I just want to point out with all this furor about 16GB minimum devices that Apple has consistently sold 8GB models at the $0 subsidized mark. I have several friends who own them (early 20's) who just make do with what they have. Their music and photos are in the cloud, they know they can only install around 100 apps, and it does everything just fine for them. They're just glad they didn't have to pay any money for it.
Moral of the story: just because a device doesn't hit your wants/needs doesn't mean it's not great for a wide range of other people.
To point out another likely issue here, Apple uses a ridiculous amount of the world's flash memory supply, and doubling the amount of memory in their base model would result in significantly more constrained supply. They've had issues in the past getting enough memory for phones/tablets and I wouldn't be surprised if this factored significantly into their decision not to increase the amount in the base model.
Yeah, that's so overly optimistic I don't even know where to begin. 25 apps might be more accurate. The 8GB iPhones have less than 5GB free once iOS crams itself inside.
At least you're admitting it's a blatant money grab.
No, Rogi, it's not a "money grab". No one's holding a gun to anyone's head, forcing them to buy the 16gb model.
I'm seeing two factions here, egged on by the media:
Entitled folk who resent the price of admission into Apple products (been like that since... well... the inception of the company). It's not Apple's job to make you fiscally comfortable.
Then there are whiners who can't seem to take personal responsibility for their poor purchase decisions. Much easier to devise a scapegoat.
Everyone in my immediate family (except myself) bought 16gb models. No one gripes about storage space, ever. Some, for years, even.
Do you really not understand this? The majority of the people that buy the 16 GB model DON'T EVEN KNOW HOW MUCH STORAGE IT HAS.
Do you have no concept of the consumer market at all? A fraction of buyers even know or give a shit at all about that. All they see is "$199, $299, $399. I'll take the $199."
Why on earth would Apple give up a $2-3/device margin when they don't need to? This decision of theirs has absolutely positively 100% zero effect on sales volume, and means probably half a billion in revenue.
Are you really going to get your panties in a bunch over an online forum? Wah wah wah.
Overall, this is an incredible phone. They managed to almost double the speed again, and the 3D touch seems like it's going to be a big boost to the way we use the phone. TouchID is very useful, and now it's faster to use touch id than it is to manually unlock the phone. Better cameras are also very important because it's the only way most people take pictures. Finally, we're getting 2 gigs of RAM, and that will increase free space by about three times (because the system and background tasks take around half a gig by themselves).
I do agree with the battery and storage complaints, although the storage doesn't affect me because I just get the larger size. However, I have plenty of friends and relatives who run into trouble because all their pictures and videos can eat space fast. The battery is a bigger issue, especially because the phone is so good that people spend more and more time using it. I think it's by a huge margin the biggest shortcoming of the iPhone, but that's because the hardware is almost perfect in every other way.
People want a magic battery and seemingly magic glass!!, they want the battery life, all the features, but not a significantlly heavier, bigger phones. 2mm thicker would make the phone, especially the larger one, unwieldy, people would complain about that for sure.
People are simply using their phones more and more and more and battery tech is not following; eventually we can hope it will.
I'm astounded that people complain about the screen when they're using the best thing out there and they're phone are now probably big butt proof too... (AL 7000).
These phones are almost tank like and people still complain about durability; what the hell do they do with those phones. BTW, I'm still using a 3GS and the screen has no cracks or major scratches.
Then they are in for a nasty surprise then, aren't they? Which in large part is the point. 16Gb is no longer sufficient for even minimal use and should no longer be the starting point. 32 GB is the starting point for the Samsung S6 and the same should be the case for the iPhone 6S. It would be fine if the storage was expandable via micro SD card.
"16Gb is no longer sufficient for even minimal use" Then that model won't sell (it's easily returned). Market forces will have ruled and all will be in balance.
Unless YOUR decree doesn't actually match the real world. And it wouldn't be the first time one person's opinion didn't dictate to the world or market.
