Apple axes Wi-Fi router division, apparently signaling the end of AirPort

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  • Reply 201 of 226
    flaneurflaneur Posts: 4,526member
    altivec88 said:
    Yah, I read that quite a while ago (maybe close to a year now), it was actually found in El-Capitain and it was for 10 USB-3 ports.   I think 10 USB-C ports would be overkill but I'll take it. LOL.  Actually, I would take anything any this point as long as its got new E5v4 cpus and updated graphics cards.  MacWorld UK says MacPro updates no later then end of November.   That deadline is coming around really soon, so we'll see.  Its the last shred of hope I have left for Mac Pro's.  After that, I really got to do something, I've got dead machines left and right here and I just keep telling everyone, lets just hang in there.  I've got people, including myself, bringing in there home computers every day just to get by.
    I see your predicament better here. My sympathies. Apple's policy of not telegraphing their intentions has a definite cruel side.

    On the other hand, this brou-ha over Airport may be all for naught. Now on to the other thread you mentioned about AI's advice to the Airport trauma sufferers.
    williamlondon
  • Reply 202 of 226
    nhtnht Posts: 4,522member
    altivec88 said:

    Do you really make decisions for your company based on single, anonymously sourced articles out on the internets? You say actions speak louder than words, but best I can tell, this one article consists only of words.

    If I were you, I'd give it a couple of days before you start ripping out the Airport extremes and replacing them with ... whatever. Apple likely hasn't made a statement yet because (1) They can't respond to every silly thing that gets written, and (2) depending on the complexity of how this (if there even is a this) relates to whatever might be under development down the pipeline, a statement would require some finesse. If the whole thing is nonsense, a statement that the whole thing is nonsense would be fairly easy to craft. If they're moving people around in preparation for some other thing that they have no intention of announcing yet, then crafting a response that addresses the current concerns while disclosing nothing about not-ready-for-primetime new things, well, that takes some verbal dexterity. 

    In any case, I'd give it a little time before you start making decisions based on scant and dubious information.

    P.S. Apple has never been in the habit of announcing new products or product updates before they're ready. I don't quite understand how you could have been a 'die hard Apple fanboy ... since 1984' and not have noticed that. 

    P.P.S. One thing Apple has been pretty good about announcing is when they intend to halt support for a product. Given the security concerns related to wireless networking, I would be stunned to find that they had quietly abandoned support long ago. In fact I know they haven't, since Airport routers got an update earlier this year.
    First off...  I appreciate your exuberance as a die hard Apple fanboy, however, I don't appreciate to have my abilities to run a company chastised over a simplification of one issue.  My decisions are based on a culmination of many things.   The biggest being I've lost my trust in Apple.  That is my feeling and Apple's actions the last few years is what caused it.  Right or Wrong... That's what I feel.  I am not going to explain the countless reasons why I have come to this conclusion but I'll leave you with one.

    The primary reason is the neglect and treatment of the Pro Market.  From Apertures death to the Final Cut X fiasco, I quickly learned that Apple has no qualms killing entire industries in a heart beat.  Its one thing to be all secretive like they have always been when your update timeline is somewhat consistent (12 to 18 month) but the Mac Pro has been updated only once in five years, and that one update was a side grade to say the least.  Our 12 core machines from 2010 cost 1/3 as much and are far more expandable and upgradable than what is available today, 6 years later.   I just wonder what your take on the handling of the Mac Pro is?   I am curious to hear how long I should wait for new Mac Pro's in order to meet your qualifications of making good decisions for my company?

    His judgement of your ability to "run a company" was based on the comment you made.  None of the crap your wrote should have significant bearing on what gear you buy anyway.  If the ROI is low on your CAPEX you have to consider switching even if painful. If that means a significant workflow change then so be it and you cost it in including the expected employee turnover.  If the hard numbers say the old way doesn't work anymore you pull the bandaid off in the least damaging method possible.  That's usually not "ditch everything and transition overnight".

    It's a business decision, not one made because you think "Apple isn't trustworthy".  No company is trustworthy to anything but their own bottom line.  Certainly not for more than a couple product cycles out.

