1. Well, yeah; the morons changed the spacing between them. The dates are closer together and higher up. :p
2. Sure thing. Right here.
3. It does; starting at 2005 (which you can’t really tell because the numbers are blurred).
4. So? It shows the adoption was the same.
3. Why do they have the US release dates for phones against the EU graph? They weren't released in the EU for months later
4. No it doesn't, see 3
Also, thanks for providing some sources for once. But how does what you provided show that the iPhone "•Broke the bonds of carrier locked features", which is what you replied to me about. The article you linked to states that smartphone adoption in the US only took off after carrier subsidies increased (ie carrier locking)
3. Why do they have the US release dates for phones against the EU graph? They weren't released in the EU for months later
4. No it doesn't, see 3
Also, thanks for providing some sources for once. But how does what you provided show that the iPhone "•Broke the bonds of carrier locked features", which is what you replied to me about. The article you linked to states that smartphone adoption in the US only took off after carrier subsidies increased (ie carrier locking)
You jumped in with Post 69 as a reply to Post 16...you have never been able to substantiate your statement. That statement is what lead to many posts back and forth with people.
Quote: Post 16
Originally Posted by mdriftmeyer
Before the iPhone there was something they were labeling as smart phones. In hindsight, they were poorly labeled as such.
Quote: Post 69
Originally Posted by jfanning
You're funny. Before iPhone OS 2, the iPhone was missing major features to be labelled a smart phone
So as you posted below, maybe you can provide a source...
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfanning
A couple of issues.
...
2. Source?
...
You seem to be all hung up about how the US market works. Your whole discussion has been a moving target as evidenced by the content of your numerous posts.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfanning
If you can't understand the point, then maybe you were a child in 2007 and/or didn't understand the industry internationally at that time.
Are personal insults of any value in a conversation? Leave them at home.
"The point"...I would refer you back to your first comment in the thread. Still never provided an answer with proof with a source.
You are aware that they released the iPhone in the UK/Germany months after the US release?
That only happened with the original IIRC, so probably just an oversight by Asymco. Also, some of the phones marked probably had different release dates across the EU, so there'll always be a bit of a blurry line.
That only happened with the original IIRC, so probably just an oversight by Asymco. Also, some of the phones marked probably had different release dates across the EU, so there'll always be a bit of a blurry line.
Yes I know that, but if you are going to provide a graph showing the effect of the EU iPhone sales on a category, shouldn't the date on the graph be the EU release date, not the US one?
You jumped in with Post 69 as a reply to Post 16...you have never been able to substantiate your statement. That statement is what lead to many posts back and forth with people.
So as you posted below, maybe you can provide a source...[
I would love to, I have posted lots of them since 2007, but AI will only let you go back 100 pages of posts, I can't link them anymore.
You seem to be all hung up about how the US market works. Your whole discussion has been a moving target as evidenced by the content of your numerous posts.
You were the one who raised the US market post #126 if you have forgotten), I was saying that you have to look at the world market (the other 96% of the world)
Oh dear indeed. I think you have dug yourself a little hole and don't know how to get out of it.
The iPhone 1 was a smartphone, but only after iPhone OS 2.0 was released, remember you could update your iPhone when the new version of the OS came out...
It is you who have dug yourself a big hole, there is no way a Symbian phone can ever ever ever be categorized as a smart phone for the simple reason that it can't scroll. The iPhone was the first phone that allowed scrolling, the minor point that it didn't have user load able apps at first is simply freaking irrelevant. Don't you remember the comment " you had me at scrolling" when Steve was demoing the pictures, contacts and photos scrolling was a huge leap in the interface the whole smartphone industry was aghast at that and RIM convened an emergency meeting to address the calamity that was facing them. Your judgement that is iOS1 was not a smartphone OS is ludicrous and laughable. Up until the iPhone no phone had the capability to selectively go thru voicemail with all carriers we had to start at the oldest voicemail and hear or skip each one to get to the latest one. Apple worked with AT&T to get smart voicemail to work , why don't you just admit you are incorrect, be a man, and stop supporting your obviously ridiculous claim?
