Turkey's deputy PM encourages Apple to move in wake of EU tax ruling

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Comments

  • Reply 21 of 98
    lmaclmac Posts: 204member
    Apple is not breaking the laws of Ireland, but doing what any business with an army of accountants does; find ways to minimize taxation. If Ireland wants to change its laws, fine, but it cannot collect taxes retroactively. Part of the reason Apple is in Ireland is the favorable tax rates, a well educated population of English speakers, and a relatively low wage structure for the E.U. This is just posturing. It will blow over. If it doesn't, Apple will pick up stakes and go someplace more favorable. India is looking good.
    SolirovertjbdragonCapriguy
  • Reply 22 of 98
    apple ][apple ][ Posts: 9,233member
    Screw the EU.

    Apple should not pay one dime.


    rovertjbdragonmonstrositylatifbpCapriguy
  • Reply 23 of 98
    apple ][apple ][ Posts: 9,233member
    Grimzahn said:
    Violating the law and then moving would make me switch to Android.  Going to watch veryt closely Mr Cooks stance and actions.
    Get ready for the new Samsung Galaxy or whatever it's called!

    I hear that it's great, and I'm sure that you'll be extremely satisfied with it. :#

    You sound like a true Fandroid and you should follow your heart.
    edited August 2016 SpamSandwichrovertjbdragonnetmagelatifbpCapriguy
  • Reply 24 of 98
    There is no chance of Turkey being in the EU this decade
    Turkey has a special economic arrangement (a customs union) with the EU on trade and tariffs.

    The larger problem there is high political risk, and the heightened risk of terrorism.
    latifbp
  • Reply 25 of 98
    In NO WAY is APPLE doing what every ordinary taxpayer does. How many ordinary taxpayers get to survey the world and get PREFERENTIAL treatment to tax-domicile in various countries? Spoiler alert  -  NONE. And I'm sorry, diehard Romney fans, but corporations AREN"T "people." They are organizations set up for one thing - PROFITS, and in return they are expected to pay their fair share to the people who allow them that privilege. Yes, people, profitmaking was NOT handed down from GOD to humanity. It was INVENTED as incentive in return for jobs and general public good. Apple got a sweet deal from Ireland apparently in violation of EU rules. Let Apple and Ireland appeal, but claims that Apple is being unfairly treated are just not accurate.
  • Reply 26 of 98

    Soli said:
    AdBrit said:
    In the end, all this is Apple trying to avoid paying taxes, something all of us do compliantly without begging for exception. Apple and other Corporations are simply moochers of a countries wealth whether that be the consumer's dollars or the consumer's labour. They are transient welfare bums.
    What should a corporation do? Pay taxes beyond what they are legally obligated to pay in order to appease you? I certainly have accountants looking for every possible way I can reduce how much I legally owe the gov't. You don't do that?
    Moochers are not concerned about protecting what they have, they simply employ power-seeking political scumbags to force you to give up what you have.
    Well-said. A lot of them have shown up here lately.
    SpamSandwichjbdragon
  • Reply 27 of 98
    I say Apple should tell the EU they'll be relocating to Britain now that they're out and Apple should simply refuse to pay that extortionate and fraudulent bill. 
    I'd go further and help push Irish out of EU.  This farse has gone too long with EU...they need to feel the BERN(pun intended)....Socialist Commy.
    netmage
  • Reply 28 of 98