    And you are just now figuring out that Apple doesn't mind killing entire industries in a heartbeat?  What are you? A slow learner?  We shipped significant product based on Xserves that was killed when Apple stopped making them. As near as I can tell our Apple Federal sales team went with it because we were done and offering Apple the proverbial "big check" got us nowhere and so we had to move to RHEL and IBM servers.  We still buy a lot of Apple product but I never saw those same federal sales folks again.  And if you think HP or IBM is much different you haven't had to buy used gear off eBay to fullfill contract requirements after their sales rep blew unicorn smoke up your PM's ass for 2 years and then the product line went tits up as everyone with two brains cells to bang together could predict.

    My take on the Mac Pro is that if you don't have a OSX dependent workflow you were a complete dumbass for buying them in 2013 and not building out a heterogeneous infrastructure with user facing iMacs/MBP backed by SAN, servers and HP or Dell workstations for the folks that needed huge local processing power beyond the iMac.  If you were making decisions based on what you "felt" then rather than building out an infrastructure that wasn't dependent on a company you should already have know was mercurial in 2013...well write it off as a learning experience.

    If you have an OSX dependent workflow you STILL should have diversified and bought fewer trash cans Mac Pros and more PCs.

    Because are you seriously going to tell me that as Mr. I Run The Damn Company that you didn't notice the whole Xserve/XSAN thing? Or did you just choose to ignore it because the MacPro was teh shiny?  

    And now in 2016, you want to ditch the baby with the bath water over another emotional feeling even though companies like IBM "feel" that Apple is sufficiently trustworthy to use as a significant vendor of computers that they are increasing purchases, not decreasing, because the TCO numbers are so favorable.

    Thats cool.  Just don't act so indignant when folks aren't overly impressed with your decision making prowess.
    nubusAppleZulu
  • Reply 203 of 226
    cornchipcornchip Posts: 1,874member
    WTF???
  • Reply 204 of 226
    Yes, well, I guess we'll see how Apple fares as a company and whether this approach is best, time will tell. :smile:

    That's a recurring theme where I work: "As long as we continue to be Number 1, we must be doing everything right."

    It's a flawed assumption. It's possible to do many things very wrong and still be the market leader. Maybe the product sucks the least of all available options, and people only buy it because the alternatives are even worse. Maybe the customer experience and the product are both good, but correcting mistakes would make them even better, and instead of being Number 1 we could be Number 1, 2 and 3 (a cute way of saying doing better than the next few competitors combined).  Either way, even a company that does many things well usually could stand to improve a thing or two here and there. In Apple's case, that may be communications.

    I agree with those who suggest that it might be time for Apple to give up the notion that being super-secretive makes it intriguing and mysterious. It doesn't. It can, in some cases, even come across as arrogant and isolated. I think Apple's market position would be positively influenced by a charismatic face fronting a communications outlet.
  • Reply 205 of 226
    VSzulcVSzulc Posts: 32unconfirmed, member
    So... It looks like it's not just Apple's routers that are dead now, they're also killing off TimeMachine/TimeCapsule as a whole.

    I just read up on the post about APFS, the new APple File System that is supposed to come out next year, and APFS does not support Directory Links, which is what makes TimeMachine work at all. 

    This seriously sucks.

    Probable scenario: You upgrade to the next version of OS X, your TimeCapsule will be a $399 door stopper. Apple will sell you iCloud backup for X amount of dollars a month. Since APFS isn't compatible with Directory Links, your old TimeMachine backups are useless.
  • Reply 206 of 226
    VSzulcVSzulc Posts: 32unconfirmed, member

    evilution said:
    When 802.11ax and 5G become actual things, Apple will move people onto this project. There is no point having experts sitting around not working on a product so they may as well be improving future products. These people haven't been fired.
    This makes more sense. 11ax isn't even close to being ratified, there really isn't anything more you can do to improve on the devices, so why have the team working on that. I think this is a whole lot of hoopla over nothing people. No one got fired, they are just working on something different right now, probably all dealing with networking technologies while we wait for 11ax to come close to ratification.

    Also, bear in mind, there is a whole lot of people who like using that ecosystem for their networking because it "just works". From Macs, to Phones, to Pads, and TVs; their system just works. Also, people do use AirPlay a whole lot, unless that has become open sourced, they will not get out of the networking business for that reason alone.
    Nope, sorry. Read my post about Apples new file system: TimeMachine is dead, Time Capsule is dead, AirPort routers are dead. 

