I bought a 21" version- suped to the max and not impressed. I want to sell it as soon as the upgrades are announced. I'm not sure if it's the build or the current OS but it's not a lighting fast as I'd like and the screen is just ok.
I suppose I should have bought the 27 but spacing concerns said no.
Fair enough. The iMac is still a consumer-level computer, so it'll never have the performance wow factor of the Mac Pro for high-end applications/pro-level work. If you wanted that, you definitely should have waited for the new Mac Pro.
Retina quality displays are getting to the consumer-level technology price point (especially at 21"), but still weren't at the time the iMac was announced. Plus I'm sure they'll want to do it on both the 21" and the 27" iMac at the same time when they do. A BTO option for retina on an iMac would be a logistical nightmare.
I went from a 5 year old Mac Pro (upgraded with an SSD and 16GB of RAM) to a 27" Core i7 iMac w/ Fusion drive and I'm pretty happy with the performance boost. Sure the Pro would have been nicer, but I'm happy with my decision given how long it's taking for the refresh. I would have been upset if it were released a month or two after I got my iMac.
SO where the **** are all these lost Mac sales going? I'm pretty damn sure it's not to any other OEM.
Macs are as compelling as they ever have been, especially compared to what else is out there. Adding flashing lights or some other bullshit is not going to make them more compelling- the desktop space is not about to see any major paradigm shifts, so I'm not sure what people want. If Mac sales are down, its because the entire PC industry is shrinking and losing steam, and that means that every other PC OEM is a million times more fucked than Apple ever will be from slowing Mac growth, since Macs (although sell fantastically and have high profits) are still a small fraction of Apple's business.
PC designs, though, have become "satisfactory for the 'jobs to be done',
The above quote is the giveaway that this article is a bit of nonsense beat up. Why? because PC designs have always been 'satisfactory', in the sense that they still do the job.
Quote:
Apple?s challenge as we see it is to continue to introduce compelling new versions of iMacs and MacBooks
Is it really. I guess Apple needs to hire this person for his sage advice. The fact is that Apple simply has to keep doing what it is doing. Once a piece of design perfection is reached then it's reached all that needs to be done then is for internal sofware and hardware innovation and excellence.
Have these analysts ever figured out there is a recession going on? Have the figured out that people are being more cautious in their buying? I know quite a few folks who have purchased iPads and are now interested in buying Macs when they make their next computer purchase, but they are waiting for improvement in the economy.
Fair enough. The iMac is still a consumer-level computer, so it'll never have the performance wow factor of the Mac Pro for high-end applications/pro-level work. If you wanted that, you definitely should have waited for the new Mac Pro.
Retina quality displays are getting to the consumer-level technology price point (especially at 21"), but still weren't at the time the iMac was announced. Plus I'm sure they'll want to do it on both the 21" and the 27" iMac at the same time when they do. A BTO option for retina on an iMac would be a logistical nightmare.
I went from a 5 year old Mac Pro (upgraded with an SSD and 16GB of RAM) to a 27" Core i7 iMac w/ Fusion drive and I'm pretty happy with the performance boost. Sure the Pro would have been nicer, but I'm happy with my decision given how long it's taking for the refresh. I would have been upset if it were released a month or two after I got my iMac.
I too got an I7 / Fusion. It really feels laptop parts built more the prior generations did. I mean it's OK. I'm just not as drawn to it that much. I must be spoiled by the quick access of my iOS devices.
I'd like to go for the Mac Pro next. Do we have any idea on pricing yet?
Experience matters. Loyalty is much more important than just the sales numbers and not everybody needs a new machine every two years like iPhones. Keep cool, the Macs future is save.
no question in my mind, that part of the reason Windows users are not buying new computers, is many of them are on XP, and will switch to Windows 7, but if they go out and buy a new computer, they are stuck with Windows 8! And as we all know, many of the Windows users have no clue whats better, 7 or 8. They shop on price, and we all know whats cheapest.
Just to add support to the point made early on in this thread about the importance of iLife and iWork in all this.
I am a switcher (well, sort of: I still use a PC for drudge work in the office and have a PC at home as a kind of legacy totem to the long-gone era when I had time to play games). I switched in 2006 and it was bliss. But I feel that I am 'running out of steam', holding off on buying a significant new piece of Apple kit (an iMac) because there is currently nothing I want to do with my current kit that I cannot do.
But the visionary thing about Apple is that it redefines what you can do, simplifies how you do it, and also (most significantly) enables you to do things you either did not think you could do, or never even conceived of doing.
