If you go read the reviews in the Mac App Store, you'll see what watered down means. They've removed tons of functionality from all three iWork applications on the Mac just to make them match up with iOS and iCloud. Go to the Apple forums.
Apple just broke my heart. This just confirmed the fear that Apple doesn't really care about serious tools. No wonder these are free. They dumped the actual software and redeveloped a mockery of what it was.
This is entirely true. The problem is that you can't avoid iWork's 6 if you want to use iCloud. If they only made MS Office available on iPad... Apple really moves the wrong way. Simplicitiy is good, but not if it means that you can't do what you need to do.
MS's main problem is that when you only have a hammer everything looks like a nail.
They cannot see that people use Office because it's installed pretty much by default on most computers at work. People then "borrow" the disks to take home and install it for free (well, they certainly did at my last place of work!). Almost every document I'm sent in Word format could have been written in TextEdit just as well, let alone Pages or something as feature-bloated as Word.
Microsoft will continue to slide into irrelevance unless they realise what people really want outside of a forced software situation and reflex actions from their work where people just want "Word format" because they're used to it.
Actually, Microsoft now has the Home Use Program with many partner companies - Office Pro for $9.95 - to combat piracy. So isn't that "giving it away" too?
The only place I've ever seen anyone using a Surface is Chesters Mill, but as that is a fictional town trapped under a dome I'm not sure it really counts
Meanwhile I know at least 30 people who have an iPad or iPad mini, and several more who are now waiting to get one following Tuesdays announcements...
Don't forget Starling City! (Arrow) but, again, a fictional city that, while no dome, has a giant crater in the middle of it.
And the NFL. Tons of banners over all the stadiums. Though, the pregame shows, they look more like props to the guys paper notes and the screen under the desk.
If anything this should be prime time for MS to release what they consider a full featured Office for the iPad at a reasonable price. They could take advantage of those users who are missing the features that the free iWork doesn't have.
I guess I'm lucky in that I haven't found any features that I use removed. So far
Um, they just did. Remember that whole iOS 7, brand new iWork and iLife apps on both OS X and iOS. Are you paying attention?
They also said NEW devices and NEW computers. Which means really only those buying iPhones, iPads, computers now should be freaking out. Anyone with older devices shouldn't be expecting anything.
For those that want to verify what they said, scrub to about minute 48 and minute 55 of the keynote to hear it for yourself
That seems to be what they did. Apparently only Keynote avoided the slaughter, though previous users all seem to dislike the side bar formatting thing (I was suspicious of its screen wasting when they showed it during the keynote).
Since the last iWork was released in 2009, I've been wondering why it was left abandoned for so long. Did they only have one developer working on it? Did he leave Apple and leave his code a mess? Did they find it was so impossible to port to iOS that they had to restart development? Will they ever put the old functionality back in???
At first I was happy about the announcement, but then I had this sneaking uneasy feeling that it was all too easy. Now I know my suspicion was right. I will never upgrade to a downgraded product.
Hopefully this will follow the model of Final Cut X -- some missing features at first that are quickly added back. I'm quite certain that the cause for the downgrades is the tit-for-tat compatibility and perhaps simplifying the real time collaboration. Some of the dropped features, like linked text boxes, were really cool and helpful.
Well, I did find one thing that isn't working like it used to- automatic list detection. There's a preference to turn it on, and when working on spreadsheets where it always happened under the previous version, this version isn't doing it. I tried looking it up in Help and wasn't able to figure it out.
Sure, it could be me messing up somehow, but - a) it shouldn't happen and b) it should be easy to fix if it does
I can see where people who really use this feature would be PISSED. For me it's not a huge deal.
I would suggest that Office and Powerpoint are not feature rich apps.
They were feature rich apps by the standards of 20 years ago.
Now it's no big whoop to create an alternative that's compatible with Microsoft Office.
Google docs. iWork. Pages. TextEdit.
What's so great about Microsoft Office in 2013? It's time to let go of the familiar that has value only because it's familiar.
Home office needs and you should look no further than the suggestions you listed, they'll work just fine. Once you start adding database connections, scripts and formulas than you have no choice but to use MS Office or Apache Open Office.
