This further makes Android Pay a blatant copycat. Google abandoned Google Wallet because of Apple Pay. Because Google Wallet trying to steal buyer information. Google Wallet failed, Apple Pay succeeded. Under pressure again, the young geniuses in Google choose to copy Apple again.
There was no stealing involved as you put it. There is also no copying as the way the banks and credit card companies set this all up everyone's way will be pretty much the same. Just like all credit cards for different companies work the same. Apple didn’t make this up on thier own and only followed the predetermined rules already set forth. They made it work really well and I enjoy using it but they didn't do it all by themselves.
Majority of Android users won't be able to use Android Pay too. So what is your point? Wait! Do you mean Android Pay will work for iPhone users? This is funny.
What are you talking about. If you want to play that game than the majority of iPhone users can't use Apple Pay as there are way more iPhones on the market being used that don't have the NFC chip than there are. So it's the same thing. And the Apple Watch doesn’t really change all that much.
In the U.S. people will be able to use Android Pay just as much as Apple Pay users can.
Because Apple doesn't own the trademark for "Android" or "Samsung". They would be sued and swiftly lose, just as any other cybersquatter would.
Although, truth be told... Apple could just as easily undermine Samsung by marketing and selling a second-tier line of non-US/Europe phones designed specifically to decimate low cost Android phones, as Xioami is doing today. Apple could remove Samsung from the picture completely for a few billion dollars.
Apparently you've missed the point entirely. If only one percent of Android owners can use Android Pay, and it's far more than that, it's one percent more than will ever be able to use Apple pay on their Android device. Because Apple has no interest in a cross-platform mobile payment feature of course the "other half" (or more) is going to use something else. That the two would resemble each other in function and features isn't due to copying as much as it is with the standards and specifications set by the industry.
Does "Android Pay" (what a laugh) use tokenization and an identical fingerprint reader?
Tokenization? Yes absolutely. I think it's actually a standards requirement. Even the original Google mobile payment solution from years back did. The first devices using it, one of the Nexus models, had an actual hardware-based secure element just as Apple Pay enabled iPhones do today.
Because carriers were greedy and wanted to push their own solutions they refused to "play" with the chipset. So in 2014 (I think) Google switched to HCE and discontinued support for physical secure-elements in an effort to get around their blockade. My guess is thay may renew that support now that Apple has cleared the way but don't know for certain. Obviously Apple has more influence.
But the way Google originally intended as far back as 2010 was the right way, as evidence Apple's use of a physical secure element for Apple Pay just as Google used. Apple was obviously better at pushing past the resistance from established players to make it happen.
There was no stealing involved as you put it. There is also no copying as the way the banks and credit card companies set this all up everyone's way will be pretty much the same. Just like all credit cards for different companies work the same. Apple didn’t make this up on thier own and only followed the predetermined rules already set forth. They made it work really well and I enjoy using it but they didn't do it all by themselves.
What are you talking about. If you want to play that game than the majority of iPhone users can't use Apple Pay as there are way more iPhones on the market being used that don't have the NFC chip than there are. So it's the same thing. And the Apple Watch doesn’t really change all that much.
In the U.S. people will be able to use Android Pay just as much as Apple Pay users can.
Anything with KitKat 4.4 and up. So where it counts that's the majority of the people that would potentially use it.
Do the dirt cheap iPhones have NFC? No. So what's your point? Most dirt cheap Android phones do have NFC in them now. Doesn't matter tho.
Google has lost completely in Android Pay. Android Pay is not an innovation but a copycat. Google business model is ad. Google Wallet is designed to collect user buying information. Android Pay can not. Further, Google Wallet from the name is completely owned by Google. Android is shared with other parties. Would Samsung, HTC, Hwawei, and all other Android phone makers like to share the Android fee with Google? I think not. So in the end Google does not make any money from Android Pay. Finally, why would merchants accept payment from Android Pay? According to you and Gatorguy, Android Pay will be available from all Android phones with Kitkat. It is so easy to make an Android phone. How the merchants can be sure the Android phone was not tempered?
Finally, why would merchants accept payment from Android Pay? According to you and Gatorguy, Android Pay will be available from all Android phones with Kitkat. It is so easy to make an Android phone. How the merchants can be sure the Android phone was not tempered?
I imagine they'd accept it because customers want to buy things from them. Good reason eh? At least the 700,000 retailers accepting it at launch would seem to think so. Financial partners like Chase, Citibank, Capital One, U.S. Bank, Discover, MasterCard, Visa, American Express and the like would agree as they're in with Android Pay too.
