it was just to cover up a larger battery......
oh...c'mon....really? That is the ONLY reason Android phones have been moving to larger screens? In your opinion...it is because they have such flawed power management that they HAVE to go to bigger screens to hide a larger battery? ...
So then following your logic....the S4 mini will havre far far more battery life correct? Then following your logic....the iPhone 4 and iPhone 3G should better battery life than the iPhone 5? Your logic falls apart really fast.....
As to your first point, yes, that's what started the trend to bigger screens.
As to your second point, well, it doesn't seem rational, so I'm at a loss as to how one could even begin to respond. All I can say is that what you label as "your logic" has no connection, logical or otherwise, with anything I wrote.
The flaw in your analysis is that, yes, a bigger screen will consume more power, but not all of the "more power" the larger battery can supply. So, yes, you lose some to the screen but you gain overall.
Big batteries are how Android devices got decent battery life times, and the way they got big batteries was by getting bigger cases, which required bigger screens to not look stupid. (Because, if you increase the size of your device in depth, it looks clunky, so you have to increase the breadth to keep it looking thin.)
If I understand your post correctly, you are saying that a wider battery can more than compensate for the increased power consumption of a correspondingly larger display. But if that's the case, how does one explain Tim Cook's remark (quoted from the original article) that "Customers are clearly looking at the size," he said, "but they also look at things like...battery life...."?
I can understand why other companies want to do this because majority of consumers prefer a screen size of 4 inches, a size they can use with one hand easily. Majority of android phones that are 4.7 inches and bigger don't fit inside pockets and are almost impossible to use with one hand. If you ask consumers which do you prefer more in terms of screen size between the iphone 5 and samsung galaxy s4, the overwhelming majority will choose the iphone 5, 4 inch screen size.
As to your first point, yes, that's what started the trend to bigger screens.
As to your second point, well, it doesn't seem rational, so I'm at a loss as to how one could even begin to respond. All I can say is that what you label as "your logic" has no connection, logical or otherwise, with anything I wrote.
Do you have sources for that? Or is that just your opinion? Sales of the Samsung Galaxy S4 well over 10 million now is not because people WANT a larger screen on their phones but because.....they had no other choice? What consumes the most power on a smartphone? The display does....... But by your statement. Android phone makers could not produce enough power for the small screen phones. So to make up for this they made the biggest power drain on the battery bigger? They made bigger screens to hide the bigger battery? But then wouldn't the problem then scale up as well?
Edit: BTW.....i had the HTC EVO 4G on Sprint when it came out in 2010. It had terrible battery life and only last about 4 hours of normal use for me. My Galaxy S4 with a 5 inch screen last a little over 24 hours of normal use for me.....
So at least 39% of all smartphones sold in the UK that quarter were 4" or larger. (No doubt there are more that did not make the top ten, such as the Note).
Is that a majority? No way. Still, is that many sales a good enough submarket for Apple to go after? That's the question.
The important comparison is really 4.5" or above vs everything else. It looks like 15% above vs 45% below in the figures you posted and the rest unknown as it's split between so many manufacturers. Given that all Android manufacturers besides Samsung are only making 5% of Android phone profits while matching the volume combined, it's likely their sales are lower end and they tend not to be larger models.
Assuming it's a ratio of 3:1 in favour of smaller phones, Apple could potentially increase sales by 1/3 by making a bigger phone. However, that is missing out the fact that flagship Android devices are cheaper than Apple's whereas Apple's bigger version would cost either the same or more than their current ones and have almost nothing to differentiate it from the other ones.
The fact that Samsung had to bring out a Galaxy S4 Mini shows that people felt the S4 was too large. The guy from the Three network mentioned that some customers had requested a smaller phone. There's not really much difference between them either - no extra screen content etc:
Tim Cook addressed the issue of having a single model at D11 and said their current strategy has worked out well for them. Sometimes I think the reason people want Apple to bring out a larger phone is to turn round and say that Apple was wrong and they are following Samsung after they pioneered larger devices just like they tried to do with the iPad Mini. The reality is that Samsung is following Apple again by bringing out a smaller S4 and a wider 8" Galaxy Note.
The important comparison is really 4.5" or above vs everything else. It looks like 15% above vs 45% below in the figures you posted and the rest unknown as it's split between so many manufacturers. Given that all Android manufacturers besides Samsung are only making 5% of Android phone profits while matching the volume combined, it's likely their sales are lower end and they tend not to be larger models.