If you bought a Snow Leopard Mac in 2009 then the upgrade to the current Mavericks is free.
Some manufactures are offering it for free for newer machines with Windows 7, those who don't it's 50 for Windows 8 (seen it as low as 25) and 75 for Windows 8 Pro. Personally if you do not have a touchscreen tablet it offers nothing so why bother.
Some manufactures are offering it for free for newer machines with Windows 7, those who don't it's 50 for Windows 8 (seen it as low as 25) and 75 for Windows 8 Pro. Personally if you do not have a touchscreen tablet it offers nothing so why bother.
Boots in a few seconds and gives some other speed improvements while its running to.
Some manufactures are offering it for free for newer machines with Windows 7, those who don't it's 50 for Windows 8 (seen it as low as 25) and 75 for Windows 8 Pro. Personally if you do not have a touchscreen tablet it offers nothing so why bother.
Originally Posted by timgriff84
Boots in a few seconds and gives some other speed improvements while its running to.
All the better for getting a Mac rather than a Windows machine.
Apple unconditionally gives for free a substantial update to Mac OS X.
Conversely most Windows users have to pay for a minor update.
All the better for getting a Mac rather than a Windows machine.
Apple unconditionally gives for free a substantial update to Mac OS X.
Conversely most Windows users have to pay for a minor update.
Hahahaha you call the difference between Windows 7 and 8 a minor update. Literally a whole new style of apps, a store, xbox music, better multi monitor support with the taskbar, boot times going from a minute to 6 seconds, amongst a load of other thing like apps.
But you think the update OSX is getting a substantial. A port of iBooks, a port of Maps, reverting the UI changes to iCal from the last update, multiple displays, safari updates and tabs in Finder. Who in there right mind even pay for that if they tried!
Reading the reviews there's even a crap load of people complaining that there machines are now slower than ever or constantly crash. I was right about to upgrade until I read that and though. Do I want to risk it so that I can have tabs in Finder and 2 apps I'm never going to use. Maybe not.
Hahahaha you call the difference between Windows 7 and 8 a minor update.
How many jokes you want here? “Major disaster”, “minor install rate”, there are a million of ‘em.
But you think the update OSX is getting a substantial. A port of iBooks, a port of Maps, reverting the UI changes to iCal from the last update, multiple displays, safari updates and tabs in Finder. Who in there right mind even pay for that if they tried!
Your seriously saying that what's listed on Apples what's new page for Mavericks is a "substantial" update.
iBooks, Maps and Safari aren't even an OS update, there a bunch of apps. Including Safari in the list is also a bit dodge, are they saying unless you update your OS your not going to get a browser update? I'm not a big Google fan but they push Chrome updates out every 2 - 4 weeks irrespective of OS.
iCal in Apples words has "a fresh new look" plus weather forecasts, and a map view. Must have taken them all of a month to build that update. Plus every other major calendar already does this.
Multiple Displays, because so many Apple users have multiple displays.
Interactive notifications and Finders Tabs are certainly new, but still not what you would call "substantial".
iCloud Keychain, I seriously didn't realise it didn't already do this. Maybe it's because other people have, I dunno. I just figured it did it. Still given that I don't feel the need to sign into Chrome to get it to do it, I wouldn't call it substantial either.
Advanced technologies that mean my Mac will use less power. Didn't think it used that much power anyway! One of the reasons I've bought MacBooks/iBooks over the past 12 years was because the battery life has always been amazing.
Tags, does sound cool and probably the only thing on the list I would give credit to. But to call it a "substantial update" and Win 8 a minor update is crazy. Apple OSX updates are never that substantial but there a lot more regular. I would say Win 7 - 8 is more comparable with the last 4 OSX updates combined. A lot of the feature updates from those version all actually came in, in Win 8.
Apple OSX updates are never that substantial but there a lot more regular. I would say Win 7 - 8 is more comparable with the last 4 OSX updates combined. A lot of the feature updates from those version all actually came in, in Win 8.
Thank you for agreeing to my original point.
All capable Macs purchased from 2009 still running Snow Leopard get the latest Mavericks for free.
Four years' worth of updates to OS X.
