Ha, now Jim Cramer says there's 4 companies Apple should buy. No brainers that he can't believe Apple didn't think of: Fitbit, Pandora, Verifone and Harmon Karden.
Slightly lower than expected sales over the next few quarters, of the iPhone 6S is not that surprising. It wasn't a particularily exciting upgrade. The iPhone 7 (even if there isn't that much known about it yet) on the other hand probably will be an exciting device by comparison, and sell in even greater bucketloads! Driving AAPL stock up to record highs again. So...same old, same old until the 7S is released and the downward cycle repeats itself.
Why do you think the 6S wasn't exciting? What's going to be exciting about the 7 that wasn't about the 6S?
I think Cook really does not care that much about the stock price. It does not effect the operation of the company. I am sure he would much prefer it be a private company at this point. It is just one of the annoying outside distractions he has to live with.
Nobody at Apple cares that much about the stock price. They are just trying their best to make great products. The stock price will take care of itself.
Nonsense. They might not care about it like AOL employees did in the 90s but believe me no one at Apple enjoys the constant negativity about the company. It's not good for employee morale either.
Everyone says AAPL <> Apple and that might be true in terms of what the stock does relative to the financials but if there's negative sentiment on AAPL it spills over to Apple. Watch that 60 minutes overtime piece; the interviewer asked Charlie Rose is the stuff under those sheets in Jony's studio really are the next big thing. That's the sentiment on this company and it won't change anytime soon as Apple is staying as secretive as ever. They're not trotting out Amazon-like drones on TV.
Traditionally if past releases are a guide, the change in number is always a major release and not just cosmetically.
Hmmm...I would argue the 5S and 6S were bigger releases in terms of the technology inside than the 5 or the 6. We've had zero rumors about the 7 other than the possibility of removing the headphone jack. So what is this alleged "pent up demand" for other than these Wall Street clowns thinking if the phone doesn't look different people won't buy it.
It's true that the 5S and 6S were bigger technological upgrades, but apparently consumers prefer the physical upgrades that come with the new numbers. We should start to see leaks of the iPhone 7 around April or May.
I don't think anyone is suggesting Apple are doomed, they're just recognising the fact that iphone growth has limits. The maturing smartphone market means the upgrade cycle could lengthen, then numbers would level off and maybe begin to decline. Investors money-boners are fueled by growth so their concerns are reflected in the share price.
There's no need to be dramatic, the share price is reality, estimates are estimates. Get over it.
Nobody at Apple cares that much about the stock price. They are just trying their best to make great products. The stock price will take care of itself.
Bullshit.
Of course Apple cares about the stock price. That was the whole reason why they are buying back $100 billion in stock.
I'm pretty sure Angela Enherts and the new CFO care about the stockprice. Or any other executive hired the last 3 years. Unlike Cook/Ives they don't have stock with a cost basis of $2. The newer employees could actually be underwater at this point.
If the stock keeps underperforming, eventually the employees will get fed up and go to another company (Amazon, MSFT, Google) that has a strong stock performance.
Remember that with the top level employees 90% of their compensation is based on the stock.
Caring about the stock price is demonstrated by deciding not to call out some analyst publicly by calling him liar who is only attempting to manipulate the stock. There is not a lot Apple can do to stop this. I would think that would be the responsibility of the SEC. With the stock going lower it is cheaper for Apple to buy back shares, so there is some benefit to Apple. I would bet if there were a way for Apple to go private, they would. The stock is not under performing because of what Apple is doing, When actual sales fall short of Apple's own estimates, then they will have a problem. Remember that MSFT stock languished for years around $25. There are limits on how high a stock can go.
Hmmm...I would argue the 5S and 6S were bigger releases in terms of the technology inside than the 5 or the 6. We've had zero rumors about the 7 other than the possibility of removing the headphone jack. So what is this alleged "pent up demand" for other than these Wall Street clowns thinking if the phone doesn't look different people won't buy it.
It's true that the 5S and 6S were bigger technological upgrades, but apparently consumers prefer the physical upgrades that come with the new numbers. We should start to see leaks of the iPhone 7 around April or May.