I won't enter into any of the skirmishes going on in this thread, I just want to add my observation that the original introduction of the iPhone was such a remarkable demonstration of capabilities of how smoothly and competently a pocket phone could tour the net and do email in addition to being a phone, that some competitors were certain that the demo was rigged. It wasn't until the iPhone was opened and studied that some people realized that Apple had done the impossible and put a fully functional computer inside the iPhone.
I won't enter into any of the skirmishes going on in this thread, I just want to add my observation that the original introduction of the iPhone was such a remarkable demonstration of capabilities of how smoothly and competently a pocket phone could tour the net and do email in addition to being a phone, that some competitors were certain that the demo was rigged. It wasn't until the iPhone was opened and studied that some people realized that Apple had done the impossible and put a fully functional computer inside the iPhone.
In fact the engineers at Rim told the executives that it was impossible for apple to have built a phone that did what it did with the battery life apple claimed , boy were they so wrong! Now look at blackberry market share!
I cannot think of a family of products like the iPod/iPhone/iPad that has singlehandedly obliterated several companies, product catogories and retail outlets except possibly the Sony Walkman / disc player, really what we have witnessed is probably the most disruptive commercial upheaval in computers/phones/music/video/books/print and soon to add watch, payment and maybe TV industries. Looking further ahead if apple sets its sights on fully Integrating its OS into hardware in the automobile systems, medical devices it will grow to a 2trillion dollar market cap. What other engineering devices can it go after? - what about aircraft? I'm sure the military has several projects using Apple's OS and front end tech to interface with systems?
It is you who have dug yourself a big hole, there is no way a Symbian phone can ever ever ever be categorized as a smart phone for the simple reason that it can't scroll. The iPhone was the first phone that allowed scrolling, the minor point that it didn't have user load able apps at first is simply freaking irrelevant. Don't you remember the comment " you had me at scrolling" when Steve was demoing the pictures, contacts and photos scrolling was a huge leap in the interface the whole smartphone industry was aghast at that and RIM convened an emergency meeting to address the calamity that was facing them. Your judgement that is iOS1 was not a smartphone OS is ludicrous and laughable. Up until the iPhone no phone had the capability to selectively go thru voicemail with all carriers we had to start at the oldest voicemail and hear or skip each one to get to the latest one. Apple worked with AT&T to get smart voicemail to work , why don't you just admit you are incorrect, be a man, and stop supporting your obviously ridiculous claim?
Sorry, slightly confused, my Symbian phones could scroll, can you tell me what model you were referring to?
This is getting old. You are aware that over half the iPhone carriers don't support visual voicemail? AT&T users account for around 1% of the worlds population, restricting that down to iPhone users drops it down again, if it was such an important feature why didn't Apple push it to all carriers?
As for your last claim, maybe you should read you own posting again, after all it is you that states the definition of a smartphone is something that can scroll.
Sorry, slightly confused, my Symbian phones could scroll, can you tell me what model you were referring to?
You know damn well that pressing on a physical down arrow button or a virtual down button with a stylus is not what is meant by scrolling. Still up to your same old crap. :no:
Sorry, slightly confused, my Symbian phones could scroll, can you tell me what model you were referring to?
This is getting old. You are aware that over half the iPhone carriers don't support visual voicemail? AT&T users account for around 1% of the worlds population, restricting that down to iPhone users drops it down again, if it was such an important feature why didn't Apple push it to all carriers?
As for your last claim, maybe you should read you own posting again, after all it is you that states the definition of a smartphone is something that can scroll.
Look you moron just frack off, you are as ignorant as anyone has ever been, and that takes something. I'm not going to bother debating you any more idiot boy
Sorry, slightly confused, my Symbian phones could scroll, can you tell me what model you were referring to?
This is getting old. You are aware that over half the iPhone carriers don't support visual voicemail? AT&T users account for around 1% of the worlds population, restricting that down to iPhone users drops it down again, if it was such an important feature why didn't Apple push it to all carriers?
As for your last claim, maybe you should read you own posting again, after all it is you that states the definition of a smartphone is something that can scroll.
Symbian is DEAD, time to bury it, no one cares, the ex-fans moved on.
Visual voicemail is on my carrier, it's an excellent feature, people who switch away from iPhone often whine about it's disappearance.
Definition of a smartphone OS = ability to install native applications.