Most machines purchased from 2009 still running Windows 7 will need a paid upgrade to Windows 8
Advanced technologies that mean my Mac will use less power. Didn't think it used that much power anyway! One of the reasons I've bought MacBooks/iBooks over the past 12 years was because the battery life has always been amazing.
I can't believe someone is actually downplaying more battery life.
Hahahaha you call the difference between Windows 7 and 8 a minor update. Literally a whole new style of apps, a store, xbox music, bettermulti monitor support with the task bar...
.
.
.
But you think the update OSX is getting a substantial. A port of iBooks, a port of Maps, reverting the UI changes to iCal from the last update, multiple displays, safari updates and tabs in Finder.
The most amusing thing is how you contradict yourself with your efforts.
You cite Windows 8 as a major update because of improved multi-monitor support and updated style of apps,
yet Mavericks is a minor update because it offers improved multi-monitor support and updated apps?
Hahahaha you call the difference between Windows 7 and 8 a minor update. Literally a whole new style of apps, a store, xbox music, better multi monitor support with the taskbar, boot times going from a minute to 6 seconds, amongst a load of other thing like apps.
You left out the shitty interface that almost no-one understands and everyone hates.
First of all, there is an upgrade fee associated with upgrading from Windows 7 to 8. It's a big update, and one that has been collectively panned by many as a disaster. Most of my friends and family refuse to update to the latest version and those that do are completely lost on how to use it. Luckily, the iPad is easy to use and does everything a Windows machine can do anyway.
I think you are referring to an upgrade from Windows 8 to 8.1, which shouldn't even be an upgrade, but a service pack to fix huge UI issues with the operating system.
OS X has always had great multiple monitor support, and yes they've made it better in this version, but that's just a small update. There are refreshes to all the apps (for the better, unlike Windows with that horrible "tiles" thing). There's also core changes to the operating system like memory compression and huge performance and energy efficiency gains. These work on older Macs (up to 7 years ago) and increase their battery life and performance at NO COST. Even when Apple did charge for OS updates, it was $29 or $19 and they are full updates to the operating system.
Lastly, Apple doesn't need to search for some new, whiz bang UI or look to make a great OS. Many believe that OS X is perfect just the way it is, so these continued refinements and workflow for end-users continues to make new users at the expense of Microsoft. People are realizing that you really do get what you pay for when you buy a Mac... you get a company that cares about the quality of the hardware and software that they deliver and they support it for years to come. You don't get that in the Windows world. Period.
So please go back to Redmond and stop posting here.
Comments
If you go read the reviews in the Mac App Store, you'll see what watered down means. They've removed tons of functionality from all three iWork applications on the Mac just to make them match up with iOS and iCloud. Go to the Apple forums.
Apple just broke my heart. This just confirmed the fear that Apple doesn't really care about serious tools. No wonder these are free. They dumped the actual software and redeveloped a mockery of what it was.
This is entirely true. The problem is that you can't avoid iWork's 6 if you want to use iCloud. If they only made MS Office available on iPad... Apple really moves the wrong way. Simplicitiy is good, but not if it means that you can't do what you need to do.
Actually, Microsoft now has the Home Use Program with many partner companies - Office Pro for $9.95 - to combat piracy. So isn't that "giving it away" too?
Don't forget Starling City! (Arrow) but, again, a fictional city that, while no dome, has a giant crater in the middle of it.
And the NFL. Tons of banners over all the stadiums. Though, the pregame shows, they look more like props to the guys paper notes and the screen under the desk.
If anything this should be prime time for MS to release what they consider a full featured Office for the iPad at a reasonable price. They could take advantage of those users who are missing the features that the free iWork doesn't have.
I guess I'm lucky in that I haven't found any features that I use removed. So far
They also said NEW devices and NEW computers. Which means really only those buying iPhones, iPads, computers now should be freaking out. Anyone with older devices shouldn't be expecting anything.
For those that want to verify what they said, scrub to about minute 48 and minute 55 of the keynote to hear it for yourself
That seems to be what they did. Apparently only Keynote avoided the slaughter, though previous users all seem to dislike the side bar formatting thing (I was suspicious of its screen wasting when they showed it during the keynote).