    Grimzahn said:
    Violating the law and then moving would make me switch to Android.  Going to watch veryt closely Mr Cooks stance and actions.
    Why wait. Go. Please.
    SpamSandwichrovertjbdragonnetmageCapriguy
  • Reply 29 of 98
    "Turkey is also politically unstable, having just recently dealt with an attempted coup." ---- Yep, despite corporations saying that certain tax rates are "unfair" and making it sound like they can create jobs out of thin air, they actually prefer to operate in countries with a stable central government and economy, both of which are critically necessary to support large amounts of consumer spending.
    edited August 2016 jbdragon
  • Reply 30 of 98
    Yeah right. First the 13 members of the EC are to be richer by 1 billion Euros each, and now a would-be dictator wants the richest corporation in the world to move to his country so he can get his personal 1 billion, too. Stay where you are, Apple. Better chance the the intelligent Irish will give the EC the finger and follow Britain out of the EU.
    SpamSandwichrovertjbdragon
  • Reply 31 of 98
    apple ][apple ][ Posts: 9,233member
    This is yet another case of the dictatorial EU dictating their dictatorial ways to their slave countries and their subjects, in this case Ireland.

    Apple made a deal in good faith with Ireland, and now the EU comes along and tells Ireland that the deal is invalid. 

    The Irish are slaves to the EU, and the Irish are not in control of their own country.

    They should get the hell out of the EU, if they were smart.

    And Apple needs to set up shop in a place that controls their own destiny and is actually in charge of their own affairs.


    edited August 2016 rovertCapriguy
  • Reply 32 of 98
    singularitysingularity Posts: 1,328member
    apple ][ said:
    This is yet another case of the dictatorial EU dictating their dictatorial ways to their slave countries and their subjects, in this case Ireland.

    Apple made a deal in good faith with Ireland, and now the EU comes along and tells Ireland that the deal is invalid. 

    The Irish are slaves to the EU, and the Irish are not in control of their own country.

    They should get the hell out of the EU, if they were smart.

    And Apple needs to set up shop in a place that controls their own destiny and is actually in charge of their own affairs.


    Yeah Apple needs to slash it's profits by 20%. that's the smart move?! 
    That's an F for business acumen and sense
    Solinetmage
  • Reply 33 of 98
    SoliSoli Posts: 10,032member
    lmac said:
    Apple is not breaking the laws of Ireland, but doing what any business with an army of accountants does; find ways to minimize taxation. If Ireland wants to change its laws, fine, but it cannot collect taxes retroactively. Part of the reason Apple is in Ireland is the favorable tax rates, a well educated population of English speakers, and a relatively low wage structure for the E.U. This is just posturing. It will blow over. If it doesn't, Apple will pick up stakes and go someplace more favorable. India is looking good.
    If Ireland changes their laws or if the EU changes laws that disallow Apple to continue using this legal loophole across the EU (which would also affect countries other companies) then they have a right to do so, but I don't get how they can ethically back-charge a company for maximizing their use of the current tax law.
    SpamSandwichwilliamlondonnolamacguyjbdragonnetmageCapriguy
  • Reply 34 of 98
    apple ][apple ][ Posts: 9,233member
    Yeah right. First the 13 members of the EC are to be richer by 1 billion Euros each, and now a would-be dictator wants the richest corporation in the world to move to his country so he can get his personal 1 billion, too. Stay where you are, Apple. Better chance the the intelligent Irish will give the EC the finger and follow Britain out of the EU.
    The EU needs some extra cash because of all of the millions of migrants, vagrants, freeloaders, beggars, rapists, murderers and terrorists that they have invited in to their territory.

    That bill is not going to be cheap. That's too damn bad, and that's their problem 100%. Screw them all.

    I agree with you that if the Irish are smart, they would do exactly what the smart people in the UK recently did.
    edited August 2016 SpamSandwichblanEjbdragonlatifbpCapriguy
  • Reply 35 of 98
    wigbywigby Posts: 692member
    AdBrit said:
    In the end, all this is Apple trying to avoid paying taxes, something all of us do compliantly without begging for exception. Apple and other Corporations are simply moochers of a countries wealth whether that be the consumer's dollars or the consumer's labour. They are transient welfare bums.
    Please show me someone who willingly pays as much tax as they can. I do not and you do not. Tax loopholes and accountants exist because we are all human and want to spend our own money instead of giving into others to waste.

