IDC data shows 66% of Android's 81% smartphone share are junk phones selling for $215

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  • Reply 101 of 180
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by jungmark View Post





    So what defines these market segments? Price? Spec list?

     

    Spec list is likely the closest we can come, since some manufacturers sell at a loss (Google Nexus on the Play Store), and some sell at a huge margin (Apple).  I'd prefer to define it as the component cost, but those numbers aren't always available, and you can approximate it by comparing spec sheets. 

  • Reply 102 of 180
    jungmarkjungmark Posts: 6,569member
    mikeb85 wrote: »
    Spec list is likely the closest we can come, since some manufacturers sell at a loss (Google Nexus on the Play Store), and some sell at a huge margin (Apple).  I'd prefer to define it as the component cost, but those numbers aren't always available, and you can approximate it by comparing spec sheets. 

    I doubt analysts use spec lists to define a smartphone let alone high-end vs low- end.
  • Reply 103 of 180
    hill60hill60 Posts: 6,989member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Mikeb85 View Post

     

     

    Spec list is likely the closest we can come, since some manufacturers sell at a loss (Google Nexus on the Play Store), and some sell at a huge margin (Apple).  I'd prefer to define it as the component cost, but those numbers aren't always available, and you can approximate it by comparing spec sheets. 


     

    Google isn't the major player, Samsung is, the Nexus is a poor representation, Galaxy S4's and Note 3's sell for the same price as iPhones, apart from discounts as the S4 approaches end of life.

  • Reply 104 of 180
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by KristianT View Post



    do i smell jealousy?




    I can't help but note

    1->The android thing looks like a garbage can

    2->The apple sign is inverted...like a mirror image....guess who mirrors apple move for move(hint:It's samsung)

  • Reply 105 of 180
    gatorguygatorguy Posts: 19,393member
    bananaman wrote: »
    I can't help but note
    The android thing looks like a garbage can

    Wow. . . you're right. I'm surprised no one else noticed /s.

    Not sure it's an observation I'd trumpet. What's being put in the "garbage can"? Probably better to ignore obvious click-bait rather than point it out.
  • Reply 106 of 180
    gatorguygatorguy Posts: 19,393member
    Heres' a link to a pretty interesting article I just finished perusing (kudos to 9to5). For those that don't venture beyond Apple-friendly sites you might have missed the news of a new Moto smartphone, the MotoG, at a shocking price... $179 off-contract! You could buy three of those for the price of one 5S.

    Before you think the management at Motorola has gone completely nuts have a read for yourself.
    http://www.mobileindustryreview.com/2013/11/moto-g-google-executing-nokias-strategy-better-even-nokia.html
  • Reply 107 of 180
    hill60hill60 Posts: 6,989member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post



    [bland product placement] the MotoG, at a shocking price... $179 off-contract! You could buy three of those for the price of one 5S.

     

    ...or four of them for one Note 3.

     

    Too bad Motorola are so bad with their hardware they are almost dead, reminds me of last ditch dumping of Blackberry PlayBooks and HP Touchpads.

  • Reply 108 of 180
    dasanman69dasanman69 Posts: 12,965member
    hill60 wrote: »
    ...or four of them for one Note 3.

    Too bad Motorola are so bad with their hardware they are almost dead, reminds me of last ditch dumping of Blackberry PlayBooks and HP Touchpads.

    The hardware is decent just look at the reviews for the Moto X and better than Samsung's they just are being out marketed by them.
  • Reply 109 of 180
    hill60hill60 Posts: 6,989member
    dasanman69 wrote: »
    The hardware is decent just look at the reviews for the Moto X and better than Samsung's they just are being out marketed by them.

    Wait until real life usage reveals them for the pieces of junk they are.

    You can't price them that low without cutting corners somewhere.

    So is Motorola a charity or a product dumper?
  • Reply 110 of 180
    dasanman69dasanman69 Posts: 12,965member
    hill60 wrote: »
    Wait until real life usage reveals them for the pieces of junk they are.

    You can't price them that low without cutting corners somewhere.

