Shuttle drivers at Apple, other Silicon Valley tech companies vote for Teamsters representation

1234568

Comments

  • Reply 141 of 170
    dasanman69dasanman69 Posts: 12,979member
    jbdragon wrote: »
    Unions did goon in the past, but now they're huge parasites sucking up paychecks.  Spending people's money on politicians.  So greedy, they want more and more and more until they drive a business out of businesses or out of this country like so many others.   These are bus drivers.  It's a non skill job.  I mean come on.  I know how to drive.  I've driven some very large Motor homes which is even harder.  Less windows to see out of.   I think they already get paid to much.  If that's what they want, we'll they can go and price themselves right out of the market.   Going Union is a bad move these days.  This is California, so what's another lost business.  See how things are in a couple years if they're still around.

    Of course since greedy executives never put a company out of business.
  • Reply 142 of 170
    jfc1138jfc1138 Posts: 3,090member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post





    I'm actually quite impressed at how far north the Spanish got trying to colonize the west coast ahead of the approaching settlers from the east. Ultimately they were spread out too thin to hold on to their claims. I am surprised that all the saintly names were kept.



    And the Russians made it down to Northern California: going by sea is a lot more efficient than walking...

  • Reply 143 of 170
    jfc1138jfc1138 Posts: 3,090member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by SolipsismY View Post





    1) image Since when are the Spanish not considered "white"?



    2) Why are still using such terms when we know about DNA and have maps the origins of man through various cultures isolated by both real and imaginary borders?

     

    ?Were the original poster Spanish I would stand corrected.

     

     

    #2? Better directed at who I was responding to.: " San Francisco was settled by white people like myself". 

  • Reply 144 of 170
    desuserigndesuserign Posts: 1,316member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

    You're not describing the Steve Jobs I'm familiar with. He seldom gave anyone credit (despite the public gushing over Jony Ive) and if someone were to insist otherwise I can almost guarantee he would've told them to go ---- themselves in no uncertain terms.

    Yeah, it's clear you aren't familiar with the Steve Jobs I described.

  • Reply 145 of 170
    SpamSandwichSpamSandwich Posts: 31,012member
    dasanman69 wrote: »
    Of course since greedy executives never put a company out of business.

    Do not be confused about what is the purpose of a business. The purpose of a business is to make a profit and its up to the owners of the business how that is done. Businesses are aren't charities and they aren't a source of guaranteed jobs.
  • Reply 146 of 170
    SpamSandwichSpamSandwich Posts: 31,012member
    desuserign wrote: »
    Yeah, it's clear you aren't familiar with the Steve Jobs I described.

    Are YOU familiar with the one I described?
  • Reply 147 of 170
    desuserigndesuserign Posts: 1,316member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

    Are YOU familiar with the one I described?

    My original post stands. I think it acknowledges his faults without ridiculously over-focusing on them. It's clear from any account of Steve that he could be a real ass (especially when he was younger) but also that he moderated as he got older. It's equally clear though that throughout his life he appreciated the contributions of others—even as he made great demands of them. If that's so incredibly unbelievable to you, you probably are incapable of subjective thought on the subject.

    Nuff said.

  • Reply 148 of 170

    I've had plenty of union experience - I've belonged to a union, and worked side-by-side with unions for 30 years.  I know what I'm talking about.  I'm not anti-union, but they are anti-competitive.  They will go to extremes to prevent competition.  I've seen them picket jobs that didn't hire union, throw stuff, inflate giant rats, use megaphones to harass, etc.  Plus, there's not a union company around that I can't find a private equivalent that's better - period.  There may be a few exceptions, like longshoremen, where there is no opportunity for private firms to even get experience because unions are so anti-competitive.  In spirit I'm not against unions if they choose to compete fairly - which is rare.    

  • Reply 149 of 170
    dasanman69dasanman69 Posts: 12,979member
    Do not be confused about what is the purpose of a business. The purpose of a business is to make a profit and its up to the owners of the business how that is done. Businesses are aren't charities and they aren't a source of guaranteed jobs.

    That doesn't give executives the right to milk it dry, or take obscene salaries. I had great respect for SJ because his salary was $1, his compensation came as a direct result of Apple's performance.
  • Reply 150 of 170
    waterrocketswaterrockets Posts: 1,231member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by pokerbear View Post

     

    I've had plenty of union experience - I've belonged to a union, and worked side-by-side with unions for 30 years.  I know what I'm talking about.  I'm not anti-union, but they are anti-competitive.  They will go to extremes to prevent competition.  I've seen them picket jobs that didn't hire union, throw stuff, inflate giant rats, use megaphones to harass, etc.  Plus, there's not a union company around that I can't find a private equivalent that's better - period.  There may be a few exceptions, like longshoremen, where there is no opportunity for private firms to even get experience because unions are so anti-competitive.  In spirit I'm not against unions if they choose to compete fairly - which is rare.    


     

    I had a friend in my engineering program who was studying mechanical engineering. She got a paid internship at Ford in Dearborn. During her work there, she (in her spare time) optimized an assembly process to save the company quite a bit of money. That savings was in labor costs...

     

    So of course they vandalized her car in the parking lot to the point that she could no longer drive it.

     

    So much of tech work is spent eliminating other people's jobs...

  • Reply 151 of 170
    dasanman69dasanman69 Posts: 12,979member
    I had a friend in my engineering program who was studying mechanical engineering. She got a paid internship at Ford in Dearborn. During her work there, she (in her spare time) optimized an assembly process to save the company quite a bit of money. That savings was in labor costs...

    So of course they vandalized her car in the parking lot to the point that she could no longer drive it.