    If your tax rate dropped to .05% tomorrow, you would gladly pass less and then complain when it was unfairly raised. This situation is no different than the deal that Ireland (not Apple) allegedly created.
    jbdragonnetmagelatifbp
  • Reply 36 of 98
    volcanvolcan Posts: 1,799member
    Soli said:

    I don't get how they can ethically back-charge a company for maximizing their use of the current tax law.
    I think the EU is claiming that Apple and Ireland have not been abiding by EU law, past or present.
    singularitycnocbuinetmage
  • Reply 37 of 98
    wigbywigby Posts: 692member

    blitz1 said:
    Soli said:
    AdBrit said:
    In the end, all this is Apple trying to avoid paying taxes, something all of us do compliantly without begging for exception. Apple and other Corporations are simply moochers of a countries wealth whether that be the consumer's dollars or the consumer's labour. They are transient welfare bums.
    What should a corporation do? Pay taxes beyond what they are legally obligated to pay in order to appease you? I certainly have accountants looking for every possible way I can reduce how much I legally owe the gov't. You don't do that?
    Legally obligated to pay in Ireland is 12,5%.
    Not 1%, not 0.005%
    Not according to the deal Ireland made with Apple. Should Apple breach that deal with Ireland in order to pay more taxes? No one would including you.
    SpamSandwichnetmagelatifbp
  • Reply 38 of 98
    cintoscintos Posts: 113member
    srice said:
    I say Apple should tell the EU they'll be relocating to Britain now that they're out of the EU.
    They would still need to pay EU taxes on revenues obtained in the EU.

    I blame the Big Four -- they are shills and sell fancy financial tricks to save $$, collect their fees and run.  5 years later the taxman comes a calling and demands taxes owed. By then the Big Four are long gone.  Corporations should take the Big Fours tricks with a pile of salt. 
    ... actually, the EU can only go directly at Ireland. They have no legal authority to order Apple to pay a dime. Its up to Ireland to extract the tax from Apple.
    netmage
  • Reply 39 of 98
    rune66rune66 Posts: 38member
    Soli said:
    lmac said:
    Apple is not breaking the laws of Ireland, but doing what any business with an army of accountants does; find ways to minimize taxation. If Ireland wants to change its laws, fine, but it cannot collect taxes retroactively. Part of the reason Apple is in Ireland is the favorable tax rates, a well educated population of English speakers, and a relatively low wage structure for the E.U. This is just posturing. It will blow over. If it doesn't, Apple will pick up stakes and go someplace more favorable. India is looking good.
    If Ireland changes their laws or if the EU changes laws that disallow Apple to continue using this legal loophole across the EU (which would also affect countries other companies) then they have a right to do so, but I don't get how they can ethically back-charge a company for maximizing their use of the current tax law.
    Well this is not a matter of Apple using a legal loophole. It's a matter of Ireland breaking EU law by allowing Apple to pay less than 2% tax on profit obtained in the entire EU. If Apple is stupid enough not to have foreseen this coming they should be fined for stupidity. But of course this is not the case. Apple has known all the time that they could be at risk but took the chance hoping they were able to bully their way through. The second part of this case is that for Apple to have been able to channel all EU-profits to Ireland they have used transfer pricing which is illegal. Tom Cook is a hypocrite. If Apple doesn't want to pay they should leave the European market.

    http://www.forbes.com/sites/beltway/2013/05/21/the-real-story-about-apples-tax-avoidance-how-ordinary-it-is/#632ea1a94d94
    singularitysrice
  • Reply 40 of 98
    If Ireland changes their laws or if the EU changes laws that disallow Apple to continue using this legal loophole across the EU (which would also affect countries other companies) then they have a right to do so, but I don't get how they can ethically back-charge a company for maximizing their use of the current tax law.
    The EU seems to be going out on a limb on this one by using the "state-aid" charge as the basis for the tax ruling. That requires them to make the case that the tax break provided Apple with a competitive advantage in the electronics market vs. other companies, which doesn't sound like an easy task considering how successful Apple has been in selling it's products outside the EU. 
    netmage
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