    So is Motorola a charity or a product dumper?

    Actually the positive reviews didn't start pouring in until after real life usage. The initial reviews were ho-hum.
  • Reply 111 of 180
    gatorguygatorguy Posts: 19,393member
    hill60 wrote: »
    Wait until real life usage reveals them for the pieces of junk they are.

    You can't price them that low without cutting corners somewhere.

    So is Motorola a charity or a product dumper?

    A top of the line iPhone 64GB iPhone 5s is estimated at just $218 to build and that includes the manufacturing costs. The Moto G is probably more comparable to a two-year old 4s with a few of the more recent 5 components. With 16GB base memory, no expensive fingerprint reader, a less expensive display, less expensive processor and no LTE it's not hard to fathom a Moto G build cost in the $120 range or so IMO. Maybe even less. A classic case of making it up in volume?
  • Reply 112 of 180
    akqiesakqies Posts: 768member
    dasanman69 wrote: »
    Actually the positive reviews didn't start pouring in until after real life usage. The initial reviews were ho-hum.

    For the money the HW is excellent. In many, many ways it's not on par with Apple's offerings but they aren't designed to compete directly with them. The quality is good enough that the main difference is the lack of profit they others get, which is unfortunate since it gives a poor idea of value.

    gatorguy wrote: »
    A top of the line iPhone 64GB iPhone 5s is estimated at just $218 to build and that includes the manufacturing costs. The Moto G is probably more comparable to a two-year old 4s with a few of the more recent 5 components. With 16GB base memory, no expensive fingerprint reader, a less expensive display, less expensive processor and no LTE it's not hard to fathom a Moto G build cost in the $120 range or so IMO. Maybe even less. A classic case of making it up in volume?

    I really wish people didn't use those estimates. Have they ever included tye long term investments for getting mass market Retina IPS displays, Touch ID, or Apple's own chip design talent and IP?
  • Reply 113 of 180
    gatorguygatorguy Posts: 19,393member
    akqies wrote: »

    I really wish people didn't use those estimates. Have they ever included tye long term investments for getting mass market Retina IPS displays, Touch ID, or Apple's own chip design talent and IP?

    Those things aren't specific to the iPhone are they? Wouldn't they figure into the broad category of R&D to be deducted from gross profits? Dunno.
  • Reply 114 of 180
    hill60hill60 Posts: 6,989member
    gatorguy wrote: »
    A top of the line iPhone 64GB iPhone 5s is estimated at just $218 to build and that includes the manufacturing costs

    I'll give you $300, enough to cover your costs with a small profit.

    When can I expect delivery?
  • Reply 115 of 180
    gatorguygatorguy Posts: 19,393member
    hill60 wrote: »
    I'll give you $300, enough to cover your costs with a small profit.

    When can I expect delivery?

    Hon Hai might be really happy to if Apple let 'em. $300 could be a lot more than Apple is buying them for.
  • Reply 116 of 180
    akqiesakqies Posts: 768member
    gatorguy wrote: »
    Those things aren't specific to the iPhone are they? Wouldn't they figure into the broad category of R&D to be deducted from gross profits? Dunno.

    In 2010 Retina was only on the iPhone 4 after a couple years of rumors about Apple investing in display vendors. That same year was the first year of an Apple A-chip years after buying PA Semi. This year the iPhone 5S is the only device with Touch ID.

    Eventually this trickles down to other devices and the per unit cost for that initial investment approaches zero but that's what a good investment does. This is what Apple excels at and a big reason for their ability to produce higher quality items at a lower cost than comparable products while still making a healthy profit.
  • Reply 117 of 180
    jungmarkjungmark Posts: 6,569member
    gatorguy wrote: »
    Those things aren't specific to the iPhone are they? Wouldn't they figure into the broad category of R&D to be deducted from gross profits? Dunno.

