Apple looks to 'reinvent the notebook' with all-new 12" MacBook with Retina display

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  • Reply 141 of 169
    adonissmuadonissmu Posts: 1,772member
    I want this to do my development on.
  • Reply 142 of 169
    adonissmuadonissmu Posts: 1,772member

    I like the mag safe idea personally as it provides that balance of being able to charge and being protected against accidents.

  • Reply 143 of 169
    tallest skiltallest skil Posts: 43,399member
    Originally Posted by mstone View Post

    The server does not know how far you are scrolled down or how large you have made the fonts so it doesn't know how much to adjust the window position.

     

    You can certainly have pages scroll with (and/or down to) new content, but your point about text size is interesting; I’ve never seen it implemented on sites without fixed formatting.

     

    Best not to screw around with a page that the user is possibly entering text.


     

    Oh, what about a text input field in a floating element? Have the input field float on top of the rest of the page content and scroll up and down the page with the user? That would do it. Make it possible to hide the box, of course.

     

    People who don't know programming shouldn't tell programmers how to do their job. The notification feature is well implemented. Your idea is misconceived.





    People who don’t know people shouldn’t tell them what they do and don’t know. :p The idea behind receiving  notifications of new content (for previous pages, as you mentioned) is fine, but not implementing live page changes makes discussion sites show their age.

  • Reply 144 of 169
    pmzpmz Posts: 3,433member
    scotty321 wrote: »
    Apple has literally gone insane. True video editing professionals & graphic design professionals & professional programmers need a LARGER SCREEN, such as the now-discontinued 17" MacBook Pro. But instead, they keep making things smaller. There was once a time when professionals could actually be MOBILE PROFESSIONALS with Apple's laptops. Not anymore. I sure miss the Steve Jobs days.

    I'm a pro. I use a Retina iMac. Can't wait to get this for mobile uses. Shows how much you know.

    By the way, nothing makes a person look more like an idiot than when they pretend to know what Steve Jobs would do.
  • Reply 145 of 169
    pmzpmz Posts: 3,433member
    misa wrote: »
    While I will agree that I think this "single port" thing is insane, This is the "MacBook" not the "Macbook Pro" and not the "Macbook Air"

    Take note of what else got nerfed. The camera (480p, while the Air and Pro have 720p) was nerfed, for no other reason than I can think of to shave a few cents off the build cost. This slots it below the Macbook Air. The MacBook does have a Retina display, but it's paired with the only available weakest graphics option - Intel HD Graphics 5300, not even the Iris Pro version. http://ark.intel.com/products/series/83614/Intel-Core-M-5Y-Mobile-Processor-Series are all 4.5Watt CPU's.

    This is just another example of the industry-wide trend of shipping slower parts for power-savings/mobile targets. Good luck running any game produced in the last 6 years on it.

    Thinking is not your strong suit.
  • Reply 146 of 169
    hittrj01hittrj01 Posts: 753member

    Does nobody remember when the original MacBook Air came out? Slow processor, underpowered graphics, one USB port, etc. Also, it didn't really serve a role in the current lineup, since there was the MacBook and MacBook Pro lines, both cheaper and more powerful. This is a Gen 1, proof-of-concept model for the enthusiasts and early adopters. Gen 2 and Gen 3 will improve specs, maybe add another USB-C port (much like the MacBook Air added a  seconds USB port during an upgrade), and battery life will increase from it's already impressive number too, I would assume. Relax, realize this is only a first step, and things will get better.

  • Reply 147 of 169
    MarvinMarvin Posts: 14,228moderator
    hittrj01 wrote: »
    Does nobody remember when the original MacBook Air came out? Slow processor, underpowered graphics, one USB port, etc. Also, it didn't really serve a role in the current lineup, since there was the MacBook and MacBook Pro lines, both cheaper and more powerful. This is a Gen 1, proof-of-concept model for the enthusiasts and early adopters. Gen 2 and Gen 3 will improve specs, maybe add another USB-C port (much like the MacBook Air added a  seconds USB port during an upgrade), and battery life will increase from it's already impressive number too, I would assume. Relax, realize this is only a first step, and things will get better.

    It has a few new design decisions but I think it will differ a lot from the 1st gen MBA. The original Air only had 2GB RAM, used a very slow 4200 RPM hard drive, had all the ports on a fold out drawer, had a low quality TN display and a slow, hot Core 2 Duo CPU.

