Review: Amazon Echo Show is 'good enough'

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Comments

  • Reply 61 of 81
    smaffeismaffei Posts: 211member
    saarek said:
    Amazon is getting to the "good enough" sweet spot before Apple is even out of the door and that is a serious problem.

    At this rate Amazon will be the entrenched standard with Apple acting like Windows Mobile, too little too late.
    Exactly. And, I can code new solutions for Alexa if I want (because unlike Siri, it's expandable). There are so many useful skills out there already. I love the fact I can play Sirius XM on Alexa now.
    williamlondon
  • Reply 62 of 81
    smaffeismaffei Posts: 211member

    Soli said:
    Apple has already opened up Siri to 3rd-paries that offering a HomePod App Store will not be an issue and I'm sure they'll surpass Amazon almost instantly with better IDE for developers.
    But, Siri isn't really that open. The API is very restrictive and only supports certain classes of apps. Furthermore, the support is iOS only. So far, there is no word on HomePod (what a God awful name) supporting Siri expansion. I'm guessing that's about a year away which makes it about 2 years too late.

    edited July 2017 williamlondon
  • Reply 63 of 81
    volcanvolcan Posts: 1,770member
    Soli said:

    Siri can probably answer a large range of questions and possibly some more correct answers for time-based events, like sporting events.
    Siri is generally pretty good with sports scores but I discovered over the weekend that she knows nothing about tennis.

    "What is the score in the Venus Williams match?"

    Siri: No clue at what I'm even talking about.

    "What is the score in the Federer match?"

    Siri: Same cluelessness.

    Google app on iPhone: Instantaneous with perfect accuracy in both cases.
    SoliGeorgeBMac
  • Reply 64 of 81
    k2kwk2kw Posts: 1,699member
    foggyhill said:
    Soli said:
    foggyhill said:
    lkrupp said:
    Arguably the best home assistant gets even better with the launch of Amazon's latest Alexa-powered accessory, dubbed the Echo Show, arriving months before Apple's competing HomePod arrives in December. 

    Overall, we like the design. It has a mix of modern with a bit of retro that will fit well in most people’s homes. 

    Alexa puts Apple's Siri to shame, and really makes a point on how Apple has been lagging behind in this space.

    I’ve highlighted just a few gems that out this ‘review’ as a typical Apple hit piece. Other ‘competitors' are briefly mentioned but the negative focus is on Apple alone. The review hits all the talking points. Where did this review come from anyway? Never heard of the person who wrote it.
    Max is our video guy. If its a video, he's the one responsible for it, with perhaps some polish by another staffer.

    I agree that Alexa is better than Siri as I've been hammering on an Echo for about two months -- but I prefer Apple's stance on data collection. Frankly, I use neither.
    There is "better" and better. What doesn't better even mean if for example they're all mostly useless as you seem to imply by not using them.
    What criteria are used; voice recognition, ability to be called across all devices, mixed language use, multi-platform use, search, whatever.

    Seems a review of those devices should define a use case and then see if the device is good for this use case cause a blanket better makes no sense in this case.

    For example, Siri is definititely better in language coverage; for people who need that Alexa is at 0% for them.
    Echo/Alexa is better than iPhone/iPad/Siri at hearing your wake word and recording your query without interference and/or being able to discern both what you're saying and the context in which you're saying it. Alexa is better at giving you a vocalized answer. Alexa is faster, or at least feels instant compared to using Siri. Amazon lets you view previous queries and submit them to Amazon if there's an error or other concern with the results through their mobile app and web app, while Apple has nothing to help idealize the service. Alexa allows for switching the wake word (Why? Maybe you have a daughter named Alexi), numerous settings to help optimize the service, buit-in 3rd-party apps, like Spotify, and 10s of thousands of 3rd-party apps they call Skills which currently makes Echo products the best option for a connected, voice-controlled, intelligent home. Alexa can run numerous—perhaps unlimited—timers, while Siri can only run one. Alexa allows a lot more to be altered, like settings, via voice since it's primarily a voice driven product.

    Siri has a considerably larger range of language support. Siri can probably answer a large range of questions and possibly some more correct answers for time-based events, like sporting events.

