Apple 'finalizing' design of Amazon Echo rival based on Siri

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Comments

  • Reply 61 of 105
    k2kwk2kw Posts: 1,823member
    I'm in for about 4 of these. 

    Id probably replace my two Google Home. What I need is 

    1 good sound
    2, Siri 2nd Generation 
    3. HomeKit 
    4.Multiuser
    5.Synchonous audio

    The rest will take care of itself 
    This lists sounds good.   Needs to be as good as Sonos in the audio quality.   Apple needs to go for much higher quality than Amazon ( I expect the price to be 500 or more).   Wanting this but not holding my breadth.
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 62 of 105
    gatorguygatorguy Posts: 21,283member
    k2kw said:
    I'm in for about 4 of these. 

    Id probably replace my two Google Home. What I need is 

    1 good sound
    2, Siri 2nd Generation 
    3. HomeKit 
    4.Multiuser
    5.Synchonous audio

    The rest will take care of itself 
    This lists sounds good.   Needs to be as good as Sonos in the audio quality.   Apple needs to go for much higher quality than Amazon ( I expect the price to be 500 or more).   Wanting this but not holding my breadth.
    There's also the option of "casting" your audio to speakers you already have, which is relatively inexpensive. 
  • Reply 63 of 105
    Soli said:

    No people will use what works.  Siri works in far more countries because they put the effort in. Alexa simply lacks the sophistication to understand more languages which means on a global scale it simply isn't a factor. 
    I'm not sure what your point is. Are you saying the Echo is a good product because their market is currently smaller? Of course Apple supports more languages, because as previously stated they support a lot more countries and users with a lot more languages. If Amazon had the same unit sales, revenue, and profit margins as the iPhone I'm certain they wouldn't supported more countries by now.

    BTW, how many countries did Siri support after only 2 years on the market?
    Siri understood English, French, German and Japanese in iOS 5; added Cantonese, Mandarin, Italian and Spanish in iOS 6. Now supports 42 dialects of 21 languages. 
    Alexa understood American English at 2 years on market. Just added U.K. English and German. Apparently, can't set location to anywhere outside those three countries.
    I don't think this a productive path to go down in relation to Amazon and Alexa. 
    Solihmurchisonwatto_cobra
  • Reply 64 of 105
    hmurchisonhmurchison Posts: 12,298member
    Soli said:

    No people will use what works.  Siri works in far more countries because they put the effort in. Alexa simply lacks the sophistication to understand more languages which means on a global scale it simply isn't a factor. 
    I'm not sure what your point is. Are you saying the Echo is a good product because their market is currently smaller? Of course Apple supports more languages, because as previously stated they support a lot more countries and users with a lot more languages. If Amazon had the same unit sales, revenue, and profit margins as the iPhone I'm certain they wouldn't supported more countries by now.

    BTW, how many countries did Siri support after only 2 years on the market?
    Siri supported 19 languages 

    Alexa is ok but offers nothing that i didn't already have from Google and Nuance regarding accuracy.  
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 65 of 105
    k2kwk2kw Posts: 1,823member
    saltyzip said:
    I thought Apple announced a short while ago they weren't creating such a voice bot!
    I think there may have been a comment to that effect at the Mac Pro round table which  is why I'm not holding my breadth for this.  we seem to get these Rumors of a Echo/Google Home competitor every 3 to 6 months.   Let's see some leaked pictures of the case and I will believe this article.
  • Reply 66 of 105
    SoliSoli Posts: 9,364member
    Soli said:

    No people will use what works.  Siri works in far more countries because they put the effort in. Alexa simply lacks the sophistication to understand more languages which means on a global scale it simply isn't a factor. 
    I'm not sure what your point is. Are you saying the Echo is a good product because their market is currently smaller? Of course Apple supports more languages, because as previously stated they support a lot more countries and users with a lot more languages. If Amazon had the same unit sales, revenue, and profit margins as the iPhone I'm certain they wouldn't supported more countries by now.

    BTW, how many countries did Siri support after only 2 years on the market?
    Siri supported 19 languages 

    Alexa is ok but offers nothing that i didn't already have from Google and Nuance regarding accuracy.  
    @baederboy ;wrote, "Siri understood English, French, German and Japanese in iOS 5." Considering that he stated which languages per version of iOS that Siri supported, I have to assume his answer is better researched than yours. Where did you read that Siri supported 19 languages at its inception?
  • Reply 67 of 105
    SoliSoli Posts: 9,364member

    sog35 said:
    Soli said:
    sog35 said:
    you are so naive if you don't think Alexa is not always listening.
    You called the public dumb and yet I've never read a more idiotic post from you.
     