I am a barrister, not an IT bod. But I can sense the irony in the form which many responses on this thread have taken. In reply to the accusation that Apple is running out of steam, pointing out tech advances in the kit is a very un-Apple answer. No one in the 'potential switcher' market really cares all that much about processor speeds etc. What matters are those classic Appleisms: ease and 'reach' of use.
It is software that really makes the difference here. I switched in 2006 some 26 years after first getting my hands on a computer. But within days of using my Mac mini, I had started (for the first time) making stuff a non-creative like me could be proud of: a couple of websites and a 64-page magazine which looked (for the time) like professional product; photo books for my family for £20 or so each which made their recipients think I had completely lost the plot and blown hundreds on self-publishing, etc. It was not my own brilliance that enabled this: it was the thoughtful integration of iWork, iLife and OS X, and their stability, which volunteered for me swathes of time otherwise spent maintaining my PC and also a kind of playful open-ended joy in using the computer.
This analyst's report has (in my non-expert view) correctly identified a symptom but misdiagnosed the cause. It is not that Apple computers are perfect. They are fantastic, for sure, and yet are still incrementally improving. But hardware advances in desktops are of marginal importance now, for most.
It's just that for several years now Apple's focus has (rightly) been elsewhere - on the iPhone and iPad and iOS.
But the time is up. I really do hope that The next iteration of OS X will bring with it a proper leap in the capabilities of iLife, iWork and iCloud. Yes, I have an iPad, an iPhone, a Mac mini (a new one) and a MacBook Air, and yes they are all great pieces of kit, but the whole computing business has become a bit too 'meh' for my liking.
Apple must not Ballmerise itself; it has the funds to keep innovating the software. Why not just throw some of those billions held offshore at a planet's-worth of IT gurus and make it happen?
what a total dope. the fact that Apple's share of the PC market overall - desktops and laptops - is going up, even while total PC sales - both Windows and Macs - are going down, means explicitly that people continue to switch from Windows to Mac. if not, Mac sales would be declining at the same rate as PC sales, but they aren't. Macs' decline is much less.
sure, first time PC buyers aren't "switching" literally, and might be buying Macs at a significantly higher rate than Windows PC's. but they can't account for the entire difference. and there definitely is not a boom in Linux PC sales instead.
this is basic second grade arithmetic. and this guy is an "analyst"?
Yeah, I don't think that's going to be happening soon if they've stretched themselves over maintaining 3 different versions. If they can standardize on the web/iCloud version for all platforms, then maybe. But there's still a number of features missing, and it's very hard to pull off desktop and mobile in the same package (as we see with the Windows 8 debacle).
I completely expect Apple to bring (almost full) feature parity to all three versions (OSX, iOS and iCloud) of iWork. I don't think they would have taken this step without a roadmap like that in place. It IS still in beta after all on the iCloud version. Squash bugs, add features, squash bugs, add features, rinse and repeat until it's done. That's where it's at today. I don't see Apple calling this a done deal yet, do you?
Is there parity lacking still between the OSX and iOS versions? Something lacking that causes formatting or cross-platform problems? I don't see any currently, but I don't drill down as deep as one can either.
Microsoft makes it look hard to pull off. In fact, they seem to be really good at convincing us that the only result possible is a monumental train wreck.
But then along comes Apple, making it look easy. Take the Garageband duality (OSX and iOS versions gaining file/project compatibility), and then they go and extend that crosstalk into Logic Pro! I can sketch a project using Garageband on the go with an iPad, then import that project into GB on my Mac to flesh out more, send that back to the iPad and/or pull either into Logic to polish the tracks further. That workflow alone is pretty amazing.
If they can do that, this iWork thing is a walk in the park. They'll get it done, I'm pretty confident of that.
I think the new iMac is a step backwards in usability -- No optical drive, and not one USB port or SD card slot in a convenient location -- All are on the back of the new iMac! All of this because of an obsession with thinness, which doesn't matter when viewed from the front!
I may have to get an MBA just so I can have Lion/Mavericks and fully utilize iCloud.
Best!
The only reason I have the iMac instead of a MacBook (outside of my wife's editing)- I do a lot of streaming kids movies from my Mac to the Apple TV, and I don't want to have my laptop on and sleeping plugged in somewhere- I like laptops to be tucked away and invisible. but those new airs are awesome- love them. You should check out the new 21.5" iMac once its announced (hopefully in the next couple monts) as an alternative.