It may not be Apple Pay but that doesn't mean it can't see success. it's not as tho Google has to compete with Apple Pay on Android devices. That's not going to be an option AFAIK.
I imagine they'd accept it because customers want to buy things from them. Good reason eh? At least the 700,000 retailers accepting it at launch would seem to think so. Financial partners like Chase, Citibank, Capital One, U.S. Bank, Discover, MasterCard, Visa, American Express and the like would agree as they're in with Android Pay too.
It may not be Apple Pay but that doesn't mean it can't see success. it's not as tho Google has to compete with Apple Pay on Android devices. That's not going to be an option AFAIK.
So it is Google that signed agreements with the 700,000 retailers? Google will take the fee all by itself?
So it is Google that signed agreements with the 700,000 retailers? Google will take the fee all by itself?
What fee do you mean? I would guess they'd probably be taking the same cut as Apple does for Apple Pay. They'll both be performing the same service. Let me know when you find out the details 'cause I've not seen them.
What fee do you mean? I would guess they'd probably be taking the same cut as Apple does for Apple Pay. They'll both be performing the same service. Let me know when you find out the details 'cause I've not seen them.
Do you know Google is blocked in China? China is the largest Android market. How could Android Pay work in China?
Do you know Google is blocked in China? China is the largest Android market. How could Android Pay work in China?
You're jumping around so much it's hard to figure out what point you're actually trying to make. I guess what you're saying is blah, blah, Android fails, blah, blah stoopid Google or something along those lines? You're certainly entitled to your opinion.
You're jumping around so much it's hard to figure out what point you're actually trying to make. I guess what you're saying is blah, blah, Android fails, blah, blah stoopid Google or something along those lines? You're certainly entitled to your opinion.
GOOG lost $7.88 today despite Google I/O conference being held this week.
GOOG lost $7.88 today despite Google I/O conference being held this week.
So what. That doesn't mean anything. That's still only down 1.42% and Apple is down 1.14% as well. So when you look at it like that it's not that big of a deal. Most of the tech sector is down today. You know why? Because it's Friday.
So what. That doesn't mean anything. That's still only down 1.42% and Apple is down 1.14% as well. So when you look at it like that it's not that big of a deal. Most of the tech sector is down today. You know why? Because it's Friday.
It is important. Google I/O conference is Google's technology roadmap for the year. Apparently the investors who invest their money on Google do not believe this roadmap will bring significant growth to Google business.
It is important. Google I/O conference is Google's technology roadmap for the year. Apparently the investors who invest their money on Google do not believe this roadmap will bring significant growth to Google business.
Since you want to go down the silly road how did Apple stock do on the first couple of days after the Apple Watch was released a few weeks ago? Was that intended as a vote of no-confidence in Apple?
Why not just say your dislike of Google has nothing at all to do with the success or failure pr even existence of Android Pay? You just don't like 'em period. Nothing to be ashamed of, you're not the only one and it's no big deal. You don't have to have a reason so don't feel you have to work so hard to rationalize it.
I heard that Android Pay will transmit information back to Google. Google will use that info to further its ad revenue.
You heard wrong then.
According to Google "We absolutely don’t sell that data and we have no plans to use [it] for advertising or anything like that," says Lockheimer. Bhat notes that there are cases in which Google will collect transaction data — but the company will limit that data use to displaying recent transactions."
I think you'd be able to appreciate this payment solution too. I won't be surprised if Apple does something similar before too long.
I don't think Apple would implement that if it's how it's being described. Articles are saying it uses your voice command 'I'd like to pay with Google' to do the transaction where an app opens on that voice command and does the transaction over Bluetooth. Using 'Google' as the phrase doesn't match with Android Pay either. What if the phone's mic doesn't pick up your voice in a bag? Are you just going to start shouting the phrase while the cashier looks at you like you're a crazy person? There needs to be more details on how exactly this is going to work and if it's secure enough operating over bluetooth.
That both Apple Pay and Android Pay resemble each other is expected.
Not the branding. Why not use Google Pay or GPay like GMail? The reason is so they can use a logo like Apple:
The UI looks like it had a makeover too - Google Wallet:
vs Android Pay:
Announcement:
Is the 'M' in Android M for mimic?
People always say that companies like Google, Samsung, Microsoft had solutions beforehand but doing something first isn't the hard part. Apple is rarely first to do things. They didn't make the first MP3 player, tablet or phone. They spent the time figuring out how to do it the right way, the intuitive way and once they've done it, other companies seem to think it's perfectly ok to copy.