    I know you all like to hate on Alexa, but Amazon has done an amazing job in a market segment they invented. Below is a link to to test that Forbes conducted. You could do 24 different questions that would make either device win depending on what you asked and who asked them. Overall it's difficult to test these services because of the HW variances. Once HomePod arrives we'll get better tests because both devices will have an array of far-field microphones and give voice-only replies.

    So basically unscientific crap and feels, good you cleared this up 
    you do know I have used it huh
    the forbes this is as unscientific as it gets , the fact that's all you got means you don't have much


    If you feel that this review is so "unscientific" why don't you run your own study/comparison to prove Siri superior.
    Soliwilliamlondon
  • Reply 65 of 81
    SoliSoli Posts: 8,690member
    smaffei said:

    Soli said:
    Apple has already opened up Siri to 3rd-paries that offering a HomePod App Store will not be an issue and I'm sure they'll surpass Amazon almost instantly with better IDE for developers.
    But, Siri isn't really that open. The API is very restrictive and only supports certain classes of apps. Furthermore, the support is iOS only. So far, there is no word on HomePod (what a God awful name) supporting Siri expansion. I'm guessing that's about a year away which makes it about 2 years too late.

     Not very, but I expect an App Store and full developer tools by next year. Even if you hate Bezos because he kicked your puppy, the people here should at least be able to admit that Amazon is pushing Apple into this market faster and better, especially since most said it wasn’t worthwhile because Apple would’ve done it before Amazon if it was—but who am I kidding, if Fandroids can’t admit that Apple paved the way for Android and the modern smartphone how can I expect Apple fanatics to admit anything positive about another company on an Apple fan site?
  • Reply 66 of 81
    Mike WuertheleMike Wuerthele Posts: 4,346administrator
    foggyhill said:
    zoetmb said:
    lkrupp said:
    Arguably the best home assistant gets even better with the launch of Amazon's latest Alexa-powered accessory, dubbed the Echo Show, arriving months before Apple's competing HomePod arrives in December. 

    Overall, we like the design. It has a mix of modern with a bit of retro that will fit well in most people’s homes. 

    Alexa puts Apple's Siri to shame, and really makes a point on how Apple has been lagging behind in this space.

    I’ve highlighted just a few gems that out this ‘review’ as a typical Apple hit piece. Other ‘competitors' are briefly mentioned but the negative focus is on Apple alone. The review hits all the talking points. Where did this review come from anyway? Never heard of the person who wrote it.
    You think Apple Insider is writing an Apple hit piece?   That's pretty funny.  Doesn't AI usually get accused of kissing Apple's butt?   Of what you quoted, the first paragraph is a fact, the second is an opinion that has nothing to do with Apple and while the third is negative about Siri, I think there's pretty much universal agreement that Siri sucks and hasn't gotten the improvements that it should have.  
    That's still not a review, universal what, by whom?  Who the hell cares about the 5 W of journalism; lets just go by pure feels for all so called "reviews" because lets face it, clicks are more important than facts. AppleInsider is slowly sliding towards MacRumor territory.

    This is supposed to be A REVIEW, not "the feels about Alexa pods" AppleInsider edition. This is probably the worse justified review since Patel at the The Verge did the embarrassing Apple Watch review.
    You have a fundamental misunderstanding of what a review is. Reviews by definition do contain specifications -- but they also entail opinions about actual use of a device. 

    Otherwise, they'd be press releases or news pieces.

    You disagree, and that's fine. You spelled out why, and that's fine. This bit here about "the feels about Alexa pods" and the aggression here is out of line. Max's opinion is no more or less valid than yours.

    To everybody -- Maintain civility on my front page, gang. Getting close, here.
    edited July 2017 SoliGeorgeBMac
  • Reply 67 of 81
    tmaytmay Posts: 3,567member
    Soli said:
    smaffei said:

    Soli said:
    Apple has already opened up Siri to 3rd-paries that offering a HomePod App Store will not be an issue and I'm sure they'll surpass Amazon almost instantly with better IDE for developers.
    But, Siri isn't really that open. The API is very restrictive and only supports certain classes of apps. Furthermore, the support is iOS only. So far, there is no word on HomePod (what a God awful name) supporting Siri expansion. I'm guessing that's about a year away which makes it about 2 years too late.