    So much of tech work is spent eliminating other people's jobs...

    Moral of the story: don't do nothing for free that ends up costing somebody else money, or you'll get dealt with. ;)

    How about not flying private jets as a cost saving measure?

    http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/WallStreet/story?id=6285739
  • Reply 152 of 170
    SpamSandwichSpamSandwich Posts: 31,012member
    I had a friend in my engineering program who was studying mechanical engineering. She got a paid internship at Ford in Dearborn. During her work there, she (in her spare time) optimized an assembly process to save the company quite a bit of money. That savings was in labor costs...

    So of course they vandalized her car in the parking lot to the point that she could no longer drive it.

    So much of tech work is spent eliminating other people's jobs...

    THAT is the "lesson" you learned from her experience?

    The real lesson is that employees are awful and need to have their work reduced or eliminated as quickly as possible, otherwise they might destroy the company.
  • Reply 153 of 170
    waterrocketswaterrockets Posts: 1,231member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post





    THAT is the "lesson" you learned from her experience?



    The real lesson is that employees are awful and need to have their work reduced or eliminated as quickly as possible, otherwise they might destroy the company.

     

    No, just a poorly conveyed aside. That was when I first despised unions.

     

    The aside is that since the industrial revolution, some portion of the engineering workforce have pretty much always been involved in the elimination of jobs. That what she did that summer, and that's what I've been doing for some time now.

  • Reply 154 of 170
    SpamSandwichSpamSandwich Posts: 31,012member
    No, just a poorly conveyed aside. That was when I first despised unions.

    The aside is that since the industrial revolution, some portion of the engineering workforce have pretty much always been involved in the elimination of jobs. That what she did that summer, and that's what I've been doing for some time now.

    Profits are the reason for being for a business. This is simply a fact. And it's also a fact that labor represents the largest expense for businesses in the US, so naturally automation and workforce reductions are a point of focus.
  • Reply 155 of 170
    No, just a poorly conveyed aside. That was when I first despised unions.

    The aside is that since the industrial revolution, some portion of the engineering workforce have pretty much always been involved in the elimination of jobs. That what she did that summer, and that's what I've been doing for some time now.

    Profits are the reason for being for a business. This is simply a fact. And it's also a fact that labor represents the largest expense for businesses in the US, so naturally automation and workforce reductions are a point of focus.

    That's not what Ive says.

    He says that, for Apple, making money is a byproduct of making great products, and I agree with him.
  • Reply 156 of 170
    waterrocketswaterrockets Posts: 1,231member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post





    Profits are the reason for being for a business. This is simply a fact. And it's also a fact that labor represents the largest expense for businesses in the US, so naturally automation and workforce reductions are a point of focus.

     

    I have long understood and accepted this fact, and I participate in it.

     

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Benjamin Frost View Post





    That's not what Ive says.



    He says that, for Apple, making money is a byproduct of making great products, and I agree with him.

     

    I wish more corporate leadership felt this way.

     

    It works for hobbies too. I race bicycles, and I see health and fitness as a byproduct of my desire to rip the legs off of my competition, leading to a higher quality experience :P

  • Reply 157 of 170
    dasanman69dasanman69 Posts: 12,979member
    THAT is the "lesson" you learned from her experience?

    The real lesson is that employees are awful and need to have their work reduced or eliminated as quickly as possible, otherwise they might destroy the company.

    Of course because flying a private jet to a Senate hearing in which you're going to beg for a bailout isn't awful.
  • Reply 158 of 170
    SpamSandwichSpamSandwich Posts: 31,012member
    That's not what Ive says.

    He says that, for Apple, making money is a byproduct of making great products, and I agree with him.

    Are there companies making great products that are not successful? I'll bet there are. Great products are one part of the equation. Marketing, manufacturing and customer service are obviously extremely important for Apple also, though they are not the advertised differentiator as much as their world-leading design. The real distinction is demand. Apple has mastered the art of building and maintaining demand for their products. Design is something that is visible and obvious and there is a definite Apple look and philosophy.
  • Reply 159 of 170
    solipsismysolipsismy Posts: 5,099member
    Are there companies making great products that are not successful? I'll bet there are. Great products are one part of the equation. Marketing, manufacturing and customer service are obviously extremely important for Apple also, though they are not the advertised differentiator as much as their world-leading design. Design is something that is visible and obvious.

    Ive's comment is only a half truth. While there is clearly a significant focus on making a great product, they all have to weigh that against the cost of making that product. Even if the iPhone 6 series is their best iPhone Apple isn't going to add components that raise the cost significantly that would result in a much lower ROI. It's simply not feasible to do, so when Ive says "this is the product we could imagine," he's leaving off the qualifier, "… for our target price point."

    To Apple's credit they are very good at saying, "We want this!" and then engineering ways to make it a cost effective feature or component to be added to their devices. One such example is their investment in display technologies that allowed them to go both Retina and IPS at a reasonable cost before others.
  • Reply 160 of 170
    waterrocketswaterrockets Posts: 1,231member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post





    Are there companies making great products that are not successful? I'll bet there are. Great products are one part of the equation. Marketing, manufacturing and customer service are obviously extremely important for Apple also, though they are not the advertised differentiator as much as their world-leading design. The real distinction is demand. Apple has mastered the art of building and maintaining demand for their products. Design is something that is visible and obvious and there is a definite Apple look and philosophy.

     

    It's semantic, but I would argue that since marketing, manufacturing, and customers service budgets all fall under products, they are part of the excellent product that Apple delivers.

     

    Certainly though, there are amazing widgets out there that almost nobody knows about. Like gaffers tape :P

Sign In or Register to comment.