Yeah, that's so overly optimistic I don't even know where to begin. 25 apps might be more accurate. The 8GB iPhones have less than 5GB free once iOS crams itself inside.
That wasn't an estimate; that was an actual limit stated to me by several friends. At 4GB free, you can install 100 40MB apps, and the majority of apps they (and I) install are around 4-11MB. It really is fine for normal use. I personally have a 64GB phone, but I also have my 29GB music library permanently on it. Without that I could easily fit in a 16GB phone with room to spare.
No, Rogi, it's not a "money grab". No one's holding a gun to anyone's head, forcing them to buy the 16gb model.
I'm seeing two factions here, egged on by the media:
Entitled folk who resent the price of admission into Apple products (been like that since... well... the inception of the company). It's not Apple's job to make you fiscally comfortable.
Then there are whiners who can't seem to take personal responsibility for their poor purchase decisions. Much easier to devise a scapegoat.
Everyone in my immediate family (except myself) bought 16gb models. No one gripes about storage space, ever. Some, for years, even.
So explain why Apple felt 32GB wasn't enough and decided to replace it with 64GB? I'm sure there were plenty of 32GB device owners that didn't have storage issues and were perfectly happy with their device.
Why is 16 > 64 good but 16 > 32 or 32 > 64 bad? Of course these are all rhetorical questions on my part. I know why. I'm just baffled as to why others don't get it.
I would add, many people just use the cloud for storage or have little music, pictures etc, 16GB suits their needs just fine.
However, IMO, perception can be reality too--- many people (probably not enough to matter to Apple, thus their decision) understand Apple is also the most profitable company in the world and understand it would not hurt Apple at all to spend the extra 50 cents or what ever for that extra memory. And if they did that, it would create 'longer lasting, potentially better functioning phone experience'(how are those 8GB phones doing?). They may also worry moves like may give the perception that Apple is just another low down, money grubbing SOB corporation (well they are but... shhh). I'm obviously no CEO, but I have read/heard that at times, business decisions are based on creating good perception (marketing, reality distortion fields etc)--- and not always the cold, harsh accounting of the dollars and cents of the moment.
Where is Taylor Swift? (case in point)
16GB is still fine to most people. That's it. Apple doesn't need to give to charity, which is basically what the whiners whine about. Jobs said people should buy less stuff, but of higher quality. If people really want the higher quality, they'll have to skimp on something else, maybe one less latte per week, and get the Iphone.
Why are people moaning about the 16GB model? That's like going into McDonalds starving, ordering some fries expecting to be full afterwards. You could have easily spent a bit more on a big mac meal and been satisfied. If you're going to use the more storage intensive features - buy the bigger size! Apple do offer that as a choice!! Additionally, you still get the choice of storing a load of your stuff in Apple's ridiculously cheap iCloud plans giving you back lots of device space.
I also love the way Joanna from the Wall Street Journal is moaning about the battery. Sure, it's the same performance as the last phone but Apple has said so themselves within their own product specifications. She mentions it cruises through Facebook swiftly... I'll bet she's using the app which is the biggest culprit for using copious amounts of battery life. Frankly, I'm surprised Apple let Facebook get away with releasing such a resource intensive app.
Sure, Apple know all the potential for adding additional shortcuts from the control centre into the actual settings menu but surely you need to give the engineers time to implement all of these things. The announcement was only last week and they have to mass produce millions of units and get them out to market by 25th. They can't just develop these things months in advance because they know the code within the iOS betas will get scrutinised and that new 3D touch features will be leaked (even more than they already are).
Battery technology won't properly be sorted until there is a move away from lithium batteries. In five years, I think the mobile technology paradigm will change again because there will a convergence of ubiquitous 5G with perpetually powered batteries. Battery size will no longer be an issue, so the size and weight of units can go down with the performance and power also benefitting.
Oh, and Samsung or any other tech company (including Apple Watch) do not have wireless charging for their mobile devices. The wire is into the charging station and they have inductive charging. It would be wireless when there is no wire necessary to power the device. Think of a 1980s solar powered calculator if you like. The technology at the moment is pseudo-wireless at best.
