Haswell-powered iMacs could hit in late Aug., followed by new MacBook Pros in mid-Sept.

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  • Reply 21 of 140
    evilutionevilution Posts: 1,399member


    I can't imagine the Haswell iMac being particularly high on the to-do list considering the main point of Haswell is battery life.


    I'd guess that they'll wait until 2014 before bothering as they can then throw in wifi ac and a few other updates at the same time, hopefully even retina.


     


    I could be wrong though, they unnecessarily made it thinner so they could rush to unnecessarily increase power efficiency. Maybe it'll run cooler at the same speeds which wouldn't be a bad thing after the weight loss during the previous update.

  • Reply 22 of 140
    tallest skiltallest skil Posts: 43,388member
    evilution wrote: »
    …unnecessarily increase power efficiency.

    Is that ever the case?
  • Reply 23 of 140
    andysolandysol Posts: 2,506member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by christopher126 View Post


    A lot of "complainers!" :)


     


    Oops! I guess, I'm complaining about the complainers...Oh well! :)



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  • Reply 24 of 140
    _rick_v__rick_v_ Posts: 142member


    Oh, I get that this isn't a sexy upgrade because it doesn't double the year-over-year performance. But the point of this Intel chip is to basically do the exact same thing while using less electricity.  In a laptop, that matters a lot.  In a desktop; well, it still makes the iMac slightly more efficient power-wise (and heat-wise).  May not mean much to you, but spread across the millions of computers that will be built around this chip, it just might.

  • Reply 25 of 140
    epsicoepsico Posts: 39member


    I'm patiently waiting for a 4k Thunderbolt Display to go with the Retina 15" MacBook Pro, so I'm kinda hoping that the new iMacs come with 4k displays.  If they upgrade the iMac, they are likely to upgrade the Thunderbolt Display as well.

  • Reply 26 of 140
    tallest skiltallest skil Posts: 43,388member
    epsico wrote: »
    …I'm kinda hoping that the new iMacs come with 4k displays.

    Well, 3840x2160 and 5120x2880.

    Why is 4K 4K? Shouldn't it be "2K"? Even that's wrong. What's wrong with 2160p? Are we really so lazy that saying "ten ay tee pea" is fine but "twenty-one six tea pea" is too hard?
  • Reply 27 of 140
    mikejonesmikejones Posts: 323member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post





    Well, 3840x2160 and 5120x2880.



    Why is 4K 4K? Shouldn't it be "2K"? Even that's wrong. What's wrong with 2160p? Are we really so lazy that saying "ten ay tee pea" is fine but "twenty-one six tea pea" is too hard?


    2K, 4K, etc. specify the horizontal resolution rounded to the nearest thousand. There are also multiple 2K and 4K resolutions depending on aspect ratio so they vary in the vertical resolution. 1080p, 2160p, etc. are terms describing the vertical resolution and whether the content is progressive or interlaced. It's just a different term to describe a different attribute. There is nothing "lazy" about it.

  • Reply 28 of 140
    Anyone ever suspect Apple will add an A7 chip to all it's macs? It would be really cheap, increase available software, extend battery life or save power when surfing, unite the 2 seperate platforms, and make testing iphone software easier for developers. I am not talking about dropping intel, but using both chips like nvidia does with its descrete processors.
  • Reply 29 of 140
    mikejonesmikejones Posts: 323member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Macnewsjunkie View Post



    Anyone ever suspect Apple will add an A7 chip to all it's macs? It would be really cheap, increase available software, extend battery life or save power when surfing, unite the 2 seperate platforms, and make testing iphone software easier for developers. I am not talking about dropping intel, but using both chips like nvidia does with its descrete processors.


    Nvidia doesn't have discrete processors.

  • Reply 30 of 140
    un_plugun_plug Posts: 25member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by karmadave View Post



    I would expect that in addition to Haswell, the new MacBook Pro's will have faster WiFi and PCIe SSD. It will be interesting to see if Apple offers a discrete GPU, on the 15" model or goes with Haswell's integrated graphics like the current (and likely future) 13" model...


     


    Quote:

    Originally Posted by MikeJones View Post


    Of course they will still have a discrete GPU.



     


    Not necessarily,


    The Pros have started becoming much less Pro over the years. With weight/slimness and more importantly, heat and battery life, taking a bigger priority in the Pro's design, I can see them dropping the discrete chips. Especially With the Intel's integrated 5100HD being twice as powerful as the 4000 and close to 650 performance (supposedly). True it would not be as good in real world application 3D/editing etc, but Apple cares a lot less about us real Pros anymore.

  • Reply 31 of 140
    curtis hannahcurtis hannah Posts: 1,832member
    So will the iMac get a longer battery life too now? /s
    How about instead will the IMacs have less power drawn?

