It's the only leaked phone we've seen so far and all the leaked "5s" parts fit in this shell. I find it illogical that no one even seems to be considering the possibility since it's just as likely as anything else at this point.
Or maybe this is the new iPhone and there will never be an iPhone 5s at all.
Either way, where is the evidence of the iPhone 5s if it's coming out so soon now?
I agree, this is the "5S" as it's been termed, essentially a 5 re-engineered in a less expensive casing and probably a few other places to cut some costs. Considering how obviously scalable iOS 7's UI is, I would expect these leaks are being controlled to hide the existence of a larger, next-gen iPhone "6" which will launch simultaneously. Then the lineup would consist of a 4.x"* high-end iPhone in black and white with a 4" mid-range available in a spectrum of colours.
* For some math, 720p at the existing 326 ppi would make a 4.5" screen.
I'm starting to think these "leaks" are controlled leaks by Apple to throw off the competition and analyst.
As Gazoobee said we strangely haven't seen iPhone 5S leaks or any Apple leaks in recent months, but all the sudden we see dozens of these plastic cases floating around.
As Tim said Apple has doubled down on security and they have so far done a great job with that. I wonder if these plastic cases are Apple's way of throwing out a red herring to cloak what they are really up to?
I agree, this is the "5S" as it's been termed, essentially a 5 re-engineered in a less expensive casing and probably a few other places to cut some costs. Considering how obviously scalable iOS 7's UI is, I would expect these leaks are being controlled to hide the existence of a larger, next-gen iPhone "6" which will launch simultaneously. Then the lineup would consist of a 4.x"* high-end iPhone in black and white with a 4" mid-range available in a spectrum of colours.
* For some math, 720p at the existing 326 ppi would make a 4.5" screen.
Anyone thinking Apple will announce a larger screen iPhone this fall I think will be disappointed.
Here's what Tim Cook said at Apple's last earnings call:
Ben A. Reitzes – Barclays Capital, Inc.
All right, thanks. And Tim, my follow-up just for you, just maybe asking you this every quarter in different ways. But I just wanted to get your reaction to what you thought of the 5-inch phone market at this time versus three months ago? And if anything has changed in your view as to that market and its place in the smartphone world versus your 4-inch product? And that’s it from me.
Tim Cook
Yeah Ben, that’s a good question. My view continues to be that iPhone 5 has the absolute best display in the industry. And we always strive to create the very best display for our customers. And some customers value large screen size, others value also other factors such as resolution, color quality, white balance, brightness, reflectivity, screen longevity, power consumption, portability, compatibility with apps and many things.
Our competitors had made some significant trade-offs in many of these areas in order to ship a larger display, we would not ship a larger display iPhone while these trade-offs exist.
And at D11
Walt: Some people like a lot bigger screens. Then some like devices between phones and tablets, that operate with a stylus. Are those concepts different enough?
Tim: A large screen today comes with a lot of tradeoffs. Customers are looking at size, but they're also looking at "do photos show the right color?" White balance, reflectivity, battery life, longevity...all very important. Our customers want us to weigh those and come out with a decision. At this point we think the Retina display is the best. In a hypothetical world where tradeoffs don't exist, screen size would be a differentiation.
Putting aside whether Tim Cook is right about these "tradeoffs" would he have made these comments in April and May if Apple was planning to release a 4.5" - 5" phone this fall? Or are we supposed to believe Apple solved for these trade off issues between when Cook made those comments at D11 and Sept/Oct when the new phone comes out? Of course I know Apple in the past has shot something down that they later embraced. But have they done it in the same year? I personally think Apple will get one more cycle out of the 5 design and we may see a larger phone in 2014. Also I'm sure there's something iOS 7 related that Apple is saving for the phone launch this fall.
IF Apple is going this route I hope they price it aggressively. But if they're going to charge $450 for a color plastic phone I think it has FAIL written all over it. Will be interesting to see where this is sold and how they market it since its so different than the flagship phone.
There's only so low Apple can/will go on the price.
If we are to assume iPhone 5 internals in a plastic shell I think $450 is close to the price we're looking at.
I'm starting to think these "leaks" are controlled leaks by Apple to throw off the competition and analyst.
As Gazoobee said we strangely haven't seen iPhone 5S leaks or any Apple leaks in recent months, but all the sudden we see dozens of these plastic cases floating around.
As Tim said Apple has doubled down on security and they have so far done a great job with that. I wonder if these plastic cases are Apple's way of throwing out a red herring to cloak what they are really up to?