     Not very, but I expect an App Store and full developer tools by next year. Even if you hate Bezos because he kicked your puppy, the people here should at least be able to admit that Amazon is pushing Apple into this market faster and better, especially since most said it wasn’t worthwhile because Apple would’ve done it before Amazon if it was—but who am I kidding, if Fandroids can’t admit that Apple paved the way for Android and the modern smartphone how can I expect Apple fanatics to admit anything positive about another company on an Apple fan site?
    Apple has provided an over-designed, over-engineering, arguably audiophile quality speaker in the HomePod to a market space that is currently occupied by the likes of Bose and Sonos. I'm not seeing this as Apple's response to Amazon's Echo at all, and in fact, Amazon itself responded to the HomePod by announcing that they would be adding a speaker product in that space in the future. 

    Further, this reviewer's "good enough" summary statement looks to be especially naive wrt to the Amazon Echo Show. It has all the appearance of a product obsolete before launch, but don't let me stand in the way of anybody's fawning narratives.
    edited July 2017
  • Reply 68 of 81
    SoliSoli Posts: 8,690member
    tmay said:
    Soli said:
    smaffei said:

    Soli said:
    Apple has already opened up Siri to 3rd-paries that offering a HomePod App Store will not be an issue and I'm sure they'll surpass Amazon almost instantly with better IDE for developers.
    But, Siri isn't really that open. The API is very restrictive and only supports certain classes of apps. Furthermore, the support is iOS only. So far, there is no word on HomePod (what a God awful name) supporting Siri expansion. I'm guessing that's about a year away which makes it about 2 years too late.

     Not very, but I expect an App Store and full developer tools by next year. Even if you hate Bezos because he kicked your puppy, the people here should at least be able to admit that Amazon is pushing Apple into this market faster and better, especially since most said it wasn’t worthwhile because Apple would’ve done it before Amazon if it was—but who am I kidding, if Fandroids can’t admit that Apple paved the way for Android and the modern smartphone how can I expect Apple fanatics to admit anything positive about another company on an Apple fan site?
    Apple has provided an over-designed, over-engineering, arguably audiophile quality speaker in the HomePod to a market space that is currently occupied by the likes of Bose and Sonos. I'm not seeing this as Apple's response to Amazon's Echo at all, and in fact, Amazon itself responded to the HomePod by announcing that they would be adding a speaker product in that space in the future. 

    Further, this reviewer's "good enough" summary statement looks to be especially naive wrt to the Amazon Echo Show. It has all the appearance of a product obsolete before launch, but don't let me stand in the way of anybody's fawning narratives.
     It's a digital personal assistant for your home. That's exactly what this market segment is and so it's following the Echo. This notion that the HomePod is "audiophile quality" is ridiculous no matter how good or bad the speaker is. Anyone that calls themselves an audiophile is just an elitist jackass, but in your usage it's a ridiculous statement because the quality of the Echo speaker compared to HomePod is useless comparison in terms of "audiophileness" because you connect whatever expensive sound system you want to your digital personal assistant. You can even buy the little Echo Dot and connect a $10k speaker system to it. It's like arguing that the iPhone is a piece shit because the speakerphone is crap for music or that you can't compare the iPhone to the iPod in terms of music playback because the iPods never came with built-in speakers.
    williamlondon
  • Reply 69 of 81
    It seems to me a worthwhile mention would've been Google's Chromecast (video) plus Home combination . It's not quite an apples-to-apples comparison but at least presents a "video response to voice commands" alternative to the Echo Show.
  • Reply 70 of 81
    tmaytmay Posts: 3,567member
    Soli said:
    tmay said:
    Soli said:
    smaffei said:

    Soli said:
    Apple has already opened up Siri to 3rd-paries that offering a HomePod App Store will not be an issue and I'm sure they'll surpass Amazon almost instantly with better IDE for developers.
    But, Siri isn't really that open. The API is very restrictive and only supports certain classes of apps. Furthermore, the support is iOS only. So far, there is no word on HomePod (what a God awful name) supporting Siri expansion. I'm guessing that's about a year away which makes it about 2 years too late.

