Apple has target ship date of 2019 for electric car project, but it won't be self driving - report

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Comments

  • Reply 21 of 166
    rogifanrogifan Posts: 10,669member

    Apple Car project is worst kept secret in Bay Area. There are more people working on it than work at almost every startup.


    48 retweets67 favorites


     

  • Reply 22 of 166

    Fantastic - 

     

    This proves what I have been saying for years - Cook was perfect selection by Jobs - 

     

    Best products -not first to market, but the absolute best quality, period period.

     

    Thanks Steve for selecting Mr. Cook and team/structure - my portfolio loves you.   no reason for absurdly low multiple.  Thesis against it is "Cook is no Steve Jobs, no vision".

     

    The car effort proves that Mr. Cook has very long/distant vision yes indeed .. stock should move to where it belongs -a 20 multiple ex cash - 

  • Reply 23 of 166
    I agree with some of the comments regarding autonomous cars and the long time frame to integrate them into the existing system.

    My personal opinion is apple will make a very well designed electric car with a higher level of range, integrated with all of its ecosystem and will introduce new safety features that compliment the driving experience.
  • Reply 24 of 166
    I hope they utilise some of the patents that Tesla open sourced a little while ago. No need to reinvent the wheel.

    I wonder how much an Apple Car would cost?
  • Reply 25 of 166
    paxmanpaxman Posts: 4,709member
    solipsismy wrote: »
    I don't think that has anything to do with it. Releasing a fully autonomous car for the public throughout the US (and beyond) in 2019 simply isn't possible. This will happen and Jony may or may not be at Apple when this is under development — which I think is happening now — but this will take a lot of changes to both infrastructure and culture before this gets fully implemented with many, many intelligent components that will need to be introduced to non-autonomous vehicles before we get to that point.
    Yes, my exact thought, too. I imagine the car will include many early stage self driving technologies similar to the new Volvo XC90. What I am very curious about is what kind of vehicle Apple will introduce. Personally I think it will be a commuter vehicle like the BMW above. I can't see Apple going against Tesla in the high end sports coupe market but I can see an Apple car competing against the Fiat 500. I guess we will find out as I really don't think Apple can keep much of this hidden in the long run.
  • Reply 26 of 166
    tmaytmay Posts: 5,761member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by TechProd1gy View Post



    I agree with some of the comments regarding autonomous cars and the long time frame to integrate them into the existing system.



    My personal opinion is apple will make a very well designed electric car with a higher level of range, integrated with all of its ecosystem and will introduce new safety features that compliment the driving experience.

    I think that Apple wants to build an urban car with enough range for the suburban commute. You need to do that in winter, so I'd argue 150 miles would be the sweet spot. In summer, that might work out to be 200 miles.

     

    Whatever the number, I don't think that Apple is going for a traditional build, based on their interest in the i3.

     

    There's a lot more that Apple could bring into the walled garden, including a strong green component, based on their known ability to build large partnerships of industry leaders. This is one undertaking where cash will be a definite benefit; how big do they want to go?

  • Reply 27 of 166
    paxmanpaxman Posts: 4,709member
    blastdoor wrote: »
    Mark my words, though -- Apple will not be selling cars to end-users in the way they sell Macs to end users. This is going to be a transportation service that you can access through your iPhone or Apple Watch. 
    I like it. It will be called Apple Tardis.
  • Reply 28 of 166
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by sog35 View Post

     

    Cant wait to get an electric car with decent acceleration at a decent price.

     

    No more oil changes every 3 months.

    No more going to the gas station every 4 days.

    No more engine filter changes.

    No more repairing:

     

    Pistons, rings, conrods, oil pumps, fuel pumps, mufflers, catalytic converters, valves, valve springs, fuel injectors or injection computers, differentials, gearboxes or automatic transmissions, exhaust pipes, engine blocks (although they need the casings), air flow meters, knock sensors, flywheels, clutches, shift linkages, vacuum reservoirs or traditional brake boosters, fan/drive belts, spark plugs,a multitude of different gaskets,high tensile bolts for things like the heads rods or crank (which are also redundant). Universal joints other than in driveshafts, fuel and oil tanks, fuel and oil lines, fuel level sensors, cam chains or belts, air, fuel and fuel filters, spark plug leads, distributors, a multitude of hall effect sensors, intake/exhaust manifolds, starter motors,alternators, coils, camshafts, pushrods, hydraulic lifters, gudgeon pins, turbo chargers, welsh plugs, bell housings, most of the bearings, plus a whole heap of machining, drilling and casting work.