You know damn well that pressing on a physical down arrow button or a virtual down button with a stylus is not what is meant by scrolling. Still up to your same old crap. :no:
You know perfectly well not to tell me what other people mean, if that is what they meant they should have said it. You are a fine one for sprouting this crap
Also, thanks for agreeing with my definition of a smartphone
It's not "your" definition, it is/was the accepted definition before the anti-apple brigade tried to muddy it by tossing in terms like "true" multitasking, user installed etc.
It's not "your" definition, it is/was the accepted definition before the anti-apple brigade tried to muddy it by tossing in terms like "true" multitasking, user installed etc.
Mine as in I used it, not mine as in I defined it, stop getting overly defensive. And if you had read this thread I used that definition earlier, and everyone here so far has claimed it was wrong
Mine as in I used it, not mine as in I defined it, stop getting overly defensive. And if you had read this thread I used that definition earlier, and everyone here so far has claimed it was wrong
The first iPhone had native applications, written and installed by Apple.
Your contention that "the iPhone wasn't a smartphone before iOS 2" has just been refuted by yourself.
Comments
2. Source?
3. That doesn't describe the smartphone market up to and including 2007
4. That doesn't show that the US was a largely locked market (and still is)
1. Well, yeah; the morons changed the spacing between them. The dates are closer together and higher up.
2. Sure thing. Right here.
3. It does; starting at 2005 (which you can’t really tell because the numbers are blurred).
4. So? It shows the adoption was the same.
3. Why do they have the US release dates for phones against the EU graph? They weren't released in the EU for months later
4. No it doesn't, see 3
Also, thanks for providing some sources for once. But how does what you provided show that the iPhone "•Broke the bonds of carrier locked features", which is what you replied to me about. The article you linked to states that smartphone adoption in the US only took off after carrier subsidies increased (ie carrier locking)
4. No it doesn't, see 3
I have no idea what you’re trying to say.
No…
Quote:
3. Why do they have the US release dates for phones against the EU graph? They weren't released in the EU for months later
4. No it doesn't, see 3
Also, thanks for providing some sources for once. But how does what you provided show that the iPhone "•Broke the bonds of carrier locked features", which is what you replied to me about. The article you linked to states that smartphone adoption in the US only took off after carrier subsidies increased (ie carrier locking)
You jumped in with Post 69 as a reply to Post 16...you have never been able to substantiate your statement. That statement is what lead to many posts back and forth with people.
Before the iPhone there was something they were labeling as smart phones. In hindsight, they were poorly labeled as such.
You're funny. Before iPhone OS 2, the iPhone was missing major features to be labelled a smart phone
So as you posted below, maybe you can provide a source...
A couple of issues.
...
2. Source?
...
You seem to be all hung up about how the US market works. Your whole discussion has been a moving target as evidenced by the content of your numerous posts.
If you can't understand the point, then maybe you were a child in 2007 and/or didn't understand the industry internationally at that time.
Are personal insults of any value in a conversation? Leave them at home.
"The point"...I would refer you back to your first comment in the thread. Still never provided an answer with proof with a source.
You are aware that they released the iPhone in the UK/Germany months after the US release?
You are aware that they released the iPhone in the UK/Germany months after the US release?
That only happened with the original IIRC, so probably just an oversight by Asymco. Also, some of the phones marked probably had different release dates across the EU, so there'll always be a bit of a blurry line.
Yes I know that, but if you are going to provide a graph showing the effect of the EU iPhone sales on a category, shouldn't the date on the graph be the EU release date, not the US one?
I would love to, I have posted lots of them since 2007, but AI will only let you go back 100 pages of posts, I can't link them anymore.
Doing a quick search
http://www.zdnet.com/article/iphones-missing-features/
http://www.techhive.com/article/148250/iphone_missing_feature.html?page=2
You were the one who raised the US market post #126 if you have forgotten), I was saying that you have to look at the world market (the other 96% of the world)
So questioning someone's age is a personal insult?
http://www.engadget.com/2007/01/09/the-iphone-is-not-a-smartphone/
edit: Also, you seem to be getting really excited/upset about something Apple fixed in 2008, you know, six years ago.