    I know now it sucks, but that's how it is.

    It makes no sense to disband an entire networking division, only to put it back together again when there is a new standard.

    You don't disband an entire division unless you don't plan on making that hardware again, period.
    tallest skil
  • Reply 207 of 226
    mattinozmattinoz Posts: 1,721member
    VSzulc said:
    So... It looks like it's not just Apple's routers that are dead now, they're also killing off TimeMachine/TimeCapsule as a whole.

    I just read up on the post about APFS, the new APple File System that is supposed to come out next year, and APFS does not support Directory Links, which is what makes TimeMachine work at all. 

    This seriously sucks.

    Probable scenario: You upgrade to the next version of OS X, your TimeCapsule will be a $399 door stopper. Apple will sell you iCloud backup for X amount of dollars a month. Since APFS isn't compatible with Directory Links, your old TimeMachine backups are useless.
    APFS feature sets makes potential aTime machine version 2 not just a bolt on but native.
    its also being designed to scale from watch to MAc pro so could well run on the existing airport hardware. 

    I think people are to keen to see doom and gloom and Apple doesn't help this on some fronts. 
    Still they are clearly investing a lot of time and money in to data security and movement and add this new rumored move and it seems more a sign of some think significant coming. 
    williamlondon
  • Reply 208 of 226
    appexappex Posts: 687member
    Nothing like a good wired connection, whenever possible, of course. Wired will always beat wireless.
  • Reply 209 of 226
    VSzulcVSzulc Posts: 32unconfirmed, member
    altivec88 said:
    Sounds more like Chicken Little running around demanding that God confirm it was just a pea. ;-)
    Do some of you work for Apple or something.  I just don't get it.  Where did I demand anything?

    What I did say, its in Apple's best interest to quash these negative articles if they are not true when it becomes viral like this.  But no, to some of you, its in Apple's best interest to just absorb these negative lies and watch their Airport sales tank in the mean time.    Heck even this site has another article with the factual title "With Apple abandoning Airport, here are the best alternative Wi-Fi routers for Mac Users"

    Yup. I'm the bad guy here.
    That's funny, first I think most people don't pay any attention to these blogs, so they aren't likely not to buy (in significant numbers) and negatively affect sales of these products, and for those that do, the comments I've seen are, "I'm going to run out and buy 2." If it becomes a problem, then Apple may comment, but to expect them to comment on every single internet blogger article is simply asking them to validate the profane and silly. Apple is above getting all worked up with these sorts of stories, and I for one am glad of it. It shows decorum on their part.

    Regardless, the negativity of people who assume end of world never ceases to amaze me. There is no official statement from Apple about EOL of these products, they are still selling and supporting them, the team was neither fired nor laid off, they were reassigned, that's all the *rumour* reported. If you are paranoid or generally negative you might assume the worst rather than wonder if th



    Are you 12? 14? Is your experience with the media limited to YouTube, or is just because you don't know anything about media, PR and how a business runs?

    This is not just a "la-di-da-lemme just make up a crazy story for hits, lols!" Kinda situation. Lemme give you a recap, I'll try to go slooow.

    This story started out as a report with Bloomberg. (No, not the odious liberal ex-mayor-Bloomberg, but the financial news giant he spawned).

    Bloomberg is one of the biggest and most reliable places to get business news. It's not a random blog, or a teenager in his pajamas-writing Apple rumors. When Bloomberg writes something, people pay attention.

    Part of why people pay attention, is because Bloomberg are journalists. Before they even posted that story, they contacted Apple for a comment. 

    That comment was "no comment"
    Now you're free to believe that Apple PR are staffed by dolts, who say "no comment" to every story that passes by them. I like to believe that they check with their superiors on what to say, if it's something out of the ordinary like this.

    Only after getting a "We don't want to discuss our future plans on this" with Apple, did Bloomberg publish the story. Which is why you're reading about it here.

    Now say what you want about Apple, but they aren't dumb. They know that a story like this can cost them sales.

    Why wouldn't Apple say: "While we don't like to comment on speculation, Apple has no plans to cease offering AirPort routers blah blah."


    Nope, instead they neither confirm nor deny that the story is true, which usually means that it's true.
  • Reply 210 of 226
    VSzulc said:
    altivec88 said:
    Sounds more like Chicken Little running around demanding that God confirm it was just a pea. ;-)
    Do some of you work for Apple or something.  I just don't get it.  Where did I demand anything?