Since we have no hard numbers from Apple we don't know that. I don't care what some analyst at FBR thinks. I care what Apple reports in its quarterly earnings. Let's not forget in January 2013 the WSJ ran a front page story about Apple cutting iPhone 5 orders by 60%. Did that ever materialize? Certainly not based on anything Apple reported.
I don't think anyone is suggesting Apple are doomed, they're just recognising the fact that iphone growth has limits. The maturing smartphone market means the upgrade cycle could lengthen, then numbers would level off and maybe begin to decline. Investors money-boners are fueled by growth so their concerns are reflected in the share price.
There's no need to be dramatic, the share price is reality, estimates are estimates. Get over it.
If this is something everyone knows why do we keep seeing these high estimates from analysts that end up getting revised down? Don't have unrealistic expectations to begin with.
Nobody at Apple cares that much about the stock price. They are just trying their best to make great products. The stock price will take care of itself.
Bullshit.
Of course Apple cares about the stock price. That was the whole reason why they are buying back $100 billion in stock.
I'm pretty sure Angela Enherts and the new CFO care about the stockprice. Or any other executive hired the last 3 years. Unlike Cook/Ives they don't have stock with a cost basis of $2. The newer employees could actually be underwater at this point.
If the stock keeps underperforming, eventually the employees will get fed up and go to another company (Amazon, MSFT, Google) that has a strong stock performance.
Remember that with the top level employees 90% of their compensation is based on the stock.
It goes back to Steve Jobs' philosophy of if you look after your customers, the profits / stock price will take care of itself. (paraphrasing)
Nobody at Apple cares that much about the stock price. They are just trying their best to make great products. The stock price will take care of itself.
Nonsense. They might not care about it like AOL employees did in the 90s but believe me no one at Apple enjoys the constant negativity about the company. It's not good for employee morale either.
Everyone says AAPL <> Apple and that might be true in terms of what the stock does relative to the financials but if there's negative sentiment on AAPL it spills over to Apple. Watch that 60 minutes overtime piece; the interviewer asked Charlie Rose is the stuff under those sheets in Jony's studio really are the next big thing. That's the sentiment on this company and it won't change anytime soon as Apple is staying as secretive as ever. They're not trotting out Amazon-like drones on TV.
Unless you're a high-level exec whose compensation, for the most part, is tied up in stock options, I can't see how it hurts employee morale if the products you're making are world class and enjoyed of hundreds of millions of consumers? If anything, stagnating innovation, decline in product quality, not getting a chance to work on the "next big thing", would hurt morale a lot more. than declining stock price.
I don't think anyone is suggesting Apple are doomed, they're just recognising the fact that iphone growth has limits. The maturing smartphone market means the upgrade cycle could lengthen, then numbers would level off and maybe begin to decline. Investors money-boners are fueled by growth so their concerns are reflected in the share price.
There's no need to be dramatic, the share price is reality, estimates are estimates. Get over it.
It isn't just iPhone growth. The entire smartphone segment has declining growth, China included. In a couple of years, the smartphone segment will be, for the most part, will be dependant on users who are upgrading as opposed to new users - with the exception of a few outlier countries of course.
Of course Apple cares about the stock price. That was the whole reason why they are buying back $100 billion in stock.
I'm pretty sure Angela Enherts and the new CFO care about the stockprice. Or any other executive hired the last 3 years. Unlike Cook/Ives they don't have stock with a cost basis of $2. The newer employees could actually be underwater at this point.
If the stock keeps underperforming, eventually the employees will get fed up and go to another company (Amazon, MSFT, Google) that has a strong stock performance.
Remember that with the top level employees 90% of their compensation is based on the stock.
Caring about the stock price is demonstrated by deciding not to call out some analyst publicly by calling him liar who is only attempting to manipulate the stock. There is not a lot Apple can do to stop this. I would think that would be the responsibility of the SEC. With the stock going lower it is cheaper for Apple to buy back shares, so there is some benefit to Apple. I would bet if there were a way for Apple to go private, they would. The stock is not under performing because of what Apple is doing, When actual sales fall short of Apple's own estimates, then they will have a problem. Remember that MSFT stock languished for years around $25. There are limits on how high a stock can go.