    To make this clear so you can hopefully understand how this technology works:

    OF COURSE ALEXA IS ALWAYS LISTENING! THAT'S HOW IT FUCKING WORKS! THERE'S NO OTHER WAY TO LISTEN FOR A KEYWORD WITHOUT ALWAYS LISTENING FOR THAT KEYWORD. THIS IS EXACTLY THE SAME—ZERO DIFFERENCE—WITH APPLE'S "HEY SIRI"! WHAT THEY AREN'T DOING IS ALWAYS RECORDING!


    ADDITIONALLY, SINCE YOU HAVE MICROPHONES AND CAMERAS AROUND YOU, IN YOUR HOME, AND ON YOUR PERSON PRETTY MUCH ALL THE TIME YOU HAVE NO IDEA WHETHER THESE DEVICES ARE LISTENING, RECORDING, AND SENDING YOUR DATA TO SOME SERVER IN SOME OTHER PART OF THE WORLD! YOU SIMPLY CAN'T BE SURE, BUT TO SAY THAT BECAUSE AMAZON DESIGNED A DEVICE TO LISTEN FOR A 'WAKE WORD' THAT IT—AND ONLY IT—CAN POSSIBLY BE USING A MICROPHONE (OR CAMERA) OUTSIDE OF YOU PURPOSELY ENABLING THEM; YOUR CLAIM THAT AMAZON MUST BE DOING SOMETHING NEFARIOUS IS THE MOST MYOPIC, PARANOID, AND DOWNRIGHT STUPID THINGS I'VE EVERY READ ON THIS FORUM!

    the part you are forgetting is not IF they are listening but WHO is listening.

    I trust Apple. I don't trust Amazon. That's the whole point.
    While your blind trust in Apple and mistrust in Amazon may be your fan boyish point, that's not what you wrote. You made a claim that it's bad because it "listens" fora keyword which you then implied means it must also be recording that information because it's listening. That's both irrational and illogical, but I doubt you'll ever understand that considering you still write every fucking post about what you desire Apple to do in the future as a statement of fact of what they'l absolutely end up doing.
    dasanman69
  • Reply 68 of 105
    hmurchisonhmurchison Posts: 12,298member
    Soli said:
    Soli said:

    No people will use what works.  Siri works in far more countries because they put the effort in. Alexa simply lacks the sophistication to understand more languages which means on a global scale it simply isn't a factor. 
    I'm not sure what your point is. Are you saying the Echo is a good product because their market is currently smaller? Of course Apple supports more languages, because as previously stated they support a lot more countries and users with a lot more languages. If Amazon had the same unit sales, revenue, and profit margins as the iPhone I'm certain they wouldn't supported more countries by now.

    BTW, how many countries did Siri support after only 2 years on the market?
    Siri supported 19 languages 

    Alexa is ok but offers nothing that i didn't already have from Google and Nuance regarding accuracy.  
    @baederboy wrote, "Siri understood English, French, German and Japanese in iOS 5." Considering that he stated which languages per version of iOS that Siri supported, I have to assume his answer is better researched than yours. Where did you read that Siri supported 19 languages at its inception?
    https://www.wikiwand.com/en/Siri#Supported_languages

    granted the 19 are including dialects but Siri language support has always been impressive  
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 69 of 105
    gatorguygatorguy Posts: 21,283member
    sog35 said:
    Soli said:
    sog35 said:
    you are so naive if you don't think Alexa is not always listening.
    You called the public dumb and yet I've never read a more idiotic post from you.
     
    To make this clear so you can hopefully understand how this technology works:

    OF COURSE ALEXA IS ALWAYS LISTENING! THAT'S HOW IT FUCKING WORKS! THERE'S NO OTHER WAY TO LISTEN FOR A KEYWORD WITHOUT ALWAYS LISTENING FOR THAT KEYWORD. THIS IS EXACTLY THE SAME—ZERO DIFFERENCE—WITH APPLE'S "HEY SIRI"! WHAT THEY AREN'T DOING IS ALWAYS RECORDING!


