100 miles? Gordon Bennett! I admittedly know very little about Tesla other than it's hot property and some people clearly see a synergy with Apple, but, for me, the problem with electric cars is the incredibly low range. When they start to reach 400/500 miles, I’ll become interested.
The top-of-the-line Model S goes for 300 miles already. The battery can be switched in less than two minutes. That car costs over $100,000.
For a $30,0000 car, you can't expect the range to be 300 miles yet. But let's say it is 120 miles. This range is more than adequate for 80% of people in America and Canada as well as for 95% of Europeans for a second car for commuting to work and running errands.
In fact, you could have both of your family cars to be Tesla, and a few times per year you need to drive out of town, you could rent an internal-combustion-engine vehicle.
The battery can be switched in less than two minutes.
What do you mean by "can be"? I saw the presentation on the fast battery swap but I haven't seen a single station that offers it.
But let's say it is 120 miles. This range is more than adequate for 80% of people in America and Canada as well as for 95% of Europeans as a second car for commuting to work and running errands.
In fact, you could have both of your family cars to be Tesla, and a few times per year you need to drive out of town, you could rent an internal-combustion-engine vehicle.
I see two issues.
1) The range of a vehicle you can't reasonably "refuel" on the go needs to be compared against some shorter distance, not the round trip. Perhaps something like a half-life of the range for round trips.
2) The idea of renting a car just to go out of town makes the whole notion of an electric car a poor option. If I am paying more than $100k for a luxury sedan I'd like to enjoy that sedan on the longer trips, not just quick 2 mile trips to the grocery store.
I don't think electric or even gas-electric hybrids are the answer. They seem to be transitional type technology to get us to that next level. At least right now it appears that hydrogen fuel cell cars might have the best chance for mass adoption if they can address the shortcomings. You can fill them up just like gas in only 5 minutes and they can go for up to 400 miles on a tank and they get the gas equivalent of around 60MPG. The two weak points are the price of hydrogen which is high and the lack of service stations to fill up your car. If enough existing service stations offer a pump then that would solve at least one problem. I look forward to seeing the new models coming out later this year. Gas will still be with us for a long while yet but it is interesting to see what the future holds.
What do you mean by "can be"? I saw the presentation on the fast battery swap but I haven't seen a single station that offers it.
I see two issues.
1) The range of a vehicle you can't reasonably "refuel" on the go needs to be compared against some shorter distance, not the round trip. Perhaps something like a half-life of the range for round trips.
2) The idea of renting a car just to go out of town makes the whole notion of an electric car a poor option. If I am paying more than $100k for a luxury sedan I'd like to enjoy that sedan on the longer trips, not just quick 2 mile trips to the grocery store.
In California, the battery swap stations are already there, and are built within the Tesla range from one another. Additionally, if you own a Tesla, you can charge it for free at many electric charging stations in California. There are 75 Super Charging stations in North America already, and you can now drive coast to coast by getting your Tesla charged at Super Charging stations only. A Super Charging station can charge a Tesla Model S in 30 minutes for a range of 170 miles. By the end of 2014, 80% of US population will be covered by Super Charging stations. By the end of 2015, 98% of US population will be covered. Super Charging stations are located near restaurants and shopping centers, so an hour-long rest stop will allow you to fully recharge the battery in a Tesla.
We are not talking about a car that costs more than $100K with a range of 120 miles. Those will be different Tesla models (not Model S), which will cost in the neighborhood of $30,000 give or take. Currently, the least expensive Tesla Model S has a range of 208 miles and costs $63,570. There's no shortage of demand - you have to wait 2-3 months for a Tesla to be delivered once you order yours.
Last June was a great opportunity to invest in Tesla, when it was $30 something per share. Today it's $204. This is nearly a 600% rise in stock price in eight months.
