I don't think Apple is allowed to approve sale prices at third parties. However the discount Apple gives to them is probably way smaller than what other venders give. Any sale price would probably come from the third party retailer's pockets.
I know that in Japan it became an issue. The claim was that Apple controlled the iPhone pricing even after the telecom's had purchased the stock. According to some authorities interpretation of Japanese law that was illegal.
So yeah I think Apple includes contract clauses requiring 3rd party reseller partners to run price reductions past them first.
Exactly. How is this any different from how Apple re-prices last year's models?
Apple doesn't reduce prices ahead of the announcement of a new model. They drop prices the day the new model is announced. Not "in anticipation of" as one poster put it, in their attempt to conflate unrelated (future) events into a cause and effect narrative.
Apple doesn't reduce prices ahead of the announcement of a new model. They drop prices the day the new model is announced. Not "in anticipation of" as one poster put it, in their attempt to conflate unrelated (future) events into a cause and effect narrative.
Don't you have the same understanding that I do that Apple must approve all price reductions/sales? In Taiwan that's the case. Orange has told consumers that Apple sets the price for them too. If accurate and some of them do a "sale", for example $100 off regular price, then Apple must be signing off on it, correct?
I think it's fairly obvious that Best Buy, Walmart, etc are clearing old stock with Apple's blessing in advance of the refresh. You may or may not believe differently.
EDIT: More than one industry article talks about an Apple reseller contract MAP (minimum advertised price) clause.
But the point is this: Analysist and Samsung was saying the Galaxy S6 Edge was selling like gangbusters and the only reason they sold less was because supply shortage.
But the $100 price drop is proof that was total bullshit. If it was selling great they would never drop the price after 4 months of release.
@sog35 : Sure, you may be right, or wrong. This article doesn't prove or disprove that, however.
What we do know from the historical data, or Idealo's data, is that Samsung's flagship S model pricing always falls by about 20+% after 4 months, regardless of their popularity, or analysts' early prediction.
You can sell a zillion phones, but if you're just breaking even, what's the point? You'<span style="line-height:1.4em;">re spinning your wheels.</span>
Not necessarily. If you can just break even, and have sufficient resources to last until your competitors go out of business, it could prove to be a good business move.
It could only if the competition was all functioning in the same segments and losing money.
In this case, they're being eaten by many companies who are perfectly glad selling at a price were Samsung is only breaking even; while they're making money. So, the one being grinded down is not the competition, but Samsung.
Also, there is an opportunity cost of not making money from tens of billions of investment; this money may have been better spent elsewhere, with a better return on investment. Their investors will ask them if what they're doing is really wise...
Then what? Increase the price once everyone is out of business? Then the same competitors will re-enter and undercut you.
Name me a business that did this tactic and had long term success AFTER they got rid of competitors? This only works in industries that governments allow Monopolies. This will not and has NEVER worked in consumer electronics.
Some people are claiming Amazon is doing that, but I don't think so. And that'S why Amazon desperately is trying to diversify out of retail where its competitive advantage has been shrinking despite its revenues growing. They'll NEVER make big profit from retail, but they may use their back end infrastructure to provide other much more profitable services.
and we all now know the S4 was the last "record-breaking" flagship from Samsung. We also know what happened to the S4's pricing (see Idealo's data again) -- it declined faster than the two predecessors, the S2 and S3.
I just don't understand why it's so difficult for some here at AI to believe that the BOM cost declines substantially throughout smartphone's production cycle. Samsung chooses to pass that saving back to consumers, as most tech/hardware companies do; Apple keeps theirs until the next release.
I guess people just hear what they want to hear. So where is the evidence that the price reduction has nothing to do with the historical competitive market pricing, all to do with their recent below-expected earning? It seems fairly clear that the $100 price cut fits inline with their historical pricing strategy -- 20% to 25% after 4 months -- but hey whatever makes you happy. *yawn*
Hilarious, these Samsung shills. That graph is deceiving, because of the scale (or lack thereof) of the x-axis. The 'predicted' price of the S5 is expected to trade at 70% of its original price at 6 months, whereas the S2 reached that after 12 months. I would like to know what that means in billions of dollars.
Hilarious, these Samsung shills. That graph is deceiving, because of the scale (or lack thereof) of the x-axis. The 'predicted' price of the S5 is expected to trade at 70% of its original price at 6 months, whereas the S2 reached that after 12 months. I would like to know what that means in billions of dollars.
@basjhj : obviously you are unfamiliar with the notion of log scale?
<a data-huddler-embed="href" href="/u/63357/basjhj" style="display:inline-block;">@basjhj</a>
: just woke up, grampa? obviously you are unfamiliar with the notion of log scale? perhaps you are still finishing up junior high?
You better look that up yourself. The first 6 points on the x axis have the same interval then suddenly it doubles then goes up by 50%, then go up by 33%.
