Jobs wasn't a Muslim. Banksy is off the reservation. Also, he is far more likely to be killed by a radical Islamist in the UK, versus in America. Guess those beheadings and bus bombings there mean nothing to him as long as he can make a smarmy visual joke.
What does that have to do with religion? Not all Syrians are muslim and Jobs' parent may have been so that image nails the point perfectly.
I love Banksy's work but feel like he's becoming a caricature of himself. Where maybe once his goal was to say something meaningful, it feels more and more like his goal is to stay relevant. But I still feel like his work is smart and provocative, though.
I think people who are analyzing this piece in a religious light are missing the point. This is typical Banksy....thrusting commercialism and excess into the relevant topic of the day.
Can you imagine how many people around the world would be without a job if that idiot Trump had his way?
No, because that’s a ludicrously irrelevant statement.
How many times has he declared bankruptcy?
Learn what bankruptcy is, please.
sdw2001 said: Iraq and refugees: Yes, if we hadn't invaded, those refugees may never have needed to flee. Of course, if the British hadn't divided up the area a hundred years ago, maybe neither Iraq war would been necessary.
You missed one. If decolonization had never happened, the middle east would be a far more stable place.
What can be said against this, Soli, when every interpretation of said religion–both written and performed–fits the legal definition of terrorism?
…insane radicals that claim they are Christian, yet you aren’t calling for all no Christians…
There is an easy response to this. Simply ask whether the prophet Muhammad was a Muslim and whether he led an exemplary life. As he spent most of his as a roving warlord, if his life was a good example, then IS is living the example much more than any westernized kebab. If this doesn’t work, ask whether the person with whom you are conversing agrees that beliefs affect behavior. For example, one if one believes that homosexuality, apostasy, and blasphemy are crimes that should be punished by death, do you think that makes the person holding that view more or less likely to commit violence against a blasphemer or homosexual?
Ask what counts as Islam and “Islamic”. If the words spoken by Muhammad and the life he lead don’t count as Islamic, call bullshit. Do the things Jesus said count as Christianity? Of course.
Give a counter example. If a Quaker or Buddhist or Hare Krishna goes on a killing spree and says he is doing it in the name of Krishna, are there any parts of the Bhagavad Gita that support him? Did the Buddha ever encourage murder? No. So you could very easily say that the attack was un-Buddhist or un-Krishna.
Give examples of systemic Islamic violence. Saudi Arabia has public stoning as a (rare, but) legal form of execution. Homosexuals, adulteresses, blasphemers, and apostates are regularly executed. Is that un-Islamic? Seriously, is Saudi Arabia un-Islamic? That would be like suggesting that Vatican City isn’t Catholic.
This all boils down to people thinking that religious beliefs are all the same, which is utter bullshit. Some religious teach peace and have long histories thereof (Buddhism, Jainism, Hare Krishna-ism, Quakerism, etc.); others teach violence and have histories of violence–Islam being the chief proponent.
…the most statistically probable danger facing the average US citizen in terms of religious extremism.
They don't represent Islam. It's about time you came around.
Oh come on, Soli. You know better. You have to know better. This post was already pretty long, so if you want straight up Quranic proof on this, let me know.
Can you imagine how many people around the world would be without a job if that idiot Trump had his way?
No, because that’s a ludicrously irrelevant statement.
How many times has he declared bankruptcy?
Learn what bankruptcy is, please.
sdw2001 said: Iraq and refugees: Yes, if we hadn't invaded, those refugees may never have needed to flee. Of course, if the British hadn't divided up the area a hundred years ago, maybe neither Iraq war would been necessary.
You missed one. If decolonization had never happened, the middle east would be a far more stable place.
What can be said against this, Soli, when every interpretation of said religion–both written and performed–fits the legal definition of terrorism?
…insane radicals that claim they are Christian, yet you aren’t calling for all no Christians…
There is an easy response to this. Simply ask whether the prophet Muhammad was a Muslim and whether he led an exemplary life. As he spent most of his as a roving warlord, if his life was a good example, then IS is living the example much more than any westernized kebab. If this doesn’t work, ask whether the person with whom you are conversing agrees that beliefs affect behavior. For example, one if one believes that homosexuality, apostasy, and blasphemy are crimes that should be punished by death, do you think that makes the person holding that view more or less likely to commit violence against a blasphemer or homosexual?
Ask what counts as Islam and “Islamic”. If the words spoken by Muhammad and the life he lead don’t count as Islamic, call bullshit. Do the things Jesus said count as Christianity? Of course.
Give a counter example. If a Quaker or Buddhist or Hare Krishna goes on a killing spree and says he is doing it in the name of Krishna, are there any parts of the Bhagavad Gita that support him? Did the Buddha ever encourage murder? No. So you could very easily say that the attack was un-Buddhist or un-Krishna.