    The starting point now is a CPU/GPU that matches Macbook Airs that people have worked with just fine but now runs with so low power that it won't generate enough heat by itself even at max load to require cooling, a Retina IPS display, a very fast PCIe SSD, 8GB RAM, 802.11ac wifi and 10Gbps USB 3.

    It will get better over time but the starting point is massively better than the 1st gen Air. In some respects it's a downgrade vs the Air but an upgrade in others and I don't think the majority of people in the market for the Air would see this as a downgrade. It is the Retina Macbook Air that people wanted. It might not even take long to get another upgrade because Skylake Y (Core M is Broadwell Y) is due out late this year. The biggest improvement would likely be graphics. The HD 5300 might struggle with some content on the Retina display and it would need about a 60% speed boost to bring it back to 2013/2014 Air performance.
  • Reply 148 of 169
    hittrj01hittrj01 Posts: 753member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Marvin View Post





    It has a few new design decisions but I think it will differ a lot from the 1st gen MBA. The original Air only had 2GB RAM, used a very slow 4200 RPM hard drive, had all the ports on a fold out drawer, had a low quality TN display and a slow, hot Core 2 Duo CPU.



    The starting point now is a CPU/GPU that matches Macbook Airs that people have worked with just fine but now runs with so low power that it won't generate enough heat by itself even at max load to require cooling, a Retina IPS display, a very fast PCIe SSD, 8GB RAM, 802.11ac wifi and 10Gbps USB 3.



    It will get better over time but the starting point is massively better than the 1st gen Air. In some respects it's a downgrade vs the Air but an upgrade in others and I don't think the majority of people in the market for the Air would see this as a downgrade. It is the Retina Macbook Air that people wanted. It might not even take long to get another upgrade because Skylake Y (Core M is Broadwell Y) is due out late this year. The biggest improvement would likely be graphics. The HD 5300 might struggle with some content on the Retina display and it would need about a 60% speed boost to bring it back to 2013/2014 Air performance.



    I agree, the starting point is much higher, and this makes me hopeful for where this product will eventually go.  I just got a MacBook Air when they refreshed it last year, so I'm good on my Macs for a while, but by the time I'm ready to replace this, I can definitely see the MacBook having a plethora of worthy upgrades, not least of which would be power and even more efficiency. An extra USB-C port would be huge, if only because when the computer is charging, that is all you can plug into without an accessory. For example, how am I supposed to do a Boot Camp installation without a dongle? How am I supposed to do a Time Machine backup without a dongle or $300 Time Capsule? This new MacBook is great, but looking to the future when I am finally ready to get a new computer, I can't wait to see how it's evolved.

     

    *edited for grammatical error

  • Reply 149 of 169
    asciiascii Posts: 5,941member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Marvin View Post



    In some respects it's a downgrade vs the Air but an upgrade in others and I don't think the majority of people in the market for the Air would see this as a downgrade. It is the Retina Macbook Air that people wanted. It might not even take long to get another upgrade because Skylake Y (Core M is Broadwell Y) is due out late this year. The biggest improvement would likely be graphics. The HD 5300 might struggle with some content on the Retina display and it would need about a 60% speed boost to bring it back to 2013/2014 Air performance.

    It's an upgrade in all design aspects (materials, size, weight, keyboard, trackpad) and a downgrade in all tech aspects (ports, cpu, gpu). Tim Cook knows he's not a product guy, so post-Steve he gave that responsibility to Jony Ive. But Ive is not a product guy either, he's a designer, he geeks out over different kinds of metals/materials and different design shapes. This total subjugation of tech to design is the end result. We will see how the market responds, i.e. have they gone too far this time?

  • Reply 150 of 169
    Basically, what you're seeing with the new MaBook, is the replacement to the MacBook Air. I predict that the Air will be entirely gone in 3 years once people learn how to live with only 1 port.
  • Reply 151 of 169
    crowleycrowley Posts: 5,997member
    ^ I predict that in three years this machine won't have one port.
  • Reply 152 of 169
    solipsismysolipsismy Posts: 5,099member
    crowley wrote: »
    ^ I predict that in three years this machine won't have one port.

    1) You mean it will have more than one port or won't have any ports at all?