16GB is still fine to most people. That's it. Apple doesn't need to give to charity, which is basically what the whiners whine about. Jobs said people should buy less stuff, but of higher quality. If people really want the higher quality, they'll have to skimp on something else, maybe one less latte per week, and get the Iphone.
What does storage space have to do with quality? You're getting the exact same phone, with the same materials, same camera, SOC, screen, OS etc. you're just getting less storage. This isn't about quality this is about Apple getting people to spend $100 more, or thinking someone who spends $649 on a phone is somehow cheap. :rolleyes:
People want a magic battery and seemingly magic glass!!, they want the battery life, all the features, but not a significantlly heavier, bigger phones. 2mm thicker would make the phone, especially the larger one, unwieldy, people would complain about that for sure.
People are simply using their phones more and more and more and battery tech is not following; eventually we can hope it will.
You make a good point -- we want everything, and it is always going to be a balancing act. However, the number one complaint about iPhones in general is battery life, so I think making the iPhone 6s 1 mm thicker would be better balanced to what people want and use.
Everyone is crying about storage when there are choices on which capacity to buy. Or, is it that you feel entitled to more storage for the same amount of money? Perhaps you just need to quit whining about the phone you obviously cannot afford.
Everyone is crying about storage when there are choices on which capacity to buy. Or, is it that you feel entitled to more storage for the same amount of money? Perhaps you just need to stick with your Obama phone, and quit whining about the phone you obviously cannot afford.
I will just say this on the storage. If they upped it to 32GB, that's a lot more apps, iAds, and purchasable media people can buy and use on their iPhone out of that gate. Someone who maxs out their size 6 months from now will just manage down, not buy a new phone until the next cycle. Looks like a solid amount of revenue left on the table to me...
It is not a 'standard', it is an entry level. I suspect many people, especially young non-techie, just need four or five apps, Phone, Messages, Facebook, or what ever is socially 'in' at the moment, iTunes, and the Camera app, and since most photos will be selfies, they aren't as large and probably get deleted from the phone on a regular basis. 16GB can work just fine for a lot of people.
It is not a 'standard', it is an entry level. I suspect many people, especially young non-techie, just need four or five apps, Phone, Messages, Facebook, or what ever is socially 'in' at the moment, iTunes, and the Camera app, and since most photos will be selfies, they aren't as large and probably get deleted from the phone on a regular basis. 16GB can work just fine for a lot of people.
Yes and yes.
Just not the kind of people who read articles like this. So we inevitably hear about it, incessantly.
Comments
I just want to point out with all this furor about 16GB minimum devices that Apple has consistently sold 8GB models at the $0 subsidized mark. I have several friends who own them (early 20's) who just make do with what they have. Their music and photos are in the cloud, they know they can only install around 100 apps, and it does everything just fine for them. They're just glad they didn't have to pay any money for it.
Moral of the story: just because a device doesn't hit your wants/needs doesn't mean it's not great for a wide range of other people.
To point out another likely issue here, Apple uses a ridiculous amount of the world's flash memory supply, and doubling the amount of memory in their base model would result in significantly more constrained supply. They've had issues in the past getting enough memory for phones/tablets and I wouldn't be surprised if this factored significantly into their decision not to increase the amount in the base model.
Yeah, that's so overly optimistic I don't even know where to begin. 25 apps might be more accurate. The 8GB iPhones have less than 5GB free once iOS crams itself inside.
No, Rogi, it's not a "money grab". No one's holding a gun to anyone's head, forcing them to buy the 16gb model.
I'm seeing two factions here, egged on by the media:
Entitled folk who resent the price of admission into Apple products (been like that since... well... the inception of the company). It's not Apple's job to make you fiscally comfortable.
Then there are whiners who can't seem to take personal responsibility for their poor purchase decisions. Much easier to devise a scapegoat.