It is you who have dug yourself a big hole, there is no way a Symbian phone can ever ever ever be categorized as a smart phone for the simple reason that it can't scroll. The iPhone was the first phone that allowed scrolling, the minor point that it didn't have user load able apps at first is simply freaking irrelevant. Don't you remember the comment " you had me at scrolling" when Steve was demoing the pictures, contacts and photos scrolling was a huge leap in the interface the whole smartphone industry was aghast at that and RIM convened an emergency meeting to address the calamity that was facing them. Your judgement that is iOS1 was not a smartphone OS is ludicrous and laughable. Up until the iPhone no phone had the capability to selectively go thru voicemail with all carriers we had to start at the oldest voicemail and hear or skip each one to get to the latest one. Apple worked with AT&T to get smart voicemail to work , why don't you just admit you are incorrect, be a man, and stop supporting your obviously ridiculous claim?
I won't enter into any of the skirmishes going on in this thread, I just want to add my observation that the original introduction of the iPhone was such a remarkable demonstration of capabilities of how smoothly and competently a pocket phone could tour the net and do email in addition to being a phone, that some competitors were certain that the demo was rigged. It wasn't until the iPhone was opened and studied that some people realized that Apple had done the impossible and put a fully functional computer inside the iPhone.
In fact the engineers at Rim told the executives that it was impossible for apple to have built a phone that did what it did with the battery life apple claimed , boy were they so wrong! Now look at blackberry market share!
I cannot think of a family of products like the iPod/iPhone/iPad that has singlehandedly obliterated several companies, product catogories and retail outlets except possibly the Sony Walkman / disc player, really what we have witnessed is probably the most disruptive commercial upheaval in computers/phones/music/video/books/print and soon to add watch, payment and maybe TV industries. Looking further ahead if apple sets its sights on fully Integrating its OS into hardware in the automobile systems, medical devices it will grow to a 2trillion dollar market cap. What other engineering devices can it go after? - what about aircraft? I'm sure the military has several projects using Apple's OS and front end tech to interface with systems?
Sorry, slightly confused, my Symbian phones could scroll, can you tell me what model you were referring to?
This is getting old. You are aware that over half the iPhone carriers don't support visual voicemail? AT&T users account for around 1% of the worlds population, restricting that down to iPhone users drops it down again, if it was such an important feature why didn't Apple push it to all carriers?
As for your last claim, maybe you should read you own posting again, after all it is you that states the definition of a smartphone is something that can scroll.
You know damn well that pressing on a physical down arrow button or a virtual down button with a stylus is not what is meant by scrolling. Still up to your same old crap. :no:
Sorry, slightly confused, my Symbian phones could scroll, can you tell me what model you were referring to?
This is getting old. You are aware that over half the iPhone carriers don't support visual voicemail? AT&T users account for around 1% of the worlds population, restricting that down to iPhone users drops it down again, if it was such an important feature why didn't Apple push it to all carriers?
As for your last claim, maybe you should read you own posting again, after all it is you that states the definition of a smartphone is something that can scroll.
Symbian is DEAD, time to bury it, no one cares, the ex-fans moved on.
Visual voicemail is on my carrier, it's an excellent feature, people who switch away from iPhone often whine about it's disappearance.
Definition of a smartphone OS = ability to install native applications.
Time to update your N8.
You know perfectly well not to tell me what other people mean, if that is what they meant they should have said it. You are a fine one for sprouting this crap
I don't have an N8, never had an N8, I haven't used a Symbian phone for years.
Bring your iPhone to an NZ carrier (or half the iPhone carriers in the world), bet you will love your visual voicemail then.
Also, thanks for agreeing with my definition of a smartphone
Also, thanks for agreeing with my definition of a smartphone
It's not "your" definition, it is/was the accepted definition before the anti-apple brigade tried to muddy it by tossing in terms like "true" multitasking, user installed etc.
Mine as in I used it, not mine as in I defined it, stop getting overly defensive. And if you had read this thread I used that definition earlier, and everyone here so far has claimed it was wrong
Mine as in I used it, not mine as in I defined it, stop getting overly defensive. And if you had read this thread I used that definition earlier, and everyone here so far has claimed it was wrong
The first iPhone had native applications, written and installed by Apple.
Your contention that "the iPhone wasn't a smartphone before iOS 2" has just been refuted by yourself.
Well done.