Doubling down on security indeed...
Has Apple leaked bogus hardware in the past? If the 5S looks just like the 5 there's probably nothing much leak-worthy. Last years promo video on the iPhone 5 spent a fair amount of time talking about the manufacturing process. I can't see Apple abandoning that after only one year.
Anyone thinking Apple will announce a larger screen iPhone this fall I think will be disappointed.
Here's what Tim Cook said at Apple's last earnings call:
And at D11
Putting aside whether Tim Cook is right about these "tradeoffs" would he have made these comments in April and May if Apple was planning to release a 4.5" - 5" phone this fall? Or are we supposed to believe Apple solved for these trade off issues between when Cook made those comments at D11 and Sept/Oct when the new phone comes out? Of course I know Apple in the past has shot something down that they later embraced. But have they done it in the same year? I personally think Apple will get one more cycle out of the 5 design and we may see a larger phone in 2014. Also I'm sure there's something iOS 7 related that Apple is saving for the phone launch this fall.
Tim Cook cleverly only referenced the quality of current larger screens on Androids and didnt bash large screens in general. He left the door open for an Apple produced large screen phone.
But I do agree with you. A large screen iPhone is not coming this year. This year the focus will be on the low cost iPhone.
There's only so low Apple can/will go on the price.
If we are to assume iPhone 5 internals in a plastic shell I think $450 is close to the price we're looking at.
OK well I don't see that flying off the shelves anywhere then. I'd love to know who the intended market is for this. I know I wouldn't pay $450 for a phone in a candy colored plastic shell.
Anyone thinking Apple will announce a larger screen iPhone this fall I think will be disappointed.
Here's what Tim Cook said at Apple's last earnings call:
And at D11
Putting aside whether Tim Cook is right about these "tradeoffs" would he have made these comments in April and May if Apple was planning to release a 4.5" - 5" phone this fall? Or are we supposed to believe Apple solved for these trade off issues between when Cook made those comments at D11 and Sept/Oct when the new phone comes out? Of course I know Apple in the past has shot something down that they later embraced. But have they done it in the same year? I personally think Apple will get one more cycle out of the 5 design and we may see a larger phone in 2014. Also I'm sure there's something iOS 7 related that Apple is saving for the phone launch this fall.
Well, like I said, the biggest supporting evidence is iOS 7. The cleaner lines, removal of textures, and content-first approach all suggest a much greater resolution independence than they have been doing. Coupled with reports from WWDC that sessions were really pushing autolayout and related techniques, this all suggests that they don't want people developing for 3.5" or 4" screens, but iPhone screens. I'm also very familiar with what Tim said, in fact so familiar that I noticed that he didn't say they wouldn't, or even that they currently aren't, just that they can't give up colour accuracy, contrast, and other qualities of a screen that contribute to the overall experience besides raw size, which is what their competitors are doing. My theory, again based on iOS 7 design choices, is that they've got a bigger display ready that's also equal or better in all those other qualities, or at least close to it. That doesn't mean they give up the iPhone 5 aesthetic - just expand it a bit, keep the chamfered edges and two-toned back.
These are the iPhone 5 when the 5s is released. The aluminum body is too costly to produce to then discount like they have in years in the past. There have been many reports on millions in returns and quality control issues. Some folks return them for minor scuffs on arrival. You cannot discount the 5 with that aluminum body.
Also there were reports of drastic cutbacks to iPhone 5 production and special sales on the current 5. These are all signs that 5 has run it's course and the premium aluminum bodied 5s with dual flash is headed for production. So what we are getting is an upgraded 5s and a plastic 5. And they are going to sell like crazy. I'll take a plastic one in black over aluminum any day.
OK well I don't see that flying off the shelves anywhere then. I'd love to know who the intended market is for this. I know I wouldn't pay $450 for a phone in a candy colored plastic shell.
You wouldn't and that's fine, but I guarantee to you that these will in fact fly off the shelves. These will sell like crazy and Tim Cook will get to keep his full pay.
What's interesting is how a few dollars' difference in case materials is seen by some people as the primary difference between "cheap" and "high end", even if the internals stayed the same.
If that were the only difference, then people will really start wondering why they should pay hundreds extra for some glass and aluminum that they usually buy another protective case for, anyway.
So it seems like that there would be more differences to lower the build price. Anyone have some guesses or suggestions as to what they might be?
Obviously, less memory and a slower CPU is one possibility. Would they also go backwards with the display, or is that not a possibility?