     

    Why not get a Leaf, or a Tesla?  Oh wait...forgot which forum I'm in.... 

  • Reply 29 of 166
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by sog35 View Post

     

    Ways Apple can improve the Auto industry:

     

    1. Purchasing cars.  What a PITA.  Constant haggling and hidden BS charges. Time for an easy relaxing car buying experience.

     

    2. Maintaining cars.  Remote diagonistic.  Imagine your car is having problems.  They probably can remotely diagonse your car. NO need to bring in your car every 2 months for an oil change.  No more replacing values, belts, filters, ect.  

     

    3. Much better info-tainment systems.  Current systems are an absolute joke.

     

    4. Overall customer service.  Dealers suck.  Repair shops suck. Gas stations suck.  All 3rd world country service.  Now imagine how good the customer service will be on a $50k Apple car.


     

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by sog35 View Post

     

     

    Leaf is cute, but common man.

     

    Tesla?  Not bad.  But their info-taiment system sucks.  And Tesla does not have enough $$$ to update their cars often enough.  The Model-S is looking long in the tooth and needs a restyle ASAP.


     

    Oh, I forgot you are the 1%, so where's your i8?  Let me guess, you lost all your money on that Fisker Karma didn't you?  LOL...bottom line, you'd buy rotten food from Apple if they marked it as "premium."

  • Reply 30 of 166
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by sog35 View Post

     

     

    when did Apple ever sell a 'rotten' product.  Go back to your hole.


     

    LOL, you didn't answer my question.

  • Reply 31 of 166
    blastdoor wrote: »
    If one must drive a car, then there are plenty of good cars that people love that are already on the market. It's not like the smartphone market in 2007. 

    The problem with cars is that driving sucks for reasons that are external to the hardware itself. That is, there's the annoyance of dealing with traffic and the opportunity cost of your time, particularly for commuters. If you really want to make automobile transportation a better experience then you need to eliminate the need to drive. 

    One way to do that is with self-driving cars. Another way to do that is through services like Uber. Another is through traditional taxi services. Of those three, Uber is the best, but it's still not what I'd call a "great" transportation service experience. 

    I've been thinking that Apple's approach to cars would be to offer transportation as a service (like Uber), but with greater vertical integration (including designing their own cars) allowing for greater control over the experience. I had assumed this would necessitate self-driving cars but I guess that's not really true -- Apple could directly employ human drivers. Maybe that's what they'll do, at least for a while. 

    Mark my words, though -- Apple will not be selling cars to end-users in the way they sell Macs to end users. This is going to be a transportation service that you can access through your iPhone or Apple Watch. 

    If you think driving sucks then maybe you need a better car. Driving is enjoyable when behind the wheel of a nice car, even when there is traffic.
  • Reply 32 of 166
    sog35 wrote: »
    Ways Apple can improve the Auto industry:

    1. Purchasing cars.  What a PITA.  Constant haggling and hidden BS charges. Time for an easy relaxing car buying experience.

    2. Maintaining cars.  Remote diagonistic.  Imagine your car is having problems.  They probably can remotely diagonse your car. NO need to bring in your car every 2 months for an oil change.  No more replacing values, belts, filters, ect.  

    3. Much better info-tainment systems.  Current systems are an absolute joke.

    4. Overall customer service.  Dealers suck.  Repair shops suck. Gas stations suck.  All 3rd world country service.  Now imagine how good the customer service will be on a $50k Apple car.

    It would be uber cool if a car company did those things... cough ... Tesla ... cough.
  • Reply 33 of 166
    sog35 wrote: »
    Leaf is cute, but common man.

    Tesla?  Not bad.  But their info-taiment system sucks.  And Tesla does not have enough $$$ to update their cars often enough.  The Model-S is looking long in the tooth and needs a restyle ASAP.

    The Model S is fine as is. What do you think sucks about their infotainment system?

    They also have a major update coming in a few weeks with several nice enhancements. The new UI looks a lot like modern iOS / Android.
  • Reply 34 of 166
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by sog35 View Post

     

    damn. 

     

    I need to hold on to my car for another 3-4 years


    Then you'll have to buy one every year.

  • Reply 35 of 166
    sog35 wrote: »
    Cant wait to get an electric car with decent acceleration at a decent price.