     Not very, but I expect an App Store and full developer tools by next year. Even if you hate Bezos because he kicked your puppy, the people here should at least be able to admit that Amazon is pushing Apple into this market faster and better, especially since most said it wasn’t worthwhile because Apple would’ve done it before Amazon if it was—but who am I kidding, if Fandroids can’t admit that Apple paved the way for Android and the modern smartphone how can I expect Apple fanatics to admit anything positive about another company on an Apple fan site?
    Apple has provided an over-designed, over-engineering, arguably audiophile quality speaker in the HomePod to a market space that is currently occupied by the likes of Bose and Sonos. I'm not seeing this as Apple's response to Amazon's Echo at all, and in fact, Amazon itself responded to the HomePod by announcing that they would be adding a speaker product in that space in the future. 

    Further, this reviewer's "good enough" summary statement looks to be especially naive wrt to the Amazon Echo Show. It has all the appearance of a product obsolete before launch, but don't let me stand in the way of anybody's fawning narratives.
     It's a digital personal assistant for your home. That's exactly what this market segment is and so it's following the Echo. This notion that the HomePod is "audiophile quality" is ridiculous no matter how good or bad the speaker is. Anyone that calls themselves an audiophile is just an elitist jackass, but in your usage it's a ridiculous statement because the quality of the Echo speaker compared to HomePod is useless comparison in terms of "audiophileness" because you connect whatever expensive sound system you want to your digital personal assistant. You can even buy the little Echo Dot and connect a $10k speaker system to it. It's like arguing that the iPhone is a piece shit because the speakerphone is crap for music or that you can't compare the iPhone to the iPod in terms of music playback because the iPods never came with built-in speakers.
    https://www.apple.com/homepod/

    I'll let Apple speak for themselves.
  • Reply 71 of 81
    SoliSoli Posts: 8,690member
    tmay said:
    Soli said:
    tmay said:
    Soli said:
    smaffei said:

    Soli said:
    Apple has already opened up Siri to 3rd-paries that offering a HomePod App Store will not be an issue and I'm sure they'll surpass Amazon almost instantly with better IDE for developers.
    But, Siri isn't really that open. The API is very restrictive and only supports certain classes of apps. Furthermore, the support is iOS only. So far, there is no word on HomePod (what a God awful name) supporting Siri expansion. I'm guessing that's about a year away which makes it about 2 years too late.

     Not very, but I expect an App Store and full developer tools by next year. Even if you hate Bezos because he kicked your puppy, the people here should at least be able to admit that Amazon is pushing Apple into this market faster and better, especially since most said it wasn’t worthwhile because Apple would’ve done it before Amazon if it was—but who am I kidding, if Fandroids can’t admit that Apple paved the way for Android and the modern smartphone how can I expect Apple fanatics to admit anything positive about another company on an Apple fan site?
    Apple has provided an over-designed, over-engineering, arguably audiophile quality speaker in the HomePod to a market space that is currently occupied by the likes of Bose and Sonos. I'm not seeing this as Apple's response to Amazon's Echo at all, and in fact, Amazon itself responded to the HomePod by announcing that they would be adding a speaker product in that space in the future. 

    Further, this reviewer's "good enough" summary statement looks to be especially naive wrt to the Amazon Echo Show. It has all the appearance of a product obsolete before launch, but don't let me stand in the way of anybody's fawning narratives.
     It's a digital personal assistant for your home. That's exactly what this market segment is and so it's following the Echo. This notion that the HomePod is "audiophile quality" is ridiculous no matter how good or bad the speaker is. Anyone that calls themselves an audiophile is just an elitist jackass, but in your usage it's a ridiculous statement because the quality of the Echo speaker compared to HomePod is useless comparison in terms of "audiophileness" because you connect whatever expensive sound system you want to your digital personal assistant. You can even buy the little Echo Dot and connect a $10k speaker system to it. It's like arguing that the iPhone is a piece shit because the speakerphone is crap for music or that you can't compare the iPhone to the iPod in terms of music playback because the iPods never came with built-in speakers.
    https://www.apple.com/homepod/

    I'll let Apple speak for themselves.
    So your answer is to let your eyes glaze over, turn off your brain, and let marketing speak with an extreme bias for Apple toward a product still not on the market do your thinking for you, while ignoring my comments about being able to connect speakers to a home-based digital personal assistant that can easily be more expensive, offer better sound reproduction, and be more numerous than what a single HomePod could ever offer. Brilliant¡
    edited July 2017 williamlondongatorguy
  • Reply 72 of 81
    GeorgeBMacGeorgeBMac Posts: 4,163member
    Soli said:
    Soli said:
    Soli said:
    It seems to me that an iPad sitting on base that supplies supplemental power, speakers and microphone would match and exceed pretty much anything this contraption could ever imagine.