    What I did say, its in Apple's best interest to quash these negative articles if they are not true when it becomes viral like this.  But no, to some of you, its in Apple's best interest to just absorb these negative lies and watch their Airport sales tank in the mean time.    Heck even this site has another article with the factual title "With Apple abandoning Airport, here are the best alternative Wi-Fi routers for Mac Users"

    Yup. I'm the bad guy here.
    That's funny, first I think most people don't pay any attention to these blogs, so they aren't likely not to buy (in significant numbers) and negatively affect sales of these products, and for those that do, the comments I've seen are, "I'm going to run out and buy 2." If it becomes a problem, then Apple may comment, but to expect them to comment on every single internet blogger article is simply asking them to validate the profane and silly. Apple is above getting all worked up with these sorts of stories, and I for one am glad of it. It shows decorum on their part.

    Regardless, the negativity of people who assume end of world never ceases to amaze me. There is no official statement from Apple about EOL of these products, they are still selling and supporting them, the team was neither fired nor laid off, they were reassigned, that's all the *rumour* reported. If you are paranoid or generally negative you might assume the worst rather than wonder if th
    Are you 12? 14? Is your experience with the media limited to YouTube, or is just because you don't know anything about media, PR and how a business runs?

    This is not just a "la-di-da-lemme just make up a crazy story for hits, lols!" Kinda situation. Lemme give you a recap, I'll try to go slooow.

    This story started out as a report with Bloomberg. (No, not the odious liberal ex-mayor-Bloomberg, but the financial news giant he spawned).

    Bloomberg is one of the biggest and most reliable places to get business news. It's not a random blog, or a teenager in his pajamas-writing Apple rumors. When Bloomberg writes something, people pay attention.

    Part of why people pay attention, is because Bloomberg are journalists. Before they even posted that story, they contacted Apple for a comment. 

    That comment was "no comment"
    Now you're free to believe that Apple PR are staffed by dolts, who say "no comment" to every story that passes by them. I like to believe that they check with their superiors on what to say, if it's something out of the ordinary like this.

    Only after getting a "We don't want to discuss our future plans on this" with Apple, did Bloomberg publish the story. Which is why you're reading about it here.

    Now say what you want about Apple, but they aren't dumb. They know that a story like this can cost them sales.

    Why wouldn't Apple say: "While we don't like to comment on speculation, Apple has no plans to cease offering AirPort routers blah blah."


    Nope, instead they neither confirm nor deny that the story is true, which usually means that it's true.
    Calm and rational is childish and paranoid and hair on fire is adult, right, is that what you think? 

    Oh, the irony is very sweet with this one. You've got it all figured out, Apple is doomed. Good for you. Meanwhile, we adults here have figured out this means exactly nothing, but go ahead and believe what you want, meanwhile the adults will act calmly and rationally and giggle while the children run around believing an apple dropping on their heads mean the end of the world.

    What's even more ironic is that Listening Post this past weekend had a segment on media and talked about how even big name media outlets are hiring 20-somethings to run their blogs and write articles for them. You should watch it.
    edited November 2016
  • Reply 211 of 226
    appex said:
    Nothing like a good wired connection, whenever possible, of course. Wired will always beat wireless.
    Great, wired, wireless, whatever, I don't care. I still need a router. My experience so far is that the router being made by someone other than Apple introduces the need for a level of expertise I lack in order to make ecosystem things like screen sharing and Back to My Mac work.
  • Reply 212 of 226
    VSzulcVSzulc Posts: 32unconfirmed, member
    flaneur said:
    altivec88 said:
    flaneur said:
    evilution said:
    When 802.11ax and 5G become actual things, Apple will move people onto this project. There is no point having experts sitting around not working on a product so they may as well be improving future products. These people haven't been fired.
    This makes more sense. 11ax isn't even close to being ratified, there really isn't anything more you can do to improve on the devices, so why have the team working on that. I think this is a whole lot of hoopla over nothing people. No one got fired, they are just working on something different right now, probably all dealing with networking technologies while we wait for 11ax to come close to ratification.