    No more oil changes every 3 months.
    No more going to the gas station every 4 days.
    No more engine filter changes.
    No more repairing:

    Pistons, rings, conrods, oil pumps, fuel pumps, mufflers, catalytic converters, valves, valve springs, fuel injectors or injection computers, differentials, gearboxes or automatic transmissions, exhaust pipes, engine blocks (although they need the casings), air flow meters, knock sensors, flywheels, clutches, shift linkages, vacuum reservoirs or traditional brake boosters, fan/drive belts, spark plugs,a multitude of different gaskets,high tensile bolts for things like the heads rods or crank (which are also redundant). Universal joints other than in driveshafts, fuel and oil tanks, fuel and oil lines, fuel level sensors, cam chains or belts, air, fuel and fuel filters, spark plug leads, distributors, a multitude of hall effect sensors, intake/exhaust manifolds, starter motors,alternators, coils, camshafts, pushrods, hydraulic lifters, gudgeon pins, turbo chargers, welsh plugs, bell housings, most of the bearings, plus a whole heap of machining, drilling and casting work.

    Dream on. You'll still have battery cooling systems, batteries, brakes, wheel bearings, electric motors, tires, interior motors and filters. Your list is a lot longer, but in reality I've never had to repair a connecting rod.

    sog35 wrote: »
    I love it.  Apple is disrupting all the names Wall Street loves.

    Google - destroying them with Ad block
    Netflix - AppleTV
    Tesla - AppleCar
    Fitbit - AppleWatch

    By more than one account Fitbit still outsells Apple Watch. I'm not too sure Apple TV is "disrupting" Netflix when you can stream it with almost anything.
  • Reply 36 of 166
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by sog35 View Post

     

     

    whats your question.


     

    You and I both like EVs, but I wouldn't buy an Apple car until it goes through many revisions.  It's a car first and software second, and I'd rather buy a car from a company that has actual engineering experience.  Physical things are totally different from software, things like brakes and headlights can't fail like software often does.  I'm not trusting my safety or my life on a version 1.0 Apple product.  Some catastrophic, dare I say rotten, 1.0 products that were spectacular failures include the Lisa, Newton, Macintosh Portable, and their continual struggle with the Internet starting with eWorld, then eventually .mac/MobileMe...

  • Reply 37 of 166
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by sog35 View Post

     

     

    Electric cars are not gressy.

     

    They have far less moving parts.

     

    Electric engine, battery, brakes, electrical systems.  Thats about it.


    If it has a steering system, it's greasy.

     

    Cars (even the relatively simple electric models) need an enormous supply chain.  They also need mechanics.  Not technicians, not geniuses.  Mechanics.  Just because it doesn't have an internal combustion engine doesn't mean it doesn't have moving parts.

     

    I know they're a smart company and have thought about all this.  Kinda surprised they're going all the way like this though.

  • Reply 38 of 166
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Conrail View Post

     

    If it has a steering system, it's greasy.

     

    Cars (even the relatively simple electric models) need an enormous supply chain.  They also need mechanics.  Not technicians, not geniuses.  Mechanics.  Just because it doesn't have an internal combustion engine doesn't mean it doesn't have moving parts.

     

    I know they're a smart company and have thought about all this.  Kinda surprised they're going all the way like this though.




    @sog35 said 'far less moving parts'. Totally different than saying 'no moving parts'. The difference with an electric car is the customer never has to touch any messy or dirty parts. For the most part Tesla technicians never get dirty. They work all day and go home as clean as they were to start the day.

  • Reply 39 of 166
    I don't think the rendering's poor. It's ironic, and it's fun. Too much is taken too seriously...
  • Reply 40 of 166
    welshdogwelshdog Posts: 1,833member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Giffen View Post



    The liability for self driving cars will be enormous for any manufacturer. I just don't see it being a viable option due to the legal system, not due to any technical reason. There's a similar issue with air delivery drones, the liability, for example, when the drone crashes onto a road causing a major traffic accident would just be too high to justify the revenue from operation.

    Those liability problems can be lessened or eliminated through concerted effort lobbying legislatures to enact favorable laws.  Many companies have done this over the years. Southwestern Bell, now AT&T, has along history of spending millions to make billions by writing their own laws and paying politicians to pass them.  One campaign in Texas cost them a few million to run and netted them $900 million.  Car companies, both old and new, will do this to make the entry of self-driving vehicles smoother and less costly.

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