    The microphone and speakers on the iPad were designed for personal, close contact use and do well for that purpose.   A simple stand could easily and cheaply provide the wider functionality this purpose requires…
    If an iPad display could be paired with the same or better HW of the Echo Show it would obviously be better HW than the Echo Show, but you can't say it would be a better product because the iPad isn't designed to do what the Echo Show does. Apple would have to create a specific UI that is primarily voice-based with the display being an auxiliary I/O. This is the same with Siri on the iPhone v any of the other Echo products, which @foggyhilll just pooh-poohed for having something positive to say about Alexa. Alexa is designed for voice commands -and- voice replies. Echo Show—as ugly as it is—is just pushing that further as Amazon has just allowed it to send and receive calls, which are currently only between Echo users, and so video chat was an obvious next step as well as showcasing some basic visual data, like the weather. I doubt this will be as popular as the other Echo products, and I'd be surprised if Apple follows suit with a "HomePad," but first let's have the HomePod become a success before Apple ventures into a cheaper product categories, as they are wont to do.

    PS: I hope Apple has voice/messaging calling/answering out of the gate with HomePod, as well as a connection with the Apple TV. This is one area in which Amazon will not be able to easily compete since they have no cellphone market and no integration, whereas Apple can offer this right away. It's actually quite good on the Echo, but it will likely always be limited to those with Echo devices.


    PPS: Amazon is also rumoured to release their own messaging app platform, which I understand from their end with this new Alexa feature and with most of their customer service being text-based, but I also have to wonder if this is even worth the investment if their current one is working.
    "... you can't say it would be a better product because the iPad isn't designed to do what the Echo Show does."

    "Design" has little to do with it.   It is functionality...  The iPad has all the inherent functionality as the Echo -- it's only "design" limitation being that it was designed for hand-held personal use rather than from across a room.   But, more powerful speakers and microphones in a base unit could easily correct that problem.

    It's other issue is the glacial slowness of Siri.   I tend to fall asleep while Siri is trying to wake up -- but that's a problem for ALL Siri products that Apple needs to work on...  Aside from that, Apple would need to tweak some of the iPad software such as Home to be more proactive to voice commands.

    That's all very doable by Apple...   If they choose.
    ”’Design’ has little to do with it” followed by “[the iPad] was designed for hand-held personal use rather than from across a room” in the same paragraph. Com’n, man! You just backed up my entire statement with that latter sentence.
    .....

    LOL...
    Acknowledging an easily corrected exception is hardly 'backing your entire' logic...  Actually trying to pretend that it does pretty much undermines any validity your argument may have had because it illustrates that it is not based on logic.  
    So you're recanting your claim that the iPad was designed for a particular functionality in order to claim my comment that Alexa was designed for a particular functionally is wrong or are you recanting your claim that designing around functionality "has little to do with it." I don't see how you can backpedal on both those claims.
    ....  Who's on first...  
  • Reply 73 of 81
    GeorgeBMacGeorgeBMac Posts: 4,163member
    tmay said:
    Soli said:
    smaffei said:

    Soli said:
    Apple has already opened up Siri to 3rd-paries that offering a HomePod App Store will not be an issue and I'm sure they'll surpass Amazon almost instantly with better IDE for developers.
    But, Siri isn't really that open. The API is very restrictive and only supports certain classes of apps. Furthermore, the support is iOS only. So far, there is no word on HomePod (what a God awful name) supporting Siri expansion. I'm guessing that's about a year away which makes it about 2 years too late.

     Not very, but I expect an App Store and full developer tools by next year. Even if you hate Bezos because he kicked your puppy, the people here should at least be able to admit that Amazon is pushing Apple into this market faster and better, especially since most said it wasn’t worthwhile because Apple would’ve done it before Amazon if it was—but who am I kidding, if Fandroids can’t admit that Apple paved the way for Android and the modern smartphone how can I expect Apple fanatics to admit anything positive about another company on an Apple fan site?
    Apple has provided an over-designed, over-engineering, arguably audiophile quality speaker in the HomePod to a market space that is currently occupied by the likes of Bose and Sonos. I'm not seeing this as Apple's response to Amazon's Echo at all, and in fact, Amazon itself responded to the HomePod by announcing that they would be adding a speaker product in that space in the future. 