The excuses made for sammy have me laughing over here!!
"Apple does this too"
NOPE
"S6 Edge demand was too high"
sammy lied to you
"Good strategy"
Apple should maybe take notes from the knockoff and cut prices 4 months after launch too! NOT!!
"but but but"
Sorry but defending your cheap knockoff and making stuff up only makes you look sad
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy
IMHO the price cuts would have more to do with new S models launching in less than a month.
They come out next year. What the heck you talking 'bout?? Either way, even if Galaxy S7 were to come out next month this in no way justifies a price cut on a "over demand" phone.
It's a terrible indictment of the ability of manufacturers who make Android devices:
these firms struggle to make money from an OS which they get for free whilst a company relatively new to the mobile market, a company which created and continues to refine its mobile device OS, walks off with the majority of the profit in the sector.
Agreed. I think it shows really clearly the importance of larger screens, and most importantly, the user experience.
Android's and Wimo's is very two-dimensional and they don't really offer much more than an extended feature phone experience.
Apple has and continues to highlight integration of services. Google tried, but it only thinks in terms of revenue x data, not Apple's focus on customer satisfaction.
and we all now know the S4 was the last "record-breaking" flagship from Samsung. We also know what happened to the S4's pricing (see Idealo's data again) -- it declined faster than the two predecessors, the S2 and S3.
I just don't understand why it's so difficult for some here at AI to believe that the BOM cost declines substantially throughout smartphone's production cycle. Samsung chooses to pass that saving back to consumers as most tech/hardware companies do; Apple keeps theirs until the next release.
You can't be serious. Probably the stupidest assumption about Samsung I have ever read.
So now Samsung and all of the other Android manufacturers are trying to be our buddies and look after our expenses by selling their phones at or below cost? GTFO!:rolleyes:
You can't be serious. Probably the stupidest assumption about Samsung I have ever read.
So now Samsung and all of the other Android manufacturers are trying to be our buddies and look after our expenses by selling their phones at or below cost? GTFO!
I'll admit this is a new one though. Android and Samsung want to share the savings with customers so the prices are going down. Apple is greedy so they keep the savings till the next model launches.
You better look that up yourself. The first 6 points on the x axis have the same interval then suddenly it doubles then goes up by 50%, then go up by 33%.
@jungmark : yes, that's how this particular log base 6 chart works. the first 6 points increase by 1, or 60, then the next 6 points by 6, 61 (ie, 12, 18, 24, 30, 36, 42), then the next 6 by by 36, or 62. But none of that really matters, we only care about the first 4 data points.
You can't be serious. Probably the stupidest assumption about Samsung I have ever read.
So now Samsung and all of the other Android manufacturers are trying to be our buddies and look after our expenses by selling their phones at or below cost? GTFO!
@pixeldoc : Sure, sounds like you never bought non-Apple products in your life? As said earlier, the cost of production drops substantially throughout their product cycle in tech. Samsung and most tech companies in general can and do drop prices frequently to stay competitive and still maintain their margin, this is no brainer.
Comments
So yeah I think Apple includes contract clauses requiring 3rd party reseller partners to run price reductions past them first.
Apple doesn't reduce prices ahead of the announcement of a new model. They drop prices the day the new model is announced. Not "in anticipation of" as one poster put it, in their attempt to conflate unrelated (future) events into a cause and effect narrative.
I think it's fairly obvious that Best Buy, Walmart, etc are clearing old stock with Apple's blessing in advance of the refresh. You may or may not believe differently.
EDIT: More than one industry article talks about an Apple reseller contract MAP (minimum advertised price) clause.
...
What an utter wasteland Android has become. ...
I'd say that it's more of a cross between "utter wasteland" and "dumpster fire."
Nice graph.
But the point is this: Analysist and Samsung was saying the Galaxy S6 Edge was selling like gangbusters and the only reason they sold less was because supply shortage.
But the $100 price drop is proof that was total bullshit. If it was selling great they would never drop the price after 4 months of release.
@sog35 : Sure, you may be right, or wrong. This article doesn't prove or disprove that, however.
What we do know from the historical data, or Idealo's data, is that Samsung's flagship S model pricing always falls by about 20+% after 4 months, regardless of their popularity, or analysts' early prediction.
They said they could not meet the demand for their S6 Edge. You do not cut the price of a product that has higher demand than you can meet.
Not necessarily. If you can just break even, and have sufficient resources to last until your competitors go out of business, it could prove to be a good business move.
It could only if the competition was all functioning in the same segments and losing money.
In this case, they're being eaten by many companies who are perfectly glad selling at a price were Samsung is only breaking even; while they're making money. So, the one being grinded down is not the competition, but Samsung.
Also, there is an opportunity cost of not making money from tens of billions of investment; this money may have been better spent elsewhere, with a better return on investment. Their investors will ask them if what they're doing is really wise...