I don't think electric or even gas-electric hybrids are the answer. They seem to be transitional type technology to get us to that next level. At least right now it appears that hydrogen fuel cell cars might have the best chance for mass adoption if they can address the shortcomings. You can fill them up just like gas in only 5 minutes and they can go for up to 400 miles on a tank and they get the gas equivalent of around 60MPG. The two weak points are the price of hydrogen which is high and the lack of service stations to fill up your car. If enough existing service stations offer a pump then that would solve at least one problem. I look forward to seeing the new models coming out later this year. Gas will still be with us for a long while yet but it is interesting to see what the future holds.
... Any ideas other than harnessing energy generated by fossil fuels to get pure hydrogen?
Think of hydrogen as an energy storage medium. Hydrogen can be used in an ICE much like compressed natural gas. Several years ago, BMW had a fleet of 7-Series sedans on the road that did just that. However, the consensus is that hydrogen is put to its best use in fuel cells.
Opponents of hydrogen go on ad nauseam ad infinitum about the source of electricity used to extract hydrogen from its source. They try to drown-out thoughts about a very important fact about electricity--its source is flexible. Your electricity may be generated by a coal-fired plant. It may also be generated by photovoltaic cells. Coal-fired plants have numerous issues. Photovoltaic cells generate electricity from the Sun, a free and inexhaustible source. Other sources fall somewhere between coal and solar with respect to issues involving source energy. You cannot put a coal, oil, or nuclear power plant in your basement. However, you can put an array of solar cells on your roof or in your back yard that will satisfy all of your electric needs for your car and your home. Many home owners are doing this now. Many new businesses are moving into buildings that generate some or all of their electric via photoelectric cells.
From where I sit, the most environmentally friend source of hydrogen is the electrolysis of water. You may have done this in your high school chemistry class. However, the fossil fuel producers want us to produce hydrogen by reforming methane. Reforming methane produces CO2, one of the by-products that we want to avoid by switching to hydrogen in the first place. If we produce electricity by burning coal, oil, or natural gas [methane], then we will generate CO2. However, there are methods of generating electricity that do not burn fossil fuels. These include hydroelectric, wind, nuclear, solar, ocean waves, etc. Obviously, some of these alternatives are better than others.
The point is that we have choices. It is up to us not to surrender our choices.
The top-of-the-line Model S goes for 300 miles already. The battery can be switched in less than two minutes. That car costs over $100,000.
For a $30,0000 car, you can't expect the range to be 300 miles yet. But let's say it is 120 miles. This range is more than adequate for 80% of people in America and Canada as well as for 95% of Europeans for a second car for commuting to work and running errands.
In fact, you could have both of your family cars to be Tesla, and a few times per year you need to drive out of town, you could rent an internal-combustion-engine vehicle.
I don't agree that 120 miles range is adequate for anyone. All the millions of people that don't own a garage park on the street; how do they recharge overnight?
Batteries have to be replaced after a few years at great expense; not so for conventional engines.
Batteries take so long to charge! Petrol or diesel lets you increase your range by 600 miles within a couple of minutes; miles quicker than electricity. Handy in an emergency.
I don't agree that 120 miles range is adequate for anyone. All the millions of people that don't own a garage park on the street; how do they recharge overnight?
To the contrary, A range of 120 miles is adequate for not just "anyone," it is adequate for the vast majority of people the vast majority of the time. For some reason, I surmise that you meant everyone rather than anyone. Most people will acknowledge that nothing fits the needs of 100% of the people 100% of the time.
Petroleum-powered vehicles force compromises. It is unrealistic to expect electric vehicles not to force compromises.
Batteries have to be replaced after a few years at great expense; not so for conventional engines.
You are either spreading deliberate misinformation or you are being deliberately uninformed. One of the features being developed is the fast swap of batteries convenience stores and service stations that cater to electric cars. Suffice it to say, the swap would take a few seconds and be very inexpensive.
Batteries take so long to charge! Petrol or diesel lets you increase your range by 600 miles within a couple of minutes; miles quicker than electricity. Handy in an emergency.