    Further, this reviewer's "good enough" summary statement looks to be especially naive wrt to the Amazon Echo Show. It has all the appearance of a product obsolete before launch, but don't let me stand in the way of anybody's fawning narratives.
    "arguably audiophile quality speaker in the HomePod"
    Yeh, that confused me...  I do not doubt that it is a good speaker -- even a great one.   But how can a single speaker be put in the audiophile class as Apple suggested?   Seems to me one would have to lower the bar considerably...
    ... It brought back memories of listening to that one lonely speaker in the dash of my '66 Tempest.  Eventually I added a rear speaker, but...
    williamlondon
  • Reply 74 of 81
    tmaytmay Posts: 3,567member
    tmay said:
    Soli said:
    smaffei said:

    Soli said:
    Apple has already opened up Siri to 3rd-paries that offering a HomePod App Store will not be an issue and I'm sure they'll surpass Amazon almost instantly with better IDE for developers.
    But, Siri isn't really that open. The API is very restrictive and only supports certain classes of apps. Furthermore, the support is iOS only. So far, there is no word on HomePod (what a God awful name) supporting Siri expansion. I'm guessing that's about a year away which makes it about 2 years too late.

     Not very, but I expect an App Store and full developer tools by next year. Even if you hate Bezos because he kicked your puppy, the people here should at least be able to admit that Amazon is pushing Apple into this market faster and better, especially since most said it wasn’t worthwhile because Apple would’ve done it before Amazon if it was—but who am I kidding, if Fandroids can’t admit that Apple paved the way for Android and the modern smartphone how can I expect Apple fanatics to admit anything positive about another company on an Apple fan site?
    Apple has provided an over-designed, over-engineering, arguably audiophile quality speaker in the HomePod to a market space that is currently occupied by the likes of Bose and Sonos. I'm not seeing this as Apple's response to Amazon's Echo at all, and in fact, Amazon itself responded to the HomePod by announcing that they would be adding a speaker product in that space in the future. 

    Further, this reviewer's "good enough" summary statement looks to be especially naive wrt to the Amazon Echo Show. It has all the appearance of a product obsolete before launch, but don't let me stand in the way of anybody's fawning narratives.
    "arguably audiophile quality speaker in the HomePod"
    Yeh, that confused me...  I do not doubt that it is a good speaker -- even a great one.   But how can a single speaker be put in the audiophile class as Apple suggested?   Seems to me one would have to lower the bar considerably...
    ... It brought back memories of listening to that one lonely speaker in the dash of my '66 Tempest.  Eventually I added a rear speaker, but...
    Apple never stated that HomePod was audiophile quality, I stated that, based on reports of its use in pairs in a room that Apple had set up at WWDC. Even if you and Soli disagree with me on "audiophile", it doesn't change how Apple is marketing these; as speakers primarily. 

    Since Amazon has, in fact, announced that they too would be building a similar class speaker to compete with HomePod, I'm guessing that it too will primarily be marketed as a speaker.
  • Reply 75 of 81
    SoliSoli Posts: 8,690member
    tmay said:
    Since Amazon has, in fact, announced that they too would be building a similar class speaker to compete with HomePod, I'm guessing that it too will primarily be marketed as a speaker.
    It's still a digital home assistant, like all their Alexa-driven Echo products, but with a better speaker. The Echo having a substantially better speaker than Echo Dot doesn't mean it's marketed as a dumb speaker with Alexa as some after through.
  • Reply 76 of 81
    gatorguygatorguy Posts: 20,288member
    tmay said:
    tmay said:
    Soli said:
    smaffei said:

    Soli said:
    Apple has already opened up Siri to 3rd-paries that offering a HomePod App Store will not be an issue and I'm sure they'll surpass Amazon almost instantly with better IDE for developers.
    But, Siri isn't really that open. The API is very restrictive and only supports certain classes of apps. Furthermore, the support is iOS only. So far, there is no word on HomePod (what a God awful name) supporting Siri expansion. I'm guessing that's about a year away which makes it about 2 years too late.