Anyone thinking Apple will announce a larger screen iPhone this fall I think will be disappointed.
Here's what Tim Cook said at Apple's last earnings call:
And at D11
Putting aside whether Tim Cook is right about these "tradeoffs" would he have made these comments in April and May if Apple was planning to release a 4.5" - 5" phone this fall? Or are we supposed to believe Apple solved for these trade off issues between when Cook made those comments at D11 and Sept/Oct when the new phone comes out? Of course I know Apple in the past has shot something down that they later embraced. But have they done it in the same year? I personally think Apple will get one more cycle out of the 5 design and we may see a larger phone in 2014. Also I'm sure there's something iOS 7 related that Apple is saving for the phone launch this fall.
That doesnt mean anything imo. All it says is they didnt do it in the past for quality reasons. Not to mention those arguments are pretty BS, they can make a good quality 4", 7.9" and 10" screens but they cant solve the problem for a 5" screen? I dont think Apple can afford to spit on a larger screen for very long without losing a good chunck of the high end market.
OK well I don't see that flying off the shelves anywhere then. I'd love to know who the intended market is for this. I know I wouldn't pay $450 for a phone in a candy colored plastic shell.
Well, that means there will still be people buying the high end phone... imo its good thing they made those out of plastic, so people like you can still be proud to have the high end aluminum phone. Personnaly I always put a case on my phones, so material or color is irrelevant to me.
If those things are sold in the $300-$399 range, they will outsell the high end iphone, just like the ipad mini outsell the big ipad. This bring us to margins, Apple needs to not care which phone model it sells, margins still need to be decent on those phones.
Plasticky, I guess they will all go into a protective case anyway. Those on a budget in The Western & developing nations would likey spend decent money on 1 device that does it all, phablet= computer, phone, tablet, e reader
What's interesting is how a few dollars' difference in case materials is seen by some people as the primary difference between "cheap" and "high end", even if the internals stayed the same.
If that were the only difference, then people will really start wondering why they should pay hundreds extra for some glass and aluminum that they usually buy another protective case for, anyway.
So it seems like that there would be more differences to lower the build price. Anyone have some guesses or suggestions as to what they might be?
Obviously, less memory and a slower CPU is one possibility. Would they also go backwards with the display, or is that not a possibility?
Thoughts?
The current iphone display, while being of good quality, is very low tech. The new AMOLED, OLED, super LCD and IGZO screens now offer the same color quality for lower power consomption. So I am hoping the new high end phone will move to a more modern screen tech and the current screens will be used on the low cost phones. I dont see Apple going with a lower resolution phone than this. They could also keep the current A6 on that thing. The screen and the A6 capacity are all in place. imo the current iphone 5 model will be discontinued when the new model launches. Apple needs to cut on the components that drive the price up and hurts there margins. what will it be is a good question.
What's interesting is how a few dollars' difference in case materials is seen by some people as the primary difference between "cheap" and "high end", even if the internals stayed the same.
If that were the only difference, then people will really start wondering why they should pay hundreds extra for some glass and aluminum that they usually buy another protective case for, anyway.
So it seems like that there would be more differences to lower the build price. Anyone have some guesses or suggestions as to what they might be?
Obviously, less memory and a slower CPU is one possibility. Would they also go backwards with the display, or is that not a possibility?
Thoughts?
Easy. It's called economy of scale. The first time around, components must be sold at a certain price to recoop engineering and tooling costs, after that they can lower the costs and still make the same amount of profits. Milling of the aluminum cases on the other hand will cost just the same though. Time and materials do not go down and the milling process is a lot more costly and time consuming than casting plastic. Plus, the return rates on the aluminum bodied iPhonesfor minor issues must have take a huge toll on margins.
Any way you cut it, it is a smart move, and Apple will sell tons of these suckers.
Well, that means there will still be people buying the high end phone... imo its good thing they made those out of plastic, so people like you can still be proud to have the high end aluminum phone. Personnaly I always put a case on my phones, so material or color is irrelevant to me.
If those things are sold in the $300-$399 range, they will outsell the high end iphone, just like the ipad mini outsell the big ipad. This bring us to margins, Apple needs to not care which phone model it sells, margins still need to be decent on those phones.
Exactly,
..and not only that, when they then sold the outgoing model for a discount, they were canibalizing and gouging themselves senseless on the premium iPhone. This way, if you really NEED and must have a premium aluminum bodied iPhone, there is the 5s, and if you want the discount model, there is the plastic 5. Everybody wins.