    ADDITIONALLY, SINCE YOU HAVE MICROPHONES AND CAMERAS AROUND YOU, IN YOUR HOME, AND ON YOUR PERSON PRETTY MUCH ALL THE TIME YOU HAVE NO IDEA WHETHER THESE DEVICES ARE LISTENING, RECORDING, AND SENDING YOUR DATA TO SOME SERVER IN SOME OTHER PART OF THE WORLD! YOU SIMPLY CAN'T BE SURE, BUT TO SAY THAT BECAUSE AMAZON DESIGNED A DEVICE TO LISTEN FOR A 'WAKE WORD' THAT IT—AND ONLY IT—CAN POSSIBLY BE USING A MICROPHONE (OR CAMERA) OUTSIDE OF YOU PURPOSELY ENABLING THEM; YOUR CLAIM THAT AMAZON MUST BE DOING SOMETHING NEFARIOUS IS THE MOST MYOPIC, PARANOID, AND DOWNRIGHT STUPID THINGS I'VE EVERY READ ON THIS FORUM!

    the part you are forgetting is not IF they are listening but WHO is listening.

    I trust Apple. I don't trust Amazon. That's the whole point.
    The whole "ohhh.... PRIVACY!" meme is so overdone it's become silly IMHO

    If you were honestly and truly highly concerned with your personal privacy you would not be telling us what you do for a living, where you're located, how much Apple stock you own and a multitude of other personal information you've shared here over the years. Your wouldn't even be a forum member to begin with. 

    You'd only pay with cash, forget about credit cards, not ever use a rewards card, stay off the internet, not use a smartphone, not deal with a bank or ever EVER borrow money. You never buy securities, file a tax return, work for any corporation or have utilities in your name.

    You'd not register for college classes, have a driver's license, walk on public streets, visit a doctor or hospital, get any prescriptions, or join any clubs.

    Geesh, you think by making sure Amazon/Apple/Google can't listen for a keyword your personal privacy is protected? LOL! That shipped sailed 50 years ago.

     "Protecting your Privacy" has been reduced to a marketing bullet-point for companies who in reality cannot protect it. Even forgetting about the internet altogether your personal details are collected and shared via a multitude of sources just from your normal real-life activities where you can't hide behind an ad-blocker and an anonymous persona. 
    edited April 2017
  • Reply 70 of 105
    fallenjtfallenjt Posts: 3,982member
    Soli said:
    fallenjt said:
    Apple should bring this into ATV 4: always on Siri built in and Bluetooth speakers capable! Don't do standalone speaker like Echo because it sounds like crap. Why build a new device while they can just upgrade existing one?
    1) Why do people want everything put in the Apple TV? How much do you think an Apple TV will
    cost with a WiFi router, HomeMit hub, and digital personal assistant built-in? How big do you think it would be? Since it's controlled via BT it doesn't have to be in plain sight so how does that work for the digital personal assistant feature? If one uses it in a room that doesn't have a TV, like a kitchen, you're saying I should buy a lot of extra HW at an inflated cost that can't be fully utilized?

    2) Clearly you've never used an archive if you don't think it's speaker is exellent. Same goes for its far-field mic setup. The entire system is excellent because of the HW, which I know firsthand from having both an Echo and Echo Dot. On a scale of 1 to 10 the Echo is a 10, the Dot is a 5 and the iPhone is a 1. That's how disparate the mic and speaker systems  are from each other.
    Echo speaker quality is 10 points for you? Conversation ends here. My Klipsch bookshelf speakers are 100x better. All I have to do is adding $20- Bluetooth receiver to the speakers in kitchen area and I can shout across the room for the device to play music...doing that right now using Echo Dot.
  • Reply 71 of 105
    StrangeDaysStrangeDays Posts: 8,797member
    Soli said:

    sog35 said:
    Soli said:
    sog35 said:
    you are so naive if you don't think Alexa is not always listening.
    You called the public dumb and yet I've never read a more idiotic post from you.
     
    To make this clear so you can hopefully understand how this technology works:

    OF COURSE ALEXA IS ALWAYS LISTENING! THAT'S HOW IT FUCKING WORKS! THERE'S NO OTHER WAY TO LISTEN FOR A KEYWORD WITHOUT ALWAYS LISTENING FOR THAT KEYWORD. THIS IS EXACTLY THE SAME—ZERO DIFFERENCE—WITH APPLE'S "HEY SIRI"! WHAT THEY AREN'T DOING IS ALWAYS RECORDING!