    Also, bear in mind, there is a whole lot of people who like using that ecosystem for their networking because it "just works". From Macs, to Phones, to Pads, and TVs; their system just works. Also, people do use AirPlay a whole lot, unless that has become open sourced, they will not get out of the networking business for that reason alone.
    One hundred posts to get a rational comment. Actually there were a couple of others, but they did not contain the term "bean counter."

    I can't believe how overwhelmed emotional people have allowed themselves to become. 


    Although the comment is rational, there is a lot more to do then just new hardware.  When a router is involved, security is paramount.  Knowing that there is no team watching over this to update firmware and/or software is a deal breaker.
     
    As for people becoming emotional.  You got that right but the part that you got wrong is the "have allowed themselves" part.   Apple has caused this culture change from us long time loyalist praising and promoting their products to frustration and anger.   Killing off products for no other reason than profit margins is the beginning of the end for Apple.  The reason Apple is successful is because of the entire ecosystem being simple and easy to use.  Some people are wiling to pay more just not to have problems.  Although, Monitors, Airports, Mac Mini's, Mac Pro's, 17" macbooks are not big money makers directly, they allow the ecosystem to thrive and keep the entire experience in Apple's control.  By taking these things away, you introduce new variables and potential for problems.  If people have to deal with these problems anyways, why would they pay more for Apple.

    I know our company, buys MacBooks, iPads, iPhones because they work seamlessly with our Mac mini servers and Mac Pro work stations (and airport extreme).  Take our Mac Pro's and mini's away and the rest goes too.   The problem is that Apple management is too high on themselves to listen to the anger and frustration that continues to grow louder and louder. Mac Pros are over a thousand days old for pete sake and there is absolutely no communication of what's going on.

    When the one trick iPhone pony comes to an end, that will be the only time Tim and company will listen.   The problem with that is that it will be too late.  Apple is squandering away what any company would kill to have, and those are the true loyal evangelists that helped make this company what it is.
    No, you guys are doing this to yourselves. There is no proof, none, that Apple has abandoned the Mac Pro, and every reason to assume that there is a good cause for the long delay. Lack of processors, impending graphics upgrades, rethinking of the inner or outer architecture, lack of engineering personnel available while the MacBook Pros were being pushed out, etc. These are the ways a rational, not an emotional, person approaches the question. Wait and see patiently.




    Spoken like someone who got an iPhone two years ago and just got a MacBook Air last Christmas and "Ohmygoditssoawesome!" 

    But some of us have been around for awhile.

    Some of us also use computers on a semipro or professional basis, know something about tech, and can't help but notice all these Apple machines with a year old or two year old processors and graphics, and can't help but notice that wow! Other manufacturers actually release new models on a timely basis, and update their hardware at least once a year!

    And here's Apple with its billions of dollars, talented engineering staff, and apparently it's just so dang hard, and Intels CPUs are late and all this poor excuses.

    Guys like you dont see the problem. After all your MacBook Air fulfills its primary purpose: Looking good at Starbucks while you surf the web. "I look like a real developer! You're just complaining too much!"

    But you haven't been around, so you don't know that it it didn't used to be like this.

    If you go back to 2010-2012, what do you see? Mac Minis, MacBooks, Mac Pro's were updated once, sometimes twice a year. New models were released on a timely basis. And this all while they were working on really groundbreaking iPhones and iPads on the side, instead of the yearly ho-hum updates we get today.

    So why is Apple not able to do yearly updates now, do you reckon? The excuse about "they are thinly staffed, don't have enough engineers! Just be patient!" You pulled out of your hat is only credible if you don't know zilch about neither Apple nor technology.



  • Reply 213 of 226
    VSzulcVSzulc Posts: 32unconfirmed, member
    VSzulc said:
    altivec88 said:
    Sounds more like Chicken Little running around demanding that God confirm it was just a pea. ;-)
    Do some of you work for Apple or something.  I just don't get it.  Where did I demand anything?