I don't think Apple would implement that if it's how it's being described. Articles are saying it uses your voice command 'I'd like to pay with Google' to do the transaction where an app opens on that voice command and does the transaction over Bluetooth. Using 'Google' as the phrase doesn't match with Android Pay either. What if the phone's mic doesn't pick up your voice in a bag? Are you just going to start shouting the phrase while the cashier looks at you like you're a crazy person? There needs to be more details on how exactly this is going to work and if it's secure enough operating over bluetooth.
I think you are misreading it Marvin. The solution is intended as hands-free, meaning you don't have to take out your phone or strap on a watch to listen for a voice command or tap it on a terminal or enter a pin.That would be counter-productive wouldn't it?
If it works, which is what a beta partnered with McDonald's is meant to help determine, it sounds as tho it can be both convenient and simple, especially if it doesn't require a smartphone accessory costing several hundred to make it work. Perhaps Project Abacus is further along than assumed and used in the payment solution or verification? No idea really. Heck they might find it's not worth pursuing, at least for now.
As for a UI redesign for Android Pay of course!! Google Wallet was a marketplace failure. Even if Android Pay and Google Wallet were identical except for the name the look would have been changed to at least give the impression it was new.
Why all the concern anyway? Apple won't have to compete with Android Pay, no chance this is coming to iDevices, nor is Apple going to offer Apple Pay to Android users. No retailer is going to have to make an either/or decision on which one to support. None of them will dump Apple Pay in favor of Android Pay. No bank or credit card processor is going to announce that with Android Pay now available they won't work with Apple any longer. And most important Apple will still reap their cut of every credit card transaction which was the intent of Apple Pay from the beginning. Android Pay doesn't change any of it.
As for the images you posted I've no idea if those are what Android Pay will be using or how the process will flow. Maybe the credit card selection screen will be a carbon-copy of Apple's. That particular screen design may not even be solely up to the whims of Apple or Google, with the payment industry having a say in it. Dunno.
At the end of the day Android Pay is not all that different from what Google originally envisioned back in 2010. They didn't have to wait for Apple to show them how the process should work, but they sure had to wait on Apple to show them how to crank it up, get the banks to play nice and promote the heck out of it. Google sucks at that, failing to understand partners would be essential and figuring out how to overcome their objections with the right carrots dangling. Timing was wrong too, 5 years early since there was no necessity for retailers to invest in the needed terminals and training like requirements are now. For Apple the timing could not have been better. They're good at that.
In typical Google fashion they also didn't spend near enough time on marketing Google Wallet , explaining what it was and why anyone would benefit from from using it. They're horrible at promoting their own products which is strange for an advertising company. They need to poach a couple of stars from Apple. No one markets better than the folks in Cupertino.
I think you are misreading it Marvin. The solution is intended as hands-free, meaning you don't have to take out your phone or strap on a watch to listen for a voice command or tap it on a terminal or enter a pin.That would be counter-productive wouldn't it?
What I described was hands-free and it wasn't my interpretation, that's how articles are describing it:
Why all the concern anyway? Apple won't have to compete with Android Pay, no chance this is coming to iDevices, nor is Apple going to offer Apple Pay to Android users.
The issue is similar to the issue with Samsung with is copying the look and feel of an experience to a competing platform. If Android or Android phones didn't have the features or offer a similar user experience then the buyer would be more likely to consider an Apple product instead. Apple could for example make a search engine but styling it to look exactly like Google wouldn't be a nice thing to do the way Microsoft did:
Google sucks at that, failing to understand partners would be essential and figuring out how to overcome their objections with the right carrots dangling.
Partnering comes with respecting turf. They tried to partner with Apple once too.
In typical Google fashion they also didn't spend near enough time on marketing Google Wallet , explaining what it was and why anyone would benefit from from using it. They're horrible at promoting their own products which is strange for an advertising company. They need to poach a couple of stars from Apple. No one markets better than the folks in Cupertino.
I suspect that's because Google's core business is advertising. Apple's core business is the product. Google could get rid of all hardware and extraneous software (including Android) and their revenue would barely move.
Comments
Android Pay implemented on all versions of Android OS or just Android M?
Andorid Pay is supported for KitKat or higher
There was no stealing involved as you put it. There is also no copying as the way the banks and credit card companies set this all up everyone's way will be pretty much the same. Just like all credit cards for different companies work the same. Apple didn’t make this up on thier own and only followed the predetermined rules already set forth. They made it work really well and I enjoy using it but they didn't do it all by themselves.