Everyone in my immediate family (except myself) bought 16gb models. No one gripes about storage space, ever. Some, for years, even.
Do you really not understand this? The majority of the people that buy the 16 GB model DON'T EVEN KNOW HOW MUCH STORAGE IT HAS.
Do you have no concept of the consumer market at all? A fraction of buyers even know or give a shit at all about that. All they see is "$199, $299, $399. I'll take the $199."
Why on earth would Apple give up a $2-3/device margin when they don't need to? This decision of theirs has absolutely positively 100% zero effect on sales volume, and means probably half a billion in revenue.
Are you really going to get your panties in a bunch over an online forum? Wah wah wah.
Overall, this is an incredible phone. They managed to almost double the speed again, and the 3D touch seems like it's going to be a big boost to the way we use the phone. TouchID is very useful, and now it's faster to use touch id than it is to manually unlock the phone. Better cameras are also very important because it's the only way most people take pictures. Finally, we're getting 2 gigs of RAM, and that will increase free space by about three times (because the system and background tasks take around half a gig by themselves).
I do agree with the battery and storage complaints, although the storage doesn't affect me because I just get the larger size. However, I have plenty of friends and relatives who run into trouble because all their pictures and videos can eat space fast. The battery is a bigger issue, especially because the phone is so good that people spend more and more time using it. I think it's by a huge margin the biggest shortcoming of the iPhone, but that's because the hardware is almost perfect in every other way.
People want a magic battery and seemingly magic glass!!, they want the battery life, all the features, but not a significantlly heavier, bigger phones. 2mm thicker would make the phone, especially the larger one, unwieldy, people would complain about that for sure.
People are simply using their phones more and more and more and battery tech is not following; eventually we can hope it will.
I'm astounded that people complain about the screen when they're using the best thing out there and they're phone are now probably big butt proof too... (AL 7000).
These phones are almost tank like and people still complain about durability; what the hell do they do with those phones. BTW, I'm still using a 3GS and the screen has no cracks or major scratches.
Then they are in for a nasty surprise then, aren't they? Which in large part is the point. 16Gb is no longer sufficient for even minimal use and should no longer be the starting point. 32 GB is the starting point for the Samsung S6 and the same should be the case for the iPhone 6S. It would be fine if the storage was expandable via micro SD card.
"16Gb is no longer sufficient for even minimal use" Then that model won't sell (it's easily returned). Market forces will have ruled and all will be in balance.
Unless YOUR decree doesn't actually match the real world. And it wouldn't be the first time one person's opinion didn't dictate to the world or market.
Yeah, that's so overly optimistic I don't even know where to begin. 25 apps might be more accurate. The 8GB iPhones have less than 5GB free once iOS crams itself inside.
That wasn't an estimate; that was an actual limit stated to me by several friends. At 4GB free, you can install 100 40MB apps, and the majority of apps they (and I) install are around 4-11MB. It really is fine for normal use. I personally have a 64GB phone, but I also have my 29GB music library permanently on it. Without that I could easily fit in a 16GB phone with room to spare.
Are you really going to get your panties in a bunch over an online forum? Wah wah wah.
I think you've got that bass ackwards.
So explain why Apple felt 32GB wasn't enough and decided to replace it with 64GB? I'm sure there were plenty of 32GB device owners that didn't have storage issues and were perfectly happy with their device.
Why is 16 > 64 good but 16 > 32 or 32 > 64 bad? Of course these are all rhetorical questions on my part. I know why. I'm just baffled as to why others don't get it.
I would add, many people just use the cloud for storage or have little music, pictures etc, 16GB suits their needs just fine.
However, IMO, perception can be reality too--- many people (probably not enough to matter to Apple, thus their decision) understand Apple is also the most profitable company in the world and understand it would not hurt Apple at all to spend the extra 50 cents or what ever for that extra memory. And if they did that, it would create 'longer lasting, potentially better functioning phone experience'(how are those 8GB phones doing?). They may also worry moves like may give the perception that Apple is just another low down, money grubbing SOB corporation (well they are but... shhh). I'm obviously no CEO, but I have read/heard that at times, business decisions are based on creating good perception (marketing, reality distortion fields etc)--- and not always the cold, harsh accounting of the dollars and cents of the moment.