Give examples of systemic Islamic violence. Saudi Arabia has public stoning as a (rare, but) legal form of execution. Homosexuals, adulteresses, blasphemers, and apostates are regularly executed. Is that un-Islamic? Seriously, is Saudi Arabia un-Islamic? That would be like suggesting that Vatican City isn’t Catholic.
This all boils down to people thinking that religious beliefs are all the same, which is utter bullshit. Some religious teach peace and have long histories thereof (Buddhism, Jainism, Hare Krishna-ism, Quakerism, etc.); others teach violence and have histories of violence–Islam being the chief proponent.
…the most statistically probable danger facing the average US citizen in terms of religious extremism.
They don't represent Islam. It's about time you came around.
Oh come on, Soli. You know better. You have to know better. This post was already pretty long, so if you want straight up Quranic proof on this, let me know.
Jobs wasn't a Muslim. Banksy is off the reservation.
In what way? A large percentage of vocal, bigoted Americans don't want to let any Syrian refugees in the country for fear that one could be a terrorist.
Furthmore, Jobs not being Muslim makes his point and of those that aren't acting like pussies when it comes to helping those in need, because the offspring of immigrants are very likely to adapt to the American culture.
Right, because it's the bigoted American public again. It has nothing to do with the fact that ISIS has publicly talked about infiltrating the program. Or that we can't even vet people who live here under the deferred action immigration plan. Or that allowing 10,000 refugees in with a 99.9% success rate means we've let in 10 jihadists.
So because someone talked about something you're willing to let yourself be frightened by words not backed up by actions? If I say I'm going to infiltrate your mom, you probably wouldn't like it, but you also wouldn't take it as a serious threat. Let's remember that France opened up their borders and yet the only terrorist that appeared to be a Syrian refugee had a faked passport.
I thought America was the Land of the Free, Home of the Brave. You and so many others certainly aren't acting like it. If you cower in fear because of an empty threat, you're letting them win. If you run away from people in need, you're letting them win. ISIL are Muslims about as much as Caucasian, male terrorists that shoot up Black churches and planned parenthood are Christians… meaning not at all.
I'd much rather "open carry" was commonplace in America and Americans took their self-protection seriously, rather than cede their freedoms to police, the military or politicians. If there are more so-called "soft target" attacks, I believe open carry will be demanded by more people and it will probably cement a Trump victory. At least more people owning weapons and learning how to protect themselves and their families would be a net plus.
Except there are literal mountains of evidence that "open carry" doesn't actually help save anyone from being gunned down and generally makes everything a lot LESS safe.
The idea that "good guys with guns" will help stop all the violence is absolutely FALSE in every way. Every study on the matter has come to the exact same conclusion. Only a moron who doesn't give a rats behind about actual facts would argue for "open carry."
Open carry == Anarchy. You know, like the "old west?" Heard of it?
I love Banksy's work but feel like he's becoming a caricature of himself. Where maybe once his goal was to say something meaningful, it feels more and more like his goal is to stay relevant. But I still feel like his work is smart and provocative, though.
I think people who are analyzing this piece in a religious light are missing the point. This is typical Banksy....thrusting commercialism and excess into the relevant topic of the day.
Except if you say something "meaningful" with art, then you *are* relevant. And if you say something relevant, then of course it has great meaning. There is no real dichotomy between relevancy and meaning.
Banksy is one of the best artists of the day and one of the only important ones.
I don't think Banksy is saying anything about Muslim here, or that Steve Jobs is a muslim. I actually think there are Syrian Christians as well, but many have been already driven from the country.
What's being said here I think, is that while we argue about the value of these lives. Whether we should open our doors to them, we need to remember that you never know which of these people could end up changing our world.
In the case of Steve Jobs, I believe he was the son of a Syrian immigrant, who fled the tyranny of Assad. He made his way to the U.S., and while he put his son up for adoption, nobody could have ever known that the son of that immigrant would found apple.
This is not a statement of what is, but a statement of what could be.
What on earth are you talking about? Assad is only 10 years older than Jobs. He was not in power in the 1950's. Steve Jobs biological father didn't flee anything. Assad was 10 years old when Jobs was born.
Try using Google sometime - Assad's father - also known as Assad - another piece of work i.e. totally brutal dictator, first destroyer of Homs, assuredly the fruit did not fall far from the tree.
The 52 school shootings in America this year were at the hands of Christians. The vast majority of the many thousands of killers in US society every year are Christian. The over a million innocents who were killed in the Middle East since 9/11 are a result of Christian government involvement. Christians kill, Muslims kill. Religion is not the issue. People born of both of these religions kill people. And both holy books of these religions are against it. The issues are control, hate and fear. The good news is the majority of the human race isn't for killing. If the US and the U.K. hadn't blown Iraq to pieces and given weapons to the Syrian opposition which ISIL came from and abandoned all their tanks we wouldn't have refugees flooding the boarders and we wouldn't have ISIL as we do today.
Sorry for the formatting...apparently the new forums suck on Chrome.