    It's like saying drugs cost < $1 to make, why are they so expensive? Testing, development, etc. who wants to pay $30 MM for the first pill.
  • Reply 118 of 180
    jeffdenverjeffdenver Posts: 108member
    The One+1 retails for $300, and has specs better than the best iPhone. How exactly are you people defining "Junk" phones? By Android standards, most iPhones are junk phones, since they are using 2 year old technology.

    http://www.theverge.com/2014/4/25/5653254/spec-sheet-oneplus-one-smartphone-compared-nexus-5-oppo-n1-blu

    2.5ghz Quad Core CPU
    3 GIGs RAM
    Retina-annihilating 1080p display
    6 lens 13MP sony-sensor camera and 5MP front camera

    $300 for 16 gigs, $350 for 64gig storage (they are not going to screw you over on storage like Apple does)

    This will outperform the Nexus 5, and the Nexus 5 already outperforms the best iPhone. And for half the price.

    [VIDEO]

    Apple people seem to confuse "cheap" with "bad" and they are not necessarily the same thing. Apple way overcharges for the performance and features they deliver.
  • Reply 119 of 180
    tallest skiltallest skil Posts: 43,399member
    Originally Posted by JeffDenver View Post

    The One+1 retails for $300, and has specs better than the best iPhone. How exactly are you people defining "Junk" phones?

     

    Phones that have to use their specs to be sold.

     

    By Android standards, most iPhones are junk phones, since they are using 2 year old technology.


     

    No, you don’t get it at all.

     

    2.5ghz Quad Core CPU


     

    And it will still lag. <img class=" src="http://forums-files.appleinsider.com/images/smilies//lol.gif" />

     

    3 GIGs RAM


     

    So long, battery!

     

    Retina-annihilating 1080p display


     

    Annihilating in the sense that you can’t see the pixels anyway, and so therefore they’re completely and utterly useless and only serve to waste battery life and processing power, you mean?

     

    6 lens 13MP sony-sensor camera and 5MP front camera


     

    So… how big are the sensors? Megapixels are meaningless.

     

    (they are not going to screw you over on storage like Apple does)


     

    Years of studies show that consumers consistently report Apple’s upgrade pricing is affordable. Take your FUD and shove it.

     

    This will outperform the Nexus 5, and the Nexus 5 already outperforms the best iPhone.


     

    No, but keep the fantasy alive, I guess. 

     
    Apple people seem to confuse "cheap" with "bad" and they are not necessarily the same thing. Apple way overcharges for the performance and features they deliver. 

     

    No, but again, enjoy the fantasy world in which you live.

  • Reply 120 of 180
    correctionscorrections Posts: 1,210member
    jeffdenver wrote: »
    The One+1 retails for $300, and has specs better than the best iPhone. How exactly are you people defining "Junk" phones? By Android standards, most iPhones are junk phones, since they are using 2 year old technology.

    Apple people seem to confuse "cheap" with "bad" and they are not necessarily the same thing. Apple way overcharges for the performance and features they deliver.

    Hi Jeff - do you understand the concept of an "average selling price"? A $300 phone does not really contribute to the plunging ASP of Android phones being $215 and falling.

    The volume of Android phones are selling for much less than $215, counteracting the price of higher end models like Samsung's Galaxy S & Note, the best selling (by far) premium phones Android has, with retail prices that are more expensive than Apple's IPhones.

    You might like the Nexus 5, but it isn't selling in any sort of meaningful volume. It's made by LG, a company that's losing money and selling relatively poor shipments.

    HTC is similarly losing money and failing to ship in significant numbers.

    In fact, the only real volume Android is seeing is in super cheap, low end junk phones that cost significantly less than $200. Enough less to counteract the 100M high end Samsung phones that are priced $500-$800.

    Also: what about Apple's iPhone 5s is "two year old tech"?

    Its ARMv8 64-bit A7, unmatched by any Android vendor at any price?
    Touch ID that works, unlike anything on Android?
    A camera with sophisticated flash that regularly beats all high end Android cameras in every pro review?
    Its ability to run real apps and exclusive games, rather than just the wallpapers, spyware and second hand ports found in Google Play?

    You really have it backward. Most Android phones are stuck running 2 year old versions of Android.
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