Then what? Increase the price once everyone is out of business? Then the same competitors will re-enter and undercut you.
Name me a business that did this tactic and had long term success AFTER they got rid of competitors? This only works in industries that governments allow Monopolies. This will not and has NEVER worked in consumer electronics.
Some people are claiming Amazon is doing that, but I don't think so. And that'S why Amazon desperately is trying to diversify out of retail where its competitive advantage has been shrinking despite its revenues growing. They'll NEVER make big profit from retail, but they may use their back end infrastructure to provide other much more profitable services.
WRONG. Samsung never said the S3, S4, or S5 had a supply issue.
They said the S6 Edge did. It makes ZERO sense for them to lower the price if the demand was higher than the supply.
Another case of Samsung bullshitting.
@sog35: Sure, you can believe whatever you "choose" to believe.
Galaxy S4 faces supply issue due to 'overwhelming demand't
and we all now know the S4 was the last "record-breaking" flagship from Samsung. We also know what happened to the S4's pricing (see Idealo's data again) -- it declined faster than the two predecessors, the S2 and S3.
I just don't understand why it's so difficult for some here at AI to believe that the BOM cost declines substantially throughout smartphone's production cycle. Samsung chooses to pass that saving back to consumers, as most tech/hardware companies do; Apple keeps theirs until the next release.
I guess people just hear what they want to hear. So where is the evidence that the price reduction has nothing to do with the historical competitive market pricing, all to do with their recent below-expected earning? It seems fairly clear that the $100 price cut fits inline with their historical pricing strategy -- 20% to 25% after 4 months -- but hey whatever makes you happy. *yawn*
Hilarious, these Samsung shills. That graph is deceiving, because of the scale (or lack thereof) of the x-axis. The 'predicted' price of the S5 is expected to trade at 70% of its original price at 6 months, whereas the S2 reached that after 12 months. I would like to know what that means in billions of dollars.
Hilarious, these Samsung shills. That graph is deceiving, because of the scale (or lack thereof) of the x-axis. The 'predicted' price of the S5 is expected to trade at 70% of its original price at 6 months, whereas the S2 reached that after 12 months. I would like to know what that means in billions of dollars.
@basjhj : obviously you are unfamiliar with the notion of log scale?
Samsung graph and the AAPL graph are starting to look the same.
You better look that up yourself. The first 6 points on the x axis have the same interval then suddenly it doubles then goes up by 50%, then go up by 33%.
The excuses made for sammy have me laughing over here!!
"Apple does this too"
NOPE
"S6 Edge demand was too high"
sammy lied to you
"Good strategy"
Apple should maybe take notes from the knockoff and cut prices 4 months after launch too! NOT!!
"but but but"
Sorry but defending your cheap knockoff and making stuff up only makes you look sad
Quote:
IMHO the price cuts would have more to do with new S models launching in less than a month.
They come out next year. What the heck you talking 'bout?? Either way, even if Galaxy S7 were to come out next month this in no way justifies a price cut on a "over demand" phone.
Agreed. I think it shows really clearly the importance of larger screens, and most importantly, the user experience.
Android's and Wimo's is very two-dimensional and they don't really offer much more than an extended feature phone experience.
Apple has and continues to highlight integration of services. Google tried, but it only thinks in terms of revenue x data, not Apple's focus on customer satisfaction.
Go Apple!
You can't be serious. Probably the stupidest assumption about Samsung I have ever read.
So now Samsung and all of the other Android manufacturers are trying to be our buddies and look after our expenses by selling their phones at or below cost? GTFO!:rolleyes:
You can't be serious. Probably the stupidest assumption about Samsung I have ever read.
So now Samsung and all of the other Android manufacturers are trying to be our buddies and look after our expenses by selling their phones at or below cost? GTFO!
That's @tooltalk for you.
I'll admit this is a new one though. Android and Samsung want to share the savings with customers so the prices are going down. Apple is greedy so they keep the savings till the next model launches.
A change from the usual arguments.
You better look that up yourself. The first 6 points on the x axis have the same interval then suddenly it doubles then goes up by 50%, then go up by 33%.
@jungmark : yes, that's how this particular log base 6 chart works. the first 6 points increase by 1, or 60, then the next 6 points by 6, 61 (ie, 12, 18, 24, 30, 36, 42), then the next 6 by by 36, or 62. But none of that really matters, we only care about the first 4 data points.
You can't be serious. Probably the stupidest assumption about Samsung I have ever read.
So now Samsung and all of the other Android manufacturers are trying to be our buddies and look after our expenses by selling their phones at or below cost? GTFO!
@pixeldoc : Sure, sounds like you never bought non-Apple products in your life? As said earlier, the cost of production drops substantially throughout their product cycle in tech. Samsung and most tech companies in general can and do drop prices frequently to stay competitive and still maintain their margin, this is no brainer.