It is misleading to suggest 52 shootings were done by "Christians," because Christianity (or a version of it) did not have anything to do with their motivation. Even when a Christian commits a crime supposedly in the name of the faith, it's a far cry from an entire radicalized segment of a major religion, one which seeks to destroy a way of life.
Christians do kill. Muslims do kill. But only one is prone interpretation that creates the aforementioned extremism. As for holy books, that's incorrect. It is much easier to interpret Islam's book to justify violence. It specifically calls for violence in places. Do we really even need to argue that point?
Iraq and refugees: Yes, if we hadn't invaded, those refugees may never have needed to flee. Of course, if the British hadn't divided up the area a hundred years ago, maybe neither Iraq war would been necessary. Maybe Sadam Hussien would have been an employee at Iraqi Wal-Mart. Mayybe he wouldn't have gassed his own people. The point is that going back and saying "we shouldn't have invaded" is pointless. We did. What matters is very recent history and the way forward. By abandoning Iraq in order to fulfill a political promise, Obama helped create ISIS. By stating "Assad must go" and drawing a red line on chemical weapons that he later refused to enforce, he helped create the refugee crisis.
You have the same view he does...that America is responsible for Islamic terror and extremism--that if we just kept our nose out of things, they'd leave us alone. This, especially as evidenced by recent events, is delusional. But, I guess that's why 30% of the country or more still supports this fantastic disaster of a President. I wonder how many more people will have to die at the hands of terrorists before they realize Obama has made the world infinitely more dangerous. Hell, even you anti-gun nuts should be upset. He's responsible for people buying tens of millions more guns than when he took office.
You, Sir, are dancing on the head of a pin. That is, making numerous claims that are your opinion as if fact. And Oh, by the way, as far as the Bible stacking up against the Koran, check this out:
In the case of Steve Jobs, I believe he was the son of a Syrian immigrant, who fled the tyranny of Assad. He made his way to the U.S., and while he put his son up for adoption, nobody could have ever known that the son of that immigrant would found apple.
I agree with the spirit of your comment, but Assad wasn't in power back then. His biological father left Syria to pursue a PHD, I think.
As I noted to another commentator who made much the same remarks - Google Assad and see who his father was. Assad Jr. obviously learned his dictatorial trade from a Master.
Jobs wasn't a Muslim. Banksy is off the reservation.
In what way? A large percentage of vocal, bigoted Americans don't want to let any Syrian refugees in the country for fear that one could be a terrorist.
Furthmore, Jobs not being Muslim makes his point and of those that aren't acting like pussies when it comes to helping those in need, because the offspring of immigrants are very likely to adapt to the American culture.
So when are you opening up your house to them?
I know and have known Muslims and none of them were radicals. I personally don't advocate for any religion, but people are free to believe whatever they like as long as they don't harm others.
It's the last part that many arabs don't seem to be dealing with very well...
I'm sure you've spent a lot of time in Arab countries, know lots of Arabs, so you know your statement is "true" - no?
So you have absolutely no argument, reply, or rebuttal, then. Why not just not reply and save people the insanely long quote?
The video is a perfect example of the most common slander/libel of Christianity, borne of malice and willful desire to misrepresent the contents of the book. It's not a matter of innocent misunderstanding–not this much incorrectness. This is an organized attack.
I also love how they randomly cut together verses, too. If you want to make your own religion, go make your own religion, but don't call it Christianity. If you want to be a Christian, you leave the book as it is. The book even says that.
Oh… three lines? Is that it? Did they really just take three lines from the Bible and then spend the rest of the video getting people's reactions? I shouldn't be surprised, though. The standard behavior these days when reporting on any given world event is to get interviews from people who have absolutely no comprehension of what the event actually was, or who weren't even there. How the event made them feel is now more important than the who, what, when, where, and why–you know, the actual CONTENTS thereof.
I expected better from Soli than just a thumbs up to it, too, but I'll give HIM the benefit of the doubt and assume that he was strapped for time in being able to write a proper reply.
So you have absolutely no argument, reply, or rebuttal, then. Why not just not reply and save people the insanely long quote?
If he had no rebuttal or argument you would then haven't gotten so defensive when shown hypocrisy and Islamaphobia from Christians.
The video is a perfect example of the most common slander/libel of Christianity, borne of malice and willful desire to misrepresent the contents of the book. It's not a matter of innocent misunderstanding–not this much incorrectness. This is an organized attack.
The only thing false was their implication that such horrible words came from the Qu'ran, when in fact it came from the Christian Bible.
I also love how they randomly cut together verses, too.
Nothing was random and nothing was cut. They stated full verses, and often multiple verses. If you have some interpretation that puts the words into a context that isn't horrifically violent then go right ahead and create a viable rebuttal to @nasserae's succinct argument that Christianity isn't the rosey, peaceful religion you want it to be.
If you want to make your own religion, go make your own religion, but don't call it Christianity. If you want to be a Christian, you leave the book as it is. The book even says that.