Assuming it's a ratio of 3:1 in favour of smaller phones, Apple could potentially increase sales by 1/3 by making a bigger phone. However, that is missing out the fact that flagship Android devices are cheaper than Apple's whereas Apple's bigger version would cost either the same or more than their current ones and have almost nothing to differentiate it from the other ones.
The fact that Samsung had to bring out a Galaxy S4 Mini shows that people felt the S4 was too large. The guy from the Three network mentioned that some customers had requested a smaller phone. There's not really much difference between them either - no extra screen content etc:
Tim Cook addressed the issue of having a single model at D11 and said their current strategy has worked out well for them. Sometimes I think the reason people want Apple to bring out a larger phone is to turn round and say that Apple was wrong and they are following Samsung after they pioneered larger devices just like they tried to do with the iPad Mini. The reality is that Samsung is following Apple again by bringing out a smaller S4 and a wider 8" Galaxy Note.
I agree....some people wanted a smaller version of the 5 inch S4. Then Samsung gave the consumer what they wanted. Isn't that what smart companies do? Didn't Apple do that with the Mini? Isn't there a lot of people that would want a larger iPhone? I would buy one......I don't think I am the only one. Isn't the larger iPhone 5 the best selling smart phone in the world? It was larger than the one before it...... I would love to have a 4.7 to 5 inch iPhone! :-)
I can understand why other companies want to do this because majority of consumers prefer a screen size of 4 inches, a size they can use with one hand easily. Majority of android phones that are 4.7 inches and bigger don't fit inside pockets and are almost impossible to use with one hand. If you ask consumers which do you prefer more in terms of screen size between the iphone 5 and samsung galaxy s4, the overwhelming majority will choose the iphone 5, 4 inch screen size.
What's your source for this? I would say market data suggests otherwise as the trend is to increase screen size. Since there's no concrete evidence on the preferred size, the trend to larger screens implies that internal research has revealed that bigger is better in the minds of consumers. Keep in mind that the impediment to usability is not screen size but chassis size. The S4 puts a larger screen into a slightly smaller chassis than the S3, improving usability while bumping up screen size.
Also it's laughable to say that a 4.7 inch phone doesn't fit in a pocket, unless you're a girl in which case you probably have a purse. I can put my Nexus 7 in my pants pocket, and I don't wear cargo shorts.
Comments
Quote:
Originally Posted by runbuh
I'm not sure what point you are trying to make with your comment.
The article was about Samsung backing away from larger screens based on the recent announcement of the S4 mini with the 4.3" screen. That's only one data point. You reference potentially more data points, but what they reflect is a broad (too broad?) product line of newer/older technology, faster/slower processors, larger/smaller screens, etc. Not a specific direction, just a ton of fragmentation.
In the last six months, what truly new phones has Samsung introduced that have screens smaller than 4.3"? I don't track Samsung phones, so I'm only aware of the S4, S4 mini, S4 zoom (rumor), S4 active (rumor), and Note III. None of them have a screen size smaller than 4.3". Even if they introduce an Android phone with a 3" screen, it still proves nothing about their long term direction. Their past lineup included smaller and larger screens, their current lineup includes smaller and larger screens, therefore a single larger or smaller screen data point proves nothing by itself. We'll have to watch the long term.
What are folks going to say about this supposed trend towards smaller screens if/when the S4 active or Note III is introduced? "Samsung fails at small screen devices and flip/flops back to large screen devices" (that's what AI will say), or the more realistic "Samsung continues to push out every type of Android phone they can, to hell with fragmentation"?
The thing is there is no specific data from Samsung stating x% of the phones we sell ship are larger than y", making the argument that Apple needs to compete with a larger screen a fallacious one, usually biased by the misconception that ALL the phones that Samsung (and others) sell ship are high end and have large screens.
What percentage of Samsung's sales shipments are Galaxy S4's?
As Samsung does not release this data there is no way of knowing, so the whole "iPhones need larger screens" argument is spurious, based on guesswork and biased by largely refusing to recognise low end sales shipments.
174 Galaxy models!
Phones like S3 and S4 never fits in gentleman's pocket. Unwillingly, will never use them.
Perhaps Apple misjudged the market for the new iP5 with a larger 4" display. No way to know for certain how iP5 and last-gen 3.5" iPhone 4/4S sales compare since Apple doesn't release that data. It's obvious Apple sells a huge number of iPhones but what percentage are iP5's?