I think Cook really does not care that much about the stock price. It does not effect the operation of the company. I am sure he would much prefer it be a private company at this point. It is just one of the annoying outside distractions he has to live with.
If Cook does not care about the stock price he needs to be fired immediately. One of his most important jobs is to satisfy the owners of the company. When piece of shit companies like Tesla are vastly out performing Apple something needs to be done.
Cook needs to care about stock price because:
1. Many of the top employees get the majority of their compensation from stock options. Stock performance is extremely important. If your stock keeps underperforming the market you will lose talent to other companies (Google, Tesla, Amazon, MSFT) who's stock has been on fire.
2. A weak stock price leads to bad press. Apple is doomed. Apple sales are weak. iPhone is failing. Watch is a failure. If you don't think that constant negativity about Apple has no effect on consumers you are crazy.
3. Some of the biggest Apple fans are Apple shareholders. When the stock is flying high I bet these shareholders buy more Apple stuff. Personally I've held off on several Apple purchases because the stock has been so crappy this year.
4. Tarnish the brand. Lets get real. The Apple brand is worth at least $50 billion. But if the news clippings keep posting articles about how Apple is struggling that won't help at all. And it isn't just the financial media. Its leaking to the mass media like CNN and USA Today. When articles say Apple has lost $160 billion in stock price in USA today that does not help the brand.
5. Makes the buyback a huge waste. How does those BILLIONS spent on $120 shares look now? If the stock drops to $100 Cook would have lost investors TENS OF BILLIONS just on the buyback alone. That is REAL money that was spent by Cook and wasted. Would you want Cook to throw away TENS OF BILLIONS on crappy advertising? Well its the same if he allows the media to control the message and the buyback is underwater.
you have it all wrong. managing to the stock market is the dumbest idea in the world. your management strategy should be to delight the customer.
so sick of your constant posts on this. you're borderline troll, dude.
Cook ALREADY HAS covered this on the earnings calls -- said very clearly not to gauge demand by vendor forecasting. already has. there is no reason for him to address it every time it happens. then they'd expect him to address any and all rumors. that isn't how Apple rolls and you know that.
grow up.
Cooks comments were MONTHS AGO. Things could have easily CHANGED by now.
Analyst were saying the supply chain was strong in Oct when Cook said those comments. Now they are saying its weak. Why can't Cook take 5 minutes out of his day to say "relying on supply chain data points is inaccurate."
Other CEO's do this all the time. They defend the stock from false rumors.
Why do you think Apple faces more false rumors than any other company on the face of the planet? Its because Apple does such a CRAPPY JOB of calling out these liars. The Media and Wall Street bullshitters know that 99% of the time Apple won't do jackshit so they continue to spew crap. Sure Apple did not defend it self in the past. Does not mean its a good idea to keep being like a wimp and let the bully piss on your face.
it doesn't matter that it was months ago -- the point remains eternal. duh.
responding to rumors is stupid and a ball and chain.
what happened to you? when did you turn hysterical?
I don't think anyone is suggesting Apple are doomed, they're just recognising the fact that iphone growth has limits. The maturing smartphone market means the upgrade cycle could lengthen, then numbers would level off and maybe begin to decline. Investors money-boners are fueled by growth so their concerns are reflected in the share price.
There's no need to be dramatic, the share price is reality, estimates are estimates. Get over it.
When Apple meets guidance, will those shitheads eat their words for being wrong YET AGAIN. No, they'll be paid big bucks for being idiots next year.
That's what is revolting about this; they're ALWAYS WRONG.
And, of course Apple shouldn't answer to those idiots; they're wrong and just doing dump and pump all day long.
These guys are manipulating Apple's stock price. Wall Street does not understand Apple, and so they hate Apple.
What this clown says makes no sense. He cites "pent up consumer demand" but then slashes his estimates for March and June quarters. So what is the pent up demand for then?
The stock is up almost a buck today, go figure.
pent up demand is for the future new form factor. People with 6's wanting a 7. (why get a 6s... it looks the same... no real bling value, unless you got a BroseGold version, like me (replacing my 4s!)