What are you talking about. If you want to play that game than the majority of iPhone users can't use Apple Pay as there are way more iPhones on the market being used that don't have the NFC chip than there are. So it's the same thing. And the Apple Watch doesn’t really change all that much.
In the U.S. people will be able to use Android Pay just as much as Apple Pay users can.
Anything with KitKat 4.4 and up. So where it counts that's the majority of the people that would potentially use it.
Do the dirt cheap iPhones have NFC? No. So what's your point? Most dirt cheap Android phones do have NFC in them now. Doesn't matter tho.
Although, truth be told... Apple could just as easily undermine Samsung by marketing and selling a second-tier line of non-US/Europe phones designed specifically to decimate low cost Android phones, as Xioami is doing today. Apple could remove Samsung from the picture completely for a few billion dollars.
Does "Android Pay" (what a laugh) use tokenization and an identical fingerprint reader?
Because carriers were greedy and wanted to push their own solutions they refused to "play" with the chipset. So in 2014 (I think) Google switched to HCE and discontinued support for physical secure-elements in an effort to get around their blockade. My guess is thay may renew that support now that Apple has cleared the way but don't know for certain. Obviously Apple has more influence.
But the way Google originally intended as far back as 2010 was the right way, as evidence Apple's use of a physical secure element for Apple Pay just as Google used. Apple was obviously better at pushing past the resistance from established players to make it happen.
http://www.nfcworld.com/2014/03/17/328326/google-wallet-ends-support-physical-secure-elements/
[VIDEO]
There was no stealing involved as you put it. There is also no copying as the way the banks and credit card companies set this all up everyone's way will be pretty much the same. Just like all credit cards for different companies work the same. Apple didn’t make this up on thier own and only followed the predetermined rules already set forth. They made it work really well and I enjoy using it but they didn't do it all by themselves.
What are you talking about. If you want to play that game than the majority of iPhone users can't use Apple Pay as there are way more iPhones on the market being used that don't have the NFC chip than there are. So it's the same thing. And the Apple Watch doesn’t really change all that much.
In the U.S. people will be able to use Android Pay just as much as Apple Pay users can.
Anything with KitKat 4.4 and up. So where it counts that's the majority of the people that would potentially use it.
Do the dirt cheap iPhones have NFC? No. So what's your point? Most dirt cheap Android phones do have NFC in them now. Doesn't matter tho.
Google has lost completely in Android Pay. Android Pay is not an innovation but a copycat. Google business model is ad. Google Wallet is designed to collect user buying information. Android Pay can not. Further, Google Wallet from the name is completely owned by Google. Android is shared with other parties. Would Samsung, HTC, Hwawei, and all other Android phone makers like to share the Android fee with Google? I think not. So in the end Google does not make any money from Android Pay. Finally, why would merchants accept payment from Android Pay? According to you and Gatorguy, Android Pay will be available from all Android phones with Kitkat. It is so easy to make an Android phone. How the merchants can be sure the Android phone was not tempered?
It may not be Apple Pay but that doesn't mean it can't see success. it's not as tho Google has to compete with Apple Pay on Android devices. That's not going to be an option AFAIK.
I imagine they'd accept it because customers want to buy things from them. Good reason eh? At least the 700,000 retailers accepting it at launch would seem to think so. Financial partners like Chase, Citibank, Capital One, U.S. Bank, Discover, MasterCard, Visa, American Express and the like would agree as they're in with Android Pay too.
It may not be Apple Pay but that doesn't mean it can't see success. it's not as tho Google has to compete with Apple Pay on Android devices. That's not going to be an option AFAIK.
So it is Google that signed agreements with the 700,000 retailers? Google will take the fee all by itself?
What fee do you mean? I would guess they'd probably be taking the same cut as Apple does for Apple Pay. They'll both be performing the same service. Let me know when you find out the details 'cause I've not seen them.
Do you know Google is blocked in China? China is the largest Android market. How could Android Pay work in China?
You're jumping around so much it's hard to figure out what point you're actually trying to make. I guess what you're saying is blah, blah, Android fails, blah, blah stoopid Google or something along those lines? You're certainly entitled to your opinion.
GOOG lost $7.88 today despite Google I/O conference being held this week.
So what. That doesn't mean anything. That's still only down 1.42% and Apple is down 1.14% as well. So when you look at it like that it's not that big of a deal. Most of the tech sector is down today. You know why? Because it's Friday.
So what. That doesn't mean anything. That's still only down 1.42% and Apple is down 1.14% as well. So when you look at it like that it's not that big of a deal. Most of the tech sector is down today. You know why? Because it's Friday.