    To see the Mac Pro and MacBook Pro comparison will be interesting.
  • Reply 32 of 140
    winterwinter Posts: 1,238member
    un_plug wrote: »

    Not necessarily,
    The Pros have started becoming much less Pro over the years. With weight/slimness and more importantly, heat and battery life, taking a bigger priority in the Pro's design, I can see them dropping the discrete chips. Especially With the Intel's integrated 5100HD being twice as powerful as the 4000 and close to 650 performance (supposedly). True it would not be as good in real world application 3D/editing etc, but Apple cares a lot less about us real Pros anymore.

    You mean the Iris Pro 5200. The 5100 will not be close to the 650M but obviously will be better than the 4000.
  • Reply 33 of 140
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 13,377member
    andysol wrote: »
    Haswell will be a pretty minor bump on the iMac due to not needing power savings.
    This may or may not be true, it depends upon which chip Apple actually chooses. For the current machines Haswell has been a performance wash due to a focus on power savings. However the same tech that allows for cooler chips cold also lead to faster chips. Heat in CMOS devices is a function of clock rate, if Apple can up the clock rate while maintaining power levels Haswell could lead to a very nice iMac update. For the Mini that extra power budget will likely go to the GPU which would be a needed improvement.

    What I'm saying is don't jump to conclusions based on current Haswell based machines.
     I'm curious if Apple will either drop the price $100 or so, maybe drop prices on customizations, make Fusion standard, or something else in addition to the small processor bump.  Oh 2014... please be the year of the retina.
    Well if Apple ever expects me to buy an iMac they will have to totally refactor the machine to make RAM and SSD access easy. I'm not one to make excuses for Apple, I would never recommend the current iMac to anyBody due to the service issues with things like the secondary storage.

    That being said I can see the new PCI Express based SSDs being a big factor in all Apple Macs this year. Timing is right and AIR demonstrates just how cost effective this high speed storage is.



    You don't know hyper-critical until you make your GF your wife.  ;)

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  • Reply 34 of 140
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 13,377member
    Not a chance! Apple wouldn't even consider such until they are on 64 bit ARM which I doubt will come with A7. Even if A7 did come there is little advantage to it in a Mac, Haswell now delivers a better performance / power result than ARM.
    Anyone ever suspect Apple will add an A7 chip to all it's macs? It would be really cheap, increase available software, extend battery life or save power when surfing, unite the 2 seperate platforms, and make testing iphone software easier for developers. I am not talking about dropping intel, but using both chips like nvidia does with its descrete processors.
  • Reply 35 of 140
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 13,377member
    applezilla wrote: »
    Ugh. I was hoping for a mid-summer rMBP release. Promised my wife my old MBP.

    She's not going to be happy.

    Don't be selfish, keep your MBP and give her the new rMBP. Save your penny's for a Broadwell based Mac.
  • Reply 36 of 140
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 13,377member
    kpluck wrote: »
    The unfortunate part of the timing here is that they will not, in all likelihood, have the new Thunderbolt 20Gbps part.
    Actually I thought that was part of what we are waiting on.
    Personally, while it wouldn't be great for Apple's bottom line, I think they should hold off any new Thunderbolt equipped machines until they can be rolled out with the new chip.
    Well I actually think that is the case. It won't hurt Mac Sales numbers much as the new AIR is selling like hotcakes.
    I think doing that would go a long way with helping Thunderbolt adoption and getting peripherals made.
    Actually I don't think it makes any difference at all. People still believe that TB was suppose to replace USB, I don't think that was ever the intention.
    Of course, they won't do that. And they also won't do a mid-cycle refresh next spring to any models with Thunderbolt to upgrade to the new chip.

    -kpluck

    Lets hope that Apple is doing the right thing here and has the TB based hardware lined up as well as the new Haswells. Speaking of Haswell, the iMacs could have been updated already so they are likely waiting on something else. Hopefully that something else is TB. However it could also be an AMD GPU that works well for software written for the new Mac Pro. That is a driver compatible card in the iMacs.
  • Reply 37 of 140
    bregaladbregalad Posts: 816member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by 1983 View Post


    Apple's fusion drive is a very expensive customization option in the country I live. I really hope if nothing else that they finally make it standard with the forthcoming Haswell iMac upgrades - but they probably won't.



    That's the big change I'm hoping for in the next iMac.


     


     


    Haswell will do very little for the iMac. In fact I fear the 21.5" model will have every part soldered to the logic board like a notebook. Iris 5200 graphics are only available in the solder-in BGA version of Haswell and Apple already makes it nearly impossible to upgrade the RAM so why not go all the way and make it truly impossible to upgrade? The 27" model should retain discrete graphics and RAM slots, at least for this year.


     


    I still don't believe we'll see a new iMac before the MBP. Notebooks, while of limited interest to me, are vastly more important to Apple. The iMac can easily wait for a desktop event featuring the new Mac Pro and Thunderbolt2.