I guess this report is what sent Apple's share price back to the below $500 toilet. It took a worse hit than any of the other computer makers despite having the bottom fall out of the stock last year. There doesn't appear that Apple can do anything to please analysts and Wall Street even though Apple is doing better than most companies in revenue and profits. They expect Apple to have rising sales on all its products or they think the company is slipping. I think these analysts need to take a good look at the economy before blaming Apple for falling sales.
This dude comes to the conclusion that the Mac "wow factor" is fading. Total crap. I think it just a matter than less consumers feel the need to upgrade because the applications most consumers are using don't require a lot of processing power to run well.
I guess this report is what sent Apple's share price back to the below $500 toilet. It took a worse hit than any of the other computer makers despite having the bottom fall out of the stock last year. There doesn't appear that Apple can do anything to please analysts and Wall Street even though Apple is doing better than most companies in revenue and profits. They expect Apple to have rising sales on all its products or they think the company is slipping. I think these analysts need to take a good look at the economy before blaming Apple for falling sales.
This dude comes to the conclusion that the Mac "wow factor" is fading. Total crap. I think it just a matter than less consumers feel the need to upgrade because the applications most consumers are using don't require a lot of processing power to run well.
I agree.
The one decision I think Tim made a mistake on is his decision to pay out dividends.
Dividends don't placate anyone, it commoditises the shares and attracts analysts and their inept scrutiny.
I think the new iMac is a step backwards in usability -- No optical drive, and not one USB port or SD card slot in a convenient location -- All are on the back of the new iMac! All of this because of an obsession with thinness, which doesn't matter when viewed from the front!
The same can be said of the Mac mini, which also puts every connector and SD Card slot in back. But its design is not guided by thinness! OTOH, the MacBook Air design is all about thin, yet it's ports and slots are conveniently placed on the thin edge of the body. So much for your "obsession with thinness" theory...
Bought my wife's 20" iMac in late 2008 and my 27" iMac a year later. Neither are anywhere near obsolete for our purposes, which are many and varied. We use them several hours each day. Our iMacs broke the three-year cycle of buying new PC desktops after their steady decline into chaos from Windows bloatware, antivirus patches and blue screens of death. I suspect that many other Mac converts have found the same and are holding on to their hardware longer.
There's some curious info in here... I presume we're ignoring the Mac Installed Base line on the graph: that's the one that is static at about 16,000,000 computers whilst about 40,000,000 ex-Windows users switch to Mac. Perhaps they're sharing?
Then there's the comment that "the company has already introduced what in our view are virtually the 'perfect' machines for the PC market.". Isn't that the same as the famous "Everything that can be invented has been invented." quote? There's plenty of room for improvement in computing devices yet!
Comments
Quote:
Originally Posted by pazuzu
I bought a 21" version- suped to the max and not impressed. I want to sell it as soon as the upgrades are announced. I'm not sure if it's the build or the current OS but it's not a lighting fast as I'd like and the screen is just ok.
I suppose I should have bought the 27 but spacing concerns said no.
Fair enough. The iMac is still a consumer-level computer, so it'll never have the performance wow factor of the Mac Pro for high-end applications/pro-level work. If you wanted that, you definitely should have waited for the new Mac Pro.
Retina quality displays are getting to the consumer-level technology price point (especially at 21"), but still weren't at the time the iMac was announced. Plus I'm sure they'll want to do it on both the 21" and the 27" iMac at the same time when they do. A BTO option for retina on an iMac would be a logistical nightmare.
I went from a 5 year old Mac Pro (upgraded with an SSD and 16GB of RAM) to a 27" Core i7 iMac w/ Fusion drive and I'm pretty happy with the performance boost. Sure the Pro would have been nicer, but I'm happy with my decision given how long it's taking for the refresh. I would have been upset if it were released a month or two after I got my iMac.
SO where the **** are all these lost Mac sales going? I'm pretty damn sure it's not to any other OEM.
Macs are as compelling as they ever have been, especially compared to what else is out there. Adding flashing lights or some other bullshit is not going to make them more compelling- the desktop space is not about to see any major paradigm shifts, so I'm not sure what people want. If Mac sales are down, its because the entire PC industry is shrinking and losing steam, and that means that every other PC OEM is a million times more fucked than Apple ever will be from slowing Mac growth, since Macs (although sell fantastically and have high profits) are still a small fraction of Apple's business.