Oh… three lines? Is that it? Did they really just take three lines from the Bible and then spend the rest of the video getting people's reactions?
Leave the book as it is means prescribing to the many verses they read—not just three lines—as well as innumerable other passages from The Good Book that tell you to commit atrocities in the name of God, not to mention all the contradictions it has; which, despite your lack of knowledge of scripture, does fit in well with the Bible since you're making hypocritical claims, judging others, calling for violence, and in no way loving thy neighbor.
I shouldn't be surprised, though. The standard behavior these days when reporting on any given world event is to get interviews from people who have absolutely no comprehension of what the event actually was, or who weren't even there. How the event made them feel is now more important than the who, what, when, where, and why–you know, the actual CONTENTS thereof.
Exactly! He was demonstrating that people like you are by and large ignorant of the very book you hold on high. I bet you don't even know that Muslims believe in Jesus or that the Qu'ran states one should make no distinction between follower of the other Abrahamic religions since all three believe in the same God, that Allah is the Arabic word for God not a different god, that Muslim simply means 'follower of Islam', and that Islam means 'one who submits to God.'
Stop watching sensationalist news and start actually learning about others.
PS: Do you honestly believe that Malala Yousafzai that wants to kill you and doesn't want women to have equal rights? I'm guessing you don't, so why do you think she is a devote Muslim if the religion speaks only of violence and hate?
Jobs wasn't a Muslim. Banksy is off the reservation.
In what way? A large percentage of vocal, bigoted Americans don't want to let any Syrian refugees in the country for fear that one could be a terrorist.
Furthmore, Jobs not being Muslim makes his point and of those that aren't acting like pussies when it comes to helping those in need, because the offspring of immigrants are very likely to adapt to the American culture.
Right, because it's the bigoted American public again. It has nothing to do with the fact that ISIS has publicly talked about infiltrating the program. Or that we can't even vet people who live here under the deferred action immigration plan. Or that allowing 10,000 refugees in with a 99.9% success rate means we've let in 10 jihadists.
So because someone talked about something you're willing to let yourself be frightened by words not backed up by actions? If I say I'm going to infiltrate your mom, you probably wouldn't like it, but you also wouldn't take it as a serious threat. Let's remember that France opened up their borders and yet the only terrorist that appeared to be a Syrian refugee had a faked passport.
I thought America was the Land of the Free, Home of the Brave. You and so many others certainly aren't acting like it. If you cower in fear because of an empty threat, you're letting them win. If you run away from people in need, you're letting them win. ISIL are Muslims about as much as Caucasian, male terrorists that shoot up Black churches and planned parenthood are Christians… meaning not at all.
I'd much rather "open carry" was commonplace in America and Americans took their self-protection seriously, rather than cede their freedoms to police, the military or politicians. If there are more so-called "soft target" attacks, I believe open carry will be demanded by more people and it will probably cement a Trump victory. At least more people owning weapons and learning how to protect themselves and their families would be a net plus.
Except there are literal mountains of evidence that "open carry" doesn't actually help save anyone from being gunned down and generally makes everything a lot LESS safe.
The idea that "good guys with guns" will help stop all the violence is absolutely FALSE in every way. Every study on the matter has come to the exact same conclusion. Only a moron who doesn't give a rats behind about actual facts would argue for "open carry."
Open carry == Anarchy. You know, like the "old west?" Heard of it?
So you have absolutely no argument, reply, or rebuttal, then. Why not just not reply and save people the insanely long quote?
You are trying too hard and you think I really care what you think. I really don't. You clearly had no intention of finding facts. All you are doing is trying to find one sided information to support your opinion about this subject. I told you this before and I will tell you this again. If you are serious about finding answers to these questions you should go to your local mosque. They will be happy to sit with you and answer your questions all day long. But I know you won't because you are not interested in facts.
The video is a perfect example of the most common slander/libel of Christianity, borne of malice and willful desire to misrepresent the contents of the book. It's not a matter of innocent misunderstanding–not this much incorrectness. This is an organized attack.
I also love how they randomly cut together verses, too. If you want to make your own religion, go make your own religion, but don't call it Christianity. If you want to be a Christian, you leave the book as it is. The book even says that.
You are guilty of the same thing when it comes to Islam and The Quran. Beside, that first video clearly shows a Christian Pastor calling for the killing of American citizens the Bible way. It is not cut together verses and it was apparently endorsed by three GOP presidential candidates.
Oh… three lines? Is that it? Did they really just take three lines from the Bible and then spend the rest of the video getting people's reactions? I shouldn't be surprised, though. The standard behavior these days when reporting on any given world event is to get interviews from people who have absolutely no comprehension of what the event actually was, or who weren't even there. How the event made them feel is now more important than the who, what, when, where, and why–you know, the actual CONTENTS thereof.
Again you are guilty of the same thing. There are more than 6,200 verses in the Quran and you decided to take handful out of context and decided that this represent the whole religion and followers. When you are shown the same verses in the Bible you declared it is "organized attack" & "randomly cut together verses". This is the definition of hypocrisy.