    What I did say, its in Apple's best interest to quash these negative articles if they are not true when it becomes viral like this.  But no, to some of you, its in Apple's best interest to just absorb these negative lies and watch their Airport sales tank in the mean time.    Heck even this site has another article with the factual title "With Apple abandoning Airport, here are the best alternative Wi-Fi routers for Mac Users"

    Yup. I'm the bad guy here.
    That's funny, first I think most people don't pay any attention to these blogs, so they aren't likely not to buy (in significant numbers) and negatively affect sales of these products, and for those that do, the comments I've seen are, "I'm going to run out and buy 2." If it becomes a problem, then Apple may comment, but to expect them to comment on every single internet blogger article is simply asking them to validate the profane and silly. Apple is above getting all worked up with these sorts of stories, and I for one am glad of it. It shows decorum on their part.

    Regardless, the negativity of people who assume end of world never ceases to amaze me. There is no official statement from Apple about EOL of these products, they are still selling and supporting them, the team was neither fired nor laid off, they were reassigned, that's all the *rumour* reported. If you are paranoid or generally negative you might assume the worst rather than wonder if th
    Are you 12? 14? Is your experience with the media limited to YouTube, or is just because you don't know anything about media, PR and how a business runs?

    This is not just a "la-di-da-lemme just make up a crazy story for hits, lols!" Kinda situation. Lemme give you a recap, I'll try to go slooow.

    This story started out as a report with Bloomberg. (No, not the odious liberal ex-mayor-Bloomberg, but the financial news giant he spawned).

    Bloomberg is one of the biggest and most reliable places to get business news. It's not a random blog, or a teenager in his pajamas-writing Apple rumors. When Bloomberg writes something, people pay attention.

    Part of why people pay attention, is because Bloomberg are journalists. Before they even posted that story, they contacted Apple for a comment. 

    That comment was "no comment"
    Now you're free to believe that Apple PR are staffed by dolts, who say "no comment" to every story that passes by them. I like to believe that they check with their superiors on what to say, if it's something out of the ordinary like this.

    Only after getting a "We don't want to discuss our future plans on this" with Apple, did Bloomberg publish the story. Which is why you're reading about it here.

    Now say what you want about Apple, but they aren't dumb. They know that a story like this can cost them sales.

    Why wouldn't Apple say: "While we don't like to comment on speculation, Apple has no plans to cease offering AirPort routers blah blah."


    Nope, instead they neither confirm nor deny that the story is true, which usually means that it's true.
    Calm and rational is childish and paranoid and hair on fire is adult, right, is that what you think? 

    Oh, the irony is very sweet with this one. You've got it all figured out, Apple is doomed. Good for you. Meanwhile, we adults here have figured out this means exactly nothing, but go ahead and believe what you want, meanwhile the adults will act calmly and rationally and giggle while the children run around believing an apple dropping on their heads mean the end of the world.

    What's even more ironic is that Listening Post this past weekend had a segment on media and talked about how even big name media outlets are hiring 20-somethings to run their blogs and write articles for them. You should watch it.


    What does 20 year olds writing articles have to do with anything? Do you always prattle on about random stuff when you don't know what to say? I'm in my late 20ies, and good for them, but that has zero relevance with the matter at hand. Which is... Apple shutting down its wireless team and EOLing their routers. 

    You mistakenly thought it was a blog rumor, and had apparently no idea that it was reported by Gurman, one of the best reporters on the beat. Nor did you know how Apple PR works, or about the fact that Apple not responding to the story, is also an answer in itself.

    Being calm and rational is fine and well, you seem to be mistaking your ignorance for stoic rationality.

    Now that we've covered that, an even bigger issue is that TimeMachine and TimeCapsule is also dead and won't be compatible with future versions of OSX and Apples new file system. 

    (If you want to participate while the grownup talk, Williamlondon, I suggest reading up on what a file system is, as well as HFS+ and APFS)
  • Reply 214 of 226
    VSzulcVSzulc Posts: 32unconfirmed, member

    mattinoz said:
    VSzulc said:
    So... It looks like it's not just Apple's routers that are dead now, they're also killing off TimeMachine/TimeCapsule as a whole.

    I just read up on the post about APFS, the new APple File System that is supposed to come out next year, and APFS does not support Directory Links, which is what makes TimeMachine work at all. 

    This seriously sucks.

    Probable scenario: You upgrade to the next version of OS X, your TimeCapsule will be a $399 door stopper. Apple will sell you iCloud backup for X amount of dollars a month. Since APFS isn't compatible with Directory Links, your old TimeMachine backups are useless.
    APFS feature sets makes potential aTime machine version 2 not just a bolt on but native.
    its also being designed to scale from watch to MAc pro so could well run on the existing airport hardware. 