If only Apple would publish the numbers for the old model entry-level versions of the iPhone with that smaller screen there would be less guesswork at how attractive the larger display is to iPhone buyers, right Hill60?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy
Perhaps Apple misjudged the market for the new iP5 with a larger 4" display. No way to know for certain how iP5 and last-gen 3.5" iPhone 4/4S sales compare since Apple doesn't release that data. If only Apple would publish the numbers for the old model entry-level versions of the iPhone with that smaller screen there would be less guesswork at how attractive the larger display is to iPhone buyers, right Hill60?
Even for you, who will grasp at any straw to spin propaganda, that analogy is so weak as to not even address the issue. The only commonalities between Apple's phone lineup vs. Samsung's, ignoring all the IP Samsung stole from Apple, is that they are phones. That's where the similarities end, and that's where your analogy falls off the cliff.
You seem awfully desperate these days. Have they threatened to cut off your funding if they don't start to see results?
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse
Android phones went to big screens to camouflage big batteries. It also, as you point out, allows them to avoid the engineering effort to reduce the space required for other components. Lazy engineering all around, including poor power management. Let's not pretend it had anything to do with "offering what consumers wanted".
So the bigger screen is to make room for the bigger battery does not well........require a bigger battery? Your logic is not sound......
The bigger screen is going to consume more power.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ireland
Samsung Insider.
yep...i have said it before.....they post this stuff to rile up the membership and increase the web traffic to the site. Then hope for some ad hits while you're here too.....
Quote:
Originally Posted by hill60
The thing is there is no specific data from Samsung stating x% of the phones we sell ship are larger than y", making the argument that Apple needs to compete with a larger screen a fallacious one, usually biased by the misconception that ALL the phones that Samsung (and others) sell ship are high end and have large screens.
1) Drop the sales/shipment thing if you want to be taken seriously. Apple also reports shipments as sales, and there have been plenty of quarters when their end user sales are millions less than their reported sales (and vice versa).
The only time that sales/shipment differences have any meaning is if a product is a total dud at the outset and shipments have to be returned. Otherwise every company... including Apple... goes through an initial inventory fill with great sales the first few days, and lowered sales after that.
For example, check out why China iPhone revenue was down $2.2 billion dollars between quarters last year. According to Cook, it was due to unsold-to-end-user units from the previous quarter sales that were just filling up retailer inventories. Of course, they had bragged about all those (retailer) sales during that previous quarter. That's what companies do.
For both companies, this difference between "sales/shipments" to retailers and sales to end users even out over time. Otherwise, we'd see the sales drop off over quarters.
2) You're right that some people misconceive that all Samsung's sales are high end. Likewise, there are many people who mistakenly go the other way and think they're mostly low end. Both mistaken notions ignore the middle. Also, it's very common for articles to only include the latest Galaxy in the "high end" sales counts, which is also incorrect. Not only do they leave out the Notes (which are very high end with their Wacom digitizers), but they ignore the earlier GS models that are still being sold.
I've been over this before, and it looks like easily 1/4 to 1/3 (or more) of Samsung's sales are high end devices.
3) As for screen size, we can never know consumer desires exactly unless a manufacturer put out the exact same device, at the exact same price, in two different sizes. However, we can look at the fact that Samsung's high end / large screen sales are pretty darned good.
Another example. Taking 1Q2013 UK figures ( I added the screen sizes) ..
We see that just the top ten touchscreen sales for all phones (including Apple's) were:
So at least 39% of all smartphones sold in the UK that quarter were 4" or larger. (No doubt there are more that did not make the top ten, such as the Note).
Including the Note, we can guess that at least 20% of all UK sales were 4.3" or above. And certainly if Apple had a larger screen, some sales would go into this category as well.
Is that a majority? No way. Still, is that many sales a good enough submarket for Apple to go after? That's the question.
Originally Posted by Joe Dirte
Why don't you do a Google search. You will find many articles about Iphones exploding including the Iphone 5. I can find plenty of other articles regarding various flaws and defects with Iphones. Remember the recent poor battery life issues caused by a recent IOS update Apple rolled out. Don't forget the recent fiasco with Apple maps. Oh and what about the antenna issues on the 4S. Your precious Iphones, which by the way contain alot of Samsung hardware inside are JUST as flawed as many of their competitors products. Get off your high horse and accept your Iphone products have the ability to be just a crappy and everyone elses products.
"Thanks for that," he said, quite dismissively, not even bothering to fully turn around. "When we care, we'll call you."
Want me to keep going.
Nah, you've lied enough for one day. Shut up and go away.