Where is Taylor Swift? (case in point)
16GB is still fine to most people. That's it. Apple doesn't need to give to charity, which is basically what the whiners whine about. Jobs said people should buy less stuff, but of higher quality. If people really want the higher quality, they'll have to skimp on something else, maybe one less latte per week, and get the Iphone.
I also love the way Joanna from the Wall Street Journal is moaning about the battery. Sure, it's the same performance as the last phone but Apple has said so themselves within their own product specifications. She mentions it cruises through Facebook swiftly... I'll bet she's using the app which is the biggest culprit for using copious amounts of battery life. Frankly, I'm surprised Apple let Facebook get away with releasing such a resource intensive app.
Sure, Apple know all the potential for adding additional shortcuts from the control centre into the actual settings menu but surely you need to give the engineers time to implement all of these things. The announcement was only last week and they have to mass produce millions of units and get them out to market by 25th. They can't just develop these things months in advance because they know the code within the iOS betas will get scrutinised and that new 3D touch features will be leaked (even more than they already are).
Battery technology won't properly be sorted until there is a move away from lithium batteries. In five years, I think the mobile technology paradigm will change again because there will a convergence of ubiquitous 5G with perpetually powered batteries. Battery size will no longer be an issue, so the size and weight of units can go down with the performance and power also benefitting.
Oh, and Samsung or any other tech company (including Apple Watch) do not have wireless charging for their mobile devices. The wire is into the charging station and they have inductive charging. It would be wireless when there is no wire necessary to power the device. Think of a 1980s solar powered calculator if you like. The technology at the moment is pseudo-wireless at best.
What does storage space have to do with quality? You're getting the exact same phone, with the same materials, same camera, SOC, screen, OS etc. you're just getting less storage. This isn't about quality this is about Apple getting people to spend $100 more, or thinking someone who spends $649 on a phone is somehow cheap. :rolleyes:
They can have magic glass.
People want a magic battery and seemingly magic glass!!, they want the battery life, all the features, but not a significantlly heavier, bigger phones. 2mm thicker would make the phone, especially the larger one, unwieldy, people would complain about that for sure.
People are simply using their phones more and more and more and battery tech is not following; eventually we can hope it will.
You make a good point -- we want everything, and it is always going to be a balancing act. However, the number one complaint about iPhones in general is battery life, so I think making the iPhone 6s 1 mm thicker would be better balanced to what people want and use.
Everyone is crying about storage when there are choices on which capacity to buy. Or, is it that you feel entitled to more storage for the same amount of money? Perhaps you just need to stick with your Obama phone, and quit whining about the phone you obviously cannot afford.
I will just say this on the storage. If they upped it to 32GB, that's a lot more apps, iAds, and purchasable media people can buy and use on their iPhone out of that gate. Someone who maxs out their size 6 months from now will just manage down, not buy a new phone until the next cycle. Looks like a solid amount of revenue left on the table to me...
16 GB as standard is ridiculous.
It is not a 'standard', it is an entry level. I suspect many people, especially young non-techie, just need four or five apps, Phone, Messages, Facebook, or what ever is socially 'in' at the moment, iTunes, and the Camera app, and since most photos will be selfies, they aren't as large and probably get deleted from the phone on a regular basis. 16GB can work just fine for a lot of people.
It is not a 'standard', it is an entry level. I suspect many people, especially young non-techie, just need four or five apps, Phone, Messages, Facebook, or what ever is socially 'in' at the moment, iTunes, and the Camera app, and since most photos will be selfies, they aren't as large and probably get deleted from the phone on a regular basis. 16GB can work just fine for a lot of people.
Yes and yes.
Just not the kind of people who read articles like this. So we inevitably hear about it, incessantly.