    I think people are to keen to see doom and gloom and Apple doesn't help this on some fronts. 
    Still they are clearly investing a lot of time and money in to data security and movement and add this new rumored move and it seems more a sign of some think significant coming. 

    While APFS may be good for snapshots, the purpose of Timemachine wasn't just to roll back changes, it was also to act like a backup.

    And surely we can agree on the fact that you're not exactly the sharpest tool in the IT-shed, if you keep a backup of your data on the same computer that you're making a backup of? ;)

    Especially if Apple is moving towards soldered HDs like in the latest MacBook Pro.

    As for using APFS on your old TimeCapsules, that could possibly be a possibility, if Apple had at least updated the TimeCapsules. The hardware in them is starting to look a little old and slow. 

    Id definitely be less pessimistic if they hadn't disbanded the router team, but as it is, I suspect that the answer from Apple concerning backups will be: "iCloud 5.99 a month!"
  • Reply 215 of 226
    "Citing sources unnamed within Apple" is no indication of a dead certainty. If there is any semblance of truth to this rumour, however, it is likely Apple exits this product category gracefully with an 802.1ac final upgrade, which I will jump at for a 2Tb Time Capsule. My TC has saved my bacon more times than I care to remember!
  • Reply 216 of 226
    nhtnht Posts: 4,522member
    VSzulc said:
    VSzulc said:

    Part of why people pay attention, is because Bloomberg are journalists. Before they even posted that story, they contacted Apple for a comment. 

    That comment was "no comment"
    Now you're free to believe that Apple PR are staffed by dolts, who say "no comment" to every story that passes by them. I like to believe that they check with their superiors on what to say, if it's something out of the ordinary like this.

    Only after getting a "We don't want to discuss our future plans on this" with Apple, did Bloomberg publish the story. Which is why you're reading about it here.

    Now say what you want about Apple, but they aren't dumb. They know that a story like this can cost them sales.

    Why wouldn't Apple say: "While we don't like to comment on speculation, Apple has no plans to cease offering AirPort routers blah blah."

    Nope, instead they neither confirm nor deny that the story is true, which usually means that it's true.

    You mistakenly thought it was a blog rumor, and had apparently no idea that it was reported by Gurman, one of the best reporters on the beat. Nor did you know how Apple PR works, or about the fact that Apple not responding to the story, is also an answer in itself.
    LOL.  Apple declining to comment is a pattern that stretches back decades.  It means absolutely nothing and not that it "usually means it's true".  Apple commenting on something is news because they so rarely do so.

    So yes, Apple's PR policy is to say no comment on every story that passes by them.

    "Apple's PR team does the least of any PR team in the world and could be replaced by a voicemail that says, "No comment" and "the suicides at the factory are down this month."

    http://valleywag.gawker.com/goodbye-to-katie-cotton-the-queen-of-evil-tech-pr-1573505515

    "Saying little on-the-record is a classic Apple PR strategy.

    “Their strategy is to say nothing; it keeps everyone guessing what Apple is up to, generates free publicity, and keeps them out of the trouble everyone gets into,” said a journalist with access to Apple PR. “Once you start answering questions, you get your foot in your mouth.” As a former member of Apple PR put it, “everything [related to Apple PR] is done strategically,” noting that “a lot of people don’t give credit to the art form of working on background.” This strategy is often executed when reporters contact Apple PR for comment or confirmation on a story. “If you were totally off-base, I would tell you” is the closest Apple will typically get to confirming a story that didn’t originate with the PR team, according to journalists at multiple major news outlets."

    https://9to5mac.com/2014/08/29/part-3-strategies-the-art-of-deep-background-and-controlling-the-press/

    williamlondon
  • Reply 217 of 226
    nhtnht Posts: 4,522member
    VSzulc said:
    flaneur said:
    No, you guys are doing this to yourselves. There is no proof, none, that Apple has abandoned the Mac Pro, and every reason to assume that there is a good cause for the long delay. Lack of processors, impending graphics upgrades, rethinking of the inner or outer architecture, lack of engineering personnel available while the MacBook Pros were being pushed out, etc. These are the ways a rational, not an emotional, person approaches the question. Wait and see patiently.