Quote:
PC designs, though, have become "satisfactory for the 'jobs to be done',
The above quote is the giveaway that this article is a bit of nonsense beat up. Why? because PC designs have always been 'satisfactory', in the sense that they still do the job.
Quote:
Apple?s challenge as we see it is to continue to introduce compelling new versions of iMacs and MacBooks
Is it really. I guess Apple needs to hire this person for his sage advice. The fact is that Apple simply has to keep doing what it is doing. Once a piece of design perfection is reached then it's reached all that needs to be done then is for internal sofware and hardware innovation and excellence.
told lie; did read
Really, the cutesy clever gen ADHD stuff is sooo tired.
Have these analysts ever figured out there is a recession going on? Have the figured out that people are being more cautious in their buying? I know quite a few folks who have purchased iPads and are now interested in buying Macs when they make their next computer purchase, but they are waiting for improvement in the economy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by auxio
Fair enough. The iMac is still a consumer-level computer, so it'll never have the performance wow factor of the Mac Pro for high-end applications/pro-level work. If you wanted that, you definitely should have waited for the new Mac Pro.
Retina quality displays are getting to the consumer-level technology price point (especially at 21"), but still weren't at the time the iMac was announced. Plus I'm sure they'll want to do it on both the 21" and the 27" iMac at the same time when they do. A BTO option for retina on an iMac would be a logistical nightmare.
I went from a 5 year old Mac Pro (upgraded with an SSD and 16GB of RAM) to a 27" Core i7 iMac w/ Fusion drive and I'm pretty happy with the performance boost. Sure the Pro would have been nicer, but I'm happy with my decision given how long it's taking for the refresh. I would have been upset if it were released a month or two after I got my iMac.
I too got an I7 / Fusion. It really feels laptop parts built more the prior generations did. I mean it's OK. I'm just not as drawn to it that much. I must be spoiled by the quick access of my iOS devices.
I'd like to go for the Mac Pro next. Do we have any idea on pricing yet?
Quote:
Originally Posted by pazuzu
I'd like to go for the Mac Pro next. Do we have any idea on pricing yet?
Nope. But I'd expect it to be high (relative to the iMac) given the components. Likely in the same range as a 12-core Pro right now.
I am a switcher (well, sort of: I still use a PC for drudge work in the office and have a PC at home as a kind of legacy totem to the long-gone era when I had time to play games). I switched in 2006 and it was bliss. But I feel that I am 'running out of steam', holding off on buying a significant new piece of Apple kit (an iMac) because there is currently nothing I want to do with my current kit that I cannot do.
But the visionary thing about Apple is that it redefines what you can do, simplifies how you do it, and also (most significantly) enables you to do things you either did not think you could do, or never even conceived of doing.
I am a barrister, not an IT bod. But I can sense the irony in the form which many responses on this thread have taken. In reply to the accusation that Apple is running out of steam, pointing out tech advances in the kit is a very un-Apple answer. No one in the 'potential switcher' market really cares all that much about processor speeds etc. What matters are those classic Appleisms: ease and 'reach' of use.
It is software that really makes the difference here. I switched in 2006 some 26 years after first getting my hands on a computer. But within days of using my Mac mini, I had started (for the first time) making stuff a non-creative like me could be proud of: a couple of websites and a 64-page magazine which looked (for the time) like professional product; photo books for my family for £20 or so each which made their recipients think I had completely lost the plot and blown hundreds on self-publishing, etc. It was not my own brilliance that enabled this: it was the thoughtful integration of iWork, iLife and OS X, and their stability, which volunteered for me swathes of time otherwise spent maintaining my PC and also a kind of playful open-ended joy in using the computer.
This analyst's report has (in my non-expert view) correctly identified a symptom but misdiagnosed the cause. It is not that Apple computers are perfect. They are fantastic, for sure, and yet are still incrementally improving. But hardware advances in desktops are of marginal importance now, for most.
It's just that for several years now Apple's focus has (rightly) been elsewhere - on the iPhone and iPad and iOS.
But the time is up. I really do hope that The next iteration of OS X will bring with it a proper leap in the capabilities of iLife, iWork and iCloud. Yes, I have an iPad, an iPhone, a Mac mini (a new one) and a MacBook Air, and yes they are all great pieces of kit, but the whole computing business has become a bit too 'meh' for my liking.