  • Reply 38 of 140
    MarvinMarvin Posts: 15,269moderator
    epsico wrote: »
    …I'm kinda hoping that the new iMacs come with 4k displays.

    Well, 3840x2160 and 5120x2880.

    Dell just announced a 32" 2160p IGZO Ultrasharp coming in Q4:

    http://www.engadget.com/2013/07/23/dell-ultrasharp-32/

    Currently Dell's most expensive display is a 30" Ultrasharp at $1250. It looks like they've finally ditched VGA and DVI - the ports on the bottom appear to be displayport, mini-displayport (or Thunderbolt perhaps) and HDMI.

    Maybe Apple will have a high resolution Thunderbolt display ready for the Mac Pro launch. It'll look better than the Dell one too as it'll have the laminated anti-glare front so deeper black levels and can be as slim as the iMac at the sides with USB 3 ports. The internal speakers might not sound very good with such a thin chassis but there's no harm in having them.

    This would be the first time Apple has moved away from IPS for a very long time too:

    http://appleinsider.com/articles/13/01/08/sharp-hypes-igzo-displays-apple-called-a-prime-candidate-to-use
    http://www.tomshardware.com/news/CES-IGZO-NTT-Docomo-Sharp-touch-Monitor,20318.html
  • Reply 39 of 140
    morzee94morzee94 Posts: 13member
    mikejones wrote: »
    Of course they will still have a discrete GPU.

    I dunno, Intel Iris 5200 and Nvidia GeForce 650M are very closely matched with the 650M just pipping the 5200 in terms of ultimate performance. While Iris would offer huge power savings it puts Apple in a difficult position as although they don't want a new product's graphics to be slower even marginally than the previous generation (especially on an expensive pro product with a retina display) in order to provide discrete graphics that is meaningfully more powerful than Iris they will have to go to the highest end of mobile graphics which would end up dramatically increasing costs and power consumption........ The truth we know right now is that the 15" MBP retina prototype that popped up on Geekbench didn't have a discrete graphics chip when tested.
  • Reply 40 of 140
    hmmhmm Posts: 3,405member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Marvin View Post





    Dell just announced a 32" 2160p IGZO Ultrasharp coming in Q4:



    http://www.engadget.com/2013/07/23/dell-ultrasharp-32/



    Currently Dell's most expensive display is a 30" Ultrasharp at $1250. It looks like they've finally ditched VGA and DVI - the ports on the bottom appear to be displayport, mini-displayport (or Thunderbolt perhaps) and HDMI.



    Maybe Apple will have a high resolution Thunderbolt display ready for the Mac Pro launch. It'll look better than the Dell one too as it'll have the laminated anti-glare front so deeper black levels and can be as slim as the iMac at the sides with USB 3 ports. The internal speakers might not sound very good with such a thin chassis but there's no harm in having them.



    This would be the first time Apple has moved away from IPS for a very long time too:



    http://appleinsider.com/articles/13/01/08/sharp-hypes-igzo-displays-apple-called-a-prime-candidate-to-use

    http://www.tomshardware.com/news/CES-IGZO-NTT-Docomo-Sharp-touch-Monitor,20318.html


    A 32" display makes little sense to me for most uses. The typical offering went from 30" 16:10 to a 27" 16:9, overall significantly smaller. 32" is just a huge amount of area to scan visually, and no OS on the market today has an effective way of partitioning screens in any way. It's basically the same thing, but spread further apart. You end up having to use a lot of mouse acceleration, which can be incredibly annoying. The touch display sounds cool, but it seems like an odd implementation. A touch display would need to be angled for reasonable ergonomics.


     


    Quote:

    Originally Posted by morzee94 View Post





    I dunno, Intel Iris 5200 and Nvidia GeForce 650M are very closely matched with the 650M just pipping the 5200 in terms of ultimate performance. While Iris would offer huge power savings it puts Apple in a difficult position as although they don't want a new product's graphics to be slower even marginally than the previous generation (especially on an expensive pro product with a retina display) in order to provide discrete graphics that is meaningfully more powerful than Iris they will have to go to the highest end of mobile graphics which would end up dramatically increasing costs and power consumption........ The truth we know right now is that the 15" MBP retina prototype that popped up on Geekbench didn't have a discrete graphics chip when tested


     


    It wouldn't be a 650m either way. It would still be a kepler gpu if NVidia or whatever AMD has out. The iris pro still consumes more power at a higher chip cost when compared to other cpus. They could use it anyway. To say that they would have to up the discrete gpu is completely disingenuous. The 7xx gpus are clocked a bit higher in general, and it would be in the same class. Only a couple oems ever go past the mid to upper-mid range gpus in a 15" notebook.

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