Again, you are either deliberately spreading misinformation or you are being deliberately uninformed. Tesla has setup a network--currently standing at 75--Supercharger battery recharging stations across the United States with an island of Superchargers in Texas. There are currently 14 Supercharger stations in Europe. These stations recharge the Tesla battery in 30 minutes at no charge to the vehicle owner. If you travel with friends or family, then your passengers will want to eat and shop at each stop during your journey. Your battery will be recharged long before your passengers finish their meals.
It is now possible for a Tesla owner to drive from Vancouver, BC to Miami, FL and to pay nothing for the battery recharges required to complete the trip. Try that in a petroleum-powered car!
To the contrary, A range of 120 miles is adequate for not just "anyone," it is adequate for the vast majority of people the vast majority of the time. For some reason, I surmise that you meant everyone rather than anyone. Most people will acknowledge that nothing fits the needs of 100% of the people 100% of the time.
I understand that most daily trips are well under 120 miles but for an assumption to made that 120 mile roundtrip range of transportation is good enough for the "vast majority" you need to be sure the "vast majority" never needs to drive over 60 miles, one-way, in a day. I don't think the "vast majority" would fall into that situation and the idea of then renting or owning a spare internal combustion engine vehicle specifically for traveling more than a 60 mile radius from your home is not a comforting argument for the future of electric vehicles.
Furthermore, if it's rated for 120 miles I assume that's highway miles. How many miles are wasted by acceleration and idling? You also need to have enough of a cushion to feasibly not get ever get stuck because you have a dead battery. This then means you need to make sure the "vast majority" never need to use a car for more than probably 100 miles round trip between charges.
I use Automatic and despite how much highway driving I do I still only average about 34 miles per hour. For example, since Monday I have driven nearly 400 miles and have had my car running for about 8.5 hours.
I understand that most daily trips are well under 120 miles but for an assumption to made that 120 mile roundtrip range of transportation is good enough for the "vast majority" you need to be sure the "vast majority" never needs to drive over 60 miles, one-way, in a day. I don't think the "vast majority" would fall into that situation and the idea of then renting or owning a spare internal combustion engine vehicle specifically for traveling more than a 60 mile radius from your home is not a comforting argument for the future of electric vehicles.
Furthermore, if it's rated for 120 miles I assume that's highway miles. How many miles are wasted by acceleration and idling? You also need to have enough of a cushion to feasibly not get ever get stuck because you have a dead battery. This then means you need to make sure the "vast majority" never need to use a car for more than probably 100 miles round trip between charges.
I use Automatic and despite how much highway driving I do I still only average about 34 miles per hour. For example, since Monday I have driven nearly 400 miles and have had my car running for about 8.5 hours.
I don't know where you're getting your data because 92% of US commuters drive less than 35 miles each way during their daily commutes. That means a 120 mile electric car (even with an effective range of just 90 miles) would be good enough for 90% of the US on most days. Considering that more and more employers are installing EV chargers, the commuter could very well be fully charged before leaving work each day.
Also, electric cars get better range at lower speeds. The Model S can get 400 miles on a charge if you were to consistently drive about 30 mph. At 55 mph it gets 300 miles. At typical speeds of 65 - 70 it gets about 250 miles per charge.
I don't know where you're getting your data because 92% of US commuters drive less than 35 miles each way during their daily commutes. That means a 120 mile electric car (even with an effective range of just 90 miles) would be good enough for 90% of the US.
Also, electric cars get better range at lower speeds. The Model S can get 400 miles on a charge if you were to consistently drive about 30 mph. At 55 mph it gets 300 miles. At typical speeds of 65 - 70 it gets about 250 miles per charge.
So these 92% never travel more than 70 miles in a day?
So these 92% never travel more than 70 miles in a day?
You're changing the topic now. You went from discussing 'most daily trips' to what a driver occasionally does. The majority of the time 92% of commuters are just fine with a 120 mile EV. That's the point. 92% of the time an EV user can charge at home overnight, drive to work and run errands each day, then return home and plug in. Rinse, dry, repeat.