    ADDITIONALLY, SINCE YOU HAVE MICROPHONES AND CAMERAS AROUND YOU, IN YOUR HOME, AND ON YOUR PERSON PRETTY MUCH ALL THE TIME YOU HAVE NO IDEA WHETHER THESE DEVICES ARE LISTENING, RECORDING, AND SENDING YOUR DATA TO SOME SERVER IN SOME OTHER PART OF THE WORLD! YOU SIMPLY CAN'T BE SURE, BUT TO SAY THAT BECAUSE AMAZON DESIGNED A DEVICE TO LISTEN FOR A 'WAKE WORD' THAT IT—AND ONLY IT—CAN POSSIBLY BE USING A MICROPHONE (OR CAMERA) OUTSIDE OF YOU PURPOSELY ENABLING THEM; YOUR CLAIM THAT AMAZON MUST BE DOING SOMETHING NEFARIOUS IS THE MOST MYOPIC, PARANOID, AND DOWNRIGHT STUPID THINGS I'VE EVERY READ ON THIS FORUM!

    the part you are forgetting is not IF they are listening but WHO is listening.

    I trust Apple. I don't trust Amazon. That's the whole point.
    While your blind trust in Apple and mistrust in Amazon may be your fan boyish point, 
    It's not at all fanboyish to trust Apple more than Amazon -- they have different business models, and Apple's is much more aligned with my desire for privacy than a reseller like Amazon or especially an ad company like google. 

    case in point, the lack of denial on amazon selling user data:

    https://daringfireball.net/linked/2017/04/27/amazon-echo-look

    edited April 2017 brucemcwatto_cobra
  • Reply 72 of 105
    StrangeDaysStrangeDays Posts: 8,797member

    gatorguy said:
    sog35 said:
    Soli said:
    sog35 said:
    you are so naive if you don't think Alexa is not always listening.
    You called the public dumb and yet I've never read a more idiotic post from you.
     
    To make this clear so you can hopefully understand how this technology works:

    OF COURSE ALEXA IS ALWAYS LISTENING! THAT'S HOW IT FUCKING WORKS! THERE'S NO OTHER WAY TO LISTEN FOR A KEYWORD WITHOUT ALWAYS LISTENING FOR THAT KEYWORD. THIS IS EXACTLY THE SAME—ZERO DIFFERENCE—WITH APPLE'S "HEY SIRI"! WHAT THEY AREN'T DOING IS ALWAYS RECORDING!


    ADDITIONALLY, SINCE YOU HAVE MICROPHONES AND CAMERAS AROUND YOU, IN YOUR HOME, AND ON YOUR PERSON PRETTY MUCH ALL THE TIME YOU HAVE NO IDEA WHETHER THESE DEVICES ARE LISTENING, RECORDING, AND SENDING YOUR DATA TO SOME SERVER IN SOME OTHER PART OF THE WORLD! YOU SIMPLY CAN'T BE SURE, BUT TO SAY THAT BECAUSE AMAZON DESIGNED A DEVICE TO LISTEN FOR A 'WAKE WORD' THAT IT—AND ONLY IT—CAN POSSIBLY BE USING A MICROPHONE (OR CAMERA) OUTSIDE OF YOU PURPOSELY ENABLING THEM; YOUR CLAIM THAT AMAZON MUST BE DOING SOMETHING NEFARIOUS IS THE MOST MYOPIC, PARANOID, AND DOWNRIGHT STUPID THINGS I'VE EVERY READ ON THIS FORUM!

    the part you are forgetting is not IF they are listening but WHO is listening.

    I trust Apple. I don't trust Amazon. That's the whole point.
    The whole "ohhh.... PRIVACY!" meme is so overdone it's become silly IMHO

    If you were honestly and truly highly concerned with your personal privacy you would not be telling us what you do for a living, where you're located, how much Apple stock you own and a multitude of other personal information you've shared here over the years. Your wouldn't even be a forum member to begin with. 

    You'd only pay with cash, forget about credit cards, not ever use a rewards card, stay off the internet, not use a smartphone, not deal with a bank or ever EVER borrow money. You never buy securities, file a tax return, work for any corporation or have utilities in your name.

    You'd not register for college classes, have a driver's license, walk on public streets, visit a doctor or hospital, get any prescriptions, or join any clubs.

    Geesh, you think by making sure Amazon/Apple/Google can't listen for a keyword your personal privacy is protected? LOL! That shipped sailed 50 years ago.

     "Protecting your Privacy" has been reduced to a marketing bullet-point for companies who in reality cannot protect it. Even forgetting about the internet altogether your personal details are collected and shared via a multitude of sources just from your normal real-life activities where you can't hide behind an ad-blocker and an anonymous persona. 
    Nonsense, your rant is loaded with fallacies of false dilemma. One can value their privacy while still filing a tax return, etc. 

    Private is a feature, not a meme, and it's a feature your beloved google cannot commit to as their business model isnt aligned for it. 
    edited April 2017 brucemcwatto_cobra
  • Reply 73 of 105
    gatorguygatorguy Posts: 21,283member
    sog35 said:
    gatorguy said:
    sog35 said:
    Soli said:
    sog35 said:
    you are so naive if you don't think Alexa is not always listening.
    You called the public dumb and yet I've never read a more idiotic post from you.
     