If you want to be a Christian, you leave the book as it is. The book even says that.
Again you are guilty of the same thing. There are more than 6,200 verses in the Quran and you decided to take handful out of context and decided that this represent the whole religion and followers. When you are shown the same verses in the Bible you declared it is "organized attack" & "randomly cut together verses". This is the definition of hypocrisy.
You show me any follower of an Abrahamic religion that says they follow all the scripture verbatim, and I'll show you a liar, a hypocrite, and a radical nut job.
If he had no rebuttal or argument you would then haven't gotten so defensive when shown hypocrisy and Islamaphobia from Christians.
There was no hypocrisy.
The only thing false was their implication that such horrible words came from the Qu'ran, when in fact it came from the Christian Bible.
Uh, no, the video completely ignored what Christian doctrine is and explicitly rewrote what the Bible said to make its point.
…nothing was cut.
Please, Soli, just read the book. You can even just look up the verses from the video, for heaven's sake.
They stated full verses, and often multiple verses.
They cut verses apart and pasted them together. They ignored Christianity itself and claimed pre-Christian hebrew doctrine was Christian doctrine. It's not even remotely accurate.
…innumerable other passages from The Good Book that tell you to commit atrocities in the name of God…
Show one. Remember: the Old Testament is not Christian doctrine.
…contradictions…
Check out the King James sometime.
…your lack of knowledge of scripture…
And your right to dictate what I do and do not know comes from where?
Exactly! He was demonstrating that people like you are by and large ignorant of the very book you hold on high.
Which you say, apparently knowing nothing whatsoever about the book in question.
…since all three believe in the same God…
Thanks for proving you don't know anything about any of the three religions.
Stop watching sensationalist news and start actually learning about others.
Says a person who hasn't read the Quran, Talmud, or Bible…
PS: Do you honestly believe that Malala Yousafzai that wants to kill you and doesn't want women to have equal rights? I'm guessing you don't, so why do you think she is a devote Muslim if the religion speaks only of violence and hate?
You're normally so cognizant of logical contradictions, so why are you incapable of seeing this one? If she doesn't want to kill me and does want women to have equal rights, she is not a mussulman. She does not follow the tenants of Islam, and so is not a member of the group. It doesn't matter if she says she is. I can say I'm French, but if I don't have the citizenship, it means nothing. Or maybe you're a supporter of transFrench rights?
…you think I really care what you think. I really don't.
So don't reply. You look like an idiot now, since you don't even listen to your own beliefs!
You clearly had no intention of finding facts.
Prove it.
All you are doing is trying to find one sided information to support your opinion about this subject.
Says the person who posted a video in which the Bible was edited to suit a false narrative.
If you are serious about finding answers to these questions you should go to your local mosque. They will be happy to sit with you and answer your questions all day long.
TAQIYYA. I've read the Quran, thanks. Try it sometime.
You are guilty of the same thing when it comes to Islam and The Quran.
Nah, sorry. This is a matter of the definition of ideological belief. Followers of Islam are explicitly called to peace when their numbers are small, political activism when their numbers grow, and genocide when they have the majority. This is all outlined in the Quran, and this is how all mussulmen have behaved for centuries.
There are more than 6,200 verses in the Quran and you decided to take handful out of context and decided that this represent the whole religion and followers.
1. I don't recall posting any verses of the Quran yet. 2. When I do post my proof of what the Quran says, it will not only be fully in context, it will be backed with both centuries of history and a wide array of modern proof of belief.
But then again, you don't care about anything but what you think. You even admitted that.
When you are shown the same verses in the Bible…
Christian doctrine does not proscribe genocide. Try again. Christian doctrine does not allow lying to get your way. Try again.
I don't think you've ever read a single religious book based on anything you've written here. If you had you wouldn't have implied that Christianity isn't bound to the Old Testament. You just went on record claiming that Christians don't believe in Adam and Eve, David and Goliath, Noah and flood, Moses, Solomon, etc. Those aren't in the New Testament.
Here's a quick lesson for you:
– Judaism follows the Torah. – Christians follows the Old and New Testament, which includes the books of the Torah as they are part of the Old Testament. – Islam follows the Torah (given to Moses), Psalms (given to David), the Gospel (given to Jesus), and the Scrolls of Abraham (can you guess who God gave this to?).
Here's a list of people found in both the Bible and the Qu'ran:
Aaron
Abel
Abraham
Adam
Cain
David
The 12 Apostles of Jesus
Elias
Elisha
Enoch
Eve
Ezra
Goliath
Isaac
Ishmael
Jacob
Jesus
John the Baptist
Jonah
Joseph
Lot
Mary
Moses
Noah
Samuel
Saul
Solomon
Zacharias
PS: I understand that you're afraid, but that's exactly what ISIS wants you to be. They want you to become like them by attacking Muslims, like they are doing in Syria, and eschew your values until you're just like them. Do you really think all those that are leaving Syria are non-Muslims or ISIS in disguise? If you do, then I feel even worse for you then I already do. You can make a choice to stop helping ISIS in their plans or you continue to believe that all Muslims are terrorists. Regardless of your choice, I forgive you.