    2) Note that it already has two port interfaces: USB-C and bi-directional 4-prong 3.5 analog and optical headphone and mic port.
  • Reply 153 of 169
    solipsismysolipsismy Posts: 5,099member
    Basically, what you're seeing with the new MaBook, is the replacement to the MacBook Air. I predict that the Air will be entirely gone in 3 years once people learn how to live with only 1 port.

    I don't see that happened. I think the MBA is a stronger brand than MB so I would expect there are radical changes coming to the MBA down the line.

    Perhaps they will make it their Apple A-series chip line of desktop "PCs" or perhaps they will make it into their convertible line of desktop "PCs" with touchscreen keyboards or both or neither.
  • Reply 154 of 169
    crowleycrowley Posts: 5,997member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by SolipsismY View Post





    1) You mean it will have more than one port or won't have any ports at all?



    2) Note that it already has two port interfaces: USB-C and bi-directional 4-prong 3.5 analog and optical headphone and mic port.

    More than one.  And thanks for thanks for the correction (makes my prediction even more likely :smokey:)

  • Reply 155 of 169
    solipsismysolipsismy Posts: 5,099member
    crowley wrote: »
    More than one.  And thanks for thanks for the correction (makes my prediction even more likely :smokey: )

    So what do you think (not necessary predict) may be Apple solution for future MBs? Personally, I'd like both sides to have USB-C and I don't care how they do it. I think the 3.5mm jack can also stay, but I say can it so long as we get a port on each side. The new Chrome Pixel has that setup and you can charge from easier side. i've waited that since I started using a notebook, but now it can be practical.
  • Reply 156 of 169
    MarvinMarvin Posts: 14,228moderator
    hittrj01 wrote: »
    how am I supposed to do a Boot Camp installation without a dongle? How am I supposed to do a Time Machine backup without a dongle or $300 Time Capsule? This new MacBook is great, but looking to the future when I am finally ready to get a new computer, I can't wait to see how it's evolved.

    They really should have put a minimum of 2 USB ports on but USB C is a successor port to USB A, it's not like micro-USB. Manufacturers still using USB A are using an old standard. A dongle shouldn't be needed either, you will get cables to go direct from USB C to other USB formats like this:

    http://www.amazon.com/UCEC-Reversible-Design-Cable-Tablet/dp/B00TARBM2E

    A hard drive for example would use USB C to a mini- or micro-USB cable. The only case for a dongle would be USB pens or mouse adaptors but they will all switch over to type C over time because it's the new standard. There won't be a future iteration of USB that uses the old plug and the USB authority should really stop certifying USB A products eventually (at least in motherboards) to ensure manufacturers make the transition.
    ascii wrote:
    It's an upgrade in all design aspects (materials, size, weight, keyboard, trackpad) and a downgrade in all tech aspects (ports, cpu, gpu). We will see how the market responds, i.e. have they gone too far this time?

    The aim was always going to be to go fanless. No mobile devices have fans in them and over 1 billion people use them all the time. Mobile has gone from poor performance, passively cooled hardware to decent performance over time, Intel has gone the other way starting with high performance and cutting the power draw and now they are converging in the same place.

    There's gaming tests of the same chip in the Asus here:


    [VIDEO]


    It's close to the HD4000 in the 2012 Air and it's close to the 2014 Air CPU. A 2014 CPU plus 2012 GPU is perfectly usable for a basic laptop when combined with 8GB RAM and 256GB SSD. If it had 2 USB ports, I don't think there would be any complaints at all.

    This is as low as the performance will ever go from now on. There isn't a step beyond fanless so every generation from now up until about 2022 will just improve performance and can reach about 8x faster by 2022.
  • Reply 157 of 169
    solipsismysolipsismy Posts: 5,099member
    Marvin wrote: »
    There's gaming tests of the same chip in the Asus here:

    video:

    I thought the ZenBook had a fan, but perhaps I'm thinking of the Lenovo.
  • Reply 158 of 169
    docno42docno42 Posts: 3,313member
    hittrj01 wrote: »
    An extra USB-C port would be huge, if only because when the computer is charging, that is all you can plug into without an accessory. For example, how am I supposed to do a Boot Camp installation without a dongle? How am I supposed to do a Time Machine backup without a dongle or $300 Time Capsule? This new MacBook is great, but looking to the future when I am finally ready to get a new computer, I can't wait to see how it's evolved.