    To make this clear so you can hopefully understand how this technology works:

    OF COURSE ALEXA IS ALWAYS LISTENING! THAT'S HOW IT FUCKING WORKS! THERE'S NO OTHER WAY TO LISTEN FOR A KEYWORD WITHOUT ALWAYS LISTENING FOR THAT KEYWORD. THIS IS EXACTLY THE SAME—ZERO DIFFERENCE—WITH APPLE'S "HEY SIRI"! WHAT THEY AREN'T DOING IS ALWAYS RECORDING!


    ADDITIONALLY, SINCE YOU HAVE MICROPHONES AND CAMERAS AROUND YOU, IN YOUR HOME, AND ON YOUR PERSON PRETTY MUCH ALL THE TIME YOU HAVE NO IDEA WHETHER THESE DEVICES ARE LISTENING, RECORDING, AND SENDING YOUR DATA TO SOME SERVER IN SOME OTHER PART OF THE WORLD! YOU SIMPLY CAN'T BE SURE, BUT TO SAY THAT BECAUSE AMAZON DESIGNED A DEVICE TO LISTEN FOR A 'WAKE WORD' THAT IT—AND ONLY IT—CAN POSSIBLY BE USING A MICROPHONE (OR CAMERA) OUTSIDE OF YOU PURPOSELY ENABLING THEM; YOUR CLAIM THAT AMAZON MUST BE DOING SOMETHING NEFARIOUS IS THE MOST MYOPIC, PARANOID, AND DOWNRIGHT STUPID THINGS I'VE EVERY READ ON THIS FORUM!

    the part you are forgetting is not IF they are listening but WHO is listening.

    I trust Apple. I don't trust Amazon. That's the whole point.
    The whole "ohhh.... PRIVACY!" meme is so overdone it's become silly IMHO

    If you were honestly and truly highly concerned with your personal privacy you would not be telling us what you do for a living, where you're located, how much Apple stock you own and a multitude of other personal information you've shared here over the years. Your wouldn't even be a forum member to begin with. 

    You'd only pay with cash, forget about credit cards, not ever use a rewards card, stay off the internet, not use a smartphone, not deal with a bank or ever EVER borrow money. You never buy securities, file a tax return, work for any corporation or have utilities in your name.

    You'd not register for college classes, have a driver's license, walk on public streets, visit a doctor or hospital, get any prescriptions, or join any clubs.

    Geesh, you think by making sure Amazon/Apple/Google can't listen for a keyword your personal privacy is protected? LOL! That shipped sailed 50 years ago.

     "Protecting your Privacy" has been reduced to a marketing bullet-point for companies who in reality cannot protect it. Even forgetting about the internet altogether your personal details are collected and shared via a multitude of sources just from your normal real-life activities where you can't hide behind an ad-blocker and an anonymous persona. 
    you make it sound black and white.

    Either 100% privacy or no privacy at all.  Sorry brah. There is a ton of grey.

    And I'm not willing to put a mic for Google/Amazon to listen to my conversations. Just won't.
    Do you ever use Siri? You do understand that rather than on-device processing as some other "voice assistants" do, all your requests and searches are uploaded to Apple for processing and stored on servers (which may or may not belong to them) in a supposed anonymized fashion. But OK, you trust Apple, which is fine and dandy.

    Do you also trust the carrier who handled the transmission? How about the owner of the servers who are storing that Siri data? Completely trust them too? And if the local or state police, IRS, SEC, FBI or CIA is investigating "you" for whatever reason is Apple legally bound to turn over any information they have about you and your activities (No one outside of Apple knows what they know nor can you find out) including identifiable Siri requests if served with a court order? I would think so in most cases.

    But no worries... You trust Apple more than Amazon so you're good to go. Your privacy is assured.  
    edited April 2017
  • Reply 74 of 105
    jcs2305jcs2305 Posts: 842member
    The privacy issue with Google and Amazon concern me a bit (we have two Alexa's), but damn if they don't work way better than Siri does. Apple has totally dropped the ball on this, IMO. I only use my AppleTV for iTunes purchases and mirroring, because our 3 y/o Roku is still far easier to use and doesn't drop signals like ATV does. I'm afraid these units are still just after-thoughts, instead of products with iPhone-like attention behind them.
    What Apple TV are you referring to? Dropped signals?  I have no drop out or connection issues with any of the ATV 4's in my house, and that was the same when I was using the 3rd generation.