I don't get the bad reactions to these cases. They look fine, and will look better when you remove the protective plastic wrap which you see bubbling in the photo. Plenty of people like color, and many would prefer the less easily damaged plastic. These will be great for kids or careless adults. Premium materials will still be available in the flagship model.
My only comment is to recall a line from a movie referencing the color of a car: "I didn't know they made these in banana."
Comments
I'm starting to think these "leaks" are controlled leaks by Apple to throw off the competition and analyst.
As Gazoobee said we strangely haven't seen iPhone 5S leaks or any Apple leaks in recent months, but all the sudden we see dozens of these plastic cases floating around.
As Tim said Apple has doubled down on security and they have so far done a great job with that. I wonder if these plastic cases are Apple's way of throwing out a red herring to cloak what they are really up to?
Doubling down on security indeed...
Here's what Tim Cook said at Apple's last earnings call:
And at D11
Putting aside whether Tim Cook is right about these "tradeoffs" would he have made these comments in April and May if Apple was planning to release a 4.5" - 5" phone this fall? Or are we supposed to believe Apple solved for these trade off issues between when Cook made those comments at D11 and Sept/Oct when the new phone comes out? Of course I know Apple in the past has shot something down that they later embraced. But have they done it in the same year? I personally think Apple will get one more cycle out of the 5 design and we may see a larger phone in 2014. Also I'm sure there's something iOS 7 related that Apple is saving for the phone launch this fall.
There's only so low Apple can/will go on the price.
If we are to assume iPhone 5 internals in a plastic shell I think $450 is close to the price we're looking at.
Tim Cook cleverly only referenced the quality of current larger screens on Androids and didnt bash large screens in general. He left the door open for an Apple produced large screen phone.
But I do agree with you. A large screen iPhone is not coming this year. This year the focus will be on the low cost iPhone.
Well, like I said, the biggest supporting evidence is iOS 7. The cleaner lines, removal of textures, and content-first approach all suggest a much greater resolution independence than they have been doing. Coupled with reports from WWDC that sessions were really pushing autolayout and related techniques, this all suggests that they don't want people developing for 3.5" or 4" screens, but iPhone screens. I'm also very familiar with what Tim said, in fact so familiar that I noticed that he didn't say they wouldn't, or even that they currently aren't, just that they can't give up colour accuracy, contrast, and other qualities of a screen that contribute to the overall experience besides raw size, which is what their competitors are doing. My theory, again based on iOS 7 design choices, is that they've got a bigger display ready that's also equal or better in all those other qualities, or at least close to it. That doesn't mean they give up the iPhone 5 aesthetic - just expand it a bit, keep the chamfered edges and two-toned back.
These are the iPhone 5 when the 5s is released. The aluminum body is too costly to produce to then discount like they have in years in the past. There have been many reports on millions in returns and quality control issues. Some folks return them for minor scuffs on arrival. You cannot discount the 5 with that aluminum body.
Also there were reports of drastic cutbacks to iPhone 5 production and special sales on the current 5. These are all signs that 5 has run it's course and the premium aluminum bodied 5s with dual flash is headed for production. So what we are getting is an upgraded 5s and a plastic 5. And they are going to sell like crazy. I'll take a plastic one in black over aluminum any day.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan
OK well I don't see that flying off the shelves anywhere then. I'd love to know who the intended market is for this. I know I wouldn't pay $450 for a phone in a candy colored plastic shell.
You wouldn't and that's fine, but I guarantee to you that these will in fact fly off the shelves. These will sell like crazy and Tim Cook will get to keep his full pay.
What's interesting is how a few dollars' difference in case materials is seen by some people as the primary difference between "cheap" and "high end", even if the internals stayed the same.
If that were the only difference, then people will really start wondering why they should pay hundreds extra for some glass and aluminum that they usually buy another protective case for, anyway.
So it seems like that there would be more differences to lower the build price. Anyone have some guesses or suggestions as to what they might be?
Obviously, less memory and a slower CPU is one possibility. Would they also go backwards with the display, or is that not a possibility?
Thoughts?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan
Anyone thinking Apple will announce a larger screen iPhone this fall I think will be disappointed.