Jobs wasn't a Muslim. Banksy is off the reservation. Also, he is far more likely to be killed by a radical Islamist in the UK, versus in America. Guess those beheadings and bus bombings there mean nothing to him as long as he can make a smarmy visual joke.
Actually thats is not true, America is by far the biggest target. You forgetting about 11/9? Boston pressure cooker bombings?, cartoon shooting or the shooting last week? And by numbers far more people have been killed by Muslims in the States.
Soli said: I don't think you've ever read a single religious book based on anything you've written here.
Whatever you say.
…Christianity isn't bound to the Old Testament.
Matthew 5:17: Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
You just went on record claiming that Christians don't believe in Adam and Eve, David and Goliath, Noah and flood, Moses, Solomon, etc.
Nope. I said absolutely no such thing. The Old Testament is a historical record, putting Christianity, its beliefs, and its source in context. It is not the source of doctrine.
– Judaism follows the Torah.
Talmud first, then the Torah.
Islam follows the Torah (given to Moses), Psalms (given to David), the Gospel (given to Jesus), and the Scrolls of Abraham (can you guess who God gave this to?).
Well, you know, the Quran. And no, not the Gospel, of course.
Here's a list of people found in both the Bible and the Qu'ran:
And? So? This is somehow evidence that the same god commands all three? The belief systems are fundamentally disparate.
PS: I understand that you're afraid
Come off it. Never thought I'd have to say that to you, of all people.
You're basing this garbage on a presupposed delusion of guilt, which causes you to believe that it is not the genocidal maniacs who are at fault for being genocidal maniacs.
“Since our enemies hate us, we must have done something wrong;
perhaps if we are nice to them they won’t hate us so much.”
“If we don’t let them invade our countries, their ideology wins!”
Never mind that this is literally exactly what their ideology wants to happen.
Appeasement always fails because it shows
weakness and breeds contempt. Why? Because the worldview of Islam was born, bred, and has lived its entire existence in conflict. If you project weakness, your neighbors will take advantage of it. Always have. Thus, there is no expectation of generosity or self-sacrifice for others–just for the collective cause.
that's exactly what ISIS wants you to be.
No, they just don't give a shit. They just want everyone who isn’t a mussulman dead, and they’ll follow the Quran to the letter in making that come to pass.
Do you really think all those that are leaving Syria are non-Muslims or ISIS in disguise?
Why would anyone think they don’t follow Islam? How is that even in question? Are you stating that the claim is that they “don’t” follow Islam because they’re “peaceful”?
Well, you know, the Quran. And no, not the Gospel, of course.
What I gave you make up the Qu'ran. And, yes, Muslims believe in Jesus and follow his teachings. They believe is a prophet.
You're basing this garbage on a presupposed delusion of guilt, which causes you to believe that it is not the genocidal maniacs who are at fault for being genocidal maniacs.
I have no guilt. I have no fear. I also have no religion, and neither a belief nor disbelief in God. My mind is clearly far too limited to comprehend something that is able to create the Universe so I don't even attempt such a feat, just like I don't try to guess what you have in your pocket at any one time. I also know that these radicals exist because of what people like you did to their world. They became frightened which grew into these extremists viewpoints.. You are frightened and have now fostered extremists viewpoints. You're perpetuating a cycle and you'll end up destroying yourself and others as a result; but you can end it if you're strong enough.
What I can do is study the teachings put force by other to find which guidelines work best for me. There is just one rule that I live by, the Gold Rule. I have found that Abrahamic religions say a lot of shitty things, but when viewed in the context for the societies in which they were meant, the picture becomes clear, just as your ignorance and fear has come clear by declaring all Muslims terrorists.
PS: Are you even going to address the cruelty in the New Testament or will have an excuse for why that doesn't count, either, when you again try to argue that Christians are inherent good, Muslims bad, and Muslims don't believe in Christ or his teachings?
Comments
I think people who are analyzing this piece in a religious light are missing the point. This is typical Banksy....thrusting commercialism and excess into the relevant topic of the day.
Learn what bankruptcy is, please.
You missed one. If decolonization had never happened, the middle east would be a far more stable place.
What can be said against this, Soli, when every interpretation of said religion–both written and performed–fits the legal definition of terrorism?
There is an easy response to this. Simply ask whether the prophet Muhammad was a Muslim and whether he led an exemplary life. As he spent most of his as a roving warlord, if his life was a good example, then IS is living the example much more than any westernized kebab. If this doesn’t work, ask whether the person with whom you are conversing agrees that beliefs affect behavior. For example, one if one believes that homosexuality, apostasy, and blasphemy are crimes that should be punished by death, do you think that makes the person holding that view more or less likely to commit violence against a blasphemer or homosexual?