Since the last iWork was released in 2009, I've been wondering why it was left abandoned for so long. Did they only have one developer working on it? Did he leave Apple and leave his code a mess? Did they find it was so impossible to port to iOS that they had to restart development? Will they ever put the old functionality back in???
At first I was happy about the announcement, but then I had this sneaking uneasy feeling that it was all too easy. Now I know my suspicion was right. I will never upgrade to a downgraded product.
Hopefully this will follow the model of Final Cut X -- some missing features at first that are quickly added back. I'm quite certain that the cause for the downgrades is the tit-for-tat compatibility and perhaps simplifying the real time collaboration. Some of the dropped features, like linked text boxes, were really cool and helpful.
Well, I did find one thing that isn't working like it used to- automatic list detection. There's a preference to turn it on, and when working on spreadsheets where it always happened under the previous version, this version isn't doing it. I tried looking it up in Help and wasn't able to figure it out.
Sure, it could be me messing up somehow, but - a) it shouldn't happen and b) it should be easy to fix if it does
I can see where people who really use this feature would be PISSED. For me it's not a huge deal.
Hope these features get added back soon.
I would suggest that Office and Powerpoint are not feature rich apps.
They were feature rich apps by the standards of 20 years ago.
Now it's no big whoop to create an alternative that's compatible with Microsoft Office.
Google docs. iWork. Pages. TextEdit.
What's so great about Microsoft Office in 2013? It's time to let go of the familiar that has value only because it's familiar.
Home office needs and you should look no further than the suggestions you listed, they'll work just fine. Once you start adding database connections, scripts and formulas than you have no choice but to use MS Office or Apache Open Office.
You're wrong. Consider November 2009 when Windows 7 and OS X Snow Leopard were available.
If you bought a Windows 7 machine then you'd have to pay Microsoft to upgrade it to the current Windows 8.1.
If you bought a Snow Leopard Mac in 2009 then the upgrade to the current Mavericks is free.
Some manufactures are offering it for free for newer machines with Windows 7, those who don't it's 50 for Windows 8 (seen it as low as 25) and 75 for Windows 8 Pro. Personally if you do not have a touchscreen tablet it offers nothing so why bother.
Some manufactures are offering it for free for newer machines with Windows 7, those who don't it's 50 for Windows 8 (seen it as low as 25) and 75 for Windows 8 Pro. Personally if you do not have a touchscreen tablet it offers nothing so why bother.
Boots in a few seconds and gives some other speed improvements while its running to.
Boots in a few seconds and gives some other speed improvements while its running to.
All the better for getting a Mac rather than a Windows machine.
Apple unconditionally gives for free a substantial update to Mac OS X.
Conversely most Windows users have to pay for a minor update.
All the better for getting a Mac rather than a Windows machine.
Apple unconditionally gives for free a substantial update to Mac OS X.
Conversely most Windows users have to pay for a minor update.
Hahahaha you call the difference between Windows 7 and 8 a minor update. Literally a whole new style of apps, a store, xbox music, better multi monitor support with the taskbar, boot times going from a minute to 6 seconds, amongst a load of other thing like apps.
But you think the update OSX is getting a substantial. A port of iBooks, a port of Maps, reverting the UI changes to iCal from the last update, multiple displays, safari updates and tabs in Finder. Who in there right mind even pay for that if they tried!
Reading the reviews there's even a crap load of people complaining that there machines are now slower than ever or constantly crash. I was right about to upgrade until I read that and though. Do I want to risk it so that I can have tabs in Finder and 2 apps I'm never going to use. Maybe not.
How many jokes you want here? “Major disaster”, “minor install rate”, there are a million of ‘em.
But you think the update OSX is getting a substantial. A port of iBooks, a port of Maps, reverting the UI changes to iCal from the last update, multiple displays, safari updates and tabs in Finder. Who in there right mind even pay for that if they tried!
How stupid can you possibly be?
How stupid can you possibly be?
Your seriously saying that what's listed on Apples what's new page for Mavericks is a "substantial" update.
iBooks, Maps and Safari aren't even an OS update, there a bunch of apps. Including Safari in the list is also a bit dodge, are they saying unless you update your OS your not going to get a browser update? I'm not a big Google fan but they push Chrome updates out every 2 - 4 weeks irrespective of OS.
iCal in Apples words has "a fresh new look" plus weather forecasts, and a map view. Must have taken them all of a month to build that update. Plus every other major calendar already does this.