It is important. Google I/O conference is Google's technology roadmap for the year. Apparently the investors who invest their money on Google do not believe this roadmap will bring significant growth to Google business.
Why not just say your dislike of Google has nothing at all to do with the success or failure pr even existence of Android Pay? You just don't like 'em period. Nothing to be ashamed of, you're not the only one and it's no big deal. You don't have to have a reason so don't feel you have to work so hard to rationalize it.
According to Google "We absolutely don’t sell that data and we have no plans to use [it] for advertising or anything like that," says Lockheimer. Bhat notes that there are cases in which Google will collect transaction data — but the company will limit that data use to displaying recent transactions."
I don't think Apple would implement that if it's how it's being described. Articles are saying it uses your voice command 'I'd like to pay with Google' to do the transaction where an app opens on that voice command and does the transaction over Bluetooth. Using 'Google' as the phrase doesn't match with Android Pay either. What if the phone's mic doesn't pick up your voice in a bag? Are you just going to start shouting the phrase while the cashier looks at you like you're a crazy person? There needs to be more details on how exactly this is going to work and if it's secure enough operating over bluetooth.
Not the branding. Why not use Google Pay or GPay like GMail? The reason is so they can use a logo like Apple:
The UI looks like it had a makeover too - Google Wallet:
vs Android Pay:
Announcement:
Is the 'M' in Android M for mimic?
People always say that companies like Google, Samsung, Microsoft had solutions beforehand but doing something first isn't the hard part. Apple is rarely first to do things. They didn't make the first MP3 player, tablet or phone. They spent the time figuring out how to do it the right way, the intuitive way and once they've done it, other companies seem to think it's perfectly ok to copy.
If it works, which is what a beta partnered with McDonald's is meant to help determine, it sounds as tho it can be both convenient and simple, especially if it doesn't require a smartphone accessory costing several hundred to make it work. Perhaps Project Abacus is further along than assumed and used in the payment solution or verification? No idea really. Heck they might find it's not worth pursuing, at least for now.
As for a UI redesign for Android Pay of course!! Google Wallet was a marketplace failure. Even if Android Pay and Google Wallet were identical except for the name the look would have been changed to at least give the impression it was new.
Why all the concern anyway? Apple won't have to compete with Android Pay, no chance this is coming to iDevices, nor is Apple going to offer Apple Pay to Android users. No retailer is going to have to make an either/or decision on which one to support. None of them will dump Apple Pay in favor of Android Pay. No bank or credit card processor is going to announce that with Android Pay now available they won't work with Apple any longer. And most important Apple will still reap their cut of every credit card transaction which was the intent of Apple Pay from the beginning. Android Pay doesn't change any of it.
As for the images you posted I've no idea if those are what Android Pay will be using or how the process will flow. Maybe the credit card selection screen will be a carbon-copy of Apple's. That particular screen design may not even be solely up to the whims of Apple or Google, with the payment industry having a say in it. Dunno.
At the end of the day Android Pay is not all that different from what Google originally envisioned back in 2010. They didn't have to wait for Apple to show them how the process should work, but they sure had to wait on Apple to show them how to crank it up, get the banks to play nice and promote the heck out of it. Google sucks at that, failing to understand partners would be essential and figuring out how to overcome their objections with the right carrots dangling. Timing was wrong too, 5 years early since there was no necessity for retailers to invest in the needed terminals and training like requirements are now. For Apple the timing could not have been better. They're good at that.
In typical Google fashion they also didn't spend near enough time on marketing Google Wallet , explaining what it was and why anyone would benefit from from using it. They're horrible at promoting their own products which is strange for an advertising company. They need to poach a couple of stars from Apple. No one markets better than the folks in Cupertino.
What I described was hands-free and it wasn't my interpretation, that's how articles are describing it:
http://gizmodo.com/googles-new-hands-free-feature-will-let-you-pay-with-th-1707767767
They are saying you have to walk up to the checkout and say a phrase to start the transaction, which would need your phone to hear your voice.
The issue is similar to the issue with Samsung with is copying the look and feel of an experience to a competing platform. If Android or Android phones didn't have the features or offer a similar user experience then the buyer would be more likely to consider an Apple product instead. Apple could for example make a search engine but styling it to look exactly like Google wouldn't be a nice thing to do the way Microsoft did:
http://www.businessinsider.com/microsoft-redesigns-bing-to-look-like-google-2012-5
Partnering comes with respecting turf. They tried to partner with Apple once too.
I suspect that's because Google's core business is advertising. Apple's core business is the product. Google could get rid of all hardware and extraneous software (including Android) and their revenue would barely move.