     Appletv 4 is a SOLID device. Some folks are let down by the lack of 4k support at this time, but it's still a solid device that is fast and streams perfect. I use the Infuse daily to watch my own content, as well as Netflix and Hulu. If I run the ookla speed test app on the ATV 4, on the third floor of my house I get a consistent 120-140mbps. My service is 155mbps.. 
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 75 of 105
    SoliSoli Posts: 9,364member
    fallenjt said:
    Soli said:
    fallenjt said:
    Apple should bring this into ATV 4: always on Siri built in and Bluetooth speakers capable! Don't do standalone speaker like Echo because it sounds like crap. Why build a new device while they can just upgrade existing one?
    1) Why do people want everything put in the Apple TV? How much do you think an Apple TV will
    cost with a WiFi router, HomeMit hub, and digital personal assistant built-in? How big do you think it would be? Since it's controlled via BT it doesn't have to be in plain sight so how does that work for the digital personal assistant feature? If one uses it in a room that doesn't have a TV, like a kitchen, you're saying I should buy a lot of extra HW at an inflated cost that can't be fully utilized?

    2) Clearly you've never used an archive if you don't think it's speaker is exellent. Same goes for its far-field mic setup. The entire system is excellent because of the HW, which I know firsthand from having both an Echo and Echo Dot. On a scale of 1 to 10 the Echo is a 10, the Dot is a 5 and the iPhone is a 1. That's how disparate the mic and speaker systems  are from each other.
    Echo speaker quality is 10 points for you? Conversation ends here. My Klipsch bookshelf speakers are 100x better. All I have to do is adding $20- Bluetooth receiver to the speakers in kitchen area and I can shout across the room for the device to play music...doing that right now using Echo Dot.
    Where the fuck did I mention Klipsch? I gave a comparison of the iPhone compared to the Dot compared to the Echo. Pretty fucking clear on that comparison. Additionally, I also mentioned the microphone setup as part of that comparison. Do your Klipsch even have microphone or a digital personal assistance setup? Why would you think I'd be reviewing speakers that you own when I never mentioned that brand, much less some unknown model as that can make a difference, as noted by reference to the Echo and Echo Dot.

    In fact, if your "Klipsch bookshelf speakers" offer BT connectivity, it's really easy to use Echo to connect to them. A simple voice command can let you switch audio sources, like between Spotify and Amazon Music, and BT speaker systems. You really should use these products before you go on a crusade to say how awful they are.
    edited April 2017
  • Reply 76 of 105
    SoliSoli Posts: 9,364member
    sog35 said:
    Soli said:

    sog35 said:
    Soli said:
    sog35 said:
    you are so naive if you don't think Alexa is not always listening.
    You called the public dumb and yet I've never read a more idiotic post from you.
     
    To make this clear so you can hopefully understand how this technology works:

    OF COURSE ALEXA IS ALWAYS LISTENING! THAT'S HOW IT FUCKING WORKS! THERE'S NO OTHER WAY TO LISTEN FOR A KEYWORD WITHOUT ALWAYS LISTENING FOR THAT KEYWORD. THIS IS EXACTLY THE SAME—ZERO DIFFERENCE—WITH APPLE'S "HEY SIRI"! WHAT THEY AREN'T DOING IS ALWAYS RECORDING!


    ADDITIONALLY, SINCE YOU HAVE MICROPHONES AND CAMERAS AROUND YOU, IN YOUR HOME, AND ON YOUR PERSON PRETTY MUCH ALL THE TIME YOU HAVE NO IDEA WHETHER THESE DEVICES ARE LISTENING, RECORDING, AND SENDING YOUR DATA TO SOME SERVER IN SOME OTHER PART OF THE WORLD! YOU SIMPLY CAN'T BE SURE, BUT TO SAY THAT BECAUSE AMAZON DESIGNED A DEVICE TO LISTEN FOR A 'WAKE WORD' THAT IT—AND ONLY IT—CAN POSSIBLY BE USING A MICROPHONE (OR CAMERA) OUTSIDE OF YOU PURPOSELY ENABLING THEM; YOUR CLAIM THAT AMAZON MUST BE DOING SOMETHING NEFARIOUS IS THE MOST MYOPIC, PARANOID, AND DOWNRIGHT STUPID THINGS I'VE EVERY READ ON THIS FORUM!

    the part you are forgetting is not IF they are listening but WHO is listening.