Multiple Displays, because so many Apple users have multiple displays.
Interactive notifications and Finders Tabs are certainly new, but still not what you would call "substantial".
iCloud Keychain, I seriously didn't realise it didn't already do this. Maybe it's because other people have, I dunno. I just figured it did it. Still given that I don't feel the need to sign into Chrome to get it to do it, I wouldn't call it substantial either.
Advanced technologies that mean my Mac will use less power. Didn't think it used that much power anyway! One of the reasons I've bought MacBooks/iBooks over the past 12 years was because the battery life has always been amazing.
Tags, does sound cool and probably the only thing on the list I would give credit to. But to call it a "substantial update" and Win 8 a minor update is crazy. Apple OSX updates are never that substantial but there a lot more regular. I would say Win 7 - 8 is more comparable with the last 4 OSX updates combined. A lot of the feature updates from those version all actually came in, in Win 8.
Apple OSX updates are never that substantial but there a lot more regular. I would say Win 7 - 8 is more comparable with the last 4 OSX updates combined. A lot of the feature updates from those version all actually came in, in Win 8.
Thank you for agreeing to my original point.
All capable Macs purchased from 2009 still running Snow Leopard get the latest Mavericks for free.
Four years' worth of updates to OS X.
Most machines purchased from 2009 still running Windows 7 will need a paid upgrade to Windows 8
I can't believe someone is actually downplaying more battery life.
Originally Posted by timgriff84
Hahahaha you call the difference between Windows 7 and 8 a minor update. Literally a whole new style of apps, a store, xbox music, better multi monitor support with the task bar...
.
.
.
But you think the update OSX is getting a substantial. A port of iBooks, a port of Maps, reverting the UI changes to iCal from the last update, multiple displays, safari updates and tabs in Finder.
The most amusing thing is how you contradict yourself with your efforts.
You cite Windows 8 as a major update because of improved multi-monitor support and updated style of apps,
yet Mavericks is a minor update because it offers improved multi-monitor support and updated apps?
Hahahaha you call the difference between Windows 7 and 8 a minor update. Literally a whole new style of apps, a store, xbox music, better multi monitor support with the taskbar, boot times going from a minute to 6 seconds, amongst a load of other thing like apps.
You left out the shitty interface that almost no-one understands and everyone hates.
First of all, there is an upgrade fee associated with upgrading from Windows 7 to 8. It's a big update, and one that has been collectively panned by many as a disaster. Most of my friends and family refuse to update to the latest version and those that do are completely lost on how to use it. Luckily, the iPad is easy to use and does everything a Windows machine can do anyway.
I think you are referring to an upgrade from Windows 8 to 8.1, which shouldn't even be an upgrade, but a service pack to fix huge UI issues with the operating system.
OS X has always had great multiple monitor support, and yes they've made it better in this version, but that's just a small update. There are refreshes to all the apps (for the better, unlike Windows with that horrible "tiles" thing). There's also core changes to the operating system like memory compression and huge performance and energy efficiency gains. These work on older Macs (up to 7 years ago) and increase their battery life and performance at NO COST. Even when Apple did charge for OS updates, it was $29 or $19 and they are full updates to the operating system.
Lastly, Apple doesn't need to search for some new, whiz bang UI or look to make a great OS. Many believe that OS X is perfect just the way it is, so these continued refinements and workflow for end-users continues to make new users at the expense of Microsoft. People are realizing that you really do get what you pay for when you buy a Mac... you get a company that cares about the quality of the hardware and software that they deliver and they support it for years to come. You don't get that in the Windows world. Period.
So please go back to Redmond and stop posting here.
Luckily, the iPad is easy to use and does everything a Windows machine can do anyway.
I would like to see you play tomb raider or final fantasy 7 or many of the other hardcore games on your iPad.
iPad does have some games but in no way beats windows at it.
Sorry, I work for a living. I don't have time to play pointless games with obscenely disproportionate boobs.