Here's what Tim Cook said at Apple's last earnings call:
And at D11
Putting aside whether Tim Cook is right about these "tradeoffs" would he have made these comments in April and May if Apple was planning to release a 4.5" - 5" phone this fall? Or are we supposed to believe Apple solved for these trade off issues between when Cook made those comments at D11 and Sept/Oct when the new phone comes out? Of course I know Apple in the past has shot something down that they later embraced. But have they done it in the same year? I personally think Apple will get one more cycle out of the 5 design and we may see a larger phone in 2014. Also I'm sure there's something iOS 7 related that Apple is saving for the phone launch this fall.
That doesnt mean anything imo. All it says is they didnt do it in the past for quality reasons. Not to mention those arguments are pretty BS, they can make a good quality 4", 7.9" and 10" screens but they cant solve the problem for a 5" screen? I dont think Apple can afford to spit on a larger screen for very long without losing a good chunck of the high end market.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan
OK well I don't see that flying off the shelves anywhere then. I'd love to know who the intended market is for this. I know I wouldn't pay $450 for a phone in a candy colored plastic shell.
Well, that means there will still be people buying the high end phone... imo its good thing they made those out of plastic, so people like you can still be proud to have the high end aluminum phone. Personnaly I always put a case on my phones, so material or color is irrelevant to me.
If those things are sold in the $300-$399 range, they will outsell the high end iphone, just like the ipad mini outsell the big ipad. This bring us to margins, Apple needs to not care which phone model it sells, margins still need to be decent on those phones.
"Designed in California, Replicated in South Korea"
Quote:
Originally Posted by KDarling
What's interesting is how a few dollars' difference in case materials is seen by some people as the primary difference between "cheap" and "high end", even if the internals stayed the same.
If that were the only difference, then people will really start wondering why they should pay hundreds extra for some glass and aluminum that they usually buy another protective case for, anyway.
So it seems like that there would be more differences to lower the build price. Anyone have some guesses or suggestions as to what they might be?
Obviously, less memory and a slower CPU is one possibility. Would they also go backwards with the display, or is that not a possibility?
Thoughts?
The current iphone display, while being of good quality, is very low tech. The new AMOLED, OLED, super LCD and IGZO screens now offer the same color quality for lower power consomption. So I am hoping the new high end phone will move to a more modern screen tech and the current screens will be used on the low cost phones. I dont see Apple going with a lower resolution phone than this. They could also keep the current A6 on that thing. The screen and the A6 capacity are all in place. imo the current iphone 5 model will be discontinued when the new model launches. Apple needs to cut on the components that drive the price up and hurts there margins. what will it be is a good question.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KDarling
What's interesting is how a few dollars' difference in case materials is seen by some people as the primary difference between "cheap" and "high end", even if the internals stayed the same.
If that were the only difference, then people will really start wondering why they should pay hundreds extra for some glass and aluminum that they usually buy another protective case for, anyway.
So it seems like that there would be more differences to lower the build price. Anyone have some guesses or suggestions as to what they might be?
Obviously, less memory and a slower CPU is one possibility. Would they also go backwards with the display, or is that not a possibility?
Thoughts?
Easy. It's called economy of scale. The first time around, components must be sold at a certain price to recoop engineering and tooling costs, after that they can lower the costs and still make the same amount of profits. Milling of the aluminum cases on the other hand will cost just the same though. Time and materials do not go down and the milling process is a lot more costly and time consuming than casting plastic. Plus, the return rates on the aluminum bodied iPhonesfor minor issues must have take a huge toll on margins.
Any way you cut it, it is a smart move, and Apple will sell tons of these suckers.
Quote:
Originally Posted by herbapou
Well, that means there will still be people buying the high end phone... imo its good thing they made those out of plastic, so people like you can still be proud to have the high end aluminum phone. Personnaly I always put a case on my phones, so material or color is irrelevant to me.
If those things are sold in the $300-$399 range, they will outsell the high end iphone, just like the ipad mini outsell the big ipad. This bring us to margins, Apple needs to not care which phone model it sells, margins still need to be decent on those phones.
Exactly,
..and not only that, when they then sold the outgoing model for a discount, they were canibalizing and gouging themselves senseless on the premium iPhone. This way, if you really NEED and must have a premium aluminum bodied iPhone, there is the 5s, and if you want the discount model, there is the plastic 5. Everybody wins.
I don't get the bad reactions to these cases. They look fine, and will look better when you remove the protective plastic wrap which you see bubbling in the photo. Plenty of people like color, and many would prefer the less easily damaged plastic. These will be great for kids or careless adults. Premium materials will still be available in the flagship model.
My only comment is to recall a line from a movie referencing the color of a car: "I didn't know they made these in banana."