For the other 8% of the time when you do need to make a longer trip you can use a FREE super charger (if you own a Tesla). Stopping for 20 extra minutes saves you $50 in gas expenses. My time is valuable but I don't mind waiting 20 minutes for $50 in my pocket. If it were a job salary that's the equivalent of making $150 / hour ($300,000 / year).
You're changing the topic now. You went from discussing 'most daily trips' to what a driver occasionally does. The majority of the time 92% of commuters are just fine with a 120 mile EV. That's the point. 92% of the time an EV user can charge at home overnight, drive to work and run errands each day, then return home and plug in. Rinse, dry, repeat.
For the other 8% of the time when you do need to make a longer trip you can use a FREE super charger (if you own a Tesla). Stopping for 20 extra minutes saves you $50 in gas expenses. My time is valuable but I don't mind waiting 20 minutes for $50 in my pocket. If it were a job salary that's the equivalent of making $150 / hour ($300,000 / year).
Why wouldn't you want to count what people potentially do with a car? My parents didn't need a station wagon for the family except for the infrequent road trips but they bought one with that in mind. My father, who drove to and from work every day would have loved to have instead had a two-seat convertible but it's impractical for the bigger picture so why would you or anyone else make an isolated scenario that doesn't cover the real world driving habits that people do use their vehicles for, even if infrequently?
Why wouldn't you want to count what people potentially do with a car? My parents didn't need a station wagon for the family except for the infrequent road trips but they bought one with that in mind. My father, who drove to and from work every day would have loved to have instead had a two-seat convertible but it's impractical for the bigger picture so why would you or anyone else make an isolated scenario that doesn't cover the real world driving habits that people do use their vehicles for, even if infrequently?
You're right, the things people potentially will want to do is important too. That's why I got the 85kW Model S. I have 200+ miles of range even though I rarely drive more than 50 - 60 miles in a day. The most important value any product is whether it suits your needs the vast majority of the time you need it. For me I'm in driver's bliss 99% of the time using my Model S. For the 1% of the time I need to make a cross country trip I'll rent a car or live with the extra charging times.
I'd rather be happy with my car 99% of the time and inconvenienced 1% of the time than drive an inferior car 99% of the time just so I'm prepared for the 1% chance I'll drive long distances.
You're right, the things people potentially will want to do is important too. That's why I got the 85kW Model S. I have 200+ miles of range even though I rarely drive more than 50 - 60 miles in a day. The most important value any product is whether it suits your needs the vast majority of the time you need it. For me I'm in driver's bliss 99% of the time using my Model S. For the 1% of the time I need to make a cross country trip I'll rent a car or live with the extra charging times.
I'd rather be happy with my car 99% of the time and inconvenienced 1% of the time than drive an inferior car 99% of the time just so I'm prepared for the 1% chance I'll drive long distances.
And that's the reasoning that led to Toyota's Prius line becoming best-selling hybrid vehicles.
I'd rather be happy with my car 99% of the time and inconvenienced 1% of the time than drive an inferior car 99% of the time just so I'm prepared for the 1% chance I'll drive long distances.
And interestingly that also seems to be the Apple approach with iOS. Synergies of product philosophy here.
Comments
The top-of-the-line Model S goes for 300 miles already. The battery can be switched in less than two minutes. That car costs over $100,000.
For a $30,0000 car, you can't expect the range to be 300 miles yet. But let's say it is 120 miles. This range is more than adequate for 80% of people in America and Canada as well as for 95% of Europeans for a second car for commuting to work and running errands.
In fact, you could have both of your family cars to be Tesla, and a few times per year you need to drive out of town, you could rent an internal-combustion-engine vehicle.
What do you mean by "can be"? I saw the presentation on the fast battery swap but I haven't seen a single station that offers it.
I see two issues.