    I trust Apple. I don't trust Amazon. That's the whole point.
    While your blind trust in Apple and mistrust in Amazon may be your fan boyish point, that's not what you wrote. You made a claim that it's bad because it "listens" fora keyword which you then implied means it must also be recording that information because it's listening. That's both irrational and illogical, but I doubt you'll ever understand that considering you still write every fucking post about what you desire Apple to do in the future as a statement of fact of what they'l absolutely end up doing.
    well you are wrong again.

    My iPhone6 does not listen to me 24x7 while unplugged.  That feature did not start till iPhone 6s with hey Siri.
    And the Echo and Dot doesn't listen when they're not plugged in, but as you oddly mention while saying it doesn't exist, "Hey Siri can be enabled on later iPhones to work whilst on battery power, which once again disproves your point.
    edited April 2017
  • Reply 77 of 105
    SoliSoli Posts: 9,364member

    Soli said:

    sog35 said:
    Soli said:
    sog35 said:
    you are so naive if you don't think Alexa is not always listening.
    You called the public dumb and yet I've never read a more idiotic post from you.
     
    To make this clear so you can hopefully understand how this technology works:

    OF COURSE ALEXA IS ALWAYS LISTENING! THAT'S HOW IT FUCKING WORKS! THERE'S NO OTHER WAY TO LISTEN FOR A KEYWORD WITHOUT ALWAYS LISTENING FOR THAT KEYWORD. THIS IS EXACTLY THE SAME—ZERO DIFFERENCE—WITH APPLE'S "HEY SIRI"! WHAT THEY AREN'T DOING IS ALWAYS RECORDING!


    ADDITIONALLY, SINCE YOU HAVE MICROPHONES AND CAMERAS AROUND YOU, IN YOUR HOME, AND ON YOUR PERSON PRETTY MUCH ALL THE TIME YOU HAVE NO IDEA WHETHER THESE DEVICES ARE LISTENING, RECORDING, AND SENDING YOUR DATA TO SOME SERVER IN SOME OTHER PART OF THE WORLD! YOU SIMPLY CAN'T BE SURE, BUT TO SAY THAT BECAUSE AMAZON DESIGNED A DEVICE TO LISTEN FOR A 'WAKE WORD' THAT IT—AND ONLY IT—CAN POSSIBLY BE USING A MICROPHONE (OR CAMERA) OUTSIDE OF YOU PURPOSELY ENABLING THEM; YOUR CLAIM THAT AMAZON MUST BE DOING SOMETHING NEFARIOUS IS THE MOST MYOPIC, PARANOID, AND DOWNRIGHT STUPID THINGS I'VE EVERY READ ON THIS FORUM!

    the part you are forgetting is not IF they are listening but WHO is listening.

    I trust Apple. I don't trust Amazon. That's the whole point.
    While your blind trust in Apple and mistrust in Amazon may be your fan boyish point, 
    It's not at all fanboyish to trust Apple more than Amazon -- they have different business models, and Apple's is much more aligned with my desire for privacy than a reseller like Amazon or especially an ad company like google. 

    case in point, the lack of denial on amazon selling user data:

    https://daringfireball.net/linked/2017/04/27/amazon-echo-look
    You should NEVER blindly trust any company. The fact that you don't understand this simple fact or that a microphone listening for a keyword doesn't mean it's always recording. Additionally, you need to consider that a device with microphones that doesn't have a digital personal assistant feature doesn't mean it can't possibly be listening and recording everything you do.
    edited April 2017 gatorguy
  • Reply 78 of 105
    gatorguy said:
    sog35 said:
    gatorguy said:
    sog35 said:
    Soli said:
    sog35 said:
    you are so naive if you don't think Alexa is not always listening.
    You called the public dumb and yet I've never read a more idiotic post from you.
     
    To make this clear so you can hopefully understand how this technology works:

    OF COURSE ALEXA IS ALWAYS LISTENING! THAT'S HOW IT FUCKING WORKS! THERE'S NO OTHER WAY TO LISTEN FOR A KEYWORD WITHOUT ALWAYS LISTENING FOR THAT KEYWORD. THIS IS EXACTLY THE SAME—ZERO DIFFERENCE—WITH APPLE'S "HEY SIRI"! WHAT THEY AREN'T DOING IS ALWAYS RECORDING!