This is an developing pattern since we hit 'peak iPad' 1) April, July, 10Qs are non-news cycles. Apple hitting their estimates, and missing Analysts Pump/Dump estimates 2) the January release is the pinnacle of Pump/Dump. 2) non-S years are always BIG release years. Phones have a 2 year half life, with the major peak the Holiday quarter the NonS device is release. Every release of a phone is 50% larger than the phone it replaces (the 2 year old phone). So to maintain credibility Analyst 'predicts' a blow out 2017. 3) But, It's time to pump gloom now (to churn the market), so the market can tank for 4 weeks, so they can buy low now... and sell on the spike of good news in January. 4) Then push the gloom until August (using WWDC at first as 'nothing to see here' and then 6 weeks later, sell the sizzle of 'it may have X'. Buy again (or go long in the futures market) after the July 10q, at the bottom 5) In September, start the pump cycle to sell/cover in November, when people see holidays sales numbers.
I'm hoping the possibility of a March annoucement (which to me is the time corporations 'commit' to their annual 'desktop/laptop/mobile' purchase) will blow up this cycle. If the corporate purchasing geeks see a 'cheaper' iPhone 6c in March, to replace the 5c's, and iPad updates, and Macbook updates, that then drives the 'low cycle of purchasing through the April-Aug time frames).
One of the things overlooked is the iPhone Upgrade Program:
Unlocked carrier-agnostic iPhones
Upgrade to a new iPhone every year
Interest-free financing
Lower monthly rates than carriers
No ETA's
We purchased 4 iPhone 6s under this program -- and each will now upgrade each model cycle.
It is a brilliant program for Apple and the User!
My teen-aged grandkids now have the latest iPhones -- and are learning about credit and financing because they are making the monthly payments.
I suspect that Apple will greatly expand this program to other products and even to emerging markets such as India.
The biggest negative with the Apple upgrade program is that it was not created with businesses in mind. I know because we faced roadblocks significant enough to convince us to go with our carrier instead and their upgrade program. Apple needs to rethink this one.
Tim Cook has shown that he's not going to let some analyst who's probably never run a business in their life dictate to him how he should run a company. Apple should let the numbers speak for themselves.
These guys are manipulating Apple's stock price. Wall Street does not understand Apple, and so they hate Apple.
Exactly. It's the same BS rumour every "s" year (and sometimes in the non-s years), dutifully reported by AppleInsider despite it's unlikely veracity.
The iPhone "s" models are pretty much always thought to be "not as much of an upgrade as expected" and "not selling as well as expected" etc. etc. but then by the time the next full model comes out, we are flooded with stories that tell us how these expectations turned out to be incorrect, and the "s" model from the previous year actually outsold all previous models.
I would wager that there are more hard-core Apple fans and customers that buy the "S" models than there are that buy the full number version ones given the choice. They are better phones after all.
Tim Cook has shown that he's not going to let some analyst who's probably never run a business in their life dictate to him how he should run a company. Apple should let the numbers speak for themselves.
Its not about Tim Cook allowing analyst and Media pudits tell him how to run the company.
Its about Tim Cook defending the companies stock and reputation and calling out these bullshitters.
Why the fuc is Cook so afraid of exposing these liars?
because Tim has more rules to follow since he has inside knowledge. If he says anything more than 'What I said yesterday' then everything he says needs to be vetted by compliance. Note his email to Cramer was defending the stock, but came under scrutiny as a potential SEC violation. I'm sure he doesn't want to waste the time, and rather run the company and not manage the company based on it's stock price (e.g. rising EPS fixes everything).
That's what I like about apple (and arguably Amazon)... they manage beyond a 90/365 day window... They pour investments into over the horizon strategies, and not manage to the stock ticker. Apple does have the advantage of a bank account that makes the stock price relatively unimportant in its financing, where as AMZN needs to have a high P/E because it's really borrowing against it's perceived value, vs bank value. (suprizingly, they are both borrowing at approximately the same rate vs equity... Apple is borrowing billions though).