1) The range of a vehicle you can't reasonably "refuel" on the go needs to be compared against some shorter distance, not the round trip. Perhaps something like a half-life of the range for round trips.
2) The idea of renting a car just to go out of town makes the whole notion of an electric car a poor option. If I am paying more than $100k for a luxury sedan I'd like to enjoy that sedan on the longer trips, not just quick 2 mile trips to the grocery store.
I don't think electric or even gas-electric hybrids are the answer. They seem to be transitional type technology to get us to that next level. At least right now it appears that hydrogen fuel cell cars might have the best chance for mass adoption if they can address the shortcomings. You can fill them up just like gas in only 5 minutes and they can go for up to 400 miles on a tank and they get the gas equivalent of around 60MPG. The two weak points are the price of hydrogen which is high and the lack of service stations to fill up your car. If enough existing service stations offer a pump then that would solve at least one problem. I look forward to seeing the new models coming out later this year. Gas will still be with us for a long while yet but it is interesting to see what the future holds.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/the-switch/wp/2014/01/24/i-tried-a-hydrogen-fuel-cell-vehicle-heres-what-it-was-like/?tid=hpModule_1728cf4a-8a79-11e2-98d9-3012c1cd8d1e
What do you mean by "can be"? I saw the presentation on the fast battery swap but I haven't seen a single station that offers it.
I see two issues.
1) The range of a vehicle you can't reasonably "refuel" on the go needs to be compared against some shorter distance, not the round trip. Perhaps something like a half-life of the range for round trips.
2) The idea of renting a car just to go out of town makes the whole notion of an electric car a poor option. If I am paying more than $100k for a luxury sedan I'd like to enjoy that sedan on the longer trips, not just quick 2 mile trips to the grocery store.
In California, the battery swap stations are already there, and are built within the Tesla range from one another. Additionally, if you own a Tesla, you can charge it for free at many electric charging stations in California. There are 75 Super Charging stations in North America already, and you can now drive coast to coast by getting your Tesla charged at Super Charging stations only. A Super Charging station can charge a Tesla Model S in 30 minutes for a range of 170 miles. By the end of 2014, 80% of US population will be covered by Super Charging stations. By the end of 2015, 98% of US population will be covered. Super Charging stations are located near restaurants and shopping centers, so an hour-long rest stop will allow you to fully recharge the battery in a Tesla.
We are not talking about a car that costs more than $100K with a range of 120 miles. Those will be different Tesla models (not Model S), which will cost in the neighborhood of $30,000 give or take. Currently, the least expensive Tesla Model S has a range of 208 miles and costs $63,570. There's no shortage of demand - you have to wait 2-3 months for a Tesla to be delivered once you order yours.
Last June was a great opportunity to invest in Tesla, when it was $30 something per share. Today it's $204. This is nearly a 600% rise in stock price in eight months.
2
I don't think electric or even gas-electric hybrids are the answer. They seem to be transitional type technology to get us to that next level. At least right now it appears that hydrogen fuel cell cars might have the best chance for mass adoption if they can address the shortcomings. You can fill them up just like gas in only 5 minutes and they can go for up to 400 miles on a tank and they get the gas equivalent of around 60MPG. The two weak points are the price of hydrogen which is high and the lack of service stations to fill up your car. If enough existing service stations offer a pump then that would solve at least one problem. I look forward to seeing the new models coming out later this year. Gas will still be with us for a long while yet but it is interesting to see what the future holds.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/the-switch/wp/2014/01/24/i-tried-a-hydrogen-fuel-cell-vehicle-heres-what-it-was-like/?tid=hpModule_1728cf4a-8a79-11e2-98d9-3012c1cd8d1e
How do you obtain hydrogen from water? Any ideas other than harnessing energy generated by fossil fuels to get pure hydrogen?
This makes sense. They both use cell phone batteries. Mush wants to build a big cell phone type battery plant. Both companies can use the batteries.
Apple’s battery tech doubles the range of Tesla vehicles. Tesla’s battery factory builds Apple’s battery tech on an industrial scale for cheap.