Apple must not Ballmerise itself; it has the funds to keep innovating the software. Why not just throw some of those billions held offshore at a planet's-worth of IT gurus and make it happen?
what a total dope. the fact that Apple's share of the PC market overall - desktops and laptops - is going up, even while total PC sales - both Windows and Macs - are going down, means explicitly that people continue to switch from Windows to Mac. if not, Mac sales would be declining at the same rate as PC sales, but they aren't. Macs' decline is much less.
sure, first time PC buyers aren't "switching" literally, and might be buying Macs at a significantly higher rate than Windows PC's. but they can't account for the entire difference. and there definitely is not a boom in Linux PC sales instead.
this is basic second grade arithmetic. and this guy is an "analyst"?
Quote:
Originally Posted by auxio
Yeah, I don't think that's going to be happening soon if they've stretched themselves over maintaining 3 different versions. If they can standardize on the web/iCloud version for all platforms, then maybe. But there's still a number of features missing, and it's very hard to pull off desktop and mobile in the same package (as we see with the Windows 8 debacle).
I completely expect Apple to bring (almost full) feature parity to all three versions (OSX, iOS and iCloud) of iWork. I don't think they would have taken this step without a roadmap like that in place. It IS still in beta after all on the iCloud version. Squash bugs, add features, squash bugs, add features, rinse and repeat until it's done. That's where it's at today. I don't see Apple calling this a done deal yet, do you?
Is there parity lacking still between the OSX and iOS versions? Something lacking that causes formatting or cross-platform problems? I don't see any currently, but I don't drill down as deep as one can either.
Microsoft makes it look hard to pull off. In fact, they seem to be really good at convincing us that the only result possible is a monumental train wreck.
But then along comes Apple, making it look easy. Take the Garageband duality (OSX and iOS versions gaining file/project compatibility), and then they go and extend that crosstalk into Logic Pro! I can sketch a project using Garageband on the go with an iPad, then import that project into GB on my Mac to flesh out more, send that back to the iPad and/or pull either into Logic to polish the tracks further. That workflow alone is pretty amazing.
If they can do that, this iWork thing is a walk in the park. They'll get it done, I'm pretty confident of that.
I think the new iMac is a step backwards in usability -- No optical drive, and not one USB port or SD card slot in a convenient location -- All are on the back of the new iMac! All of this because of an obsession with thinness, which doesn't matter when viewed from the front!
Originally Posted by zBernie
I think the new iMac is a step backwards in usability…
Nonsense.
No optical drive…
And no one cares about those anymore.
…and not one USB port or SD card slot in a convenient location…
Yeah, no iMac has ever had front-facing ports and Apple hasn't changed that since 1998. I'm pretty sure that's not really a concern.
All of this because of an obsession with thinness…
No, not at all, given that these things happened independently of the thinness.
…which doesn't matter when viewed from the front!
*insert favorite proverb about the future here*
This dude comes to the conclusion that the Mac "wow factor" is fading. Total crap. I think it just a matter than less consumers feel the need to upgrade because the applications most consumers are using don't require a lot of processing power to run well.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Constable Odo
I guess this report is what sent Apple's share price back to the below $500 toilet. It took a worse hit than any of the other computer makers despite having the bottom fall out of the stock last year. There doesn't appear that Apple can do anything to please analysts and Wall Street even though Apple is doing better than most companies in revenue and profits. They expect Apple to have rising sales on all its products or they think the company is slipping. I think these analysts need to take a good look at the economy before blaming Apple for falling sales.
This dude comes to the conclusion that the Mac "wow factor" is fading. Total crap. I think it just a matter than less consumers feel the need to upgrade because the applications most consumers are using don't require a lot of processing power to run well.
I agree.
The one decision I think Tim made a mistake on is his decision to pay out dividends.
Dividends don't placate anyone, it commoditises the shares and attracts analysts and their inept scrutiny.
The same can be said of the Mac mini, which also puts every connector and SD Card slot in back. But its design is not guided by thinness! OTOH, the MacBook Air design is all about thin, yet it's ports and slots are conveniently placed on the thin edge of the body. So much for your "obsession with thinness" theory...
There's some curious info in here... I presume we're ignoring the Mac Installed Base line on the graph: that's the one that is static at about 16,000,000 computers whilst about 40,000,000 ex-Windows users switch to Mac. Perhaps they're sharing?
Then there's the comment that "the company has already introduced what in our view are virtually the 'perfect' machines for the PC market.". Isn't that the same as the famous "Everything that can be invented has been invented." quote? There's plenty of room for improvement in computing devices yet!