Ask what counts as Islam and “Islamic”. If the words spoken by Muhammad and the life he lead don’t count as Islamic, call bullshit. Do the things Jesus said count as Christianity? Of course.
Give a counter example. If a Quaker or Buddhist or Hare Krishna goes on a killing spree and says he is doing it in the name of Krishna, are there any parts of the Bhagavad Gita that support him? Did the Buddha ever encourage murder? No. So you could very easily say that the attack was un-Buddhist or un-Krishna.
Give examples of systemic Islamic violence. Saudi Arabia has public stoning as a (rare, but) legal form of execution. Homosexuals, adulteresses, blasphemers, and apostates are regularly executed. Is that un-Islamic? Seriously, is Saudi Arabia un-Islamic? That would be like suggesting that Vatican City isn’t Catholic.
This all boils down to people thinking that religious beliefs are all the same, which is utter bullshit. Some religious teach peace and have long histories thereof (Buddhism, Jainism, Hare Krishna-ism, Quakerism, etc.); others teach violence and have histories of violence–Islam being the chief proponent.
Except that’s Islam, and has always been.
Soli said:
Oh come on, Soli. You know better. You have to know better. This post was already pretty long, so if you want straight up Quranic proof on this, let me know.
People start reading up on what the religion actually says, discovering that they’re justified?
http://www.advocate.com/media/2015/11/09/watch-rachel-maddow-breaks-down-pastors-kill-gays-rally-attended-gop-candidates
The idea that "good guys with guns" will help stop all the violence is absolutely FALSE in every way. Every study on the matter has come to the exact same conclusion. Only a moron who doesn't give a rats behind about actual facts would argue for "open carry."
Open carry == Anarchy. You know, like the "old west?" Heard of it?
Banksy is one of the best artists of the day and one of the only important ones.
As I noted to another commentator who made much the same remarks - Google Assad and see who his father was. Assad Jr. obviously learned his dictatorial trade from a Master.
The video is a perfect example of the most common slander/libel of Christianity, borne of malice and willful desire to misrepresent the contents of the book. It's not a matter of innocent misunderstanding–not this much incorrectness. This is an organized attack.
I also love how they randomly cut together verses, too. If you want to make your own religion, go make your own religion, but don't call it Christianity. If you want to be a Christian, you leave the book as it is. The book even says that.
Oh… three lines? Is that it? Did they really just take three lines from the Bible and then spend the rest of the video getting people's reactions? I shouldn't be surprised, though. The standard behavior these days when reporting on any given world event is to get interviews from people who have absolutely no comprehension of what the event actually was, or who weren't even there. How the event made them feel is now more important than the who, what, when, where, and why–you know, the actual CONTENTS thereof.
I expected better from Soli than just a thumbs up to it, too, but I'll give HIM the benefit of the doubt and assume that he was strapped for time in being able to write a proper reply.
The only thing false was their implication that such horrible words came from the Qu'ran, when in fact it came from the Christian Bible.Nothing was random and nothing was cut. They stated full verses, and often multiple verses. If you have some interpretation that puts the words into a context that isn't horrifically violent then go right ahead and create a viable rebuttal to @nasserae's succinct argument that Christianity isn't the rosey, peaceful religion you want it to be.
Leave the book as it is means prescribing to the many verses they read—not just three lines—as well as innumerable other passages from The Good Book that tell you to commit atrocities in the name of God, not to mention all the contradictions it has; which, despite your lack of knowledge of scripture, does fit in well with the Bible since you're making hypocritical claims, judging others, calling for violence, and in no way loving thy neighbor.
Exactly! He was demonstrating that people like you are by and large ignorant of the very book you hold on high. I bet you don't even know that Muslims believe in Jesus or that the Qu'ran states one should make no distinction between follower of the other Abrahamic religions since all three believe in the same God, that Allah is the Arabic word for God not a different god, that Muslim simply means 'follower of Islam', and that Islam means 'one who submits to God.'
Stop watching sensationalist news and start actually learning about others.
PS: Do you honestly believe that Malala Yousafzai that wants to kill you and doesn't want women to have equal rights? I'm guessing you don't, so why do you think she is a devote Muslim if the religion speaks only of violence and hate?
These numerous states currently have open carry and they have not descended into complete "anarchy": http://si.wsj.net/public/resources/images/OG-AC384_openca_G_20140822132909.jpg
You are guilty of the same thing when it comes to Islam and The Quran. Beside, that first video clearly shows a Christian Pastor calling for the killing of American citizens the Bible way. It is not cut together verses and it was apparently endorsed by three GOP presidential candidates.
Again you are guilty of the same thing. There are more than 6,200 verses in the Quran and you decided to take handful out of context and decided that this represent the whole religion and followers. When you are shown the same verses in the Bible you declared it is "organized attack" & "randomly cut together verses". This is the definition of hypocrisy.