Win win.
Opponents of hydrogen go on ad nauseam ad infinitum about the source of electricity used to extract hydrogen from its source. They try to drown-out thoughts about a very important fact about electricity--its source is flexible. Your electricity may be generated by a coal-fired plant. It may also be generated by photovoltaic cells. Coal-fired plants have numerous issues. Photovoltaic cells generate electricity from the Sun, a free and inexhaustible source. Other sources fall somewhere between coal and solar with respect to issues involving source energy. You cannot put a coal, oil, or nuclear power plant in your basement. However, you can put an array of solar cells on your roof or in your back yard that will satisfy all of your electric needs for your car and your home. Many home owners are doing this now. Many new businesses are moving into buildings that generate some or all of their electric via photoelectric cells.
From where I sit, the most environmentally friend source of hydrogen is the electrolysis of water. You may have done this in your high school chemistry class. However, the fossil fuel producers want us to produce hydrogen by reforming methane. Reforming methane produces CO2, one of the by-products that we want to avoid by switching to hydrogen in the first place. If we produce electricity by burning coal, oil, or natural gas [methane], then we will generate CO2. However, there are methods of generating electricity that do not burn fossil fuels. These include hydroelectric, wind, nuclear, solar, ocean waves, etc. Obviously, some of these alternatives are better than others.
The point is that we have choices. It is up to us not to surrender our choices.
I don't agree that 120 miles range is adequate for anyone. All the millions of people that don't own a garage park on the street; how do they recharge overnight?
Batteries have to be replaced after a few years at great expense; not so for conventional engines.
Batteries take so long to charge! Petrol or diesel lets you increase your range by 600 miles within a couple of minutes; miles quicker than electricity. Handy in an emergency.
To the contrary, A range of 120 miles is adequate for not just "anyone," it is adequate for the vast majority of people the vast majority of the time. For some reason, I surmise that you meant everyone rather than anyone. Most people will acknowledge that nothing fits the needs of 100% of the people 100% of the time.
Petroleum-powered vehicles force compromises. It is unrealistic to expect electric vehicles not to force compromises.
You are either spreading deliberate misinformation or you are being deliberately uninformed. One of the features being developed is the fast swap of batteries convenience stores and service stations that cater to electric cars. Suffice it to say, the swap would take a few seconds and be very inexpensive.
Again, you are either deliberately spreading misinformation or you are being deliberately uninformed. Tesla has setup a network--currently standing at 75--Supercharger battery recharging stations across the United States with an island of Superchargers in Texas. There are currently 14 Supercharger stations in Europe. These stations recharge the Tesla battery in 30 minutes at no charge to the vehicle owner. If you travel with friends or family, then your passengers will want to eat and shop at each stop during your journey. Your battery will be recharged long before your passengers finish their meals.
It is now possible for a Tesla owner to drive from Vancouver, BC to Miami, FL and to pay nothing for the battery recharges required to complete the trip. Try that in a petroleum-powered car!
Learn more about the Tesla Supercharger network here--if you dare.
I understand that most daily trips are well under 120 miles but for an assumption to made that 120 mile roundtrip range of transportation is good enough for the "vast majority" you need to be sure the "vast majority" never needs to drive over 60 miles, one-way, in a day. I don't think the "vast majority" would fall into that situation and the idea of then renting or owning a spare internal combustion engine vehicle specifically for traveling more than a 60 mile radius from your home is not a comforting argument for the future of electric vehicles.
Furthermore, if it's rated for 120 miles I assume that's highway miles. How many miles are wasted by acceleration and idling? You also need to have enough of a cushion to feasibly not get ever get stuck because you have a dead battery. This then means you need to make sure the "vast majority" never need to use a car for more than probably 100 miles round trip between charges.
I use Automatic and despite how much highway driving I do I still only average about 34 miles per hour. For example, since Monday I have driven nearly 400 miles and have had my car running for about 8.5 hours.