Quote:
Originally Posted by geekdad
So the bigger screen is to make room for the bigger battery does not well........require a bigger battery? Your logic is not sound......
The bigger screen is going to consume more power.
The flaw in your analysis is that, yes, a bigger screen will consume more power, but not all of the "more power" the larger battery can supply. So, yes, you lose some to the screen but you gain overall.
Big batteries are how Android devices got decent battery life times, and the way they got big batteries was by getting bigger cases, which required bigger screens to not look stupid. (Because, if you increase the size of your device in depth, it looks clunky, so you have to increase the breadth to keep it looking thin.)
Quote:
Originally Posted by KDarling
... So at least 39% of all smartphones sold in the UK that quarter were 4" or larger. (No doubt there are more that did not make the top ten, such as the Note).
Including the Note, we can guess that at least 20% of all UK sales were 4.3" or above. And certainly if Apple had a larger screen, some sales would go into this category as well.
Is that a majority? No way. Still, is that many sales a good enough submarket for Apple to go after? That's the question.
It's always fun to have a little numerical sophistry from KDarling.
Video here showing the Mega, Mini and regular S4.[SIZE=5][/SIZE]
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse
The flaw in your analysis is that, yes, a bigger screen will consume more power, but not all of the "more power" the larger battery can supply. So, yes, you lose some to the screen but you gain overall.
Big batteries are how Android devices got decent battery life times, and the way they got big batteries was by getting bigger cases, which required bigger screens to not look stupid. (Because, if you increase the size of your device in depth, it looks clunky, so you have to increase the breadth to keep it looking thin.)
oh...c'mon....really? That is the ONLY reason Android phones have been moving to larger screens? In your opinion...it is because they have such flawed power management that they HAVE to go to bigger screens to hide a larger battery? Wow.......all the people buying the larger screen phones...well they have all been duped. They bought their phones not because they WANTED a bigger screen but because it was well the ONLY choice they could have made! It was the ONLY phone available. Wow according to you people that buy large screen phones did it because it was the only phone available to them. The phone makers pulled one over on them huh? Instead of giving the consumer a larger screen phone because it was what they wanted.......it was because that was all the phone manufacturers could produce? So Samsung is making the 5 inch Galaxy S4...not because people WANT a larger phone but because it is to hide the bigger battery?
So then following your logic....the S4 mini will havre far far more battery life correct? Then following your logic....the iPhone 4 and iPhone 3G should better battery life than the iPhone 5? Your logic falls apart really fast.....People want larger screens on their phones.....not everyone.....but some do.......the phone companies are making larger screen phones because that is what the consumer is buying........
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse
The flaw in your analysis is that, yes, a bigger screen will consume more power, but not all of the "more power" the larger battery can supply. So, yes, you lose some to the screen but you gain overall.
Big batteries are how Android devices got decent battery life times, and the way they got big batteries was by getting bigger cases, which required bigger screens to not look stupid. (Because, if you increase the size of your device in depth, it looks clunky, so you have to increase the breadth to keep it looking thin.)
So all the millions of people buying larger screen phones.....are really just after a larger battery? Consumer choice has nothing to do with it?
The Android phone makers just put out large screen phones...and people buy them by the millions......wow and to think it was just to cover up a larger battery......
Quote:
Originally Posted by geekdad
oh...c'mon....really? That is the ONLY reason Android phones have been moving to larger screens? In your opinion...it is because they have such flawed power management that they HAVE to go to bigger screens to hide a larger battery? ...
So then following your logic....the S4 mini will havre far far more battery life correct? Then following your logic....the iPhone 4 and iPhone 3G should better battery life than the iPhone 5? Your logic falls apart really fast.....
As to your first point, yes, that's what started the trend to bigger screens.
As to your second point, well, it doesn't seem rational, so I'm at a loss as to how one could even begin to respond. All I can say is that what you label as "your logic" has no connection, logical or otherwise, with anything I wrote.
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse
The flaw in your analysis is that, yes, a bigger screen will consume more power, but not all of the "more power" the larger battery can supply. So, yes, you lose some to the screen but you gain overall.
Big batteries are how Android devices got decent battery life times, and the way they got big batteries was by getting bigger cases, which required bigger screens to not look stupid. (Because, if you increase the size of your device in depth, it looks clunky, so you have to increase the breadth to keep it looking thin.)
If I understand your post correctly, you are saying that a wider battery can more than compensate for the increased power consumption of a correspondingly larger display. But if that's the case, how does one explain Tim Cook's remark (quoted from the original article) that "Customers are clearly looking at the size," he said, "but they also look at things like...battery life...."?