They cut verses apart and pasted them together. They ignored Christianity itself and claimed pre-Christian hebrew doctrine was Christian doctrine. It's not even remotely accurate.Show one. Remember: the Old Testament is not Christian doctrine.
Check out the King James sometime.
And your right to dictate what I do and do not know comes from where?
Which you say, apparently knowing nothing whatsoever about the book in question.
Thanks for proving you don't know anything about any of the three religions.
Says a person who hasn't read the Quran, Talmud, or Bible…
You're normally so cognizant of logical contradictions, so why are you incapable of seeing this one? If she doesn't want to kill me and does want women to have equal rights, she is not a mussulman. She does not follow the tenants of Islam, and so is not a member of the group. It doesn't matter if she says she is. I can say I'm French, but if I don't have the citizenship, it means nothing. Or maybe you're a supporter of transFrench rights?
You think this is a valid response?
So don't reply. You look like an idiot now, since you don't even listen to your own beliefs!
Prove it.
Says the person who posted a video in which the Bible was edited to suit a false narrative.
TAQIYYA. I've read the Quran, thanks. Try it sometime.
Nah, sorry. This is a matter of the definition of ideological belief. Followers of Islam are explicitly called to peace when their numbers are small, political activism when their numbers grow, and genocide when they have the majority. This is all outlined in the Quran, and this is how all mussulmen have behaved for centuries.
1. I don't recall posting any verses of the Quran yet.
2. When I do post my proof of what the Quran says, it will not only be fully in context, it will be backed with both centuries of history and a wide array of modern proof of belief.
But then again, you don't care about anything but what you think. You even admitted that.
Christian doctrine does not proscribe genocide. Try again.
Christian doctrine does not allow lying to get your way. Try again.
Here's a quick lesson for you:
– Judaism follows the Torah.
– Christians follows the Old and New Testament, which includes the books of the Torah as they are part of the Old Testament.
– Islam follows the Torah (given to Moses), Psalms (given to David), the Gospel (given to Jesus), and the Scrolls of Abraham (can you guess who God gave this to?).
Here's a list of people found in both the Bible and the Qu'ran:
PS: I understand that you're afraid, but that's exactly what ISIS wants you to be. They want you to become like them by attacking Muslims, like they are doing in Syria, and eschew your values until you're just like them. Do you really think all those that are leaving Syria are non-Muslims or ISIS in disguise? If you do, then I feel even worse for you then I already do. You can make a choice to stop helping ISIS in their plans or you continue to believe that all Muslims are terrorists. Regardless of your choice, I forgive you.
Matthew 5:17: Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
Nope. I said absolutely no such thing. The Old Testament is a historical record, putting Christianity, its beliefs, and its source in context. It is not the source of doctrine.
Talmud first, then the Torah.
Well, you know, the Quran. And no, not the Gospel, of course.
And? So? This is somehow evidence that the same god commands all three? The belief systems are fundamentally disparate.
Come off it. Never thought I'd have to say that to you, of all people.
You're basing this garbage on a presupposed delusion of guilt, which causes you to believe that it is not the genocidal maniacs who are at fault for being genocidal maniacs.
“Since our enemies hate us, we must have done something wrong; perhaps if we are nice to them they won’t hate us so much.”
“If we don’t let them invade our countries, their ideology wins!”
Never mind that this is literally exactly what their ideology wants to happen.
Appeasement always fails because it shows weakness and breeds contempt. Why? Because the worldview of Islam was born, bred, and has lived its entire existence in conflict. If you project weakness, your neighbors will take advantage of it. Always have. Thus, there is no expectation of generosity or self-sacrifice for others–just for the collective cause.
No, they just don't give a shit. They just want everyone who isn’t a mussulman dead, and they’ll follow the Quran to the letter in making that come to pass.
Why would anyone think they don’t follow Islam? How is that even in question? Are you stating that the claim is that they “don’t” follow Islam because they’re “peaceful”?
I have no guilt. I have no fear. I also have no religion, and neither a belief nor disbelief in God. My mind is clearly far too limited to comprehend something that is able to create the Universe so I don't even attempt such a feat, just like I don't try to guess what you have in your pocket at any one time. I also know that these radicals exist because of what people like you did to their world. They became frightened which grew into these extremists viewpoints.. You are frightened and have now fostered extremists viewpoints. You're perpetuating a cycle and you'll end up destroying yourself and others as a result; but you can end it if you're strong enough.
What I can do is study the teachings put force by other to find which guidelines work best for me. There is just one rule that I live by, the Gold Rule. I have found that Abrahamic religions say a lot of shitty things, but when viewed in the context for the societies in which they were meant, the picture becomes clear, just as your ignorance and fear has come clear by declaring all Muslims terrorists.
PS: Are you even going to address the cruelty in the New Testament or will have an excuse for why that doesn't count, either, when you again try to argue that Christians are inherent good, Muslims bad, and Muslims don't believe in Christ or his teachings?