This is the crux of analysts being able to state utter BS as long they are 'arms length' away from the companies they analyze.
Comments
Everyone says AAPL <> Apple and that might be true in terms of what the stock does relative to the financials but if there's negative sentiment on AAPL it spills over to Apple. Watch that 60 minutes overtime piece; the interviewer asked Charlie Rose is the stuff under those sheets in Jony's studio really are the next big thing. That's the sentiment on this company and it won't change anytime soon as Apple is staying as secretive as ever. They're not trotting out Amazon-like drones on TV.
It's true that the 5S and 6S were bigger technological upgrades, but apparently consumers prefer the physical upgrades that come with the new numbers. We should start to see leaks of the iPhone 7 around April or May.
Unless you're a high-level exec whose compensation, for the most part, is tied up in stock options, I can't see how it hurts employee morale if the products you're making are world class and enjoyed of hundreds of millions of consumers? If anything, stagnating innovation, decline in product quality, not getting a chance to work on the "next big thing", would hurt morale a lot more. than declining stock price.
It isn't just iPhone growth. The entire smartphone segment has declining growth, China included. In a couple of years, the smartphone segment will be, for the most part, will be dependant on users who are upgrading as opposed to new users - with the exception of a few outlier countries of course.
MSFT stock has been doing much better lately.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/stevedenning/2011/11/28/maximizing-shareholder-value-the-dumbest-idea-in-the-world/
dont quit your day job.
it doesn't matter that it was months ago -- the point remains eternal. duh. responding to rumors is stupid and a ball and chain. what happened to you? when did you turn hysterical?
That's what is revolting about this; they're ALWAYS WRONG.
And, of course Apple shouldn't answer to those idiots; they're wrong and just doing dump and pump all day long.
People with 6's wanting a 7. (why get a 6s... it looks the same... no real bling value, unless you got a BroseGold version, like me (replacing my 4s!)
This is an developing pattern since we hit 'peak iPad'
1) April, July, 10Qs are non-news cycles. Apple hitting their estimates, and missing Analysts Pump/Dump estimates
2) the January release is the pinnacle of Pump/Dump.
2) non-S years are always BIG release years. Phones have a 2 year half life, with the major peak the Holiday quarter the NonS device is release. Every release of a phone is 50% larger than the phone it replaces (the 2 year old phone). So to maintain credibility Analyst 'predicts' a blow out 2017.
3) But, It's time to pump gloom now (to churn the market), so the market can tank for 4 weeks, so they can buy low now... and sell on the spike of good news in January.
4) Then push the gloom until August (using WWDC at first as 'nothing to see here' and then 6 weeks later, sell the sizzle of 'it may have X'. Buy again (or go long in the futures market) after the July 10q, at the bottom
5) In September, start the pump cycle to sell/cover in November, when people see holidays sales numbers.
I'm hoping the possibility of a March annoucement (which to me is the time corporations 'commit' to their annual 'desktop/laptop/mobile' purchase) will blow up this cycle. If the corporate purchasing geeks see a 'cheaper' iPhone 6c in March, to replace the 5c's, and iPad updates, and Macbook updates, that then drives the 'low cycle of purchasing through the April-Aug time frames).
The iPhone "s" models are pretty much always thought to be "not as much of an upgrade as expected" and "not selling as well as expected" etc. etc. but then by the time the next full model comes out, we are flooded with stories that tell us how these expectations turned out to be incorrect, and the "s" model from the previous year actually outsold all previous models.
I would wager that there are more hard-core Apple fans and customers that buy the "S" models than there are that buy the full number version ones given the choice. They are better phones after all.
That's what I like about apple (and arguably Amazon)... they manage beyond a 90/365 day window... They pour investments into over the horizon strategies, and not manage to the stock ticker. Apple does have the advantage of a bank account that makes the stock price relatively unimportant in its financing, where as AMZN needs to have a high P/E because it's really borrowing against it's perceived value, vs bank value. (suprizingly, they are both borrowing at approximately the same rate vs equity... Apple is borrowing billions though).
This is the crux of analysts being able to state utter BS as long they are 'arms length' away from the companies they analyze.