I understand that most daily trips are well under 120 miles but for an assumption to made that 120 mile roundtrip range of transportation is good enough for the "vast majority" you need to be sure the "vast majority" never needs to drive over 60 miles, one-way, in a day. I don't think the "vast majority" would fall into that situation and the idea of then renting or owning a spare internal combustion engine vehicle specifically for traveling more than a 60 mile radius from your home is not a comforting argument for the future of electric vehicles.
Furthermore, if it's rated for 120 miles I assume that's highway miles. How many miles are wasted by acceleration and idling? You also need to have enough of a cushion to feasibly not get ever get stuck because you have a dead battery. This then means you need to make sure the "vast majority" never need to use a car for more than probably 100 miles round trip between charges.
I use Automatic and despite how much highway driving I do I still only average about 34 miles per hour. For example, since Monday I have driven nearly 400 miles and have had my car running for about 8.5 hours.
I don't know where you're getting your data because 92% of US commuters drive less than 35 miles each way during their daily commutes. That means a 120 mile electric car (even with an effective range of just 90 miles) would be good enough for 90% of the US on most days. Considering that more and more employers are installing EV chargers, the commuter could very well be fully charged before leaving work each day.
http://www.statisticbrain.com/commute-statistics/
Also, electric cars get better range at lower speeds. The Model S can get 400 miles on a charge if you were to consistently drive about 30 mph. At 55 mph it gets 300 miles. At typical speeds of 65 - 70 it gets about 250 miles per charge.
So these 92% never travel more than 70 miles in a day?
So these 92% never travel more than 70 miles in a day?
You're changing the topic now. You went from discussing 'most daily trips' to what a driver occasionally does. The majority of the time 92% of commuters are just fine with a 120 mile EV. That's the point. 92% of the time an EV user can charge at home overnight, drive to work and run errands each day, then return home and plug in. Rinse, dry, repeat.
For the other 8% of the time when you do need to make a longer trip you can use a FREE super charger (if you own a Tesla). Stopping for 20 extra minutes saves you $50 in gas expenses. My time is valuable but I don't mind waiting 20 minutes for $50 in my pocket. If it were a job salary that's the equivalent of making $150 / hour ($300,000 / year).
Why wouldn't you want to count what people potentially do with a car? My parents didn't need a station wagon for the family except for the infrequent road trips but they bought one with that in mind. My father, who drove to and from work every day would have loved to have instead had a two-seat convertible but it's impractical for the bigger picture so why would you or anyone else make an isolated scenario that doesn't cover the real world driving habits that people do use their vehicles for, even if infrequently?
Why wouldn't you want to count what people potentially do with a car? My parents didn't need a station wagon for the family except for the infrequent road trips but they bought one with that in mind. My father, who drove to and from work every day would have loved to have instead had a two-seat convertible but it's impractical for the bigger picture so why would you or anyone else make an isolated scenario that doesn't cover the real world driving habits that people do use their vehicles for, even if infrequently?
You're right, the things people potentially will want to do is important too. That's why I got the 85kW Model S. I have 200+ miles of range even though I rarely drive more than 50 - 60 miles in a day. The most important value any product is whether it suits your needs the vast majority of the time you need it. For me I'm in driver's bliss 99% of the time using my Model S. For the 1% of the time I need to make a cross country trip I'll rent a car or live with the extra charging times.
I'd rather be happy with my car 99% of the time and inconvenienced 1% of the time than drive an inferior car 99% of the time just so I'm prepared for the 1% chance I'll drive long distances.
And that's the reasoning that led to Toyota's Prius line becoming best-selling hybrid vehicles.
I'd rather be happy with my car 99% of the time and inconvenienced 1% of the time than drive an inferior car 99% of the time just so I'm prepared for the 1% chance I'll drive long distances.
And interestingly that also seems to be the Apple approach with iOS. Synergies of product philosophy here.
I just had a thought, Apple should buy Tesla!