     Not very, but I expect an App Store and full developer tools by next year. Even if you hate Bezos because he kicked your puppy, the people here should at least be able to admit that Amazon is pushing Apple into this market faster and better, especially since most said it wasn’t worthwhile because Apple would’ve done it before Amazon if it was—but who am I kidding, if Fandroids can’t admit that Apple paved the way for Android and the modern smartphone how can I expect Apple fanatics to admit anything positive about another company on an Apple fan site?
    Apple has provided an over-designed, over-engineering, arguably audiophile quality speaker in the HomePod to a market space that is currently occupied by the likes of Bose and Sonos. I'm not seeing this as Apple's response to Amazon's Echo at all, and in fact, Amazon itself responded to the HomePod by announcing that they would be adding a speaker product in that space in the future. 

    Further, this reviewer's "good enough" summary statement looks to be especially naive wrt to the Amazon Echo Show. It has all the appearance of a product obsolete before launch, but don't let me stand in the way of anybody's fawning narratives.
    "arguably audiophile quality speaker in the HomePod"
    Yeh, that confused me...  I do not doubt that it is a good speaker -- even a great one.   But how can a single speaker be put in the audiophile class as Apple suggested?   Seems to me one would have to lower the bar considerably...
    ... It brought back memories of listening to that one lonely speaker in the dash of my '66 Tempest.  Eventually I added a rear speaker, but...

    Since Amazon has, in fact, announced that they too would be building a similar class speaker to compete with HomePod...
    In fact I don't believe Amazon announced anything about a new Echo soon to come with a better speaker. You're thinking of the rumor posted here a few days ago. 
    ...but I will not be surprised if/when it happens.
    Soli
  • Reply 77 of 81
    tmaytmay Posts: 3,567member
    gatorguy said:
    tmay said:
    tmay said:
    Soli said:
    smaffei said:

    Soli said:
    Apple has already opened up Siri to 3rd-paries that offering a HomePod App Store will not be an issue and I'm sure they'll surpass Amazon almost instantly with better IDE for developers.
    But, Siri isn't really that open. The API is very restrictive and only supports certain classes of apps. Furthermore, the support is iOS only. So far, there is no word on HomePod (what a God awful name) supporting Siri expansion. I'm guessing that's about a year away which makes it about 2 years too late.

     Not very, but I expect an App Store and full developer tools by next year. Even if you hate Bezos because he kicked your puppy, the people here should at least be able to admit that Amazon is pushing Apple into this market faster and better, especially since most said it wasn’t worthwhile because Apple would’ve done it before Amazon if it was—but who am I kidding, if Fandroids can’t admit that Apple paved the way for Android and the modern smartphone how can I expect Apple fanatics to admit anything positive about another company on an Apple fan site?
    Apple has provided an over-designed, over-engineering, arguably audiophile quality speaker in the HomePod to a market space that is currently occupied by the likes of Bose and Sonos. I'm not seeing this as Apple's response to Amazon's Echo at all, and in fact, Amazon itself responded to the HomePod by announcing that they would be adding a speaker product in that space in the future. 

    Further, this reviewer's "good enough" summary statement looks to be especially naive wrt to the Amazon Echo Show. It has all the appearance of a product obsolete before launch, but don't let me stand in the way of anybody's fawning narratives.
    "arguably audiophile quality speaker in the HomePod"
    Yeh, that confused me...  I do not doubt that it is a good speaker -- even a great one.   But how can a single speaker be put in the audiophile class as Apple suggested?   Seems to me one would have to lower the bar considerably...
    ... It brought back memories of listening to that one lonely speaker in the dash of my '66 Tempest.  Eventually I added a rear speaker, but...

    Since Amazon has, in fact, announced that they too would be building a similar class speaker to compete with HomePod...
    In fact I don't believe Amazon announced anything about a new Echo soon to come with a better speaker. You're thinking of the rumor posted here a few days ago. 
    ...but I will not be surprised if/when it happens.
    You are correct;

    https://www.engadget.com/2017/07/12/amazon-echo-homepod/

    At any rate, there appears to be a substantial market for higher end/higher priced, speakers that have assistants and support music streaming. I expect a number of non-Amazon speakers with Alexa to arrive, to it could be a very lucrative space to be in. I'm guessing many will be AirPlay compatible.
  • Reply 78 of 81
    taddtadd Posts: 93member
    Soli said:
    Didn’t read article. 
    But man, that this is UG LY. 
    It might be functional and there's not too much you can do with a display that needs to be facing someone from a standard height without getting overly complex, but that's definitely an uninspired design.