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse
As to your first point, yes, that's what started the trend to bigger screens.
As to your second point, well, it doesn't seem rational, so I'm at a loss as to how one could even begin to respond. All I can say is that what you label as "your logic" has no connection, logical or otherwise, with anything I wrote.
Do you have sources for that? Or is that just your opinion? Sales of the Samsung Galaxy S4 well over 10 million now is not because people WANT a larger screen on their phones but because.....they had no other choice? What consumes the most power on a smartphone? The display does....... But by your statement. Android phone makers could not produce enough power for the small screen phones. So to make up for this they made the biggest power drain on the battery bigger? They made bigger screens to hide the bigger battery? But then wouldn't the problem then scale up as well?
Edit: BTW.....i had the HTC EVO 4G on Sprint when it came out in 2010. It had terrible battery life and only last about 4 hours of normal use for me. My Galaxy S4 with a 5 inch screen last a little over 24 hours of normal use for me.....
The important comparison is really 4.5" or above vs everything else. It looks like 15% above vs 45% below in the figures you posted and the rest unknown as it's split between so many manufacturers. Given that all Android manufacturers besides Samsung are only making 5% of Android phone profits while matching the volume combined, it's likely their sales are lower end and they tend not to be larger models.
Assuming it's a ratio of 3:1 in favour of smaller phones, Apple could potentially increase sales by 1/3 by making a bigger phone. However, that is missing out the fact that flagship Android devices are cheaper than Apple's whereas Apple's bigger version would cost either the same or more than their current ones and have almost nothing to differentiate it from the other ones.
The fact that Samsung had to bring out a Galaxy S4 Mini shows that people felt the S4 was too large. The guy from the Three network mentioned that some customers had requested a smaller phone. There's not really much difference between them either - no extra screen content etc:
Tim Cook addressed the issue of having a single model at D11 and said their current strategy has worked out well for them. Sometimes I think the reason people want Apple to bring out a larger phone is to turn round and say that Apple was wrong and they are following Samsung after they pioneered larger devices just like they tried to do with the iPad Mini. The reality is that Samsung is following Apple again by bringing out a smaller S4 and a wider 8" Galaxy Note.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin
The important comparison is really 4.5" or above vs everything else. It looks like 15% above vs 45% below in the figures you posted and the rest unknown as it's split between so many manufacturers. Given that all Android manufacturers besides Samsung are only making 5% of Android phone profits while matching the volume combined, it's likely their sales are lower end and they tend not to be larger models.
Assuming it's a ratio of 3:1 in favour of smaller phones, Apple could potentially increase sales by 1/3 by making a bigger phone. However, that is missing out the fact that flagship Android devices are cheaper than Apple's whereas Apple's bigger version would cost either the same or more than their current ones and have almost nothing to differentiate it from the other ones.
The fact that Samsung had to bring out a Galaxy S4 Mini shows that people felt the S4 was too large. The guy from the Three network mentioned that some customers had requested a smaller phone. There's not really much difference between them either - no extra screen content etc:
Tim Cook addressed the issue of having a single model at D11 and said their current strategy has worked out well for them. Sometimes I think the reason people want Apple to bring out a larger phone is to turn round and say that Apple was wrong and they are following Samsung after they pioneered larger devices just like they tried to do with the iPad Mini. The reality is that Samsung is following Apple again by bringing out a smaller S4 and a wider 8" Galaxy Note.
I agree....some people wanted a smaller version of the 5 inch S4. Then Samsung gave the consumer what they wanted. Isn't that what smart companies do? Didn't Apple do that with the Mini? Isn't there a lot of people that would want a larger iPhone? I would buy one......I don't think I am the only one. Isn't the larger iPhone 5 the best selling smart phone in the world? It was larger than the one before it...... I would love to have a 4.7 to 5 inch iPhone! :-)
What's your source for this? I would say market data suggests otherwise as the trend is to increase screen size. Since there's no concrete evidence on the preferred size, the trend to larger screens implies that internal research has revealed that bigger is better in the minds of consumers. Keep in mind that the impediment to usability is not screen size but chassis size. The S4 puts a larger screen into a slightly smaller chassis than the S3, improving usability while bumping up screen size.
Also it's laughable to say that a 4.7 inch phone doesn't fit in a pocket, unless you're a girl in which case you probably have a purse. I can put my Nexus 7 in my pants pocket, and I don't wear cargo shorts.