    You already answered your question - you charge and get data with an adaptor. I wouldn't hold my breath for this form factor to get two USB-C ports. Unless wireless headphones get to the point where Apple drops the headphone jack on the iPhone. As long as the iPhone has a headphone jack, this computer will too. Although personally I would rather have a second USB-C port and an adaptor for the headphone jack since I use data and power FAR more than headphones on my computers (almost never, since my headphones are plugged into my iPhone or iPad).
  • Reply 159 of 169
    MarvinMarvin Posts: 14,228moderator
    solipsismy wrote: »
    I thought the ZenBook had a fan, but perhaps I'm thinking of the Lenovo.

    Some of the other manufacturers have fans in them, the ones like the Dell with the i5/i7 have fans. The Asus in that video is listed here as being fanless:

    http://www.asus.com/Notebooks_Ultrabooks/ASUS_ZENBOOK_UX305/
    docno42 wrote:
    what problem were they really solving with the new Mac Pro? Was anyone really clamoring for it to be that much more smaller that they had to remove the capability to change out the GPUs entirely? Quiet is always welcome, but my current Mac Pro I'm typing on is already whisper quite unless I'm really doing something processor intensive

    The new Mac Pro stays quiet under load ( ). This helps in audio production environments.

    The size doesn't constrain them vs performance for the spec they offer, the old model was bigger than necessary for the parts they sold in it. The first revision was a bit of a side-step vs the old 12-core but it has 12-cores on a single chip vs dual 6-core and dual high-end GPUs. The old model couldn't really fit two high-end GPUs in. Hard drives will be phased out and were slow so taking them out eliminates a weak point. The old one couldn't support Thunderbolt easily so a 5K display would have been difficult across all models. The GPU upgradeability was not a plus for them because people didn't buy the GPUs from them and it held people back from upgrading the machine. Intel already makes an 18-core Haswell chip so future updates will look much better. I expect the next MP update will offer up to 18-core, dual GPUs with 16GB video memory, even faster SSDs possibly 2-3GB/s. People always say but you could have dual 18-core but they cost a crazy amount of money and Apple never went above a certain price point because not enough people buy at that level for it to be worth doing.
  • Reply 160 of 169
    docno42docno42 Posts: 3,313member
    Marvin wrote: »
    The new Mac Pro stays quiet under load ( ). This helps in audio production environments.

    Good for them, not everyone requires absolute quiet.
    The size doesn't constrain them vs performance for the spec they offer, the old model was bigger than necessary for the parts they sold in it.

    And again, for most professionals the size of the desktop matters not. My Windows box is in a bigger case with even more empty space - cubic volume wasn't the consideration for why I picked it, a mix of other desirable features drove those decisions.
    The old model couldn't really fit two high-end GPUs in.

    Funny, mine has three in it right now. With an external power supply to drive them. PITA but it works. With the advancements in power consumption that nVidia is making, even with the wimpy power supply in the old Mac Pro's having two cards be entirely self contained is trivial.
    Hard drives will be phased out and were slow so taking them out eliminates a weak point.

    Storage is never an issue since external interconnects are speedy enough. Being able to put a decent amount of storage internally is very convenient, though but not my main complaint.
    The old one couldn't support Thunderbolt easily so a 5K display would have been difficult across all models.

    Funny, Dell has the same resolution today with dual display port. Display Port, the same video technology embedded into Thunderbolt.

    And if Intel wasn't playing games to try to squeeze out AMD and nVidia, there is no reason Thunderbolt has to be a problem.
    The GPU upgradeability was not a plus for them because people didn't buy the GPUs from them

    If Apple really card about that then why starting with Mavericks do you no longer need to flash "windows" cards to get them to work with your Mac? Please - Apple could care less that people customize as long as you buy the base device where they make their real dollars. This whole Apple lock in meme is beyond tired.
    and it held people back from upgrading the machine.

    Any impact would be negligible for true pro's. What's most disturbing about the new Mac Pro is there is no way to get it with an nVidia GPU and for many applications nVidia beats the pants off of AMD.

    I do welcome that they dropped the complexity of having two CPU's in a system. Too bad we didn't see the corresponding price drop along with that reduction in complexity :p
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