    ADDITIONALLY, SINCE YOU HAVE MICROPHONES AND CAMERAS AROUND YOU, IN YOUR HOME, AND ON YOUR PERSON PRETTY MUCH ALL THE TIME YOU HAVE NO IDEA WHETHER THESE DEVICES ARE LISTENING, RECORDING, AND SENDING YOUR DATA TO SOME SERVER IN SOME OTHER PART OF THE WORLD! YOU SIMPLY CAN'T BE SURE, BUT TO SAY THAT BECAUSE AMAZON DESIGNED A DEVICE TO LISTEN FOR A 'WAKE WORD' THAT IT—AND ONLY IT—CAN POSSIBLY BE USING A MICROPHONE (OR CAMERA) OUTSIDE OF YOU PURPOSELY ENABLING THEM; YOUR CLAIM THAT AMAZON MUST BE DOING SOMETHING NEFARIOUS IS THE MOST MYOPIC, PARANOID, AND DOWNRIGHT STUPID THINGS I'VE EVERY READ ON THIS FORUM!

    the part you are forgetting is not IF they are listening but WHO is listening.

    I trust Apple. I don't trust Amazon. That's the whole point.
    The whole "ohhh.... PRIVACY!" meme is so overdone it's become silly IMHO

    If you were honestly and truly highly concerned with your personal privacy you would not be telling us what you do for a living, where you're located, how much Apple stock you own and a multitude of other personal information you've shared here over the years. Your wouldn't even be a forum member to begin with. 

    You'd only pay with cash, forget about credit cards, not ever use a rewards card, stay off the internet, not use a smartphone, not deal with a bank or ever EVER borrow money. You never buy securities, file a tax return, work for any corporation or have utilities in your name.

    You'd not register for college classes, have a driver's license, walk on public streets, visit a doctor or hospital, get any prescriptions, or join any clubs.

    Geesh, you think by making sure Amazon/Apple/Google can't listen for a keyword your personal privacy is protected? LOL! That shipped sailed 50 years ago.

     "Protecting your Privacy" has been reduced to a marketing bullet-point for companies who in reality cannot protect it. Even forgetting about the internet altogether your personal details are collected and shared via a multitude of sources just from your normal real-life activities where you can't hide behind an ad-blocker and an anonymous persona. 
    you make it sound black and white.

    Either 100% privacy or no privacy at all.  Sorry brah. There is a ton of grey.

    And I'm not willing to put a mic for Google/Amazon to listen to my conversations. Just won't.
    Do you ever use Siri? You do understand that rather than on-device processing as some other "voice assistants" do, all your requests and searches are uploaded to Apple for processing and stored on servers (which may or may not belong to them) in a supposed anonymized fashion. But OK, you trust Apple, which is fine and dandy.

    Do you also trust the carrier who handled the transmission? How about the owner of the servers who are storing that Siri data? Completely trust them too? And if the local or state police, IRS, SEC, FBI or CIA is investigating "you" for whatever reason is Apple legally bound to turn over any information they have about you and your activities (No one outside of Apple knows what they know nor can you find out) including identifiable Siri requests if served with a court order? I would think so in most cases.

    But no worries... You trust Apple more than Amazon so you're good to go. Your privacy is assured.  

    Please just stop. Your defense of Google is getting very tiring.

    Where does Google make their money" Selling ads based off data they collect. Where does Apple make money? Selling hardware. You can't be that stupid to see the difference in their business model, and which company is FAR MORE LIKELY to keep/store/track data about their users. And it's not Apple.
    tallest skilbrucemcwatto_cobra
  • Reply 79 of 105
    stompy said:
    Apple's had 3 stagnant WiFi products for a while now (AirPort Extreme, AirPort Time Capsule and AirPort Express), even if Apple dropped the separate Time Capsule, wouldn't if be great to have what you listed in one product (Design win! Keep using the current "Extreme" form factor as it would actually make sense in this product :) ) as well as an "Express" version? (drop the switch, put everything else in the smallest unit possible.) Sigh. If I dreamed this up, that's a sure sign it will never happen. 
    If it could also be a wifi extender (AC), you got yourself a deal!
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 80 of 105
    fallenjt said:
    sog35 said:
    lkrupp said:
    sog35 said:
    sounds good.

    I like the concept of Echo, but don't want to give information to Amazon and Jeff
    People squawk about privacy but their actions prove they don’t care. The populace accepts the surveillance culture that has developed with the technology. It’s fait accompli. We are being watched 24/7/365.
    I don't care how the public views privacy. I'm talking for myself only. No way am I giving Amazon/Google access to the audio in my home 24/7

    The public is dumb. I'm not.
    Lol, are you some kind of privacy freak with a lot of illegal activities to hide? Amazon Alexa would be triggered by 3 names only and not process any other things.
    The state of today's society: If you care just a smidge about how your personal info is used by entities accountable only to their shareholders and act accordingly, you're a laughable freak.
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