    But if you think the outside phoned it in you should see the internals on the iFixit teardown. In Amazon's defense, they didn't need to spend a great deal of time and money trying to compact the internals. In fact they have plenty of room to work with, but still the internals are unpleasant to look at for modern CE.
    I agree that it is ugly.  But on Soli's recommendation I watched the iFixit youtube video.  Wow that thing has much better components than I expected. The speakers look amazing for such a small plastic-y product and the CPU board seemed ridiculously overkill for the what the thing looks like and how it is described (in the review).  i would have thought by 2017 we'd have products doing what this does with less expensive [looking] stuff in it.  Why make such a crappy sounding product (according to the review) with such great looking speakers?  Think about how nice they look compared to what is in an iMac or some other tiny devices which sound adequate.  I'm thinking that the budgets for internal parts were not shared with the original design staff, else they'd have used a better display and a much nicer looking cabinet.  600 pixel high resolution?  How long has it been since a tablet came with 600 pixel high resolution?  
  • Reply 79 of 81
    As nice as it is, anyone with a smart phone will find much of it redundant.  If not all of it.
  • Reply 80 of 81
    Soli said:
    tmay said:
    Soli said:
    tmay said:
    Soli said:
    smaffei said:

    Soli said:
    Apple has already opened up Siri to 3rd-paries that offering a HomePod App Store will not be an issue and I'm sure they'll surpass Amazon almost instantly with better IDE for developers.
    But, Siri isn't really that open. The API is very restrictive and only supports certain classes of apps. Furthermore, the support is iOS only. So far, there is no word on HomePod (what a God awful name) supporting Siri expansion. I'm guessing that's about a year away which makes it about 2 years too late.

     Not very, but I expect an App Store and full developer tools by next year. Even if you hate Bezos because he kicked your puppy, the people here should at least be able to admit that Amazon is pushing Apple into this market faster and better, especially since most said it wasn’t worthwhile because Apple would’ve done it before Amazon if it was—but who am I kidding, if Fandroids can’t admit that Apple paved the way for Android and the modern smartphone how can I expect Apple fanatics to admit anything positive about another company on an Apple fan site?
    Apple has provided an over-designed, over-engineering, arguably audiophile quality speaker in the HomePod to a market space that is currently occupied by the likes of Bose and Sonos. I'm not seeing this as Apple's response to Amazon's Echo at all, and in fact, Amazon itself responded to the HomePod by announcing that they would be adding a speaker product in that space in the future. 

    Further, this reviewer's "good enough" summary statement looks to be especially naive wrt to the Amazon Echo Show. It has all the appearance of a product obsolete before launch, but don't let me stand in the way of anybody's fawning narratives.
     It's a digital personal assistant for your home. That's exactly what this market segment is and so it's following the Echo. This notion that the HomePod is "audiophile quality" is ridiculous no matter how good or bad the speaker is. Anyone that calls themselves an audiophile is just an elitist jackass, but in your usage it's a ridiculous statement because the quality of the Echo speaker compared to HomePod is useless comparison in terms of "audiophileness" because you connect whatever expensive sound system you want to your digital personal assistant. You can even buy the little Echo Dot and connect a $10k speaker system to it. It's like arguing that the iPhone is a piece shit because the speakerphone is crap for music or that you can't compare the iPhone to the iPod in terms of music playback because the iPods never came with built-in speakers.
    https://www.apple.com/homepod/

    I'll let Apple speak for themselves.
    So your answer is to let your eyes glaze over, turn off your brain, and let marketing speak with an extreme bias for Apple toward a product still not on the market do your thinking for you, while ignoring my comments about being able to connect speakers to a home-based digital personal assistant that can easily be more expensive, offer better sound reproduction, and be more numerous than what a single HomePod could ever offer. Brilliant¡
    You sound annoying.
    williamlondon
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