    Spoken like someone who got an iPhone two years ago and just got a MacBook Air last Christmas and "Ohmygoditssoawesome!" 

    But some of us have been around for awhile.

    Some of us also use computers on a semipro or professional basis, know something about tech, and can't help but notice all these Apple machines with a year old or two year old processors and graphics, and can't help but notice that wow! Other manufacturers actually release new models on a timely basis, and update their hardware at least once a year!

    And here's Apple with its billions of dollars, talented engineering staff, and apparently it's just so dang hard, and Intels CPUs are late and all this poor excuses.

    Guys like you dont see the problem. After all your MacBook Air fulfills its primary purpose: Looking good at Starbucks while you surf the web. "I look like a real developer! You're just complaining too much!"

    But you haven't been around, so you don't know that it it didn't used to be like this.

    If you go back to 2010-2012, what do you see? Mac Minis, MacBooks, Mac Pro's were updated once, sometimes twice a year. New models were released on a timely basis. And this all while they were working on really groundbreaking iPhones and iPads on the side, instead of the yearly ho-hum updates we get today.

    So why is Apple not able to do yearly updates now, do you reckon? The excuse about "they are thinly staffed, don't have enough engineers! Just be patient!" You pulled out of your hat is only credible if you don't know zilch about neither Apple nor technology.
    Flaneur - joined 2010
    VSZulc - joined October

    Which poster hasn't been around?

    Its always been like this.  People whining about Apple's update or lack thereof.  Apple no longer cares about pros.  Apple is too expensive. Apple is arrogant. Apple didn't release a TV so it's teh doomed. All Apple cares about is the iPod and iPhone.  Blah blah blah.  

    For someone who has stated he's a late twenty something you were how old in 2010?  No genius, you haven't been around a while.  Flaneur has been around a while.  

    You are such a technology genius that you haven't figured out how to check a join date on an Internet forum before spouting off...
    williamlondon
  • Reply 218 of 226
    tipootipoo Posts: 1,119member
    Damn shame. One of Apples best kept secrets was how rock solid those routers were, at least on the latest firmware. They fell behind on features in the last few years, but still seemed to have a lot more uptime than even the most modern equipment by some others, thanks maybe to the FreeBSD/NetBSD core. Off to Eero I guess.

    One wonders if the Mac Pro which also hasn’t been updated in 3 years will get put into a can that looks like itself.

    That’ll be a shame. Having a POSIX certified FreeBSD based operating system using workstation that could take oodles of ECC RAM out there, even if I didn’t need such a thing anymore, was somehow…It sounds really odd, but somehow a comfort. This essay does it justice.

    https://marco.org/2016/11/05/world-without-mac-pro
  • Reply 219 of 226
    AppleZuluAppleZulu Posts: 1,309member
    Wow. A lot of crankiness on this thread. As of this morning, all information out there on this issue still appears to be based on the one article. 

    The number of times that information is repeated has no bearing on its accuracy. Until there is more independent reporting and/or an actual statement from Apple, all we have is the one article and a lot of subsequent noise. That's the context. People can make any decisions they want based on that, but they should just remember that this is one writer with unnamed sources. 

    As for 'being around,' I will say that I have been around long enough to have witnessed any number of things firsthand or 'from the inside,' and I don't think I have ever read a subsequent news report that gets it entirely correct. 

    So so when I read something like this one article, my reaction is 'well, if that's correct, it would be concerning. I'll be interested to learn more about it.' If I'm going to speculate, that speculation is going to be framed around the question, 'what is the most logical, least panicked reason that this information might be true?' 

    In this case, the actual, pre-speculative information reported is that development engineers from the router team have been, over time, reassigned to other projects. Everything else is speculation. So to me, until further information becomes available, the least hair-on-fire reason that this would be happening while Apple continues to sell routers and time capsules is that, for the time being, there's not much to develop, and good engineers are best used for active engineering. 

    Hopefully there will be more information on this soon, but I'm not going to get too worked up over it in the meantime. If the issue was particularly pressing for me, I'd probably take a shot at inquiring directly to someone on the Apple executive team. It's not unheard of for them to actually respond to regular people with vague, but reassuring answers. 
    williamlondon
  • Reply 220 of 226
    My feeling is that if its not an iPhone, don't make any long term expectations.... as Trump would say "Sad"
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